hehe you're right. I pulled that out of my ass. simple question, who would (few/some/many) nader supporters vote for if he wasn't in the race
maccain or obama?
or am I being absolutely ridiculous and completely illogical? :rolleyes:
Yes, you're being "absolutely ridiculous and completely illogical". I voted for Nader in 2004 and I'll vote for him in 2008. After Kucinich was bullied out of the race and before Nader announced that he's running, I was very likely not going to vote at all. I don't think I could vote for anyone else in the race and have a clear conscience.
The idea that Nader takes votes from democrats is stale and plain wrong. If dems want my vote, they had damn well better earn it. They've done NOTHING but cater to the Bush and other republicans and support this god awful war. They are NOT progressive. I, for one am very much interested in PROGRESSive candidates and nothing less.
I am voting Obama, and like that Nader is running. Hopefully he can keep the Dems in line and hold them to their promises.
Anyway, you are the dumbass with this logic. If Obama can't beat McCain with Nader running, then there is something seriously wrong in this world. Now if Chuck Hagel had the Republican nomination, I may have been a little worried.
Good post. It just makes so much sense for Nader to run. It blows my mind that people can't see that. Obviously, I want him to win. But if not, I think he does nothing but help the dems. The American people are sick and tired of republicans. But for some reason the dems are moving further and further right. It's pure fucking insanity.
I am voting Obama, and like that Nader is running. Hopefully he can keep the Dems in line and hold them to their promises.
Anyway, you are the dumbass with this logic. If Obama can't beat McCain with Nader running, then there is something seriously wrong in this world. Now if Chuck Hagel had the Republican nomination, I may have been a little worried.
are blatant insults like this allowed around here? I take you for another high school kid like that roland guy. thats not an insult, just a maturity level observation. you know why? because there is nothing wrong with this world if a candidate you dont support wins. I think you'll understand when you get older. as for my logic, all I can say is Al Gore 2000. but you were probably much too young to know what happen then but heres a hint. Nader essentially lost gore florida, which ended up costing gore the election.
Good post. It just makes so much sense for Nader to run. It blows my mind that people can't see that. Obviously, I want him to win. But if not, I think he does nothing but help the dems. The American people are sick and tired of republicans. But for some reason the dems are moving further and further right. It's pure fucking insanity.
talk about insane logic. how does nader running HELP the dems? he is taking votes directly away from democrats. even though the communist says he and his buddies wouldn't vote for a democrat, many people who vote for nader would.
talk about insane logic. how does nader running HELP the dems? he is taking votes directly away from democrats. even though the communist says he and his buddies wouldn't vote for a democrat, many people who vote for nader would.
He helps by keeping the other guys honest, bringing ignored issues up and he helps to shape the Dem's platform into fitting more closely with what leftist types would like to see in their candidate. If they don't represent what we'd like to see done in this country why in the heck would we vote for them?
The Dems don't get our votes simply because they're not McCain. They have to represent the principles we value, tackle the problem issues that are swept under the rug by the others, their record should match their rhetoric, they need to have actually DONE things to make them deserving and not just said some things....
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
are blatant insults like this allowed around here? I take you for another high school kid like that roland guy. thats not an insult, just a maturity level observation. you know why? because there is nothing wrong with this world if a candidate you dont support wins. I think you'll understand when you get older. as for my logic, all I can say is Al Gore 2000. but you were probably much too young to know what happen then but heres a hint. Nader essentially lost gore florida, which ended up costing gore the election.
Did you even bother reading the link to a thread on this I posted to you?
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
He helps by keeping the other guys honest, bringing ignored issues up and he helps to shape the Dem's platform into fitting more closely with what leftist types would like to see in their candidate. If they don't represent what we'd like to see done in this country why in the heck would we vote for them?
The Dems don't get our votes simply because they're not McCain. They have to represent the principles we value, tackle the problem issues that are swept under the rug by the others, their record should match their rhetoric, they need to have actually DONE things to make them deserving and not just said some things....
sorry bout thats just not true for so many dems. I think even more so now because so many are anti-bush they will vote for anyone who isnt him no matter what. and if nader wasn't in the race, 99 times out of 100, the dems would get that vote.
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
Yes, you're being "absolutely ridiculous and completely illogical". I voted for Nader in 2004 and I'll vote for him in 2008. After Kucinich was bullied out of the race and before Nader announced that he's running, I was very likely not going to vote at all. I don't think I could vote for anyone else in the race and have a clear conscience.
