I saw the best minds of my generation destroyed by madness, starving hysterical naked,
dragging themselves through the negro streets at dawn looking for an angry fix,
angelheaded hipsters burning for the ancient heavenly connection to thestarry dynamo in the machinery of night,
who poverty and tatters and hollow-eyed and high sat up smoking in the supernatural darkness of cold-water fiats 'doating across the tops of cities contemplating jazz,
who bared their brains to Heaven under the El and saw Mohammedan angels staggering on tenement roofs illuminated,
who passed through universities with radiant cool eyes hallucinating Arkansas and Blake-light tragedy among the scholars of war,
who were expelled from the academies for crazy & publishing obscene odes on the windows of the skull,
who cowered in unshaven rooms in underwear, burning their money in wastebaskets and listening to the Terror through the wall,
who got busted in their pubic beards returning through Laredo with a belt of marijuana for New York,
who ate fire in paint hotels or drank turpentine in Paradise Alley, death, or purgatoried their torsos night after night,
with dreams, with drugs, with waking nightmares, alcohol and cock and endless balls,
incomparable blind streets of shuddering cloud and lightning in the mind leaping toward poles of Canada & Paterson, illuminating all the motionless world of Time between,
Peyote solidities of halls, backyard green tree cemetery dawns, wine drunkenness over the rooftops, storefront boroughs of teahead joyride neon blinking traffic light, sun and moon and tree vibrations in the roaring winter dusks of Brooklyn, ashcan rantings and kind king light of mind,
who chained themselves to subways for the endless ride from Battery to holy Bronx on benzedrine until the noise of wheels and children brought them down shuddering mouth-wracked and battered bleak of brain all drained of brilliance in the drear light of Zoo,
who sank all night in submarine light of Bickford's floated out and sat through the stale beer afternoon in desolate Fugazzi's, I listening to the crack of doom on the hydrogen jukebox,
who talked continuously seventy hours from park to pad to bar to Bellevue to museum to the Brooklyn Bridge,
a lost battalion of platonic conversationalists jumping down the stoops off fire escapes off windowsills off Empire State out of the moon, yacketayakking screaming vomiting whispering facts and memories and anecdotes and eyeball kicks and shocks of hospitals and jails and wars,
whole intellects disgorged in total recall for seven days and nights with brilliant eyes, meat for the Synagogue cast on the pavement,
who vanished into nowhere Zen New Jersey leaving a trail of ambiguous picture postcards of Atlantic City Hall,
suffering Eastern sweats and Tangerian bone-grindings and migraines of China under junk-withdrawal in Newark's bleak furnished room,
who wandered around and around at midnight in the railroad yard wondering where to go, and went, leaving no broken hearts,
who lit cigarettes in boxcars boxcars boxcars racketing through snow toward lonesome farms in grandfather night,
who studied Plotinus Poe St. John of the Cross telepathy and bop kaballa because the cosmos instinctively vibrated at their feet in Kansas,
who loned it through the streets of Idaho seeking visionary indian angels,
who were visionary indian angels,
who thought they were only mad when Baltimore gleamed in supernatural ecstasy,
who jumped in limousines with the Chinaman of Oklahoma on the impulse of winter midnight streetlight smalltown rain,
who lounged hungry and lonesome through Houston seeking jazz or sex or soup, and followed the brilliant Spaniard to converse about America and Eternity, a hopeless task, and so took ship to Africa,
who disappeared into the volcanoes of Mexico leaving behind nothing but the shadow of dungarees and the lava and ash of poetry scattered in fireplace Chicago,
who reappeared on the West Coast investigating the E.B.I. in beards and shorts with big pacifist eyes sexy in their dark skin passing out incomprehensible leaflets,
who burned cigarette holes in their arms protesting the narcotic tobacco haze of Capitalism . . .
i sure hope,pearlmutt,my american or whatever country friend,
he wasnt gender confused!;)
A whisper and a thrill
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
Ali, what was this about? Were those two lines meant to sum up something about drugs and american-indian culture? I've gotta say I got none of that. Can you explain where you were coming from in your writing, because it's completely gone over my head. Keep in mind we are not all american on here, so if there are some specific american references that only americans would understand could you explian them. thanks, because this whole thread seems a little bit crazy to me, you write about america haters and hippies and all of a sudden your talking about indians and drugs.
Well,you should GET INTO american culture and contact who you need to contact to change your freedoms.
Don't you think America wants to visit the other countries to promote peace?
And in Amsterdam,where drugs are legal,they represent antohther "tribe",
much like the American Indians.
You gotta realize who your friends are,other countries foreign to me who believe in GOd.And thats my poiint.The rest of you can be fuckers.
A whisper and a thrill
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
don't worry pacifier, I'm not too sure what is going on either but it makes for quite interesting readin. i think it might be because i'm not an american or an american hater or an america hater or a native american or a hippie or a drug addict or ... i'm sure there's something else.... all good though.
I don’t think you can/should honestly try to compare the drug problems in north America to spiritual / ritual / medicinal use. I know people who take various banned substances for glaucoma, MS, arthritis, Parkinson’s, etc….and I mean that is all good. I also know many natives who still practice healing ceremonies and what not that include hashish or pot, I even know many recreational users…but to overlook the bigger issues is an insult to every one of those people. Drugs are a problem. Even if only pot….heavy users are a strain on society, but not nearly as much so as coke, crack, meth, etc users. As far as comparing street drugs to aspirin?????????? Why even go there…a form of medication designed specifically to treat ailments, and fairly hard to abuse or become dependant on. Are you going to compare taking a Tylenol to using coke to settle nerves? I have no problem with drug users. I have huge issues with drug abusers. They are a mental and financial strain on loved ones, and society as a whole. They lead to crime, unemployment, increased insurance rates, violence, strains on taxpayers via rehab. No it is not something most can control, and not to many would use if they had the choice, but they are a pain none the less. I feel I can say this without thinking twice or worrying about stepping over boundaries because of my personal history. I have seen both sides and I know what I say is true.
