F2F is OPEN

Weston1283 · January 27

10LordsALeaping said:

As much as I like the 10C idea, it would just lead to all resellers joining the club. More so than they already have. I think the no transfer is the best option, albeit an unpopular move, as said above. This is the way.
I don't mean to be that guy or throw shade, but if they don't control tickets, then really they just sell merch.
I've resigned myself to not catching this leg of the tour, since the fix is in.

The only 10C benefit that has been in place for years now is access to GA and 10C reserved sections via lottery. Which to be honest, if that is the only benefit, it is a great deal for $35 a year.

Go Animal · January 27

ally12 said:

Weston1283 said:

jwc6160 said:

Weston1283 said:

Fully transferable 10club tickets is the only way forward

Would you rather have a handful of people abuse full transferability (entering all shows, helping their other 10c buddies, and maybe even someone selling above face value)

Or would you rather continue with what F2F has become

10C is simply not going to go back to a will call system or go back to managing it themselves. The process will forever be outsourced at this point. So that is not a realistic option.

I say no transfers at all at this point. Just kill F2F altogether. You either go or risk giving up your log in info. This would open up tickets for more members initially as people wouldn't put in for every show knowing they can just sell back on F2F. I say this as someone in the midwest who never gets a show in my town. It would be way more risky for me since i'm flying to almost any show I go to. I'd still rather run that risk than see us all get screwed by TM bots and resellers.

That could work. So basically a digital will call system. If you can't make it, then tough luck. Wouldn't be a popular option, but it is an option I suppose.

This is a great idea

I think this is what Jack White's been doing (or close to it). Each club he's been playing gets a straight cut. The digital ticketing system gets a flat fee, or a small cut. JW & his team keep the rest. More freedom, and still making boatloads of cash (all possible, when you don't have to worry about Live Nation/TM).

Sad part is, PJ literally wrote the book on this in 1995! Go play independent venues, whether it's an arena, amphitheater, or a freaking field in the middle of nowhere (and you accidentally create Coachella).

We'd ALL travel to shows that had tiered pricing, regardless of where they were. This is all doable, it's just nobody wants to handle the logistics & payroll.

Bands would rather hand over money THEY'VE earned performing their songs, and let someone else handle it & take all the complaints that come along with it. God forbid they create some jobs by taking that money, and re-investing in themselves...

10LordsALeaping · January 27

Weston1283 said:

The only 10C benefit that has been in place for years now is access to GA and 10C reserved sections via lottery. Which to be honest, if that is the only benefit, it is a great deal for $35 a year.

I'm all for that and will still gladly pay my annual. I am also bummed by the last two tours getting shut out, but I am not unique in that regard. I will keep tossing my hat in the ring. Hope springs eternal.

jwc6160 · January 27

Go Animal said:

ally12 said:

Weston1283 said:

jwc6160 said:

Weston1283 said:

Fully transferable 10club tickets is the only way forward

Would you rather have a handful of people abuse full transferability (entering all shows, helping their other 10c buddies, and maybe even someone selling above face value)

Or would you rather continue with what F2F has become

10C is simply not going to go back to a will call system or go back to managing it themselves. The process will forever be outsourced at this point. So that is not a realistic option.

I say no transfers at all at this point. Just kill F2F altogether. You either go or risk giving up your log in info. This would open up tickets for more members initially as people wouldn't put in for every show knowing they can just sell back on F2F. I say this as someone in the midwest who never gets a show in my town. It would be way more risky for me since i'm flying to almost any show I go to. I'd still rather run that risk than see us all get screwed by TM bots and resellers.

That could work. So basically a digital will call system. If you can't make it, then tough luck. Wouldn't be a popular option, but it is an option I suppose.

