I'd go just to view the people ...

blacknapkins

... because they sound absolutely hilarious.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070529/ap_on_re_us/creation_museum_opening

MrBrian

Because they have a different view/belief in something, no matter how strange it may be or may not be, you want to go over and laugh at them?

Alex_Coe

Well, it is pretty ridiculous. Religion was always supported by the fact that evidence doesn't mattter. You can't prove or disprove religion whether you are a priest or an atheist. This museum kid of takes a shit all over the ideal that religion does not have to be based on science.

After all, why call it a museum unless it's to be taken scientifically?

blackredyellow

I like this analysis in that article...

Lawrence Krauss, an author and physicist at Cleveland's Case Western Reserve University, decided to view the museum firsthand.

"It's really impressive — and it really gives the impression that they're talking about science at some point," Krauss said. On a scale of 1 to 5, with 5 being best, "I'd give it a 4 for technology, 5 for propaganda. As for content, I'd give it a negative 5."

crittables

blackredyellow wrote:

I like this analysis in that article...

Lawrence Krauss, an author and physicist at Cleveland's Case Western Reserve University, decided to view the museum firsthand.

"It's really impressive — and it really gives the impression that they're talking about science at some point," Krauss said. On a scale of 1 to 5, with 5 being best, "I'd give it a 4 for technology, 5 for propaganda. As for content, I'd give it a negative 5."

haha, i was getting ready to post that quote too. you beat me to it.

i'm sorry but i find the whole creation argument a bit nuts. and here is why:

"Some exhibits show dinosaurs aboard Noah's Ark and assert that all animals were vegetarians until Adam committed the first sin in the Garden of Eden."

small town beck

That must have been some ark Noah had if he had dinosaurs on there too

Ahh what passes for entertainment these days :rolleyes:

jeffbr

I get a kick out of people making bank off of blind religionists. More power to them! I hope that "museum" is wildly financially successful.

Cosmo

If people need something to believe in... good. I firmly believe hope and faith are great qualities to have. But, hope and faith are not truths. They are beliefs.
This museum is... well, not for me. Just like if the Scientologists built a museum to prove that L.Ron Hubbard holds the truth. The Church of Scientology and the Church of Christianity are one in the same to me... foundations based upon religion to earn tax free dollars. I'll pass on both... but, i'll continue to follow Jesus, not L.Ron.
...
And about the Ark... i would NOT want to share the same land mass as Tyrannasarus Rex, let alone cabin space.

small town beck

Cosmo wrote:

If people need something to believe in... good. I firmly believe hope and faith are great qualities to have. But, hope and faith are not truths. They are beliefs.
This museum is... well, not for me. Just like if the Scientologists built a museum to prove that L.Ron Hubbard holds the truth. The Church of Scientology and the Church of Christianity are one in the same to me... foundations based upon religion to earn tax free dollars. I'll pass on both... but, i'll continue to follow Jesus, not L.Ron.
...
And about the Ark... i would NOT want to share the same land mass as Tyrannasarus Rex, let alone cabin space.

hahaha..just imagine using the loo after ol' T Rex :eek:

Cosmo

small town beck wrote:

hahaha..just imagine using the loo after ol' T Rex :eek:

...
I saw a newslet that showed an animatronic diorama of Adam naming the animals... and there were lions and giraffees and elephants and DINOSAURS. And people have told me that the lions and T.Rexs were strict vegetarians before Adam bit the apple... you know that as soon as that happened, ol' T.Rex would have done to Adam what that T.Rex in Jurrasic Park did to that lawyer sitting on the can.

RolandTD20Kdrummer

After reading this, I pretty much dismissed the place.

http://www.creationmuseum.org/about

.

angelica

Alex_Coe wrote:

After all, why call it a museum unless it's to be taken scientifically?

Ever heard of the famed Madame Tussauds Wax Museum? Not only can we see our fave actors and actors immortalized in.... wax.... but we can also gleefully delight in wax conceptions of Britney Spears, Madonna and Beyonce! Sounds scientific, huh....er, at least...uh, historic maybe?

