Amen...the tax "refund" is such a scam. I don't understand why people want it -- you're paying them to effectively bury your money and then dig it up a few months later.
I talked to a friend of mine last night and she was all excited that she was getting a $1,200 "refund". I asked her if I could borrow $100 and then just give it back to her six months from now. She didn't get it.........
People honestly get mad when you tell them that a refund is a big scam. I just increased my withholdings to 4 (I'm single with no dependents), in the hopes of breaking even or even owing just a little. It increased my take home pay by $150 for a 2 week check. I'd rather spend it now than wait for another year to go by for them to give it back to me.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Amen...the tax "refund" is such a scam. I don't understand why people want it -- you're paying them to effectively bury your money and then dig it up a few months later.
I talked to a friend of mine last night and she was all excited that she was getting a $1,200 "refund". I asked her if I could borrow $100 and then just give it back to her six months from now. She didn't get it.........
How strange. I had this conversation with one of my co-workers just last night. I 'work it' so I pretty much break even. My co-worker asked me if I was upset because I wasn't getting much money back from the Feds. It was my money to begin with and it is NOT an interest-free loan from the gov't. I just prefer not to use the feds as a savings account.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
What power does any employee have to change anything about their job? What power does any person have to change anything about their life?
nothing and as much as they want to exercise. employees do not dictate policy to the government. nor should they. they are unelected. if decisions about taxation need to be made, they need to be made by the branch of the government that is elected and answerable to the people. not some upstart employee who thinks he knows better than everyone else in the country how the irs should operate.
It will likely be someone bitter that they have an education but couldn't adapt to a competitive marketplace, so they sought sanctuary in a sector where they will be rewarded merely for breathing in and out, and not thinking too much or rocking the boat.
Um, just so you know, professional positions (position requiring degrees) within the gov't are competitive and my experience has been that they pay better than the private sector.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
It's essentially a revenue neutral (and then some) national retail sales tax with a prebate paid to everyone with a social security number each month to ensure the people at the bottom are not getting screwed and paying taxes on the essentials of life etc.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
Um, just so you know, professional positions (position requiring degrees) within the gov't are competitive and my experience has been that they pay better than the private sector.
I have also known a number of government "professionals" who looked longingly at what we were doing in the private tech sector, but were unable/unwilling to make the move due to their personal risk profile.
If true, your comment highlights a VERY serious problem.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
It's essentially a revenue neutral (and then some) national retail sales tax with a prebate paid to everyone with a social security number each month to ensure the people at the bottom are not getting screwed and paying taxes on the essentials of life etc.
I have also known a number of government "professionals" who looked longingly at what we were doing in the private tech sector, but were unable/unwilling to make the move due to their personal risk profile.
If true, your comment highlights a VERY serious problem.
I wonder if you might explain that problem as you see it.
"The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr
Amen...the tax "refund" is such a scam. I don't understand why people want it -- you're paying them to effectively bury your money and then dig it up a few months later.
I talked to a friend of mine last night and she was all excited that she was getting a $1,200 "refund". I asked her if I could borrow $100 and then just give it back to her six months from now. She didn't get it.........
If you borrowed the $100 from your friend and gave it back 6 months later, do you think she'd call it a scam?
I wonder if you might explain that problem as you see it.
Sure.
#1 - their salaries are paid with tax dollars. This money should be used as efficiently as possible. Paying people equal to or great than the prevailing wage for a comparable private sector position is wasteful.
#2 - their jobs require less risk, and as soulsinging sees their roles, less innovation or self-motivation. They are given specific job functions, and they do the work. The jobs are relatively "safe" compared to private sector jobs. The risk : reward ratio is way out of whack.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
this "fair tax" conceept they posted seems to sound like what you're always bitching about... levying taxes based on one's use of services. the more you use, the more you contribute.
Is that what they do, the IRS? Excuse me for my ignorance about the US tax system.
Yes. The IRS requires me, as an employer, to withhold a % of my employees' income from their paychecks. In the spring, those employees then compute the actual amount of tax they owed for the previous year and then either a) pay an additional amount to cover a deficiency or b) receive a check back from the IRS for any overage.
this "fair tax" conceept they posted seems to sound like what you're always bitching about... levying taxes based on one's use of services. the more you use, the more you contribute.
Huh? You're not buying those services from the government.
#1 - their salaries are paid with tax dollars. This money should be used as efficiently as possible. Paying people equal to or great than the prevailing wage for a comparable private sector position is wasteful.
#2 - their jobs require less risk, and as soulsinging sees their roles, less innovation or self-motivation. They are given specific job functions, and they do the work. The jobs are relatively "safe" compared to private sector jobs. The risk : reward ratio is way out of whack.
1) i would think we would want some of the top people possible handling our governmental processes, so a high salary is essential to attracting such people. look at what's become of our educational system.