This is a great idea

I think this is what Jack White's been doing (or close to it). Each club he's been playing gets a straight cut. The digital ticketing system gets a flat fee, or a small cut. JW & his team keep the rest. More freedom, and still making boatloads of cash (all possible, when you don't have to worry about Live Nation/TM).
Sad part is, PJ literally wrote the book on this in 1995! Go play independent venues, whether it's an arena, amphitheater, or a freaking field in the middle of nowhere (and you accidentally create Coachella).
We'd ALL travel to shows that had tiered pricing, regardless of where they were. This is all doable, it's just nobody wants to handle the logistics & payroll.
Bands would rather hand over money THEY'VE earned performing their songs, and let someone else handle it & take all the complaints that come along with it. God forbid they create some jobs by taking that money, and re-investing in themselves...

I'm not sure your "create jobs" comment rings true. I don't know the accuracy of this, but i've heard that the band keeps a pretty big crew on the payroll. If they started playing smaller venues and shows, they would need less crew. Again, that is just me speculating. I would love to have a chance to see them at a smaller venue, but i'm not sure it will ever happen.

The easiest solution is to ban all transfers and work to get tickets placed on reseller sites removed. Just put it in the agreement that any ticket found on a reseller site will be voided.

Go Animal · January 27

jwc6160 said:

Go Animal said:

ally12 said:

Weston1283 said:

jwc6160 said:

Weston1283 said:

Fully transferable 10club tickets is the only way forward

Would you rather have a handful of people abuse full transferability (entering all shows, helping their other 10c buddies, and maybe even someone selling above face value)

Or would you rather continue with what F2F has become

10C is simply not going to go back to a will call system or go back to managing it themselves. The process will forever be outsourced at this point. So that is not a realistic option.

I say no transfers at all at this point. Just kill F2F altogether. You either go or risk giving up your log in info. This would open up tickets for more members initially as people wouldn't put in for every show knowing they can just sell back on F2F. I say this as someone in the midwest who never gets a show in my town. It would be way more risky for me since i'm flying to almost any show I go to. I'd still rather run that risk than see us all get screwed by TM bots and resellers.

That could work. So basically a digital will call system. If you can't make it, then tough luck. Wouldn't be a popular option, but it is an option I suppose.

This is a great idea

I think this is what Jack White's been doing (or close to it). Each club he's been playing gets a straight cut. The digital ticketing system gets a flat fee, or a small cut. JW & his team keep the rest. More freedom, and still making boatloads of cash (all possible, when you don't have to worry about Live Nation/TM).
Sad part is, PJ literally wrote the book on this in 1995! Go play independent venues, whether it's an arena, amphitheater, or a freaking field in the middle of nowhere (and you accidentally create Coachella).
We'd ALL travel to shows that had tiered pricing, regardless of where they were. This is all doable, it's just nobody wants to handle the logistics & payroll.
Bands would rather hand over money THEY'VE earned performing their songs, and let someone else handle it & take all the complaints that come along with it. God forbid they create some jobs by taking that money, and re-investing in themselves...

I'm not sure your "create jobs" comment rings true. I don't know the accuracy of this, but i've heard that the band keeps a pretty big crew on the payroll. If they started playing smaller venues and shows, they would need less crew. Again, that is just me speculating. I would love to have a chance to see them at a smaller venue, but i'm not sure it will ever happen.

The easiest solution is to ban all transfers and work to get tickets placed on reseller sites removed. Just put it in the agreement that any ticket found on a reseller site will be voided.

Was more referring to having 10C in charge of all tickets & distribution, but I don't know the "family tree" of their current operation. I suppose responsibility could be delegated to existing employees, but who knows.

And small(ish) venues would only be once in a while things: Ryman, The Vic, The Greek, Jones Beach, Hollywood Bowl, Red Rocks, Fillmore (San Fran & Denver), The Dr. Phillip's Center, Ruth Eckerd Hall...

Hopefully, the government can break up the monopoly that Live Nation has on tickets & venues, but with the con man in chief back in the saddle, I'm not holding my breath.

The band has the ability to change things, but I'm not sure they care anymore?

They've already broken through the $200 price point. Why not keep as much of that as possible? And still support the causes they hold dear (and visit cities they never go to anymore).

