Dude seriously I'm scared

outontheporch

Man the way the world is now, I'm seriously scared every day of my life. There's not a moment that goes by where I'm not at least slightly peturbed about what will happen next. I'm not blambing GW or anyone in particular. I'll leave that to you guys. I'm paranoid now that a nuke will fall on my head any minute after hearing about N. Korea's test. I can't enjoy life 100%, because I'm always afraid now of my friend's in Iraq that are in danger. I already lost my best friend over there. Man the world sucks these days. But when did it ever not suck? Maybe back when all we had to worry about was grabbing some caveman food. But even they had to worry about dinasaurs or some crap. Whatever, I'm going to go have a beer and play some Final Fantasy and pretend I was in the game, instead of here.

sponger

I heard an expression on South Park the other day that went, "You are so Sept. 10." Times have changed, and I know where you're coming from. Just listen to lots of PJ and everything will be alright.

What helps me relax is thinking of how if we all got nuked tomorrow, I would have no more credit card bills, no more student loans to pay off, no wimpy toyota corolla that I'd have to drive around in, no logic-clouding libido to worry about, no more crappy job to go to....etc. Also, just be grateful you don't live in Tijuana. It smells like piss down there.

Byrnzie

What scares me is that 90% of Americans couldn't find North Korea on a map, and yet they are scared of the place! It's also scary how the media machine in the states is so effective at scaring, and indoctrinating the public. It's a shame that people have learned nothing from the example provided us by the years of propaganda and indoctrination in Germany in the 1930's, and of the effects that this can have.

wendy1976

i can't help thinking the exact same way.The world leaders are jumping up and down and you just cannot predict what wil happen next...that is scary to me.Wil n korea keep going on with provocation...and if so,how wil the rest of the world react.Is this a bonus to al those extremist(not pointing in a particular direction)out there to take this explosive situation and try and turning it in something they can add more shit too??
But the thing is....you cannot do anything about it but wait and hope it wil blow over(?).
I am almost afraid to turn on the news:(

PaperPlates

Byrnzie wrote:

What scares me is that 90% of Americans couldn't find North Korea on a map, and yet they are scared of the place! It's also scary how the media machine in the states is so effective at scaring, and indoctrinating the public. It's a shame that people have learned nothing from the example provided us by the years of propaganda and indoctrination in Germany in the 1930's, and of the effects that this can have.

what scares me is when people use made up statistics, like "90% of americans couldnt find North Korea on a map" and then other idjuts just believe it. And when people make ridiculous nazi comparisons, without fully understanding EITHER part of history, past or present. Sad really. Like sheep to the sheppard.

redrock

wendy1976 wrote:

Wil n korea keep going on with provocation...

Devil's advocate... why assume N. Korea going on with provocation? Could we not say they are simply trying to make sure they can defend themselves from 'others' (ie US) who have the bomb and are willing to use it?....

As I said, Devil's advocate. Instead of picking on certain countries and trying to stop them from developing nuclear weapons, ALL countries should get rid of theirs and then the threat will be gone (at least for nuclear bombs!).

sponger

N. Korea just wants respect and attention. It wants to be taken seriously like the other "big boys" on the world stage.

wendy1976

I think that n korea is doing a lot of provocation....just as any other country that owns and is willing to use nuclear bombs.So i think you missunderstood my point or did not make my point clear enough.I totally agree that al country's should destroy those bombs ...only then wil these situations end.
And as far as the being able to defend your selve goes...i think when youre are talking about nucleare weopons there is no such thing....you can only give the one attaking you the same treatment back....defending yourselve is thinking you have a chance of beating/winning.....but howe can you win when both you and your opponend are responsable for killing so many and f up the environment with radiation.

redrock

wendy1976 wrote:

I think that n korea is doing a lot of provocation....just as any other country that owns and is willing to use nuclear bombs.So i think you missunderstood my point or did not make my point clear enough.I totally agree that al country's should destroy those bombs ...only then wil these situations end.
And as far as the being able to defend your selve goes...i think when youre are talking about nucleare weopons there is no such thing....you can only give the one attaking you the same treatment back....defending yourselve is thinking you have a chance of beating/winning.....but howe can you win when both you and your opponend are responsable for killing so many and f up the environment with radiation.

I agree with you... I did say I was being devil's advocate.... As long as the US will continue to develop a weapon that, if used, could impact the CORE of the earth (yes... they are working on that)... no one has a chance. Money in all those countries intent on developing the 'most fearsome' weapon (which would eventually destroy them too!), should be spent on education, health, etc.

Byrnzie

PaperPlates wrote:

what scares me is when people use made up statistics, like "90% of americans couldnt find North Korea on a map" and then other idjuts just believe it. And when people make ridiculous nazi comparisons, without fully understanding EITHER part of history, past or present. Sad really. Like sheep to the sheppard.