2) that's a misrepresentation. the power to tax is a congressional power. the irs is only the means of collecting such taxes. now if you're talking about innovation in the sense of making that process streamlined and efficient, sure ou want that. but employees of the irs cannot and should not be making sweeping national policy changes (like disbanding the tax system becos they think it's robbery) when that power is specifically left to congress. would you be ok with the epa being able to unilaterally seize your business becos some phone answering tech got an email about how the epa isn't doing a good job protecting the environment and decided it was his job to fix that in whatever way he saw fit?
I have also known a number of government "professionals" who looked longingly at what we were doing in the private tech sector, but were unable/unwilling to make the move due to their personal risk profile.
If true, your comment highlights a VERY serious problem.
Oh, don't get me wrong, the gov't can make something quite difficult due to their paperwork and 'red tape'. Something such as creating a new position in the private sector is a hell of a lot easier than in a federal institution. But, we don't all sit around daydreaming about the private sector. It has been my experience that it is much more difficult to get a coveted position with the feds in my field than with the private sector. I have my pick of positions in the private sector. I have worked for both and have enjoyed the benefits of both. I just wanted to point out that you statement was NOT a fair assessment of all federal positions.
BTW, How does my statement highlight a problem?
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
Huh? You're not buying those services from the government.
but you are availing yourself of the availablility and consistency in products and services that is protected by the federal government's regulation of interstate commerce.
Yes. The IRS requires me, as an employer, to withhold a % of my employees' income from their paychecks. In the spring, those employees then compute the actual amount of tax they owed for the previous year and then either a) pay an additional amount to cover a deficiency or b) receive a check back from the IRS for any overage.
The catch is the IRS gets you either way you decide. If you make a lot of money, and don't declare enough witholding, they'll require you to file quarterly estimated taxes. So you get to pay them 4 times a year based on what you think your income should be at the end of the year. If you declare too much withholding, the IRS keeps more of your paycheck. People who don't understand compounding interest and opportunity costs (or have no self-control in terms of saving) rejoice when they see how big their refund check will be. People who understand what has been done realize that the IRS just got free use of their money for the better part of the year.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
#1 - their salaries are paid with tax dollars. This money should be used as efficiently as possible. Paying people equal to or great than the prevailing wage for a comparable private sector position is wasteful.
#2 - their jobs require less risk, and as soulsinging sees their roles, less innovation or self-motivation. They are given specific job functions, and they do the work. The jobs are relatively "safe" compared to private sector jobs. The risk : reward ratio is way out of whack.
Why should a physician working for the federal gov't make less than those in the private sector. That physician is taking care of our veterans. How is that wasteful?
How do their jobs require less risk? You need to shadow me in one of our level 3 laboratories.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
but you are availing yourself of the availablility and consistency in products and services that is protected by the federal government's regulation of interstate commerce.
Hehe...the government's regulation of such things often increases prices, harms competition, and generally disserves consumers. But that's really beside the issue.
The proposed national sales tax system offers little improvement over the current crimes of taxation. It is still forced. It still happens regardless of the actual governmental contribution to commerce, good or bad. It still allows people to benefit more than they provide, or vise versa.
The only plusses I see there is that it's slightly more visible it would reduce my tax burden to zero since I'd simply buy nearly everything overseas.
#1 - their salaries are paid with tax dollars. This money should be used as efficiently as possible. Paying people equal to or great than the prevailing wage for a comparable private sector position is wasteful.
#2 - their jobs require less risk, and as soulsinging sees their roles, less innovation or self-motivation. They are given specific job functions, and they do the work. The jobs are relatively "safe" compared to private sector jobs. The risk : reward ratio is way out of whack.
I guess I'm a little surprised that isn't a 'given' there, like it is where I am. Government employees here notoriously have better security, great benefits and a better than average wage.
As for how soulsinging sees their roles, are you referring to the fact that he thinks that it is correct that such employees don't dictate policy to the government?
"The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr
Comments
He wouldn't have those problems if the government did not rob him every day of his life.
Because a very large portion of them do.
People honestly get mad when you tell them that a refund is a big scam. I just increased my withholdings to 4 (I'm single with no dependents), in the hopes of breaking even or even owing just a little. It increased my take home pay by $150 for a 2 week check. I'd rather spend it now than wait for another year to go by for them to give it back to me.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
from my window to yours
How strange. I had this conversation with one of my co-workers just last night. I 'work it' so I pretty much break even. My co-worker asked me if I was upset because I wasn't getting much money back from the Feds. It was my money to begin with and it is NOT an interest-free loan from the gov't. I just prefer not to use the feds as a savings account.
