i’ve also quoted Vernie many a time to my husband. “Oh a flower you are to my land.”
I fucking love this band. Good reminder to revisit their album.
You (and your text) inspired me to listen to Nico this morning. Not typical walking music, but it was perfect
Life ain't so shitty
No it isn't, my friend.
2014: Cincinnati 2016: Lexington and Wrigley 1
0
goldrush
everybody knows this is nowhere Posts: 7,578
Come to Where I'm From Podcast Episode #44 is Available now! Our guests this episode are Rogers Stevens & Christopher Thorn of Blind Melon! You should sit down and strap in for this one, we go deep, we span the vast career of the band, the ups and down, we talk about Shannon Hoon of course, when they all met, how Blind Melon came to be, recording the first album, the iconic Bee Girl album cover, the music video, hanging out with Axl Rose, recording the follow up Soup, everything falling apart and bringing it all back together! We hope you enjoy this one as much as we did! Part 2 with Travis Warren is next week!
After we did our @blindmelonband Podcast Episode, Rogers Stevens and I sat down @dannybones64 Transparent Gallery and jammed on some of my new songs. This is Signs of Age!
these guys spend so much flipping time looking back and talking ad nauseum about shannon, i can't imagine being the new singer. they literally talk about the old days more than their own new material. i just don't get it.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
I've seen AIC a few times and they have carried on well without Layne, but not everyone is as successful.
i can't help but think part of it is they've struck a great balance between moving on and honouring Layne's legacy. all these guys do is talk about shannon, post on social media about shannon, so much of their merch has the goddamn bee girl on it. jesus, move on. forge a new path. honestly, I think they'd be way more successful if people weren't so confused if they were still a current band or not. they sure don't act like one.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
I've seen AIC a few times and they have carried on well without Layne, but not everyone is as successful.
i can't help but think part of it is they've struck a great balance between moving on and honouring Layne's legacy. all these guys do is talk about shannon, post on social media about shannon, so much of their merch has the goddamn bee girl on it. jesus, move on. forge a new path. honestly, I think they'd be way more successful if people weren't so confused if they were still a current band or not. they sure don't act like one.
It's probably because that is how they make most of their money to live on. I personally don't think they would be more successful doing it any other way. I don't think there is or will ever be a bigger demand for new Blind Melon music. Shannon Hoon was and always will be the heart of that band, and I think they know it.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
bands don't make money off merch or music sales anymore. they make money off touring. if money is their driving factor, they are doing it wrong.
and if you listen to For My Friends, to me it's obvious that shannon wasn't the creative heart of the band, it was more collaborative, if that's what you meant. that album is top to bottom fantastic.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
bands don't make money off merch or music sales anymore. they make money off touring. if money is their driving factor, they are doing it wrong.
and if you listen to For My Friends, to me it's obvious that shannon wasn't the creative heart of the band, it was more collaborative, if that's what you meant. that album is top to bottom fantastic.
No, I meant that Hoon was the heart of the band because of his vocals, and because of the fan following. He was their money-maker.
I know that most money comes from touring with bands not of course, but I think for BM in particular, since they can only sell small shows with not very much revenue, their Shannon Hoon content really is probably still very important to them financially. Their vinyl reissues and the merch from the Hoon years probably makes all the difference in the world to them, and that is the content that they continue to rely on to keep making money and selling tickets. That is exactly why they would be so focused on Hoon. If this weren't the case, then they wouldn't be doing it IMO. The only thing really bringing the people to the shows they do play is Hoon's legacy, not a real following of their current singer. The band's actions seem to say that they know this and have accepted it, at least until they see the right time to try and break away from that. As for For My Friends.... I mean.... it's a pretty decent song, but the vocals just don't live up to what was lost IMO, the sound is really just kind of rehashed from the Hoon years, and unless they become a new band altogether with a different name (which they should do if they want to pave their own road), they will NEVER break free of Hoon's overpowering legacy, especially with a weaker sound-alike singer. That they are still Blind Melon tells me that WANT to ride Hoon's legacy, or at least don't have enough faith in making a living if they don't.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
you don't need to constantly promote your dead singer to bring people to the shows. they are going to fill 700-seaters whether you constantly mention him in interviews and on social media or not. the people going are "cult" followers anyway. everyone knows going in, when you have limited new material, you are going to be largely playing the old stuff. and when they eventually get enough new material, which they will with the new album coming out, everyone also knows they will still be playing the old hits.