All that aside, I definitely agree with the last part (for obvious reasons lol)

Chrrie · January 27

It’s supposedly already an agreement that tickets being scalped will be voided. Given that there already is no transfer I don’t know what they could do to get around the hack other than not use mobile tickets. If the ticket has a barcode it can be hosted on that secure.tickets site. Here’s an example of what one looks like:

https://secure.tickets/wallet/EWmxBwu13xSHp8Mki4u1P6

If they went back to enabling transfers you can say goodbye to face value tickets if you strike out in the lottery other than the handful of good samaritans on here who will play by the rules, UNLESS the 10c actually does crack down on it. But that also half relies on self-policing and reporting the people who are doing it.

KJ228171 · January 27

jwc6160 said:

Weston1283 said:

Fully transferable 10club tickets is the only way forward

Would you rather have a handful of people abuse full transferability (entering all shows, helping their other 10c buddies, and maybe even someone selling above face value)

Or would you rather continue with what F2F has become

10C is simply not going to go back to a will call system or go back to managing it themselves. The process will forever be outsourced at this point. So that is not a realistic option.

I say no transfers at all at this point. Just kill F2F altogether. You either go or risk giving up your log in info. This would open up tickets for more members initially as people wouldn't put in for every show knowing they can just sell back on F2F. I say this as someone in the midwest who never gets a show in my town. It would be way more risky for me since i'm flying to almost any show I go to. I'd still rather run that risk than see us all get screwed by TM bots and resellers.

That won't work. Before the mobile barcode was reversed engineered scalpers were selling entire TM accounts. Others were "renting" access to accounts. It might stop some one looking to make a quick buck but it would not stop the institutional players.

jwc6160 · January 27

Chrrie said:

It’s supposedly already an agreement that tickets being scalped will be voided. Given that there already is no transfer I don’t know what they could do to get around the hack other than not use mobile tickets. If the ticket has a barcode it can be hosted on that secure.tickets site. Here’s an example of what one looks like:

https://secure.tickets/wallet/EWmxBwu13xSHp8Mki4u1P6

If they went back to enabling transfers you can say goodbye to face value tickets if you strike out in the lottery other than the handful of good samaritans on here who will play by the rules, UNLESS the 10c actually does crack down on it. But that also half relies on self-policing and reporting the people who are doing it.

I guess I don't understand the tech enough. If each ticket has a barcode and the agreement says no resell, can't they see the tickets out on resell sites and void them? Sure it would be a bit of work, but hell, people that post here would do most of the work for them.

Chrrie · January 27

jwc6160 said:

Chrrie said:

It’s supposedly already an agreement that tickets being scalped will be voided. Given that there already is no transfer I don’t know what they could do to get around the hack other than not use mobile tickets. If the ticket has a barcode it can be hosted on that secure.tickets site. Here’s an example of what one looks like:

https://secure.tickets/wallet/EWmxBwu13xSHp8Mki4u1P6

If they went back to enabling transfers you can say goodbye to face value tickets if you strike out in the lottery other than the handful of good samaritans on here who will play by the rules, UNLESS the 10c actually does crack down on it. But that also half relies on self-policing and reporting the people who are doing it.

I guess I don't understand the tech enough. If each ticket has a barcode and the agreement says no resell, can't they see the tickets out on resell sites and void them? Sure it would be a bit of work, but hell, people that post here would do most of the work for them.

Yes. The DMB fan club does this, they don’t void the tickets (that I know of) but they will call them and only the original fan club member who purchased them can pick them up from the box office. If no seat numbers are listed they will call the entire row. Had it happen with some of my tickets last year.

josermoreno · January 27

Just got u 504 error

Chrrie · January 27

josermoreno said:

Just got u 504 error

there arent any in that row up on vivid or tickpick right now so if some show up in the day next they are ostensibly these. although i hope it was a link that someone was successful in getting.

josermoreno · January 27

Chrrie said:

josermoreno said:

Just got u 504 error

there arent any in that row up on vivid or tickpick right now so if some show up in the day next they are ostensibly these. although i hope it was a link that someone was successful in getting.

Hope somebody got them! I Was actually surprised I carted them.

