Oil a factor in Australian role in Iraq
Rushlimbo
Posts: 832
I guess every nation cannot have the noble reasoning that BushCo has for being in Iraq. It's hard to believe we have such a greedy ally such as Australia.
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Oil is a key factor keeping Australian troops in the US-led war in Iraq, Defence Minister Brendan Nelson said Thursday, before his boss Prime Minister John Howard sharply contradicted him.
Nelson's startling comments caused an immediate stir in Australia, one of the United States' few major allies in the increasingly unpopular war, but Howard quickly backed away from the explosive contention.
A new defence review had concluded that maintaining "resource security" in the Middle East was a priority, Nelson said in an interview with the Australian Broadcasting Corporation.
"Energy security is extremely important to all nations throughout the world, and of course, in protecting and securing Australia's interests," he said.
"Obviously the Middle East itself, not only Iraq, but the entire region is an important supplier of energy, oil in particular, to the rest of the world.
"Australians and all of us need to think what would happen if there were a premature withdrawal from Iraq," Nelson said.
Australia joined the US-led invasion of Iraq in 2003, which was said to be aimed at eliminating Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction, which were never found.
Howard remains a very staunch supporter of Washington's military campaign in Iraq. Australia's deployment currently numbers about 1,575 soldiers.
Nelson also said Australia's main reasons for remaining in Iraq were to prevent violence driven by Al-Qaeda between the Sunni and Shia populations and to help key ally the United States combat terrorism and stabilise the region.
But he contended that safeguarding oil supplies was an important part of bringing stability.
"For all of those reasons, one of which is energy security, it's extremely important that Australia take the view that it's in our interests, our security interests, to make sure that we leave the Middle East, and leave Iraq in particular, in a position of sustainable security," he said.
But Howard swung into damage limitation mode later in the day, strongly denying that either Nelson or he himself had said securing oil supply was a key factor behind his country's contentious involvement in the war in Iraq.
"We're not there because of oil and we didn't go there because of oil, we don't remain there because of oil," he told commercial radio. "Oil is not the reason."
Treasurer Peter Costello also joined in the denial that Australian troops were primarily in Iraq to secure oil supplies.
"We're fighting for something much more important here than oil, this is about democracy and freedom in the Middle East," he told reporters.
Howard had earlier told a conference in Canberra that energy demand was a key reason for helping to develop a stable Middle East.
But he later said it was "stretching it a bit" to conclude that Australia's involvement in Iraq was motivated by oil
He told the conference Australia's presence in the Middle East was central to his government's defence strategy, arguing the country could not afford to wait for threats to reach its shores before taking action.
"Many of the key strategic trends I have mentioned -- including terrorism and extremism, challenging demographics, WMD (weapons of mass destruction) aspirations, energy demand and great-power competition -- converge in the Middle East," he said.
"Our major ally and our most important economic partners have crucial interests there."
The centre-left opposition Labor Party, which wants to withdraw Australia's troops from Iraq, accused the government of making contradictory statements on its reasons for being in Iraq.
"This government simply makes it up as it goes along on Iraq," Labor leader Kevin Rudd told reporters.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/australiairaqwaroil;_ylt=ArlcA0NESY8lwq1egqpy.dUDW7oF
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Oil is a key factor keeping Australian troops in the US-led war in Iraq, Defence Minister Brendan Nelson said Thursday, before his boss Prime Minister John Howard sharply contradicted him.
Nelson's startling comments caused an immediate stir in Australia, one of the United States' few major allies in the increasingly unpopular war, but Howard quickly backed away from the explosive contention.
A new defence review had concluded that maintaining "resource security" in the Middle East was a priority, Nelson said in an interview with the Australian Broadcasting Corporation.
"Energy security is extremely important to all nations throughout the world, and of course, in protecting and securing Australia's interests," he said.
"Obviously the Middle East itself, not only Iraq, but the entire region is an important supplier of energy, oil in particular, to the rest of the world.
"Australians and all of us need to think what would happen if there were a premature withdrawal from Iraq," Nelson said.
Australia joined the US-led invasion of Iraq in 2003, which was said to be aimed at eliminating Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction, which were never found.
Howard remains a very staunch supporter of Washington's military campaign in Iraq. Australia's deployment currently numbers about 1,575 soldiers.
Nelson also said Australia's main reasons for remaining in Iraq were to prevent violence driven by Al-Qaeda between the Sunni and Shia populations and to help key ally the United States combat terrorism and stabilise the region.
But he contended that safeguarding oil supplies was an important part of bringing stability.
"For all of those reasons, one of which is energy security, it's extremely important that Australia take the view that it's in our interests, our security interests, to make sure that we leave the Middle East, and leave Iraq in particular, in a position of sustainable security," he said.
But Howard swung into damage limitation mode later in the day, strongly denying that either Nelson or he himself had said securing oil supply was a key factor behind his country's contentious involvement in the war in Iraq.