shannon's legacy isn't so incredible that they need to hang onto it like this.
they had two albums and a posthumous mishmash of oddities. with the release of this second record with Travis, the amount of material will be the same.
who knows. maybe travis doesn't care about it. maybe he embraces it. just seems really odd and unnecessary to me.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
you don't need to constantly promote your dead singer to bring people to the shows. they are going to fill 700-seaters whether you constantly mention him in interviews and on social media or not. the people going are "cult" followers anyway. everyone knows going in, when you have limited new material, you are going to be largely playing the old stuff. and when they eventually get enough new material, which they will with the new album coming out, everyone also knows they will still be playing the old hits.
shannon's legacy isn't so incredible that they need to hang onto it like this.
they had two albums and a posthumous mishmash of oddities. with the release of this second record with Travis, the amount of material will be the same.
who knows. maybe travis doesn't care about it. maybe he embraces it. just seems really odd and unnecessary to me.
As long as they are using the name Blind Melon, they are going to be stuck with it. Like I said (although I added it later, so maybe you didn't see it), if they want to define themselves more independently from Hoon, who is the whole reason they have that cult following, they are going to need to start a new band altogether. As Blind Melon, they are the survivors of and additions to Shannon Hoon's band, and they will never get past that. The fact that they keep piling on the Hoon stuff tells me that they know this, and think that that is the best way for them to keep making a living right now. Why else would they be doing it? There is not way they are doing that for any reason other than money IMHO.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I don't think they are "stuck with" hoon's "legacy" just because they use the name. he's not robert plant. they had two albums. one of which had one big hit. they weren't selling out arenas here. they are essentially selling one tier lower in venues than they were at the height with Shannon. and that's with false starts of Travis quitting/being fired, coming back to finish the tour, leaving again, and now being back again.
I don't think continuing on with the name should really pigeon hole a band like you are suggesting it does. it is really the only thing that makes logistical marketing sense unless you are a megastar. anything else is starting over and hoping for lighting to strike twice. I don't think that means a band is stuck with anything, especially, as I said, with such a relatively small body of work preceding him.
The whole record For My Friends is great, and live he is awesome. Is he a Shannon knock-off vocally? Yes. Artistically, no (his solo stuff is country, and it's horrendous). I honestly could close my eyes at the show during the Hoon material and it sounded exactly like him. But honestly, with such distinctive voice, I don't know how you replace him and stay true to the material live. AIC took a massive risk with Duvall. It seems to have worked out for them. I saw them live for the first time this year and they killed.
a few of the guys had actually started a new band after hoon's death, called Unified Theory with the short-lived singer of Live before Ed K came back. they were good. I liked the two records they put out. But no one knew them.
anyway, I don't really see how constantly using shannon's legacy is a successful way of monetizing anything. the name of the band is enough for marketing shows. putting the bee girl on a hoodie isn't going to put much food on the table.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
They shouldn’t call it Blind Melon just like they shouldn’t call it Alice in Chains. You could call it the Jerry Cantrell Project and people would still listen but to call it the same thing in disrespectful in my opinion but hey that’s my opinion.
I think putting the bee girl on a hoodie is going to put a lot more food on the table than any sweatshirt relating to For My Friends ever could. :will shrug: I'm more with Robbie on this one. I think carrying on a well known band after losing the lead vocalist, and replacing them with sound-a-likes, is disrespectful, but even more than that, it's a big huge MEH for the music world. Just my opinion!