As far as Americans spreading peace….yes, there is a lot of that. There is however also a lot of butting in where they are not really wanted. It’s one thing to offer help in changing, it is another to slam it down somebody’s throat. What one views as freedom, is not what all view as free. Do you honestly believe anybody is free? You conform, as do I, to the government’s reign, otherwise society as we know it here simply would not exist.
Yes Coca Cola had cocaine in originally, which is why it was banned. It was replaced by a legal drug….modified caffeine.
BTW, Amsterdam is seriously changing their “red-light district” image. It is a continuously shrinking area, and you really don’t want to break the rules there anymore.
The only thing I enjoy is having no feelings....being numb rocks!
And I won't make the same mistakes
(Because I know)
Because I know how much time that wastes
(And function)
Function is the key
great post depopulation, but i eespecially love this part:
What one views as freedom, is not what all view as free.
great, great words and so true. and hell, i am american and i don't get this thread at all. so all you foreigners, don't feel left out, i think most of us are. hehe. me, i say feck all haters, b/c...why hate?
Well,you should GET INTO american culture and contact who you need to contact to change your freedoms.
Don't you think America wants to visit the other countries to promote peace?
And in Amsterdam,where drugs are legal,they represent antohther "tribe",
much like the American Indians.
You gotta realize who your friends are,other countries foreign to me who believe in GOd.And thats my poiint.The rest of you can be fuckers.
Ok, this totally goes of track and doesn't answer my question at all, but in response to what you are saying I know more than enough about American culture, we get bombarded with it here in Australia and I have to say it's a culture that I don't want to 'get into'. Most Americans that I have met seem like really great people, but America as a whole does not appeal to me.
And as for changing my freedoms? WHAT? I am perfectly free. I live in Australia, I'm free to do as I wish and say what I wish, I'm free to get sick and poor because my government supports me during hard times and I'm free to feel safe because Australia is a hell of a lot safer than most countries, including America, I'm sure.
I have no idea the relevance of Amsterdam and legal drugs and other tribes, so I won't even bother responiding to that.
Realise who our friends are? America has Australia in their back pocket, don't worry about that, but being friends with only countries that believe in God seems rediculous to me. Australia is a multicultural country, most of the people here probably don't believe in the same God I do, should we all turn in on ourselves?
Look, as I've said before, I really have no idea where you are coming from and the more you write the less connected everything you are saying seems to be. My original question was what did the two lines in your poem mean?
don't worry pacifier, I'm not too sure what is going on either but it makes for quite interesting readin. i think it might be because i'm not an american or an american hater or an america hater or a native american or a hippie or a drug addict or ... i'm sure there's something else.... all good though.
Yes, I think that may be the case with me too. Interesting? sure, but definately confusing!
great post depopulation, but i eespecially love this part:
What one views as freedom, is not what all view as free.
great, great words and so true. and hell, i am american and i don't get this thread at all. so all you foreigners, don't feel left out, i think most of us are. hehe. me, i say feck all haters, b/c...why hate?
I saw the best minds of my generation destroyed by madness, starving hysterical naked,
dragging themselves through the negro streets at dawn looking for an angry fix,
angelheaded hipsters burning for the ancient heavenly connection to thestarry dynamo in the machinery of night,
who poverty and tatters and hollow-eyed and high sat up smoking in the supernatural darkness of cold-water fiats 'doating across the tops of cities contemplating jazz,
who bared their brains to Heaven under the El and saw Mohammedan angels staggering on tenement roofs illuminated,
who passed through universities with radiant cool eyes hallucinating Arkansas and Blake-light tragedy among the scholars of war,
who were expelled from the academies for crazy & publishing obscene odes on the windows of the skull,
who cowered in unshaven rooms in underwear, burning their money in wastebaskets and listening to the Terror through the wall,
who got busted in their pubic beards returning through Laredo with a belt of marijuana for New York,
who ate fire in paint hotels or drank turpentine in Paradise Alley, death, or purgatoried their torsos night after night,
with dreams, with drugs, with waking nightmares, alcohol and cock and endless balls,
incomparable blind streets of shuddering cloud and lightning in the mind leaping toward poles of Canada & Paterson, illuminating all the motionless world of Time between,
Peyote solidities of halls, backyard green tree cemetery dawns, wine drunkenness over the rooftops, storefront boroughs of teahead joyride neon blinking traffic light, sun and moon and tree vibrations in the roaring winter dusks of Brooklyn, ashcan rantings and kind king light of mind,
who chained themselves to subways for the endless ride from Battery to holy Bronx on benzedrine until the noise of wheels and children brought them down shuddering mouth-wracked and battered bleak of brain all drained of brilliance in the drear light of Zoo,
who sank all night in submarine light of Bickford's floated out and sat through the stale beer afternoon in desolate Fugazzi's, I listening to the crack of doom on the hydrogen jukebox,
who talked continuously seventy hours from park to pad to bar to Bellevue to museum to the Brooklyn Bridge,
a lost battalion of platonic conversationalists jumping down the stoops off fire escapes off windowsills off Empire State out of the moon, yacketayakking screaming vomiting whispering facts and memories and anecdotes and eyeball kicks and shocks of hospitals and jails and wars,
whole intellects disgorged in total recall for seven days and nights with brilliant eyes, meat for the Synagogue cast on the pavement,
who vanished into nowhere Zen New Jersey leaving a trail of ambiguous picture postcards of Atlantic City Hall,
suffering Eastern sweats and Tangerian bone-grindings and migraines of China under junk-withdrawal in Newark's bleak furnished room,
who wandered around and around at midnight in the railroad yard wondering where to go, and went, leaving no broken hearts,
who lit cigarettes in boxcars boxcars boxcars racketing through snow toward lonesome farms in grandfather night,
who studied Plotinus Poe St. John of the Cross telepathy and bop kaballa because the cosmos instinctively vibrated at their feet in Kansas,
who loned it through the streets of Idaho seeking visionary indian angels,
who were visionary indian angels,
who thought they were only mad when Baltimore gleamed in supernatural ecstasy,
who jumped in limousines with the Chinaman of Oklahoma on the impulse of winter midnight streetlight smalltown rain,
who lounged hungry and lonesome through Houston seeking jazz or sex or soup, and followed the brilliant Spaniard to converse about America and Eternity, a hopeless task, and so took ship to Africa,
who disappeared into the volcanoes of Mexico leaving behind nothing but the shadow of dungarees and the lava and ash of poetry scattered in fireplace Chicago,
who reappeared on the West Coast investigating the E.B.I. in beards and shorts with big pacifist eyes sexy in their dark skin passing out incomprehensible leaflets,
who burned cigarette holes in their arms protesting the narcotic tobacco haze of Capitalism . . .