PrezIntense · January 27

Didn't it used to be you only had so many you could request through 10C or am I remembering that wrong? If so, I'd like to see it go back to that -- put in for the four shows you really want to go to, instead of putting in for twenty shows.

Weston1283 · January 27

PrezIntense said:

Didn't it used to be you only had so many you could request through 10C or am I remembering that wrong? If so, I'd like to see it go back to that -- put in for the four shows you really want to go to, instead of putting in for twenty shows.

You could always put in for as many as you wanted, but you had to rank them in a priority list. Generally you only got your 1st and 2nd choices, unless 10C tickets were not 100% accounted for, for a specific show.

They also used to play 20-30 cities on a tour. Now they play 5-10 and you have multiple metro areas fighting for the same shows.

PrezIntense · January 27

Oh that's right! Yeah I liked the priority ranking system.

BloodMeridian80 · January 27

Weston1283 said:

PrezIntense said:

Didn't it used to be you only had so many you could request through 10C or am I remembering that wrong? If so, I'd like to see it go back to that -- put in for the four shows you really want to go to, instead of putting in for twenty shows.

You could always put in for as many as you wanted, but you had to rank them in a priority list. Generally you only got your 1st and 2nd choices, unless 10C tickets were not 100% accounted for, for a specific show.

They also used to play 20-30 cities on a tour. Now they play 5-10 and you have multiple metro areas fighting for the same shows.

Back in the day, I think 2000 and earlier, you could only put in for one show.

cutz · January 27

ekwipt said:

From last night.

WOW!

But there is a $230 Savings.

Zod · January 28

jwc6160 said:

Chrrie said:

It’s supposedly already an agreement that tickets being scalped will be voided. Given that there already is no transfer I don’t know what they could do to get around the hack other than not use mobile tickets. If the ticket has a barcode it can be hosted on that secure.tickets site. Here’s an example of what one looks like:

https://secure.tickets/wallet/EWmxBwu13xSHp8Mki4u1P6

If they went back to enabling transfers you can say goodbye to face value tickets if you strike out in the lottery other than the handful of good samaritans on here who will play by the rules, UNLESS the 10c actually does crack down on it. But that also half relies on self-policing and reporting the people who are doing it.

I guess I don't understand the tech enough. If each ticket has a barcode and the agreement says no resell, can't they see the tickets out on resell sites and void them? Sure it would be a bit of work, but hell, people that post here would do most of the work for them.

No, because they don't post the bar code for free, neither do resell sites post the seat #'s, Just the section and row, most likely on purpose so the tickets can't be tracked to the person that owns them on TM. It makes it hard to police when you don't know the exact seat #'s. 10c would need to buy the tickets to see what shows up, or fans would, then relay the info.

given2flym · January 28

Zod said:

jwc6160 said:

Chrrie said:

It’s supposedly already an agreement that tickets being scalped will be voided. Given that there already is no transfer I don’t know what they could do to get around the hack other than not use mobile tickets. If the ticket has a barcode it can be hosted on that secure.tickets site. Here’s an example of what one looks like:

https://secure.tickets/wallet/EWmxBwu13xSHp8Mki4u1P6

If they went back to enabling transfers you can say goodbye to face value tickets if you strike out in the lottery other than the handful of good samaritans on here who will play by the rules, UNLESS the 10c actually does crack down on it. But that also half relies on self-policing and reporting the people who are doing it.

I guess I don't understand the tech enough. If each ticket has a barcode and the agreement says no resell, can't they see the tickets out on resell sites and void them? Sure it would be a bit of work, but hell, people that post here would do most of the work for them.

No, because they don't post the bar code for free, neither do resell sites post the seat #'s, Just the section and row, most likely on purpose so the tickets can't be tracked to the person that owns them on TM. It makes it hard to police when you don't know the exact seat #'s. 10c would need to buy the tickets to see what shows up, or fans would, then relay the info.

Some resale sites occasionally post seat numbers

on2legs · January 28

LOL for $0 in service fees. Just pay us 5x face value and you won’t have to pay any pesky fees!

F2F is OPEN

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