See my point? ...... people can, for the most part, differentiate between science and religion. People can be trusted to discern for themselves. They won't be "hoodwinked" unless they already believe this stuff.

small town beck

Cosmo wrote:

...
I saw a newslet that showed an animatronic diorama of Adam naming the animals... and there were lions and giraffees and elephants and DINOSAURS. And people have told me that the lions and T.Rexs were strict vegetarians before Adam bit the apple... you know that as soon as that happened, ol' T.Rex would have done to Adam what that T.Rex in Jurrasic Park did to that lawyer sitting on the can.

I can just see a lion having a lovely arugula salad now

Adam naming the animals??? Now that is classic and the dinosaurs too??? WOW. Also, I don't remember dinosaurs in the bible? Although I will admit I am not a huge bible buff.

gue_barium

Some exhibits show dinosaurs aboard Noah's Ark and assert that all animals were vegetarians until Adam committed the first sin in the Garden of Eden

.

Good god.

gue_barium

angelica wrote:

Ever heard of the famed Madame Tussauds Wax Museum? Not only can we see our fave actors and actors immortalized in.... wax.... but we can also gleefully delight in wax conceptions of Britney Spears, Madonna and Beyonce! Sounds scientific, huh....er, at least...uh, historic maybe?

See my point? ...... people can, for the most part, differentiate between science and religion. People can be trusted to discern for themselves. They won't be "hoodwinked" unless they already believe this stuff.

But, a museum dedicated to children's stories is one thing...if you call it a children's museum.

angelica

gue_barium wrote:

But, a museum dedicated to children's stories is one thing...if you call it a children's museum.

I think they are entitled to call it whatever they want. I support it. These are their beliefs. More power to them if they want to teach their children with such life-like and impactful tools. It's a free country. If people don't like it, they don't have to go.

gue_barium

angelica wrote:

I think they are entitled to call it whatever they want. I support it. These are their beliefs. More power to them if they want to teach their children with such life-like and impactful tools. It's a free country. If people don't like it, they don't have to go.

Then you agree that it is a children's Museum?

angelica

gue_barium wrote:

Then you agree that it is a children's Museum?

I'm sure they have their own purposes. It's not my place to define the purposes of their museum for them. And those who go can also define their own purposes for doing so.

The thing is that I feel I don't have the right to impose my beliefs on their view/vision. If I have a different view, it's up to me to create on behalf of that.

gue_barium

angelica wrote:

I'm sure they have their own purposes. It's not my place to define the purposes of their museum for them. And those who go can also define their own purposes for doing so.

The thing is that I feel I don't have the right to impose my beliefs on their view/vision. If I have a different view, it's up to me to create on behalf of that.

I was asking your opinion on the storytelling aspect of it. Surely, that they are telling children that carnivores were vegetarians before Adam and Eve messed up in Eden...and that there were dinosaurs on Noah's Ark (is that even in the Bible? lol)...um, it seems lke children's stories, to me, and I thought you agreed. Fiction is fiction, right?

angelica

gue_barium wrote:

I was asking your opinion on the storytelling aspect of it. Surely, that they are telling children that carnivores were vegetarians before Adam and Eve messed up in Eden...and that there were dinosaurs on Noah's Ark (is that even in the Bible? lol)...um, it seems lke children's stories, to me, and I thought you agreed. Fiction is fiction, right?

If you remember the infamous Einstein article* from the other day, we're all attributing arbitrary value to everything. It's all dependent on our worldviews. Again, it's about how humans process information, and our "signifiers" that represent what IS real. The signifiers aren't what is real. They are all arbitrary, due to what we are predisposed to comprehend.

I, for some reason, happen to understand all points of religious view, and how they all stem from the exact same basic principles, and are sculped and molded by our different psychological and cultural views. I totally support even the fundamental Christian view. Their idea of reality is different than, say, a scientist's. Each one is perceiving reality. This illusion that science is any less manmade, in my opinion, is the big hoax here. I say this with complete and utmost seriousness.