a nice artifact, i think. it's still got some life to it. yes, it does.
It's pretty simple....I do not hate 'America'. However, I do believe that the Bush administration should all be hung for crimes against humanity. There is a difference between somebody hating a corrupt government, and someone who hates an entire 'country' - whatever that means - I mean, how do you hate a country?? Is it possible for someone to hate the grand canyon, the redwoods, Pearl Jam, Mark Twain, Walt Whitman, Harley Davidson Motorcycles, Hunter S Thompson, Jimi Hendrix, Niagra Falls, e.t.c, e.t.c, ad infinitum. I HATE THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT - I DO NOT HATE AMERICA! THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING!!
finsburypark (are u abu hamza?) made the vital assertion that good ol' smacky Allen writes shit poetry. I have to agree, if H.L Mencken was still around when Ginny was writing he wouldn't have lasted 5 minutes and today we wouldn't be subjected to unecessary howling about the 'spirituality' of his work. This is a man who 'ommed' his way back into his soul when trouble was headed his way...true we may aver that as a classic humanist, of artistic bent and romantic nature Ginsberg has influenced the conception of some quality writing, but lets not forget his portrait of social/political realism is one with many holes and doesn't really provide 'that little glimpse of truth for which we have forgotten to ask.'
What do you call 3 sheep tied together in the middle of Wales? - A Leisure Centre.
finsburypark (are u abu hamza?) made the vital assertion that good ol' smacky Allen writes shit poetry. I have to agree, if H.L Mencken was still around when Ginny was writing he wouldn't have lasted 5 minutes and today we wouldn't be subjected to unecessary howling about the 'spirituality' of his work. This is a man who 'ommed' his way back into his soul when trouble was headed his way...true we may aver that as a classic humanist, of artistic bent and romantic nature Ginsberg has influenced the conception of some quality writing, but lets not forget his portrait of social/political realism is one with many holes and doesn't really provide 'that little glimpse of truth for which we have forgotten to ask.'
Haha, no I'm not Old Hooky. I'm named after some carrots Ed Vedder threw from the stage at Finsbury Park in 1993. One hit me on the head.
Anyway, yes, about Allen, what bugs me are all these adjectives and adverbs , and over-long lines that neither show nor tell anything except that he's no Yeats when it comes to political symbolism.
Who would you say was a good "Condition of America" poet though, if such a thing exists?
"artistic bent and romantic nature Ginsberg has influenced the conception of some quality writing, but lets not forget his portrait of social/political realism is one with many holes and doesn't really provide 'that little glimpse of truth for which we have forgotten to ask.'"
i actually like the supermarket poem by ginsberg better as to america's condition. i'll try to find it. i could actually be wrong, maybe it's not ginsberg's . . . i think it is though.
i thought howl though really covered a lot of what ali was bringing up . . . drugs, peyote in particular, indians, hippies, hate -- perhaps even self-hate, not sure, and of course capitalism and its result on some americans, which i can't help think of when i think of america:
"angelheaded hipsters burning for the ancient heavenly connection to thestarry dynamo in the machinery of night,
Peyote solidities of halls, backyard green tree cemetery dawns, wine drunkenness over the rooftops, storefront boroughs of teahead joyride neon blinking traffic light, sun and moon and tree vibrations in the roaring winter dusks of Brooklyn, ashcan rantings and kind king light of mind,
who loned it through the streets of Idaho seeking visionary indian angels,
who were visionary indian angels,
who burned cigarette holes in their arms protesting the narcotic tobacco haze of Capitalism . . ."
years ago, when i first read howl and i was a lot younger, i thought, you've got to be kidding me, you are a melodramatic fool if this is what you think america is, now that i'm a little older though i feel a great deal of sympathy and understanding when i read it. . . just my two cents.
ginsberg, america, and a reference to the new pearl jam cd . . . can you find it:
A Supermarket in California
Allen Ginsberg
What thoughts I have of you tonight, Walt Whitman, for
I walked down the sidestreets under the trees with a headache
self-conscious looking at the full moon.