The idea that Nader takes votes from democrats is stale and plain wrong. If dems want my vote, they had damn well better earn it. They've done NOTHING but cater to the Bush and other republicans and support this god awful war. They are NOT progressive. I, for one am very much interested in PROGRESSive candidates and nothing less.
Here are the actual results from the 2000 election:
Gore 50,999,897 48.38%
Bush 50,456,002 47.87%
Nader 2,882,955 2.74%
Total 105,405,100 100.00%*
Allocating the 2,882,955 Nader votes along established patterns: 46% / 1,326,159 to Gore and 23% / 663,080 to Bush (leaving out the 31% of Nader voters who said they wouldn't have voted at all) shows Gore more than doubling his popular vote margin.
I don't think it's him? He was a decent guy, although i think i miss a lot of what goes on here because i don't post much when we are busy at work.
Masterframer. Now that's a name i have not heard in a long time :(
Where are you amigo?
You're far too kind...trust me.
masterframer is probably busy touring with Obama
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
are blatant insults like this allowed around here? I take you for another high school kid like that roland guy. thats not an insult, just a maturity level observation. you know why? because there is nothing wrong with this world if a candidate you dont support wins. I think you'll understand when you get older. as for my logic, all I can say is Al Gore 2000. but you were probably much too young to know what happen then but heres a hint. Nader essentially lost gore florida, which ended up costing gore the election.
You started with the insults by calling Nader a dumbass. Probably easier to make "blatant insults" when someone isn't here to defend himself, right?
Also, this isn't meant to be an insult but your statements are ignorant enough that I'm surprised any of us are even responding. Most of the time when people have no idea what the fuck they are talking about they just get ignored. This is just a very important issue to a lot of people here so it seems we're trying to help you understand. Unfortunately, you have some sort of learning disability. Maybe if someone on the TV was saying this stuff you'd finally get it...
You started with the insults by calling Nader a dumbass. Probably easier to make "blatant insults" when someone isn't here to defend himself, right?
Also, this isn't meant to be an insult but your statements are ignorant enough that I'm surprised any of us are even responding. Most of the time when people have no idea what the fuck they are talking about they just get ignored. This is just a very important issue to a lot of people here so it seems we're trying to help you understand. Unfortunately, you have some sort of learning disability. Maybe if someone on the TV was saying this stuff you'd finally get it...
Great post
And by the way lazymoon, I'm 31. Once again your logic has dumbfounded you.
Also, this isn't meant to be an insult but your statements are ignorant enough that I'm surprised any of us are even responding. Most of the time when people have no idea what the fuck they are talking about they just get ignored. This is just a very important issue to a lot of people here so it seems we're trying to help you understand. Unfortunately, you have some sort of learning disability. Maybe if someone on the TV was saying this stuff you'd finally get it...
again with the insults. the dems will lose votes to nader. thats a fact.
that in doing that he is helping mccain get elected. unless you think nader actually has a chance of winning?
If he did, it would be nice.
So what you're saying is that people should vote Democratic, no matter what, to strategically vote against a Republican....even if we don't agree with their policies or like their record???? Even if they've did little more than sweet talk while in the senate and has almost nothing to show for it? Even if the Dem candidate doesn't represent my ideals or address the issues that matter most to me? We on the left are simply just supposed to vote Dem every election because some Rep might win if we don't???? Boy, there's a ton of accountability in your plan, lazy. The Dems could do whatever the fuck they please but we are still somehow obligated to vote for them, regardless?
Eh, I think I'll pass and vote for the guy who deserves it. You feel free to vote for whoever you're supposed to...whichever seems to be a little less than worst to you at the time. And that's what we'll keep seeing get elected into our gov't...a little less than worst or worst. I wonder why things are so fucked in this country?? I just can't place it.....
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
but I'm sure you realize he has no chance. that doesnt mean I'm trying to talk you out of voting for him. please vote for whoever you want, thats your right.
So what you're saying is that people should vote Democratic, no matter what, to strategically vote against a Republican....even if we don't agree with their policies or like their record????
no no thats not what I'm saying at all. but wouldn't you agree that most if not all of nader supporters lean more left then right?
Even if they've did little more than sweet talk while in the senate and has almost nothing to show for it? Even if the Dem candidate doesn't represent my ideals or address the issues that matter most to me? We on the left are simply just supposed to vote Dem every election because some Rep might win if we don't???? Boy, there's a ton of accountability in your plan, lazy. The Dems could do whatever the fuck they please but we are still somehow obligated to vote for them, regardless?
Eh, I think I'll pass and vote for the guy who deserves it. You feel free to vote for whoever you're supposed to...whichever seems to be a little less than worst to you at the time. And that's what we'll keep seeing get elected into our gov't...a little less than worst or worst. I wonder why things are so fucked in this country?? I just can't place it.....
you are completely misunderstanding what I'm saying. but boy, do you love to rant about nothing
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
but I'm sure you realize he has no chance. that doesnt mean I'm trying to talk you out of voting for him. please vote for whoever you want, thats your right.
It's not all about winning, it's how you played the game.
It's not all about winning, it's how you played the game.
Probably or ones that would have stayed at home. I was going to write in Kucinich until Nader announced. What's your point here?
What are you saying exactly? That people should vote for who they think is best OR that they should vote Dem because McCain might win?
why is this so hard for you to understand? why are you thinking I'm saying people should vote for a particular candidate? I'm not.
here is my point..again. most if not all nader supporters are more in line with dems the republicans. correct? IF nader wasn't running, some/few/most would tend to vote for a democrat. but since he IS running, the dems will lose some/few/many votes to nader. and in such a close race, every vote counts. I really feel dumber for having to explain this like 3 times.
why is this so hard for you to understand? why are you thinking I'm saying people should vote for a particular candidate? I'm not.
here is my point..again. most if not all nader supporters are more in line with dems the republicans. correct? IF nader wasn't running, some/few/most would tend to vote for a democrat. but since he IS running, the dems will lose some/few/many votes to nader. and in such a close race, every vote counts. I really feel dumber for having to explain this like 3 times.
But you're not being direct. It's obvious to everyone here that when you vote for one guy, that vote doesn't go to the other guys.
Dems will lose votes bc of Nader running....well duh shit, but are you going anywhere with that statement or not?
What do you mean by 'in such a close race, every vote counts'? It counts towards the total votes that the person you voted for gets. Where else are you going with that, if anywhere?
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
But you're not being direct. It's obvious to everyone here that when you vote for one guy, that vote doesn't go to the other guys.
Dems will lose votes bc of Nader running....well duh shit, but are you going anywhere with that statement or not?
What do you mean by 'in such a close race, every vote counts'? It counts towards the total votes that the person you voted for gets. Where else are you going with that, if anywhere?
I'm just pointing out that by nader deciding to run, he is helping mccain get elected.
I'm just pointing out that by nader deciding to run, he is helping mccain get elected.
So you wouldn't say the main problem here is the Dems not getting enough support to win because of their lack of appeal to many leftist voters? Don't you think the Dems should earn their votes like everyone else?
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
So you wouldn't say the main problem here is the Dems not getting enough support to win because of their lack of appeal to many leftist voters? Don't you think the Dems should earn their votes like everyone else?
sure. but the fact remains. nader is taking away votes of dems. and really, for what? he has no chance of winning. its a waste if you ask me, but do as you will.
Comments
The idea that Nader takes votes from democrats is stale and plain wrong. If dems want my vote, they had damn well better earn it. They've done NOTHING but cater to the Bush and other republicans and support this god awful war. They are NOT progressive. I, for one am very much interested in PROGRESSive candidates and nothing less.
are blatant insults like this allowed around here? I take you for another high school kid like that roland guy. thats not an insult, just a maturity level observation. you know why? because there is nothing wrong with this world if a candidate you dont support wins. I think you'll understand when you get older. as for my logic, all I can say is Al Gore 2000. but you were probably much too young to know what happen then but heres a hint. Nader essentially lost gore florida, which ended up costing gore the election.
talk about insane logic. how does nader running HELP the dems? he is taking votes directly away from democrats. even though the communist says he and his buddies wouldn't vote for a democrat, many people who vote for nader would.
He helps by keeping the other guys honest, bringing ignored issues up and he helps to shape the Dem's platform into fitting more closely with what leftist types would like to see in their candidate. If they don't represent what we'd like to see done in this country why in the heck would we vote for them?
The Dems don't get our votes simply because they're not McCain. They have to represent the principles we value, tackle the problem issues that are swept under the rug by the others, their record should match their rhetoric, they need to have actually DONE things to make them deserving and not just said some things....