*http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3671/is_200310/ai_n9308281

Purple Hawk

angelica wrote:

I'm sure they have their own purposes. It's not my place to define the purposes of their museum for them. And those who go can also define their own purposes for doing so.

The thing is that I feel I don't have the right to impose my beliefs on their view/vision. If I have a different view, it's up to me to create on behalf of that.

it's always easier to assume that others with a different perspective are whack jobs (not that I'VE ever been guilty of that, of course!) than to understand the perspective itself.

we all have the right to impose our opinions on their (people we disagree with) beliefs, and there's nothing wrong with calling out views we disagree with. gotta get down into the issues, and that's not an easy process...before you can really understand where all sides are coming from...or even understand your own view.

either way...way to derail a pointless thread into a meaningful discussion

small town beck

angelica wrote:

Ever heard of the famed Madame Tussauds Wax Museum? Not only can we see our fave actors and actors immortalized in.... wax.... but we can also gleefully delight in wax conceptions of Britney Spears, Madonna and Beyonce! Sounds scientific, huh....er, at least...uh, historic maybe?

See my point? ...... people can, for the most part, differentiate between science and religion. People can be trusted to discern for themselves. They won't be "hoodwinked" unless they already believe this stuff.

So uhmmm was that not really Brad Pitt's ass I grabbed :eek:

I agree with what you said not my cup of tea but whatever floats your boat. I do find it odd though I have an uncle who I consider quite religious( I am NOT ) and he would never hesitate to tell me I am wrong yet I don't think he is wrong per se or would never say "your beliefs are wrong".. who would I be to say that??? Not what I believe but your beliefs are the one thing you truly own.

RolandTD20Kdrummer

"Its inspiration is the Bible — the literal interpretation that contends God created the heavens and the earth and everything in them just a few thousand years ago."

" 'If the Bible is the word of God, and its history really is true, that’s our presupposition or axiom, and we are starting there,” museum founder Ken Ham said during recent tour of the sleek and modern facility' "

"Ham said he believes most fossils are the result of the Great Flood described in Genesis."

“Americans just aren’t gullible enough to believe that they came from a fish,” he said.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14122311/


anyone that believes the earth is only a few thousand years old is a stone cold lunatic...

angelica

Purple Hawk wrote:

it's always easier to assume that others with a different perspective are whack jobs (not that I'VE ever been guilty of that, of course!) than to understand the perspective itself.

we all have the right to impose our opinions on their (people we disagree with) beliefs, and there's nothing wrong with calling out views we disagree with. gotta get down into the issues, and that's not an easy process...before you can really understand where all sides are coming from...or even understand your own view.

either way...way to derail a pointless thread into a meaningful discussion

...that darn gue...stirring up meaning and value in this discussion....

I, personally, do not have the right to impose my views on others. I have the right to have my view, and to share my view, even if I'm sharing a view of what another does. But if I am being psychologically sound and honest, I must own that it is my view. If I were to impose my view on another, analyzing and telling them what they "are" doing, or what beliefs they "should" hold, I would be infringing on them. It is this base fact of psychology that has 98% of the population tied up with one another, rather than being psychologically indivual and "whole". I'm not making this up, either.

angelica

small town beck wrote:

So uhmmm was that not really Brad Pitt's ass I grabbed :eek:

I agree with what you said not my cup of tea but whatever floats your boat. I do find it odd though I have an uncle who I consider quite religious( I am NOT ) and he would never hesitate to tell me I am wrong yet I don't think he is wrong per se or would never say "your beliefs are wrong".. who would I be to say that??? Not what I believe but your beliefs are the one thing you truly own.

I spent many years telling people they were wrong, and it sure didn't work for me. It actually ensured a lot of conflict for me! I've come to totally agree with your perspective here: "who would I be to say that???" in regards to someone's view being wrong. I do get opinionated, and I do think others are "wrong" a lot. Ultimately, the only safe bet for me is to present what I see. That way I know I'm being accurate, 'cause I can speak for myself and my view.

Purple Hawk

angelica wrote:

...that darn gue...stirring up meaning and value in this discussion....