In my hungry fatigue, and shopping for images, I went
into the neon fruit supermarket, dreaming of your enumerations!
What peaches and what penumbras! Whole families
shopping at night! Aisles full of husbands! Wives in the
avocados, babies in the tomatoes!--and you, Garcia Lorca, what
were you doing down by the watermelons?
I saw you, Walt Whitman, childless, lonely old grubber,
poking among the meats in the refrigerator and eyeing the grocery
boys.
I heard you asking questions of each: Who killed the
pork chops? What price bananas? Are you my Angel?
I wandered in and out of the brilliant stacks of cans
following you, and followed in my imagination by the store
detective.
We strode down the open corridors together in our
solitary fancy tasting artichokes, possessing every frozen
delicacy, and never passing the cashier.
Where are we going, Walt Whitman? The doors close in
an hour. Which way does your beard point tonight?
(I touch your book and dream of our odyssey in the
supermarket and feel absurd.)
Will we walk all night through solitary streets? The
trees add shade to shade, lights out in the houses, we'll both be
lonely.
Will we stroll dreaming of the lost America of love
past blue automobiles in driveways, home to our silent cottage?
Ah, dear father, graybeard, lonely old courage-teacher,
what America did you have when Charon quit poling his ferry and
you got out on a smoking bank and stood watching the boat
disappear on the black waters of Lethe?
god, i love that poem . . . "where are you going walt whitman?" this of could be a reference to whitman's chocolates, but i doubt it.
whoops, where are we going, walt whitman? . . . i think it was a better question, and well, we know the answer, of course, we went to the supermarket . . .
Ok, this totally goes of track and doesn't answer my question at all, but in response to what you are saying I know more than enough about American culture, we get bombarded with it here in Australia and I have to say it's a culture that I don't want to 'get into'. Most Americans that I have met seem like really great people, but America as a whole does not appeal to me.
And as for changing my freedoms? WHAT? I am perfectly free. I live in Australia, I'm free to do as I wish and say what I wish, I'm free to get sick and poor because my government supports me during hard times and I'm free to feel safe because Australia is a hell of a lot safer than most countries, including America, I'm sure.
I have no idea the relevance of Amsterdam and legal drugs and other tribes, so I won't even bother responiding to that.
Realise who our friends are? America has Australia in their back pocket, don't worry about that, but being friends with only countries that believe in God seems rediculous to me. Australia is a multicultural country, most of the people here probably don't believe in the same God I do, should we all turn in on ourselves?
Look, as I've said before, I really have no idea where you are coming from and the more you write the less connected everything you are saying seems to be. My original question was what did the two lines in your poem mean?
great post.
There is a reason many Americans who travel abroad depart from Canada, and put the big ol mapple leaf on their stuff. The US and Canada are very similar in many aspects, including freedoms....yet Canadians are generally recieved better around the world...there is no arguing that. I know some Americans, and generally speaking, americans are great. It is more the media I have the issue with. It is great to want to assert democracy to other nations....does that include MTV? I bring this up, as it is a major point brought up in the Middle East about 5 years ago. I do not hate Americans, but the overbaring "American Ego" can be frustrating.
BTW, IMO the tittle of this thread says enough..."f all you american haters" Personally, as a Canadian, I would not be too upset if people said they hated Canada. I would not cuss at them. I would instead feel a bit hurt that we conveyed a bad image, accept that they don't like us, but always leave an outstreatched hand to let them know that I do not feel the same about them. But, maybe that is just me.
The only thing I enjoy is having no feelings....being numb rocks!
And I won't make the same mistakes
(Because I know)
Because I know how much time that wastes
(And function)
Function is the key
There is a reason many Americans who travel abroad depart from Canada, and put the big ol mapple leaf on their stuff. The US and Canada are very similar in many aspects, including freedoms....yet Canadians are generally recieved better around the world...there is no arguing that. I know some Americans, and generally speaking, americans are great. It is more the media I have the issue with. It is great to want to assert democracy to other nations....does that include MTV? I bring this up, as it is a major point brought up in the Middle East about 5 years ago. I do not hate Americans, but the overbaring "American Ego" can be frustrating.
BTW, IMO the tittle of this thread says enough..."f all you american haters" Personally, as a Canadian, I would not be too upset if people said they hated Canada. I would not cuss at them. I would instead feel a bit hurt that we conveyed a bad image, accept that they don't like us, but always leave an outstreatched hand to let them know that I do not feel the same about them. But, maybe that is just me.
As an America, I am happy to live here and be breathing actually, but I don't agree with everything we do. We make the best with what we are given. I don't believe that the antics of others - such as government - speak for an entire country. They are the front men but don't speak for everyone. Nothing is ever that black and white. It is just not my belief to judge anyone that way. Did you decide to be white or black or have the mother and father that you have or to be born where you were born? Each person is individual regardless of who/where they are. I do think Depop did a great job of summing up how I feel in his last paragraph above. I agree that America seems overbearing and I have watched as others and been embarrased and disappointed by what our government leads us into. That does not stop my love of America and the versatility and beauty that can be found here also. Like anywhere else, there is good here also, not just bad. Peace & Love regardless of who/where you are...
Our love must not be just words, but True Love, which shows itself in action,
No one needs a smile more than someone who fails to give one,
After you die...you know how to LIVE!
Talking of great Americans...check out Henry Miller if you havn't already - 'Tropic of Capricorn' and 'Tropic of Cancer' - Two of my top five favourite books of all time.
Art is only a means to life, to the life more abundant. It is not in itself the life more abundant. It merely points the way, something which is overlooked not only by the public, but very often by the artist himself. In becoming an end it defeats itself.
