The only drag show I've been to was some time ago. I went with friends to see a show at Finocchio's, a club that was famous for being one of the earlier and best known clubs of the time featuring drag shows. If shows today are anything like that one I went to in S.F., I don't see what all the fuss is about. It was a great show and nothing to get up in knots about. There was nothing "dirty" or obscene about any of the performances. Some of the performers were better than others but I remember this one Philippine guy who in drag was an absolutely gorgeous knock-out and was a wonderful singer. If someone has a problem with a talented guy who can look that feminine and beautiful, that's just kind of sad and weird to me, but just don't go to the show. It's not doing anyone any harm.
I don't know Brian. I'm still mad about Klinger on MASH.
Klinger! LOL, too funny!
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
See, here's a bill I have no issue with. TX has removed the language around drag queens from their bill that would seek to ban sexualized performances to children. This was both smart and the right thing to do as the bill as originally written would likely violate the 14th Amendment. This new bill would ban anyone from performing sexually. I have no problem with that. It's not singling out one class, which is how the bill started. Further, a drag queen doing story hour at the library would be legal, as it would not be sexual. No problem.
It makes sense to word it that way. But when this all started becoming news, I remember seeing footage of drag shows in restaurants with kids. It seemed to me the bill was written that way because those were the shows performing to kids. It makes sense to word it that way, but its not surprising it started out as a drag show ban either to me. Yeah, there's probably some examples of straight sex shows, but in a lot less kid friendly areas, like Vegas strip or downtown Venice Beach, where a family is a lot less likely going to be surprised by one or where kids are just banned altogether.
FTR, this is another example where the gov't is making choices for parents, something that @JB16057 railed against. Why should parents be prohibited by law from taking their kids to a show that could be sexualized? Sounds like the gov't knowing what's best for kids, regardless of their parents views.
Do you honestly believe that parents should be allowed to expose their kids to sexualized shows? I do believe there should be rules set by the government to protect children but there is a line that should not be crossed. You are conflating these issues.
Do you believe that it should be illegal to take a child to Rated R movies?
I'm just trying to understand when you think it's okay for the gov't to dictate to parents and when it's not.
I think a point you're missing is there's a difference between a parent deciding to let their kid watch an R rated movie, vs a sexualized show in public where children can congregate, like a family restaurant or public park. Don't you agree there's a big difference?
No. What's the difference? A public park, sure because who don't want to be see that could see it. But not a theater, a restaurant or other private venue. How is that different than a movie theater?
A parent should have certain expectations when going to a family restaurant that is open to the public. I expect next time I walk into Denny's that there won't be a sex show next to my table. There are restaurants that allow that, and have requirements to get in, just like a movie theater does. A 12 year old can't walk up to the box office and buy a R rated movie ticket. He can walk into a Denny's and order a hamburger.
When did Denny's start hosting "sex shows", unannounced or other?
They haven't. The conversation started when mrussel pointed out a new bill that banned sexualized performances to children. I responded by saying I only saw this getting started in the news a while back because a few restaurants (maybe the same restaurant multiple times, maybe the same show with different footage, I really don't know) had drag shows in them where a lot of kids were present.
Since the parents were upset, I had assumed (maybe incorrectly) that they did not know this was going to happen. Why else would they complain? Maybe that assumption was incorrect. I just used Denny's as an example, because I have no idea what the name of the restaurant was.
Have you considered doing more research on stories before taking a position and / or jumping to conclusions?
I just looked at the story I was talking about. I either never heard the full story or just forgot. I thought it was a family style restaurant and they didn't know it was going to happen. Looks like I was wrong. It looks like it was advertised as an 18+ drag show and a Barr/grill type of place. So yeah, don't know why you'd take your kids and then complain.
See, here's a bill I have no issue with. TX has removed the language around drag queens from their bill that would seek to ban sexualized performances to children. This was both smart and the right thing to do as the bill as originally written would likely violate the 14th Amendment. This new bill would ban anyone from performing sexually. I have no problem with that. It's not singling out one class, which is how the bill started. Further, a drag queen doing story hour at the library would be legal, as it would not be sexual. No problem.
It makes sense to word it that way. But when this all started becoming news, I remember seeing footage of drag shows in restaurants with kids. It seemed to me the bill was written that way because those were the shows performing to kids. It makes sense to word it that way, but its not surprising it started out as a drag show ban either to me. Yeah, there's probably some examples of straight sex shows, but in a lot less kid friendly areas, like Vegas strip or downtown Venice Beach, where a family is a lot less likely going to be surprised by one or where kids are just banned altogether.
FTR, this is another example where the gov't is making choices for parents, something that @JB16057 railed against. Why should parents be prohibited by law from taking their kids to a show that could be sexualized? Sounds like the gov't knowing what's best for kids, regardless of their parents views.
Do you honestly believe that parents should be allowed to expose their kids to sexualized shows? I do believe there should be rules set by the government to protect children but there is a line that should not be crossed. You are conflating these issues.
Do you believe that it should be illegal to take a child to Rated R movies?
I'm just trying to understand when you think it's okay for the gov't to dictate to parents and when it's not.
I think a point you're missing is there's a difference between a parent deciding to let their kid watch an R rated movie, vs a sexualized show in public where children can congregate, like a family restaurant or public park. Don't you agree there's a big difference?