I, personally, do not have the right to impose my views on others. I have the right to have my view, and to share my view, even if I'm sharing a view of what another does. But if I am being psychologically sound and honest, I must own that it is my view. If I were to impose my view on another, analyzing and telling them what they "are" doing, or what beliefs they "should" hold, I would be infringing on them. It is this base fact of psychology that has 98% of the population tied up with one another, rather than being psychologically indivual and "whole". I'm not making this up, either.

well...gue is obviously a wing nut , but there are a number of views held by credible people I disagree with...i don't view it as "imposing" anything...it's more of differentiating right and wrong. granted, that perspective varies, but i think all of us, regardless of background, can agree on certain core principles...and agreeing on those is not imposing anything, it's recognizing what we think is right, i think we all have a common grasp of what is right and wrong...that is the most basic of human concepts. it's where we go from there.

angelica

Purple Hawk wrote:

well...gue is obviously a wing nut , but there are a number of views held by credible people I disagree with...i don't view it as "imposing" anything...it's more of differentiating right and wrong. granted, that perspective varies, but i think all of us, regardless of background, can agree on certain core principles...and agreeing on those is not imposing anything, it's recognizing what we think is right, i think we all have a common grasp of what is right and wrong...that is the most basic of human concepts. it's where we go from there.

Disagreeing is valid, imo. The idea is that there are two different views, and they are at odds with each other. It's when we are infringing in our disagreement that I take issue with.

If you see that people agree on core principles, I disagree!

If we did agree on those core principles, that would not be infringing. But when we believe our core principles are "right" and try telling another they are "wrong" for their core principles when we disagree, I say we've overstepped our bounds. And we get payback when we infringe--we create disharmony and will incur the consequences. It's not a crime, and as I say, basically everyone does it. If we're sensitive to it, we can always adjust, and get our balance back and learn. But, at base, these consequences are very real. We pay the price for less than ideal behaviours. Evolutionarily speaking, it would be great if we were in synch with that feedback. Unfortunately, us masses have ourselves numbed out by the external world and our TVs and gadgets, etc, that we're really out of touch and are not learning so much.

RolandTD20Kdrummer

anyone that completely tosses science out the window (as in this case) is in for a pretty serious reality crash one day...

maybe that's what Prozac is for...

Any way to make a buck off people I suppose.

small town beck

angelica wrote:

I spent many years telling people they were wrong, and it sure didn't work for me. It actually ensured a lot of conflict for me! I've come to totally agree with your perspective here: "who would I be to say that???" in regards to someone's view being wrong. I do get opinionated, and I do think others are "wrong" a lot. Ultimately, the only safe bet for me is to present what I see. That way I know I'm being accurate, 'cause I can speak for myself and my view.

Just to be clear I still haven't lost my passion for a good argument And I have been told I hate to be wrong... I believe the term my good friend used was "a know it all" and sure if I know I am right I do NOT back down but if I am wrong I will admit it. usually Thank goodness that doesn't happen often

I am still trying to figure out whose ass that was?? .

Abookamongstthemany

angelica wrote:

I spent many years telling people they were wrong, and it sure didn't work for me. It actually ensured a lot of conflict for me! I've come to totally agree with your perspective here: "who would I be to say that???" in regards to someone's view being wrong. I do get opinionated, and I do think others are "wrong" a lot. Ultimately, the only safe bet for me is to present what I see. That way I know I'm being accurate, 'cause I can speak for myself and my view.

Same here...I am so tired of telling people they are wrong. What does it accomplish number one and number two...everyone thinks they are right, so how is my 'right' any better than their 'right'? All I can do is accept that people see things very differently and speak of my own truth...speak of what matters to me and hope it resonates with others. This board is living proof that shouting out how wrong the other guy is just a waste of time and energy. We've been posting here for years and how many people have really changed their stances? Nothing ever changes that way...people just shut you out. If you focus on the positives of what you believe, it will gain support and people will more readily flow towards your point of view.

NMyTree

Rumor has it Adam ate Eve long before the apple was bitten.

Vegetarians my ass!