Henry Miller
Chaos is the score upon which reality is written.
Henry Miller
Confusion is a word we have invented for an order which is not understood.
Henry Miller
Develop an interest in life as you see it; the people, things, literature, music - the world is so rich, simply throbbing with rich treasures, beautiful souls and interesting people. Forget yourself.
Henry Miller
Develop interest in life as you see it; in people, things, literature, music - the world is so rich, simply throbbing with rich treasures, beautiful souls and interesting people. Forget yourself.
Henry Miller
Every man has his own destiny: the only imperative is to follow it, to accept it, no matter where it leads him.
Henry Miller
Every man with a bellyful of the classics is an enemy to the human race.
Henry Miller
I have never been able to look upon America as young and vital but rather as prematurely old, as a fruit which rotted before it had a chance to ripen.
Henry Miller
I have no money, no resources, no hopes. I am the happiest man alive.
Henry Miller
I see America spreading disaster. I see America as a black curse upon the world. I see a long night settling in and that mushroom which has poisoned the world withering at the roots.
Henry Miller
If men cease to believe that they will one day become gods then they will surely become worms.
Henry Miller
If there is to be any peace it will come through being, not having.
Henry Miller
If we are always arriving and departing, it is also true that we are eternally anchored. One's destination is never a place but rather a new way of looking at things.
Henry Miller
Imagination is the voice of daring. If there is anything Godlike about God it is that. He dared to imagine everything.
Henry Miller
In expanding the field of knowledge we but increase the horizon of ignorance.
Henry Miller
In this age, which believes that there is a short cut to everything, the greatest lesson to be learned is that the most difficult way is, in the long run, the easiest.
Henry Miller
Instead of asking - "How much damage will the work in question bring about?" why not ask - "How much good? How much joy?"
Henry Miller
Life is 440 horsepower in a 2-cylinder engine.
Henry Miller
Life is constantly providing us with new funds, new resources, even when we are reduced to immobility. In life's ledger there is no such thing as frozen assets.
Henry Miller
Life, as it is called, is for most of us one long postponement.
Henry Miller
Moralities, ethics, laws, customs, beliefs, doctrines - these are of trifling import. All that matters is that the miraculous become the norm.
Henry Miller
Music is a beautiful opiate, if you don't take it too seriously.
Henry Miller
Nine-tenths of our sickness can be prevented by right thinking plus right hygiene - nine-tenths of it!
Henry Miller
No man is great enough or wise enough for any of us to surrender our destiny to. The only way in which anyone can lead us is to restore to us the belief in our own guidance.
Henry Miller
No matter how vast, how total, the failure of man here on earth, the work of man will be resumed elsewhere. War leaders talk of resuming operations on this front and that, but man's front embraces the whole universe.
Henry Miller
Obscenity is a cleansing process, whereas pornography only adds to the murk.
Henry Miller
One has to be a lowbrow, a bit of a murderer, to be a politician, ready and willing to see people sacrificed, slaughtered, for the sake of an idea, whether a good one or a bad one.
Henry Miller
One of the reasons why so few of us ever act, instead of react, is because we are continually stifling our deepest impulses.
Henry Miller
One's destination is never a place but rather a new way of looking at things.
Henry Miller
Our own physical body possesses a wisdom which we who inhabit the body lack. We give it orders which make no sense.
Henry Miller
Plots and character don't make life. Life is here and now, anytime you say the word, anytime you let her rip.
Henry Miller
Sex is one of the nine reasons for reincarnation... the other eight are unimportant.
Henry Miller
The aim of life is to live, and to live means to be aware, joyously, drunkenly, serenely, divinely aware.
Henry Miller
The City of New York is like an enormous citadel, a modern Carcassonne. Walking between the magnificent skyscrapers one feels the presence on the fringe of a howling, raging mob, a mob with empty bellies, a mob unshaven and in rags.
Henry Miller
The concert is a polite form of self induced torture.
Henry Miller
The great work must inevitably be obscure, except to the very few, to those who like the author himself are initiated into the mysteries. Communication then is secondary: it is perpetuation which is important. For this only one good reader is necessary.
Henry Miller
The legal system is often a mystery, and we, its priests, preside over rituals baffling to everyday citizens.
Henry Miller
The man who is forever disturbed about the condition of humanity either has no problems of his own or has refused to face them.
Henry Miller
The man who looks for security, even in the mind, is like a man who would chop off his limbs in order to ahve artificial ones which will give him no pain or trouble.
Henry Miller
The moment one gives close attention to any thing, even a blade of grass it becomes a mysterious, awesome, indescribably magnificent world in itself.
Henry Miller
The one thing we can never get enough of is love. And the one thing we never give enough is love.
Henry Miller
The ordinary man is involved in action, the hero acts. An immense difference.
Henry Miller
The real leader has no need to lead - he is content to point the way.
Henry Miller
The waking mind is the least serviceable in the arts.
Henry Miller
The word "civilization" to my mind is coupled with death. When I use the word, I see civilization as a crippling, thwarting thing, a stultifying thing. For me it was always so. I don't believe in the golden ages, you see... civilization is the arteriosclerosis of culture.
Henry Miller
The world is not to be put in order; the world is order, incarnate. It is for us to harmonize with this order.
Henry Miller
There is no salvation in becoming adapted to a world which is crazy.
Henry Miller
Topographically the country is magnificent - and terrifying. Why terrifying? Because nowhere else in the world is the divorce between man and nature so complete. Nowhere have I encountered such a dull, monotonous fabric of life as here in America. Here boredom reaches its peak.