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
yes, in terms of hoon merch vs warren merch, yes, but my point is that merch profit is so negligible, it makes the whole idea moot anyway.
the name thing doesn't bother me one bit. it's a marketing tool and nothing else. it's an established name. everyone knows the guy died. no one's going to a blind melon show and going "who the fuck is that guy? where's shannon??". but honestly, you see in the music listings in your paper that blind melon is coming, you know who it is. you see the name unified theory, and you gloss over it, not knowing who the fuck they are. not unless you are a music nut like i am.
i have no idea why anyone gets their feathers ruffled over a name. the name is just the thing you call it so people know who they are. that's it. it's branding.
if there's one thing i don't like, is how the new stp vocalist fucking tries to look and act like scott. i really dig their album with him. but then i saw them live. he shuffles around the stage in the exact same manner as scott did, he wears the fedora and the feather boa around his neck. to me THAT is odd. and they only played two songs off the new record. i get it that i'm in the minority at a show, everyone wants to hear the hits. i want to hear the new stuff.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
They shouldn’t call it Blind Melon just like they shouldn’t call it Alice in Chains. You could call it the Jerry Cantrell Project and people would still listen but to call it the same thing in disrespectful in my opinion but hey that’s my opinion.
no one is going to see the jerry cantrel project in droves like they do aic though. they don't know if he's playing aic songs. they just know he used to be the guy in aic. you call it aic, you know what you're getting.
was everyone all bent out of shape about acdc when bon scott died and they continued with the name? it's just different phases of the band. even as a vocalist, i don't like that people put a bigger emphasis on the name when it's the lead singer. if the drummer leaves or dies, no one gives a shit if the band keeps their name. and yes, some drummers do have a massive impact on the band's sound. just ask jack white.
btw, i'm not saying i'm right here. everyone has different attachments to things and whatnot. i was honestly in your camp when they announced aic with william. 'SACRILEGE" I shouted. then i realized it's not that big a deal.
it was also odd to see ian astbury dressed up like jim morrison when he was part of the doors of the 21st century. just be the singer, like ed did at the rrhof. but to play dress up and pretend you're him? to me that's weird.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
Layne Staley wasn't AIC and Shannon Hoon wasn't Blind Melon. People put tooooooo much emphasis on front men.
Blind Melon and AIC lost their Magic with their front men, but not their mojo. The magic never lasts. Never. Pearl Jam still has Eddie. Pearl Jam still has mojo. Does Pearl Jam have the magic they did in '93?
FWIW, Travis has a better voice than Shannon ever did. He was brilliant creatively and had charisma bleeding out of his pores, but he sang in full falsetto WAY way too often. Travis hits the notes from the diaphragm much more.
Layne Staley wasn't AIC and Shannon Hoon wasn't Blind Melon. People put tooooooo much emphasis on front men.
Blind Melon and AIC lost their Magic with their front men, but not their mojo. The magic never lasts. Never. Pearl Jam still has Eddie. Pearl Jam still has mojo. Does Pearl Jam have the magic they did in '93?
FWIW, Travis has a better voice than Shannon ever did. He was brilliant creatively and had charisma bleeding out of his pores, but he sang in full falsetto WAY way too often. Travis hits the notes from the diaphragm much more.
agreed 100%
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
BLIND MELON ANNOUNCED FOR WINNIPEG SHOW APRIL 8. Soul Asylum supporting.
I saw that yesterday. Huge fan of both. Tempted to make the drive up. I'll be seeing SA with Local H for their annual holiday show here, but wouldn't mind this one as well. April is still iffy weather-wise though. Play it by ear.
Just looked at tickets and it's at a theatre, which means assigned seating, which means if I decide last minute, no good seats will be left. Oh, first world problems...
My brother saw them last year at a small theatre and had blast. He had some kind of backstage tickets so there was a short acoustic set with about 10 "audience" in the back and they played Sleepyhouse and it was crazy good. Then they opened the show with my favorite I Wonder... Really should have gone to that.
Just looked at tickets and it's at a theatre, which means assigned seating, which means if I decide last minute, no good seats will be left. Oh, first world problems...
sometimes, depending on the band, the floor is still GA, even though there are seats. I would imagine BM would most likely be assigned though.
"Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk" -EV 8/14/93
We'll see what it looks like in April. School break then, so we could have a long weekend in Winnipeg. Do minors need passports? I should Google that...
EDIT: Looks like birth cert is all that's needed for minors, if Google is to be believed.
Well, mine will be worse if I go lol. I know better than to buy tickets in advance for anything between Oct and April, save for something big like PJ, Springsteen, etc.
I've eaten too much money in tickets over the years getting stuck in bad weather during the winter months.
They shouldn’t call it Blind Melon just like they shouldn’t call it Alice in Chains. You could call it the Jerry Cantrell Project and people would still listen but to call it the same thing in disrespectful in my opinion but hey that’s my opinion.
My counter argument to that one. At least moreso with AIC (as I know less about BM) is that it took a band (or most of a band) to create the reputation the band name holds. I feel it's amazingly difficult to find that level of success twice. It's easy to say make a new name, and a new rep for yourself, but it's insanely hard for lightning to strike twice. In this case I saw Jerry Cantrell do 3 solo performances. One was an opening opening slot for Days of the New and Metallica. The 2nd two were club shows in Vancouver. One was Richards on Richards which held maybe 500ish people (700 if they oversell). The 2nd was at the commodore which holds about 1100. William Duvall was going vocals at those bar shows (but not at the Metallica show). The last few times they played Vancouver they played the Queen E. Theatre which holds 3000. That's about triple the attendees from a Jerry Cantrell solo show. Plus they can probably charge more for the tickets.
While I mixed on the new AIC. I enjoy the live shows, but I'm mixed on the new albums. I think the other guys (mainly Cantrell) should be able to use the name. It seems unfair to me that they lose a big chunk of their livelihood because their singer had problems. I understand the other argument, because I'm getting less and less enthralled with the replace the lead singer thing that's going on. I've had no desire to see reformed Queen, Journey, STP etc.. with singers. AIC might be the only band I've made the effort to see after they've lost a singer. Well there's AC/DC but that's it's unique thing. That's best case scenario. Maybe the only band that had just as much success with studio albums before and after they lost a singer.
Comments
2016: Lexington and Wrigley 1
Bonus video!
After we did our @blindmelonband Podcast Episode, Rogers Stevens and I sat down @dannybones64 Transparent Gallery and jammed on some of my new songs. This is Signs of Age!
(Jeff Tweedy, Sydney 2007)
“Put yer good money on the sunrise”
(Tim Rogers)
-EV 8/14/93
I've seen AIC a few times and they have carried on well without Layne, but not everyone is as successful.
2016: Lexington and Wrigley 1
-EV 8/14/93
and if you listen to For My Friends, to me it's obvious that shannon wasn't the creative heart of the band, it was more collaborative, if that's what you meant. that album is top to bottom fantastic.
-EV 8/14/93
shannon's legacy isn't so incredible that they need to hang onto it like this.
they had two albums and a posthumous mishmash of oddities. with the release of this second record with Travis, the amount of material will be the same.
who knows. maybe travis doesn't care about it. maybe he embraces it. just seems really odd and unnecessary to me.
-EV 8/14/93
I don't think continuing on with the name should really pigeon hole a band like you are suggesting it does. it is really the only thing that makes logistical marketing sense unless you are a megastar. anything else is starting over and hoping for lighting to strike twice. I don't think that means a band is stuck with anything, especially, as I said, with such a relatively small body of work preceding him.
The whole record For My Friends is great, and live he is awesome. Is he a Shannon knock-off vocally? Yes. Artistically, no (his solo stuff is country, and it's horrendous). I honestly could close my eyes at the show during the Hoon material and it sounded exactly like him. But honestly, with such distinctive voice, I don't know how you replace him and stay true to the material live. AIC took a massive risk with Duvall. It seems to have worked out for them. I saw them live for the first time this year and they killed.
a few of the guys had actually started a new band after hoon's death, called Unified Theory with the short-lived singer of Live before Ed K came back. they were good. I liked the two records they put out. But no one knew them.
anyway, I don't really see how constantly using shannon's legacy is a successful way of monetizing anything. the name of the band is enough for marketing shows. putting the bee girl on a hoodie isn't going to put much food on the table.