Disregarding my made up estimate of 90%, please explain how you presume to know what knowledge I have of history, past or present.

polaris

wendy1976 wrote:

I think that n korea is doing a lot of provocation....just as any other country that owns and is willing to use nuclear bombs.So i think you missunderstood my point or did not make my point clear enough.I totally agree that al country's should destroy those bombs ...only then wil these situations end.
And as far as the being able to defend your selve goes...i think when youre are talking about nucleare weopons there is no such thing....you can only give the one attaking you the same treatment back....defending yourselve is thinking you have a chance of beating/winning.....but howe can you win when both you and your opponend are responsable for killing so many and f up the environment with radiation.

i think theoretically ... you are defending yourself because some countries would think twice about occupying your land if you had nukes ... we all know when the nukes fly - no one wins ... but they call them arms races for a reason ...

all i know is that i just don't see what is the difference between n. korea owning nukes or pakistan or india or the US for that matter ... and i don't buy the they will sell to iran propaganda excuse either because we all know who the largest arms dealers are in the world and we know those weapons are put to *not so good* uses ...

wendy1976

polaris wrote:

i think theoretically ... you are defending yourself because some countries would think twice about occupying your land if you had nukes ... we all know when the nukes fly - no one wins ... but they call them arms races for a reason ...

i think in theory that is what the countrys with nukes say.But in "reality" that would mean that if everyone had nuclear bombs no one would dare to invade another country???
Some of them wil think twice and decide to invade anyway....
I also think that for excample an american does not sleep better because they have nukes....knowing the ones that might oppose them also have them.
I would sleep a whole lot better if i knew there are no such bombs around....but he who would'nt

polaris

wendy1976 wrote:

i think in theory that is what the countrys with nukes say.But in "reality" that would mean that if everyone had nuclear bombs no one would dare to invade another country???
Some of them wil think twice and decide to invade anyway....
I also think that for excample an american does not sleep better because they have nukes....knowing the ones that might oppose them also have them.
I would sleep a whole lot better if i knew there are no such bombs around....but he who would'nt

well ... in reality ... no one has invaded countries with nukes ... that is why i think they call them arms races ...

true - the world would be safer without them but until everyone decides to get rid of them - it just isn't gonna happen ...

wendy1976

polaris wrote:

well ... in reality ... no one has invaded countries with nukes ... that is why i think they call them arms races ...

true - the world would be safer without them but until everyone decides to get rid of them - it just isn't gonna happen ...

you are right no one has invaded countries with nukes.....yet
lets hope it wil stay that way ....and that is what i was saying earlier,there is no way of knowing that. Thats is why i agreed to the first post of being scared.

gremmiev

Byrnzie wrote:

What scares me is that 90% of Americans couldn't find North Korea on a map, and yet they are scared of the place! It's also scary how the media machine in the states is so effective at scaring, and indoctrinating the public. It's a shame that people have learned nothing from the example provided us by the years of propaganda and indoctrination in Germany in the 1930's, and of the effects that this can have.

I have to say that I agree with this... History repeats itself and the world never seems to learn. What happened to Germany in the 30's was a direct reaction to the Allies embargo on them after the 1st world war. The Nazi's took their chance to grab the power on the back of the Versailles Treaty stringent rules about Germany's import/export and restrictions on the military, which left many Germans unemployed and plunged the country into a depression. All these factors in place, it was easy for Hitler to get to power by promising more jobs and promoting German patriotism. Then he was free to 'twist' the truth and force his views on the people by forms of propaganda, indoctrination and new laws governing the rights of the people. There are many cases of people being jailed or killed purely on the fact that they disagreed with the government.

The current situation with N. Korea is a difficult one as they are a closed country that we know very little about. In my mind, the worst thing that can happen to N. Korea is for the UN to enforce sanctions that restricts the import and export of goods. This could plunge an already poverty stricken country further into poverty and thus allowing the leadership to gather more support against ‘The West’.

jeffbr

gremmiev wrote:

The current situation with N. Korea is a difficult one as they are a closed country that we know very little about. In my mind, the worst thing that can happen to N. Korea is for the UN to enforce sanctions that restricts the import and export of goods. This could plunge an already poverty stricken country further into poverty and thus allowing the leadership to gather more support against ‘The West’.

What is your solution, then? We've tried ignoring them. We've tried talking with them. I'm completley opposed to military action over there. So it seems to me your "worst solution" sounds like the best solution.

thankyougrandma

sanctions would only make the peoples suffer more, the government officials and military officials won't lack any food or clean water even if you impose strict sanctions, only the population will suffer...

polaris

also ... in the west we have a perception that kim jong il is some wacko ... from all accounts that is far from the truth ... what the west needs to concern itself with is 1. if they administer some form of regime change - there are some real wackos in that country that would be 10 times worst and 2. understand the consequences of our actions - if you want to label a country an axis of evil ... well guess what - maybe they'll just decide to do that ... if i'm north korea now - i would be looking at protecting myself and it seems to only way to do that is to arm itself ... cuz they don't wanna be another afghanistan or iraq ...

gremmiev

jeffbr wrote:

What is your solution, then? We've tried ignoring them. We've tried talking with them. I'm completley opposed to military action over there. So it seems to me your "worst solution" sounds like the best solution.

The UN Security Council is currently drafting resolution that proposes strict financial and trade sanctions on N. Korea. The problem with this is that it will be the people that will suffer and not the leadership, who are the ones that should be targeted.

