Sarah Palin question

mammasan
mammasan Posts: 5,656
edited September 2008 in A Moving Train
My girlfriend mentioned something about Palin this morning and it got me thinking. She stated that if Sarah Palin was a man or even an older less attractive woman she would not have been selected as the VP candidate. Now this is not an attack against her and I'm not trying to diminish any of her accomplishments, just merely asking what other thought about the statement.
"When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
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  • vduboise
    vduboise Posts: 1,937
    mammasan wrote:
    My girlfriend mentioned something about Palin this morning and it got me thinking. She stated that if Sarah Palin was a man or even an older less attractive woman she would not have been selected as the VP candidate. Now this is not an attack against her and I'm not trying to diminish any of her accomplishments, just merely asking what other thought about the statement.


    You are correct. They would not have picked "Mr. Palin". They picked her because:
    a) she is a woman- and they wanted to get the Hillary votes away from Obama.
    b) she is pretty- get the men who value looks on to the ticket- a distraction technique :D.
  • bootlegger10
    bootlegger10 Posts: 16,263
    Would Obama have been the nominee if he weren't black? Would he have even spoke at the 2004 DNC?

    Does Obama give a crap what Biden has to say, or was he just playing politics and picking someone with supposed foreign relations experience so the media would back off?

    The veep pick this year has been a game.
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    bootlegger10 wrote:
    Would Obama have been the nominee if he weren't black? Would he have even spoke at the 2004 DNC?

    Does Obama give a crap what Biden has to say, or was he just playing politics and picking someone with supposed foreign relations experience so the media would back off?

    The veep pick this year has been a game.

    Well there is a difference between Obama and Palin. Obama was selected by votes. Palin was picked by one man, or a small committee., but I do believe that you are right about Biden. had Obama's weekness not been foreign policy, and that being Biden's strength, he probably would not have picked him.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun
    LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun Posts: 6,097
    its all about being in the right place at the right time.
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    mammasan wrote:
    Well there is a difference between Obama and Palin. Obama was selected by votes. Palin was picked by one man, or a small committee., but I do believe that you are right about Biden. had Obama's weekness not been foreign policy, and that being Biden's strength, he probably would not have picked him.


    Biden brings more then foreign policy to the table...

    i think he had arguably the best resume for the VP job... out of anyone in government quite frankly
  • jimed14
    jimed14 Posts: 9,488
    watching her speak right now ... it's a train wreck.

    she's worse than a 7th grader reading a book report ....

    she's reading word for word of a script in front of her ... spouting how much aof a patriot and a maverick mccain is ... using pretty much every line she used the other night.

    nothing new.

    nothing about the republicans plan.



    yet ........ these people are lapping it up.

    If the people can vote Bush in '04 .... they can certainly be tricked into buying this crap. I fear for our future.
    "You're one of the few Red Sox fans I don't mind." - Newch91

    "I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    my2hands wrote:
    Biden brings more then foreign policy to the table...

    i think he had arguably the best resume for the VP job... out of anyone in government quite frankly


    What's so great about Biden's resume? Frankly, I'm not seeing anything so wonderful.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • saveuplife
    saveuplife Posts: 1,173
    mammasan wrote:
    My girlfriend mentioned something about Palin this morning and it got me thinking. She stated that if Sarah Palin was a man or even an older less attractive woman she would not have been selected as the VP candidate. Now this is not an attack against her and I'm not trying to diminish any of her accomplishments, just merely asking what other thought about the statement.


    I think she's probably right. But, this can go many ways. If Obama wasn't black, he may probably would not have been selected as the P candidate. If Bush wasn't the son of a former Pres, he may not have been selected as a P candidate. If Clinton didn't have a natural talent for speaking, he most likely would not have been president. We could probably think of generalizations for every single politician if we had the time for it.

    All politicians have idiosyncratic qualities.
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    This is not about Biden or Obama or McCain this is about the idea that a VP candidate may have been selected because of her appearance and not her credentials.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    saveuplife wrote:
    I think she's probably right. But, this can go many ways. If Obama wasn't black, he may probably would not have been selected as the P candidate. If Bush wasn't the son of a former Pres, he may not have been selected as a P candidate. If Clinton didn't have a natural talent for speaking, he most likely would not have been president. We could probably think of generalizations for every single politician if we had the time for it.

    All politicians have idiosyncratic qualities.

    True but if you take Bill Clinton away but put another candidate with the same appeal he still would have won. My point is that if you took Sarah Palin away and replaced her appearance, not her beliefs or credentials, would he/she still have been selected as the VP. The Barrack comparison is the same as Palin. If Obama was a white male would he have received the nomination?
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • puremagic
    puremagic Posts: 1,907
    Yes, because the public, the voters, the media, the opposition from the other candidates within his own party and the opposing party went after that man with a superfine tooth comb and he won his nomination.

    If wanted to play politics, he could have gone with the Virginia or TX pick and seriously upset the apple cart.

    McCain's vp pick has been a game. How much of a maverick is he if he couldn't even select his own vp choice?
    SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
  • norm
    norm Posts: 31,146
    the christian right doesn't like mccain but they know they couldn't nominate say huckabee whom i'm sure they wanted

    they realize mccain can get elected but they still wanted "one of theirs" at the top....so they searched for one and got a 2-fer-1 in palin....christian fundy and a woman...and a hot one at that....who speaks well...it was a helluva selection by the gop.....and it scares the shit out of me
  • catch22
    catch22 Posts: 1,081
    bootlegger10 wrote:
    Would Obama have been the nominee if he weren't black? Would he have even spoke at the 2004 DNC?

    Does Obama give a crap what Biden has to say, or was he just playing politics and picking someone with supposed foreign relations experience so the media would back off?

    The veep pick this year has been a game.

    the VP pick is always a game. obama would still have been the nominee this year (it's absurd to think the delegates picked him because he was black, i'd say sadly that he was chosen despite that fact because of his charisma), but i am honestly not sure if he would have spoken at the 2004 dnc or not. it's possible he wouldn't have.

    but palin was selected because she was a woman. if they'd picked a crusty old white guy with her views, their ship would be sunk. but they picked a young woman that allows them to package fashion in a palatable candidate because she doesn't look as scary as she is.
    and like that... he's gone.
  • saveuplife
    saveuplife Posts: 1,173
    mammasan wrote:
    True but if you take Bill Clinton away but put another candidate with the same appeal he still would have won. My point is that if you took Sarah Palin away and replaced her appearance, not her beliefs or credentials, would he/she still have been selected as the VP. The Barrack comparison is the same as Palin. If Obama was a white male would he have received the nomination?


    I don't know if you are right about the Bill Clinton thing. Supposedly, he was considered "attractive". LOL. So, if you replaced Dick Cheney's look and style with Clinton, I think he would've lost. But, that's just my opinion.

    I think you are def right that Sarah Palin would not have been selected if she wasn't a woman. I def think Obama would not have received the nomination if he wasn't black.

    Ever since JFK, looks have mattered.... I think your gf is totally right.
  • Solat13
    Solat13 Posts: 6,996
    It goes both ways though.

    Would Obama be sending Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York, Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano and Kansas Gov. Kathleen Sebelius to speak on his behalf if the GOP had a picked a Charlie Crist, Mitt Romney or someone similar as the VP?

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080905/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_obama_women

    I think the last think Obama ever thought he'd need was Hillary's help in this campaign.
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  • Pacomc79
    Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    impossible to say really without any inside knowledge. On the off hand I say, well obviously they took her because she's a woman.

    It's also possible that she is Closest to McCain in beliefs and he felt like he could work with her, that's not going to be the case with one of the people that lost to him like Romney, and who knows about Charlie Christ.

    It could also be that he wanted an attractive younger person with the same ideals as him as important as image is in an election these days.

    I don't think it's completely as simple as "she's a woman" but I definately think it played a large role in the decision to select her over the others. Put average unknown male governor in Alaska in the same circumstance and I doubt they are the choice. She might even be a better choice because of her lack of heavy public exposure prior to her selection.

    McCain may well not get along really well with many people in his own party, after all he was pretty well taken out in 2000 and he's spent 8 years moving closer to them really so to select a guy like Mitt Romney I just can't see them getting along at all.
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    saveuplife wrote:
    I don't know if you are right about the Bill Clinton thing. Supposedly, he was considered "attractive". LOL. So, if you replaced Dick Cheney's look and style with Clinton, I think he would've lost. But, that's just my opinion.

    I think you are def right that Sarah Palin would not have been selected if she wasn't a woman. I def think Obama would not have received the nomination if he wasn't black.

    Ever since JFK, looks have mattered.... I think your gf is totally right.


    I agree with my gf, but in thinking about it, especially with all the sexist talk going around lately, isn't her selection basically sexist. I mean if she looked like Bea Author, sorry Bea, do you think she would have been picked. Probably not so that would leave me to believe that her looks had more to do with it than her credentials. That is sexism. Now of course this is all speculation since we can't prove it.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • saveuplife
    saveuplife Posts: 1,173
    Pacomc79 wrote:
    impossible to say really without any inside knowledge. On the off hand I say, well obviously they took her because she's a woman.

    It's also possible that she is Closest to McCain in beliefs and he felt like he could work with her, that's not going to be the case with one of the people that lost to him like Romney, and who knows about Charlie Christ.

    It could also be that he wanted an attractive younger person with the same ideals as him as important as image is in an election these days.

    I don't think it's completely as simple as "she's a woman" but I definately think it played a large role in the decision to select her over the others. Put average unknown male governor in Alaska in the same circumstance and I doubt they are the choice. She might even be a better choice because of her lack of heavy public exposure prior to her selection.

    Dude, that quote tag under your name is awesome.
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    Solat13 wrote:
    It goes both ways though.

    Would Obama be sending Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York, Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano and Kansas Gov. Kathleen Sebelius to speak on his behalf if the GOP had a picked a Charlie Crist, Mitt Romney or someone similar as the VP?

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080905/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_obama_women

    I think the last think Obama ever thought he'd need was Hillary's help in this campaign.

    Well that is just good strategy. If he comes out throwing shots at her it could be perceived as sexist. In order to avoid that send a woman to throw your jabs for you.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • inmytree
    inmytree Posts: 4,741
    mammasan wrote:
    My girlfriend mentioned something about Palin this morning and it got me thinking. She stated that if Sarah Palin was a man or even an older less attractive woman she would not have been selected as the VP candidate. Now this is not an attack against her and I'm not trying to diminish any of her accomplishments, just merely asking what other thought about the statement.

    I think your girlfriend is correct in her assessment...however, I think Plains social stances sealed the deal...

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