"We're not there because of oil and we didn't go there because of oil, we don't remain there because of oil," he told commercial radio. "Oil is not the reason."
Treasurer Peter Costello also joined in the denial that Australian troops were primarily in Iraq to secure oil supplies.
"We're fighting for something much more important here than oil, this is about democracy and freedom in the Middle East," he told reporters.
Howard had earlier told a conference in Canberra that energy demand was a key reason for helping to develop a stable Middle East.
But he later said it was "stretching it a bit" to conclude that Australia's involvement in Iraq was motivated by oil
He told the conference Australia's presence in the Middle East was central to his government's defence strategy, arguing the country could not afford to wait for threats to reach its shores before taking action.
"Many of the key strategic trends I have mentioned -- including terrorism and extremism, challenging demographics, WMD (weapons of mass destruction) aspirations, energy demand and great-power competition -- converge in the Middle East," he said.
"Our major ally and our most important economic partners have crucial interests there."
The centre-left opposition Labor Party, which wants to withdraw Australia's troops from Iraq, accused the government of making contradictory statements on its reasons for being in Iraq.
"This government simply makes it up as it goes along on Iraq," Labor leader Kevin Rudd told reporters.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/australiairaqwaroil;_ylt=ArlcA0NESY8lwq1egqpy.dUDW7oF
War is Peace
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
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Comments
—Dorothy Parker
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It isnt a shock to me, I'm just sick of the numerous other reasons given for invading Iraq. A little truth would be nice but it isnt gonna happen with these criminals in power.
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
So we shouldnt care that our government lies to us? In a democracy the government is supposed to yield to the will of the people, not the other way around. I think it is very sad that you choose to throw your arms up in the air and say, "The truth wont change anything, so who cares".
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
its never been a secret that oil plays a role in our dealing with Iraq.
Call me jaded but I don't listen to what they're saying any more. I only focus on what they are doing. I can either agree and justify their actions or not. I do this independant of whatever crap they're spewing.
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
its pretty sickening to think there's anyone that doubted for a second the real reason we're in Iraq........and to think people don't call Bush and company freakin liars everytime he opens his mouth is beyond me.
oil was never mentioned as the real reason why we went to Iraq but... oil, as a factor, was never denied.
in fact, I remember bush and others saying, they didn't want saddam to invade kuiwait, then possibly saudi arbia, and have control such a huge % of the worlds oil.
thats the thing,....the rest was all baloney to sucker us.....no other reason but oil....now if dip would have said....hey...lets attack sadaam cause we're wanting to secure the oil....and we bought into it...different story..but that's not what they said....and this story just points to the fact they still skirt by this one strategy....and many beleive them...probably out of self preservation.
....and they are getting killed like mad.
Talk about dirty, dirty work...holy!
edit: ins't their more private contractors employed in Iraq than troops now?
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
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I would like to point out that like many Americans the majority of Australians do not support the war in Iraq and never have.
And like Americans we are suffering from a pathetic, overbearing, condescending, lying, cheating, self serving government like most other Western democracies have been since 9/11.
Treasurer Peter Costello also joined in the denial that Australian troops were primarily in Iraq to secure oil supplies.
"We're fighting for something much more important here than oil, this is about democracy and freedom in the Middle East," he told reporters.
This bit makes me laugh the most!!! Yeah, let's fight for democracy and freedom in the Middle East Petey coz god knows you've fucked it up here!!! :rolleyes:
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
People don't want the truth anyway, there still harping on about wepons of mass destruction and how it's saddams fault.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
I agree, except there's only one problem - its THEIR oil, not ours. Concocting stories to invade Middle East contries, or fabricating reasons to plant ourselves there won't work. If you don't think ownership of said resource is important, then hey, I say countries from around the globe should start pilfereing American oil, from American soil, and start doing so on the flimsiest of reasons. It has nothing to do with necessity, unless you buy into the "might is right" argument.
Ya know, I'm starting to think thgat we in the West don't want oil self-sufficiency. B/c achieving that robs us of one of the primary ruses for being in the Middle East.
The framework is already set for military might and global domination. What do you do with the trillions and trillions already invested?
That shiny new Ferrari is burning a hole in your driveway, and you don't have a license to drive....however....you can just flick away any cop that pulls you over. The engine is running, and a hot babe giving you the eyes in the passenger seat. If you drive, millions of peoples lives will be negative affected, but you stand to gain everything.
What do you do?
Ultimately we need to find ways to harvest the sun. This is where it all comes from. Solar panels should be like sheets of paper. Can we find a clean method of storing sun energy?
This should be the focus. Maybe science says it's impossible, and this is the only alternative to ensure our survival.
It's kinda like crocs fighting over a drying up puddle of water in Africa.
I don't think enough effort has been made personally, but who am I to say what scientists do all day and think of?
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
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( o.O)
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The fact is, the United States is involved in almost every corner of the globe as are many of the more developed/leading countries. The US has an immense impact on world affairs regardless if our military is in town or not for many reasons, be they economical, political or cultural.
It just sucks balls how the MT has been hijacked by like-minded people who "know" that the US is an evil empire ruled by corupt politicians and greedy corporations whose only ambitions are to feed their machines, fill their wallets and grab power by any means necessary. What is considered the "center" around here as far as discussion goes is sooooo scewed the left that its just rediculous.
its not that we're like minded or that we know....we just look at the facts and it screams what it is.....why aren't we in Africa???? Why didn't we go after North Korea??? Oil...there's no grey area...and one really has to suppress facts to think otherwise. Oh never mind...its Sadaams fault.
We're not there to steal their oil dude, we are currently paying out the ass - over $70 a barrell for it. With regards to the oil aspect, we are there to protect it not to shoot up the place and pump it back to America while our troops stand guard.
If we needed oil so bad that we had to pay hundreds of millions of dollars a week to wage a war to "steal" it from the Iraqi's - why the fuck wouldn't we just go up to Anwar and drill the shit out of the place. That is certainly much, much easier than fighting in Iraq for it. Oh wait, that wouldn't feed the military/industrial complex - my fault... sorry for over looking that part.
Anyhow, the fact that we are still in Iraq trying to rebuild the country is why you can't deny the aspect of nation-building as a legitimate reason for being in Iraq as well.
Global domination from the end of a gun barrel. It's quite simple. Look at the numbers. It's not about defense. It's a strangle hold.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
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( o.O)
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We are in Africa my friend. We are all over the world. There is hardly a country out there that our troops are not in or close enough to have an influence.
The big difference between "Africa" and Iraq is that the Middle East is the troubled region producing terrorists, not "Africa". What good would it do to attempt a political/social change in Africa when the terrorist are coming out of the Middle East?????????????????????
And as far as Muslim countries in Africa, yeah, there is no double standard - we are all on top of them - Somalia, Ethiopia, Djubuti, Eygpt...
North Korea... we have been negotiating with them for decades. They have a massive army and citizenry that is basically brain-washed to fight till the last child is standing for their leader/god, Kim Jung Il. It's a lot different than Iraq. And our approach reflects that difference.
Are there any more "facts" I'm suppressing that you would like to discuss???
your first 2 paragraphs are dead on. I always thought this was common sense. all I hear is "we went to war for oil" guess what, thats a reason. and guess what else, we are paying a shitload for it. like you said, 72 dollars a fucking barrel. we didnt "go there for it". whatever that means.
your last paragraph is correct but I'm starting to get pissed off that the Iraqis cant put aside their differences and start building their own country, instead of blowing it up themselves.
I missed us going into Africa, deposing a leader and putting in a couple of hundred thousand troops. Course I really would have wished it would have stopped the genocide from happening.....hmmmm. We only invaded two countries....Afganistan to rid the Taliban and Iraq for their oil....oh and as a nice bonus...help VP's company out....simple...really simple.
What's a lot more concerning is the 7 trillion Americans have to pay out in massive taxes at some point and get absolutely nothing in return.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
Some people still think that nobody makes money off of oil being 70 bucks a barrell. :rolleyes:
When you said before that we "are not in Africa" that our presence there does not count in your view becuase we have not deposed a leader with a couple hundred thousand troops? I'm pretty sure people in the horn of Africa would definetly tell you the Americans are there.
How can you deny a mutli-faceted reasoning for deposing Saddam, and only concentrate on the oil aspect? Doesn't the fact that we are still there suffering over a hundred casualties a month tell you there is another purpose besides grabbing the oil? If we were there JUST for the oil, why did we not go in, go straight for it and begin to pump it all back to the US while our troops stood guard? Why is it that the Democracts are screaming and kicking for us to leave? Do you not think they are controlled by corporate interests?
OPEC is the real winner with high oil prices. But don't kid yourself, the oil industry is only a fraction of corporate America and their influence on foreign policy is not trumped by all the others who are getting fleaced by $70 a barrell oil. (Do you think Detroit is pyschyed about $70 oil? Do you think Wall Street is pysched about it?)
Not to mention the American voters are pissed about the price. It's not like Dick Cheney and George Bush are the whipping boys of the oil industry - they have a lot of people answer to and hand out favors.
It's a show!
Those same dems who screamed bloody murder about you going in in the first place? You can't tell me you actually believe that the entire force would pull out in a four year span if the dems won. Don't kid yourself.
Did you pay attention when your boys first went in as to what they did secure? Was it the museum? No. Was it the health and welfare of the people? No. Was it the cache of arms that were locked with a twist tie? No. It was the oil fields and they couldn't even do that right.
If I didn't think you worked for the government, I would wonder what rock you crawled out from with the stories you believe in.