Military action is out of the question as this will only ignite an already volitile situation. Also Iran, who are trying to develop their own nuclear weapons, have just announced their support for N. Korea. Which doens't make matters better.

China, who has the most influence over the country, needs to use their leverage and force N. Korea to further talks and find a diplomatic solution... and if this fails THEN enforce financial sanctions and force inspections on all imports and exports of goods but do not stop aid getting to the people.

brainofPJ

my life's good, i have nothing to worry about. not going to effect me in anyway...

haha 'effect'...

just realized that

Collin

Dinosaurs?


Don't live in fear, it's useless.

hippiemom

Collin wrote:

Dinosaurs?


Don't live in fear, it's useless.

Exactly! You will face whatever life throws at you, the same as you always have, and if life throws the worst you'll probably surprise yourself and deal with it better than you'd have imagined. Going around being frightened won't improve the world's situation even one tiny bit, so why do it?

jeffbr

gremmiev wrote:

China, who has the most influence over the country, needs to use their leverage and force N. Korea to further talks and find a diplomatic solution... and if this fails THEN enforce financial sanctions and force inspections on all imports and exports of goods but do not stop aid getting to the people.

What would you consider a reasonable timeline for diplomatic solutions? I agree with you that diplomatic solutions are preferred and when they fail THEN enforce financial sanctions. So how much time do we give diplomatic solutions?

I also agree with you about China and I think they're getting a little tired and embarrassed by N. Korea, so I expect them to step up soon. It isn't in their interest to have N. Korea cause other Asian countries (ie Taiwan, Japan) to start pursuing nuke programs.

polaris

jeffbr wrote:

What would you consider a reasonable timeline for diplomatic solutions? I agree with you that diplomatic solutions are preferred and when they fail THEN enforce financial sanctions. So how much time do we give diplomatic solutions?

I also agree with you about China and I think they're getting a little tired and embarrassed by N. Korea, so I expect them to step up soon. It isn't in their interest to have N. Korea cause other Asian countries (ie Taiwan, Japan) to start pursuing nuke programs.

i propose not calling north korea an axis of evil ... negotiate to have our own weapons stock reduced especially nuclear ... agree never to invade or occupy the country ... that would be a start i say ...

binauralsounds

thankyougrandma wrote:

sanctions would only make the peoples suffer more, the government officials and military officials won't lack any food or clean water even if you impose strict sanctions, only the population will suffer...

so you think the people are taken care of now??? Lil kim is makin sure his people are not suffering???
Cmon!

Byrnzie

jeffbr wrote:

What is your solution, then? We've tried ignoring them. We've tried talking with them. I'm completley opposed to military action over there. So it seems to me your "worst solution" sounds like the best solution.

How about we leave them be, instead of provoking them into aggression? I mean, not evryone likes being fucked with.

binauralsounds

Byrnzie wrote:

How about we leave them be, instead of provoking them into aggression? I mean, not evryone likes being fucked with.

Tell that to China. They aren't too happy right bout now with that crazy bitch.

LikeAnOcean

outontheporch wrote:

Man the way the world is now, I'm seriously scared every day of my life. There's not a moment that goes by where I'm not at least slightly peturbed about what will happen next. I'm not blambing GW or anyone in particular. I'll leave that to you guys. I'm paranoid now that a nuke will fall on my head any minute after hearing about N. Korea's test. I can't enjoy life 100%, because I'm always afraid now of my friend's in Iraq that are in danger. I already lost my best friend over there. Man the world sucks these days. But when did it ever not suck? Maybe back when all we had to worry about was grabbing some caveman food. But even they had to worry about dinasaurs or some crap. Whatever, I'm going to go have a beer and play some Final Fantasy and pretend I was in the game, instead of here.

Where you alive during the cold war? Things were MUCH worse then. At one point we were a trigger from the end of the world.

jeffbr

Byrnzie wrote:

How about we leave them be, instead of provoking them into aggression? I mean, not evryone likes being fucked with.

So the head-in-the-sand solution is now on the table. And do you recommend that Japan, Taiwan and other countries in the vicinity just ignore them as well? This isn't just a US provocation. Even Russia and China, who aren't really our buddies, are concerned with N. Korea at this point.

Byrnzie

jeffbr wrote:

So the head-in-the-sand solution is now on the table. And do you recommend that Japan, Taiwan and other countries in the vicinity just ignore them as well? This isn't just a US provocation. Even Russia and China, who aren't really our buddies, are concerned with N. Korea at this point.

I would suggest that these other Asian countries focus most of their attention on diplomacy with the U.S. Afterall, it's the U.S that is rattling sabres as per usual. If it's not North Korea, then it's Iran. If it's not Iran, it's Sadaam and his 'weapons of mass destruction'. If it's not Sadaam, it's Castro. E.t.c, e.t.c, ad infinitum.
I would say that diplomacy needs to be pursued with both the U.S and North Korea by all third parties concerned.

LikeAnOcean

Whats scarier to me is not that they have them, but that they are already threatening to use them.