Henry Miller
True strength lies in submission which permits one to dedicate his life, through devotion, to something beyond himself.
Henry Miller
Until we accept the fact that life itself is founded in mystery, we shall learn nothing.
Henry Miller
We do not talk - we bludgeon one another with facts and theories gleaned from cursory readings of newspapers, magazines and digests.
Henry Miller
We have two American flags always: one for the rich and one for the poor. When the rich fly it means that things are under control; when the poor fly it means danger, revolution, anarchy.
Henry Miller
We live in the mind, in ideas, in fragments. We no longer drink in the wild outer music of the streets - we remember only.
Henry Miller
What holds the world together, as I have learned from bitter experience, is sexual intercourse.
Henry Miller
Whatever I do is done out of sheer joy; I drop my fruits like a ripe tree. What the general reader or the critic makes of them is not my concern.
Henry Miller
Whatever there be of progress in life comes not through adaptation but through daring.
Henry Miller
When one is trying to do something beyond his known powers it is useless to seek the approval of friends. Friends are at their best in moments of defeat.
Henry Miller
Whenever a taboo is broken, something good happens, something vitalizing. Taboos after all are only hangovers, the product of diseased minds, you might say, of fearsome people who hadn't the courage to live and who under the guise of morality and religion have imposed these things upon us.
Henry Miller
don't worry pacifier, I'm not too sure what is going on either but it makes for quite interesting readin. i think it might be because i'm not an american or an american hater or an america hater or a native american or a hippie or a drug addict or ... i'm sure there's something else.... all good though.
Please.If my cousins in Germany heard me call them Nazis,they would call me a fat American.And thats only cause of my meds,Karen,You bitch:D
A whisper and a thrill
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
i disagree, and certainly not directed at people, especially people you don't even know. perhaps hate directed at hateful activities, ideas and concepts.....
Comments
PEACE
*^*^*^*^*^*^*^RED MOSQUITO #2^*^*^*^*^*^*^*
Dublin 08/06
Katowice 06/07 London 06/07 Dusseldorf 06/07 Nijgemen 06/07
he wasnt gender confused!;)
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
Don't you think America wants to visit the other countries to promote peace?
And in Amsterdam,where drugs are legal,they represent antohther "tribe",
much like the American Indians.
You gotta realize who your friends are,other countries foreign to me who believe in GOd.And thats my poiint.The rest of you can be fuckers.
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
As far as Americans spreading peace….yes, there is a lot of that. There is however also a lot of butting in where they are not really wanted. It’s one thing to offer help in changing, it is another to slam it down somebody’s throat. What one views as freedom, is not what all view as free. Do you honestly believe anybody is free? You conform, as do I, to the government’s reign, otherwise society as we know it here simply would not exist.
Yes Coca Cola had cocaine in originally, which is why it was banned. It was replaced by a legal drug….modified caffeine.
BTW, Amsterdam is seriously changing their “red-light district” image. It is a continuously shrinking area, and you really don’t want to break the rules there anymore.
And I won't make the same mistakes
(Because I know)
Because I know how much time that wastes
(And function)
Function is the key
What one views as freedom, is not what all view as free.
great, great words and so true. and hell, i am american and i don't get this thread at all.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
Ok, this totally goes of track and doesn't answer my question at all, but in response to what you are saying I know more than enough about American culture, we get bombarded with it here in Australia and I have to say it's a culture that I don't want to 'get into'. Most Americans that I have met seem like really great people, but America as a whole does not appeal to me.
And as for changing my freedoms? WHAT? I am perfectly free. I live in Australia, I'm free to do as I wish and say what I wish, I'm free to get sick and poor because my government supports me during hard times and I'm free to feel safe because Australia is a hell of a lot safer than most countries, including America, I'm sure.
I have no idea the relevance of Amsterdam and legal drugs and other tribes, so I won't even bother responiding to that.
Realise who our friends are? America has Australia in their back pocket, don't worry about that, but being friends with only countries that believe in God seems rediculous to me. Australia is a multicultural country, most of the people here probably don't believe in the same God I do, should we all turn in on ourselves?
Look, as I've said before, I really have no idea where you are coming from and the more you write the less connected everything you are saying seems to be. My original question was what did the two lines in your poem mean?
I agree, great words there depop
a nice artifact, i think. it's still got some life to it. yes, it does.
7/11/06, 8/11/06, 18/11/06
escape is never the safest plan...
Haha, no I'm not Old Hooky. I'm named after some carrots Ed Vedder threw from the stage at Finsbury Park in 1993. One hit me on the head.
Anyway, yes, about Allen, what bugs me are all these adjectives and adverbs , and over-long lines that neither show nor tell anything except that he's no Yeats when it comes to political symbolism.
Who would you say was a good "Condition of America" poet though, if such a thing exists?
i actually like the supermarket poem by ginsberg better as to america's condition. i'll try to find it. i could actually be wrong, maybe it's not ginsberg's . . . i think it is though.
i thought howl though really covered a lot of what ali was bringing up . . . drugs, peyote in particular, indians, hippies, hate -- perhaps even self-hate, not sure, and of course capitalism and its result on some americans, which i can't help think of when i think of america:
"angelheaded hipsters burning for the ancient heavenly connection to thestarry dynamo in the machinery of night,
Peyote solidities of halls, backyard green tree cemetery dawns, wine drunkenness over the rooftops, storefront boroughs of teahead joyride neon blinking traffic light, sun and moon and tree vibrations in the roaring winter dusks of Brooklyn, ashcan rantings and kind king light of mind,
who loned it through the streets of Idaho seeking visionary indian angels,
who were visionary indian angels,
who burned cigarette holes in their arms protesting the narcotic tobacco haze of Capitalism . . ."
years ago, when i first read howl and i was a lot younger, i thought, you've got to be kidding me, you are a melodramatic fool if this is what you think america is, now that i'm a little older though i feel a great deal of sympathy and understanding when i read it. . . just my two cents.