-EV 8/14/93
You could call it the Jerry Cantrell Project and people would still listen but to call it the same thing in disrespectful in my opinion but hey that’s my opinion.
-Seattle,Wash-Key Arena-9/22/9 -Pemberton,B.C-7/17/16
-Vancouver,B.C-GM Place -9/25/9 -Seattle,Wash-Safeco Field-8/8/18
-Vancouver,B.C-Pacific Coliseum-9/25/11 -Seattle,Wash-Safeco Field-8/10/18
-Misoula,MT-Adams Field House-9/30/12 -Vancouver,BC-Rogers Arena-5/4/24
the name thing doesn't bother me one bit. it's a marketing tool and nothing else. it's an established name. everyone knows the guy died. no one's going to a blind melon show and going "who the fuck is that guy? where's shannon??". but honestly, you see in the music listings in your paper that blind melon is coming, you know who it is. you see the name unified theory, and you gloss over it, not knowing who the fuck they are. not unless you are a music nut like i am.
i have no idea why anyone gets their feathers ruffled over a name. the name is just the thing you call it so people know who they are. that's it. it's branding.
if there's one thing i don't like, is how the new stp vocalist fucking tries to look and act like scott. i really dig their album with him. but then i saw them live. he shuffles around the stage in the exact same manner as scott did, he wears the fedora and the feather boa around his neck. to me THAT is odd. and they only played two songs off the new record. i get it that i'm in the minority at a show, everyone wants to hear the hits. i want to hear the new stuff.
-EV 8/14/93
was everyone all bent out of shape about acdc when bon scott died and they continued with the name? it's just different phases of the band. even as a vocalist, i don't like that people put a bigger emphasis on the name when it's the lead singer. if the drummer leaves or dies, no one gives a shit if the band keeps their name. and yes, some drummers do have a massive impact on the band's sound. just ask jack white.
btw, i'm not saying i'm right here. everyone has different attachments to things and whatnot. i was honestly in your camp when they announced aic with william. 'SACRILEGE" I shouted. then i realized it's not that big a deal.
it was also odd to see ian astbury dressed up like jim morrison when he was part of the doors of the 21st century. just be the singer, like ed did at the rrhof. but to play dress up and pretend you're him? to me that's weird.
-EV 8/14/93
-EV 8/14/93
People put tooooooo much emphasis on front men.
Blind Melon and AIC lost their Magic with their front men, but not their mojo. The magic never lasts. Never. Pearl Jam still has Eddie. Pearl Jam still has mojo. Does Pearl Jam have the magic they did in '93?
FWIW, Travis has a better voice than Shannon ever did. He was brilliant creatively and had charisma bleeding out of his pores, but he sang in full falsetto WAY way too often. Travis hits the notes from the diaphragm much more.
-EV 8/14/93
2016: Lexington and Wrigley 1
Then they opened the show with my favorite I Wonder... Really should have gone to that.
-EV 8/14/93
EDIT: Looks like birth cert is all that's needed for minors, if Google is to be believed.
-EV 8/14/93
I've eaten too much money in tickets over the years getting stuck in bad weather during the winter months.
While I mixed on the new AIC. I enjoy the live shows, but I'm mixed on the new albums. I think the other guys (mainly Cantrell) should be able to use the name. It seems unfair to me that they lose a big chunk of their livelihood because their singer had problems. I understand the other argument, because I'm getting less and less enthralled with the replace the lead singer thing that's going on. I've had no desire to see reformed Queen, Journey, STP etc.. with singers. AIC might be the only band I've made the effort to see after they've lost a singer. Well there's AC/DC but that's it's unique thing. That's best case scenario. Maybe the only band that had just as much success with studio albums before and after they lost a singer.