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Did you even bother reading the link to a thread on this I posted to you?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
sorry bout thats just not true for so many dems. I think even more so now because so many are anti-bush they will vote for anyone who isnt him no matter what. and if nader wasn't in the race, 99 times out of 100, the dems would get that vote.
o I'm sorry, I didn't know it was a rule around here to obey your every command. ...
fuck nader. he lost gore the election in 2000 and will help mccain get elected this time around. although he probably doesnt need much help.
oops nevermind..
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
Here are the actual results from the 2000 election:
Gore 50,999,897 48.38%
Bush 50,456,002 47.87%
Nader 2,882,955 2.74%
Total 105,405,100 100.00%*
* Includes all candidates
See: http://www.fec.gov/pubrec/2000presgeresults.htm
Allocating the 2,882,955 Nader votes along established patterns: 46% / 1,326,159 to Gore and 23% / 663,080 to Bush (leaving out the 31% of Nader voters who said they wouldn't have voted at all) shows Gore more than doubling his popular vote margin.
interesting...
'Are you gonna bark all day, little doggy, or are you gonna bite?'
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Masterframer. Now that's a name i have not heard in a long time :(
Where are you amigo?
You're far too kind...trust me.
masterframer is probably busy touring with Obama
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
Also, this isn't meant to be an insult but your statements are ignorant enough that I'm surprised any of us are even responding. Most of the time when people have no idea what the fuck they are talking about they just get ignored. This is just a very important issue to a lot of people here so it seems we're trying to help you understand. Unfortunately, you have some sort of learning disability. Maybe if someone on the TV was saying this stuff you'd finally get it...
Great post
And by the way lazymoon, I'm 31. Once again your logic has dumbfounded you.
so its ok for you to insult me if I call nader an asshole? what is he your dad? fuck nader.
again with the insults. the dems will lose votes to nader. thats a fact.
And? What's your point?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
that in doing that he is helping mccain get elected. unless you think nader actually has a chance of winning?
If he did, it would be nice.
So what you're saying is that people should vote Democratic, no matter what, to strategically vote against a Republican....even if we don't agree with their policies or like their record???? Even if they've did little more than sweet talk while in the senate and has almost nothing to show for it? Even if the Dem candidate doesn't represent my ideals or address the issues that matter most to me? We on the left are simply just supposed to vote Dem every election because some Rep might win if we don't???? Boy, there's a ton of accountability in your plan, lazy. The Dems could do whatever the fuck they please but we are still somehow obligated to vote for them, regardless?
Eh, I think I'll pass and vote for the guy who deserves it. You feel free to vote for whoever you're supposed to...whichever seems to be a little less than worst to you at the time. And that's what we'll keep seeing get elected into our gov't...a little less than worst or worst. I wonder why things are so fucked in this country?? I just can't place it.....
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
no no thats not what I'm saying at all. but wouldn't you agree that most if not all of nader supporters lean more left then right?
you are completely misunderstanding what I'm saying. but boy, do you love to rant about nothing
don't ever buy anything from there
edit: oops wrong thread I think :P
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
It's not all about winning, it's how you played the game.
Probably or ones that would have stayed at home. I was going to write in Kucinich until Nader announced. What's your point here?
What are you saying exactly? That people should vote for who they think is best OR that they should vote Dem because McCain might win?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Haha
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
why is this so hard for you to understand? why are you thinking I'm saying people should vote for a particular candidate? I'm not.
here is my point..again. most if not all nader supporters are more in line with dems the republicans. correct? IF nader wasn't running, some/few/most would tend to vote for a democrat. but since he IS running, the dems will lose some/few/many votes to nader. and in such a close race, every vote counts. I really feel dumber for having to explain this like 3 times.
But you're not being direct. It's obvious to everyone here that when you vote for one guy, that vote doesn't go to the other guys.
Dems will lose votes bc of Nader running....well duh shit, but are you going anywhere with that statement or not?
What do you mean by 'in such a close race, every vote counts'? It counts towards the total votes that the person you voted for gets. Where else are you going with that, if anywhere?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
I'm just pointing out that by nader deciding to run, he is helping mccain get elected.
So you wouldn't say the main problem here is the Dems not getting enough support to win because of their lack of appeal to many leftist voters? Don't you think the Dems should earn their votes like everyone else?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
sure. but the fact remains. nader is taking away votes of dems. and really, for what? he has no chance of winning. its a waste if you ask me, but do as you will.