A Supermarket in California
Allen Ginsberg
What thoughts I have of you tonight, Walt Whitman, for
I walked down the sidestreets under the trees with a headache
self-conscious looking at the full moon.
In my hungry fatigue, and shopping for images, I went
into the neon fruit supermarket, dreaming of your enumerations!
What peaches and what penumbras! Whole families
shopping at night! Aisles full of husbands! Wives in the
avocados, babies in the tomatoes!--and you, Garcia Lorca, what
were you doing down by the watermelons?
I saw you, Walt Whitman, childless, lonely old grubber,
poking among the meats in the refrigerator and eyeing the grocery
boys.
I heard you asking questions of each: Who killed the
pork chops? What price bananas? Are you my Angel?
I wandered in and out of the brilliant stacks of cans
following you, and followed in my imagination by the store
detective.
We strode down the open corridors together in our
solitary fancy tasting artichokes, possessing every frozen
delicacy, and never passing the cashier.
Where are we going, Walt Whitman? The doors close in
an hour. Which way does your beard point tonight?
(I touch your book and dream of our odyssey in the
supermarket and feel absurd.)
Will we walk all night through solitary streets? The
trees add shade to shade, lights out in the houses, we'll both be
lonely.
Will we stroll dreaming of the lost America of love
past blue automobiles in driveways, home to our silent cottage?
Ah, dear father, graybeard, lonely old courage-teacher,
what America did you have when Charon quit poling his ferry and
you got out on a smoking bank and stood watching the boat
disappear on the black waters of Lethe?
god, i love that poem . . . "where are you going walt whitman?" this of could be a reference to whitman's chocolates, but i doubt it.
great post.
There is a reason many Americans who travel abroad depart from Canada, and put the big ol mapple leaf on their stuff. The US and Canada are very similar in many aspects, including freedoms....yet Canadians are generally recieved better around the world...there is no arguing that. I know some Americans, and generally speaking, americans are great. It is more the media I have the issue with. It is great to want to assert democracy to other nations....does that include MTV? I bring this up, as it is a major point brought up in the Middle East about 5 years ago. I do not hate Americans, but the overbaring "American Ego" can be frustrating.
BTW, IMO the tittle of this thread says enough..."f all you american haters" Personally, as a Canadian, I would not be too upset if people said they hated Canada. I would not cuss at them. I would instead feel a bit hurt that we conveyed a bad image, accept that they don't like us, but always leave an outstreatched hand to let them know that I do not feel the same about them. But, maybe that is just me.
And I won't make the same mistakes
(Because I know)
Because I know how much time that wastes
(And function)
Function is the key
As an America, I am happy to live here and be breathing actually, but I don't agree with everything we do. We make the best with what we are given. I don't believe that the antics of others - such as government - speak for an entire country. They are the front men but don't speak for everyone. Nothing is ever that black and white. It is just not my belief to judge anyone that way. Did you decide to be white or black or have the mother and father that you have or to be born where you were born? Each person is individual regardless of who/where they are. I do think Depop did a great job of summing up how I feel in his last paragraph above. I agree that America seems overbearing and I have watched as others and been embarrased and disappointed by what our government leads us into. That does not stop my love of America and the versatility and beauty that can be found here also. Like anywhere else, there is good here also, not just bad. Peace & Love regardless of who/where you are...
No one needs a smile more than someone who fails to give one,
After you die...you know how to LIVE!
Henry Miller
Chaos is the score upon which reality is written.
Henry Miller
Confusion is a word we have invented for an order which is not understood.
Henry Miller
Develop an interest in life as you see it; the people, things, literature, music - the world is so rich, simply throbbing with rich treasures, beautiful souls and interesting people. Forget yourself.
Henry Miller
Develop interest in life as you see it; in people, things, literature, music - the world is so rich, simply throbbing with rich treasures, beautiful souls and interesting people. Forget yourself.
Henry Miller
Every man has his own destiny: the only imperative is to follow it, to accept it, no matter where it leads him.
Henry Miller
Every man with a bellyful of the classics is an enemy to the human race.
Henry Miller
I have never been able to look upon America as young and vital but rather as prematurely old, as a fruit which rotted before it had a chance to ripen.
Henry Miller
I have no money, no resources, no hopes. I am the happiest man alive.
Henry Miller
I see America spreading disaster. I see America as a black curse upon the world. I see a long night settling in and that mushroom which has poisoned the world withering at the roots.
Henry Miller
If men cease to believe that they will one day become gods then they will surely become worms.
Henry Miller
If there is to be any peace it will come through being, not having.
Henry Miller
If we are always arriving and departing, it is also true that we are eternally anchored. One's destination is never a place but rather a new way of looking at things.
Henry Miller
Imagination is the voice of daring. If there is anything Godlike about God it is that. He dared to imagine everything.
Henry Miller
In expanding the field of knowledge we but increase the horizon of ignorance.
Henry Miller
In this age, which believes that there is a short cut to everything, the greatest lesson to be learned is that the most difficult way is, in the long run, the easiest.
Henry Miller
Instead of asking - "How much damage will the work in question bring about?" why not ask - "How much good? How much joy?"