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
nothing and as much as they want to exercise. employees do not dictate policy to the government. nor should they. they are unelected. if decisions about taxation need to be made, they need to be made by the branch of the government that is elected and answerable to the people. not some upstart employee who thinks he knows better than everyone else in the country how the irs should operate.
Um, just so you know, professional positions (position requiring degrees) within the gov't are competitive and my experience has been that they pay better than the private sector.
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
what's the fair tax again? i don't recall the specifics.
It's tough to go over in a post, the summations and rebuttals are over on the website.
http://www.fairtax.org/fairtax/about.htm
It's essentially a revenue neutral (and then some) national retail sales tax with a prebate paid to everyone with a social security number each month to ensure the people at the bottom are not getting screwed and paying taxes on the essentials of life etc.
I have also known a number of government "professionals" who looked longingly at what we were doing in the private tech sector, but were unable/unwilling to make the move due to their personal risk profile.
If true, your comment highlights a VERY serious problem.
There's only one fair tax:
$ BUDGET / # OF TAXPAYERS = INDIVIDUAL TAX
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
If you borrowed the $100 from your friend and gave it back 6 months later, do you think she'd call it a scam?
naděje umírá poslední
If I spent $99 of it and only gave her $1 back, yes. Otherwise, if I gave her all $100 back I'd hope she'd call it pointless.
Is that what they do, the IRS? Excuse me for my ignorance about the US tax system.
naděje umírá poslední
Sure.
#1 - their salaries are paid with tax dollars. This money should be used as efficiently as possible. Paying people equal to or great than the prevailing wage for a comparable private sector position is wasteful.
#2 - their jobs require less risk, and as soulsinging sees their roles, less innovation or self-motivation. They are given specific job functions, and they do the work. The jobs are relatively "safe" compared to private sector jobs. The risk : reward ratio is way out of whack.
this "fair tax" conceept they posted seems to sound like what you're always bitching about... levying taxes based on one's use of services. the more you use, the more you contribute.
Yes. The IRS requires me, as an employer, to withhold a % of my employees' income from their paychecks. In the spring, those employees then compute the actual amount of tax they owed for the previous year and then either a) pay an additional amount to cover a deficiency or b) receive a check back from the IRS for any overage.
If she thought it was a good deal I might want to explain the concept of opportunity costs.
Huh? You're not buying those services from the government.
1) i would think we would want some of the top people possible handling our governmental processes, so a high salary is essential to attracting such people. look at what's become of our educational system.
2) that's a misrepresentation. the power to tax is a congressional power. the irs is only the means of collecting such taxes. now if you're talking about innovation in the sense of making that process streamlined and efficient, sure ou want that. but employees of the irs cannot and should not be making sweeping national policy changes (like disbanding the tax system becos they think it's robbery) when that power is specifically left to congress. would you be ok with the epa being able to unilaterally seize your business becos some phone answering tech got an email about how the epa isn't doing a good job protecting the environment and decided it was his job to fix that in whatever way he saw fit?
Oh, don't get me wrong, the gov't can make something quite difficult due to their paperwork and 'red tape'. Something such as creating a new position in the private sector is a hell of a lot easier than in a federal institution. But, we don't all sit around daydreaming about the private sector. It has been my experience that it is much more difficult to get a coveted position with the feds in my field than with the private sector. I have my pick of positions in the private sector. I have worked for both and have enjoyed the benefits of both. I just wanted to point out that you statement was NOT a fair assessment of all federal positions.
BTW, How does my statement highlight a problem?
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
but you are availing yourself of the availablility and consistency in products and services that is protected by the federal government's regulation of interstate commerce.
The catch is the IRS gets you either way you decide. If you make a lot of money, and don't declare enough witholding, they'll require you to file quarterly estimated taxes. So you get to pay them 4 times a year based on what you think your income should be at the end of the year. If you declare too much withholding, the IRS keeps more of your paycheck. People who don't understand compounding interest and opportunity costs (or have no self-control in terms of saving) rejoice when they see how big their refund check will be. People who understand what has been done realize that the IRS just got free use of their money for the better part of the year.
Why should a physician working for the federal gov't make less than those in the private sector. That physician is taking care of our veterans. How is that wasteful?
How do their jobs require less risk? You need to shadow me in one of our level 3 laboratories.
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
Hehe...the government's regulation of such things often increases prices, harms competition, and generally disserves consumers. But that's really beside the issue.
The proposed national sales tax system offers little improvement over the current crimes of taxation. It is still forced. It still happens regardless of the actual governmental contribution to commerce, good or bad. It still allows people to benefit more than they provide, or vise versa.
The only plusses I see there is that it's slightly more visible it would reduce my tax burden to zero since I'd simply buy nearly everything overseas.
As for how soulsinging sees their roles, are you referring to the fact that he thinks that it is correct that such employees don't dictate policy to the government?
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!