No. What's the difference? A public park, sure because who don't want to be see that could see it. But not a theater, a restaurant or other private venue. How is that different than a movie theater?
A parent should have certain expectations when going to a family restaurant that is open to the public. I expect next time I walk into Denny's that there won't be a sex show next to my table. There are restaurants that allow that, and have requirements to get in, just like a movie theater does. A 12 year old can't walk up to the box office and buy a R rated movie ticket. He can walk into a Denny's and order a hamburger.
When did Denny's start hosting "sex shows", unannounced or other?
They haven't. The conversation started when mrussel pointed out a new bill that banned sexualized performances to children. I responded by saying I only saw this getting started in the news a while back because a few restaurants (maybe the same restaurant multiple times, maybe the same show with different footage, I really don't know) had drag shows in them where a lot of kids were present.
Since the parents were upset, I had assumed (maybe incorrectly) that they did not know this was going to happen. Why else would they complain? Maybe that assumption was incorrect. I just used Denny's as an example, because I have no idea what the name of the restaurant was.
Have you considered doing more research on stories before taking a position and / or jumping to conclusions?
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Something we should all be more open to doing and accepting, myself included.
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,289
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Something we should all be more open to doing and accepting, myself included.
I've done that a few times where I think I know I'm so smart... and then take a look again... and mimic George Carlin by saying, "AHH! I'm full of shit!"
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
“Shitty remarks?” Sure, okay.
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
“Shitty remarks?” Sure, okay.
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
Yes. Shitty, condescending remarks. There’s better ways to disagree and debate. But do you.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
“Shitty remarks?” Sure, okay.
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
Yes. Shitty, condescending remarks. There’s better ways to disagree and debate. But do you.
Shitty condescending remarks are great way to get people to change their minds and become more informed.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
“Shitty remarks?” Sure, okay.
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
Yes. Shitty, condescending remarks. There’s better ways to disagree and debate. But do you.
Shitty condescending remarks are great way to get people to change their minds and become more informed.
That’s been my argument since day one of (unfortunately) stumbling into AMT.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
“Shitty remarks?” Sure, okay.
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
Yes. Shitty, condescending remarks. There’s better ways to disagree and debate. But do you.
I think it’s shittier to mischaracterize a situation and feed into the repub hysteria. But you do you.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
“Shitty remarks?” Sure, okay.
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
Yes. Shitty, condescending remarks. There’s better ways to disagree and debate. But do you.
Shitty condescending remarks are great way to get people to change their minds and become more informed.
That’s been my argument since day one of (unfortunately) stumbling into AMT.
AMT is my only internet black hole and I'm ok with it. If the next round of shows puts members in the 300s again I may stop paying for my privilege to waste time here.
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Agreed no need for the shitty remarks. Mace is a good poster here and I commend him for sticking around honestly.
“Shitty remarks?” Sure, okay.
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
Yes. Shitty, condescending remarks. There’s better ways to disagree and debate. But do you.
Shitty condescending remarks are great way to get people to change their minds and become more informed.
Exactly. Scream at me, shame me, and subject me to super loud and highly compressed techno pop CDs and I'm on your side in a hot second!
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Awwwww why? I hate nvm posts. Feel like I missed something good.
Something about clutching pearls, complaining, calling a spade a spade and you know, “shitty remarks.”
Shit that sounds awesome. All I’m saying is there’s a nicer way to go about it. Especially with a respectable poster , whether you agree with them or not. We all know your passion for politics
I like to take a strong stance, make an argument. Then look back and see if I was right. How do you do it?
If you were to debate a colleague in front of the school body on any topic, would that be your approach?
No, but this isn't my job either. My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess. That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
So, we should take you seriously?
Give him a break. He came back and admitted he misread it. Mace is good people and a fair debater.
Awwwww why? I hate nvm posts. Feel like I missed something good.
Something about clutching pearls, complaining, calling a spade a spade and you know, “shitty remarks.”
Shit that sounds awesome. All I’m saying is there’s a nicer way to go about it. Especially with a respectable poster , whether you agree with them or not. We all know your passion for politics
I’m getting ready to go out to dinner. I’m not giving you an example on how to be nice.
Too bad, particularly in the context of Mace’s post and all of the other back and forth. Should have stuck with NVM. Thought I was going to learn something.
I’m getting ready to go out to dinner. I’m not giving you an example on how to be nice.
Too bad, particularly in the context of Mace’s post and all of the other back and forth. Should have stuck with NVM. Thought I was going to learn something.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Comments
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Looks like I was wrong. It looks like it was advertised as an 18+ drag show and a Barr/grill type of place. So yeah, don't know why you'd take your kids and then complain.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
My wife gives me crap all the time. The harder I argue something, the less I actually know. When I'm the most confident I tend to move on quicker from the conversation. I don't mean to, just how I am. I just lose interest I guess.
That's my personal/casual life. My professional life is different.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
I've done that a few times where I think I know I'm so smart... and then take a look again... and mimic George Carlin by saying, "AHH! I'm full of shit!"
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Mace went from characterizing “drag shows” from drag shows to “sexualized” to “sex shows” and back to “sexualized” prior to admitting they have never attended a drag show and misread it. You guys do what you want but I find that type of opinion ill informed and to some degree disingenuous. Maybe I’ll skip over and stop responding to their posts? Or make more “shitty remarks?”
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
know your passion for politics
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14