Henry Miller
Life is 440 horsepower in a 2-cylinder engine.
Henry Miller
Life is constantly providing us with new funds, new resources, even when we are reduced to immobility. In life's ledger there is no such thing as frozen assets.
Henry Miller
Life, as it is called, is for most of us one long postponement.
Henry Miller
Moralities, ethics, laws, customs, beliefs, doctrines - these are of trifling import. All that matters is that the miraculous become the norm.
Henry Miller
Music is a beautiful opiate, if you don't take it too seriously.
Henry Miller
Nine-tenths of our sickness can be prevented by right thinking plus right hygiene - nine-tenths of it!
Henry Miller
No man is great enough or wise enough for any of us to surrender our destiny to. The only way in which anyone can lead us is to restore to us the belief in our own guidance.
Henry Miller
No matter how vast, how total, the failure of man here on earth, the work of man will be resumed elsewhere. War leaders talk of resuming operations on this front and that, but man's front embraces the whole universe.
Henry Miller
Obscenity is a cleansing process, whereas pornography only adds to the murk.
Henry Miller
One has to be a lowbrow, a bit of a murderer, to be a politician, ready and willing to see people sacrificed, slaughtered, for the sake of an idea, whether a good one or a bad one.
Henry Miller
One of the reasons why so few of us ever act, instead of react, is because we are continually stifling our deepest impulses.
Henry Miller
One's destination is never a place but rather a new way of looking at things.
Henry Miller
Our own physical body possesses a wisdom which we who inhabit the body lack. We give it orders which make no sense.
Henry Miller
Plots and character don't make life. Life is here and now, anytime you say the word, anytime you let her rip.
Henry Miller
Sex is one of the nine reasons for reincarnation... the other eight are unimportant.
Henry Miller
The aim of life is to live, and to live means to be aware, joyously, drunkenly, serenely, divinely aware.
Henry Miller
The City of New York is like an enormous citadel, a modern Carcassonne. Walking between the magnificent skyscrapers one feels the presence on the fringe of a howling, raging mob, a mob with empty bellies, a mob unshaven and in rags.
Henry Miller
The concert is a polite form of self induced torture.
Henry Miller
The great work must inevitably be obscure, except to the very few, to those who like the author himself are initiated into the mysteries. Communication then is secondary: it is perpetuation which is important. For this only one good reader is necessary.
Henry Miller
The legal system is often a mystery, and we, its priests, preside over rituals baffling to everyday citizens.
Henry Miller
The man who is forever disturbed about the condition of humanity either has no problems of his own or has refused to face them.
Henry Miller
The man who looks for security, even in the mind, is like a man who would chop off his limbs in order to ahve artificial ones which will give him no pain or trouble.
Henry Miller
The moment one gives close attention to any thing, even a blade of grass it becomes a mysterious, awesome, indescribably magnificent world in itself.
Henry Miller
The one thing we can never get enough of is love. And the one thing we never give enough is love.
Henry Miller
The ordinary man is involved in action, the hero acts. An immense difference.
Henry Miller
The real leader has no need to lead - he is content to point the way.
Henry Miller
The waking mind is the least serviceable in the arts.
Henry Miller
The word "civilization" to my mind is coupled with death. When I use the word, I see civilization as a crippling, thwarting thing, a stultifying thing. For me it was always so. I don't believe in the golden ages, you see... civilization is the arteriosclerosis of culture.
Henry Miller
The world is not to be put in order; the world is order, incarnate. It is for us to harmonize with this order.
Henry Miller
There is no salvation in becoming adapted to a world which is crazy.
Henry Miller
Topographically the country is magnificent - and terrifying. Why terrifying? Because nowhere else in the world is the divorce between man and nature so complete. Nowhere have I encountered such a dull, monotonous fabric of life as here in America. Here boredom reaches its peak.
Henry Miller
True strength lies in submission which permits one to dedicate his life, through devotion, to something beyond himself.
Henry Miller
Until we accept the fact that life itself is founded in mystery, we shall learn nothing.
Henry Miller
We do not talk - we bludgeon one another with facts and theories gleaned from cursory readings of newspapers, magazines and digests.
Henry Miller
We have two American flags always: one for the rich and one for the poor. When the rich fly it means that things are under control; when the poor fly it means danger, revolution, anarchy.
Henry Miller
We live in the mind, in ideas, in fragments. We no longer drink in the wild outer music of the streets - we remember only.
Henry Miller
What holds the world together, as I have learned from bitter experience, is sexual intercourse.
Henry Miller
Whatever I do is done out of sheer joy; I drop my fruits like a ripe tree. What the general reader or the critic makes of them is not my concern.
Henry Miller
Whatever there be of progress in life comes not through adaptation but through daring.
Henry Miller
When one is trying to do something beyond his known powers it is useless to seek the approval of friends. Friends are at their best in moments of defeat.
Henry Miller
Whenever a taboo is broken, something good happens, something vitalizing. Taboos after all are only hangovers, the product of diseased minds, you might say, of fearsome people who hadn't the courage to live and who under the guise of morality and religion have imposed these things upon us.
Henry Miller
oh my dearest finns....:(
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
I swear I will make you visit again.
shut up,finns.
A whisper and a chill
adv2005
"Why do I bother?"
The 11th Commandment.
"Whatever"
PETITION TO STOP THE BAN OF SMOKING IN BARS IN THE UNITED STATES....Anyone?
Haha, it didn't hurt, Ali. I kept it for years until it disintegrated.
i disagree, and certainly not directed at people, especially people you don't even know. perhaps hate directed at hateful activities, ideas and concepts.....
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow