America's Gun Violence #2

HughFreakingDillon

we see just as much violence in entertainment up here as you folks do. our entertainment is basically 85% american. 10% canadian, 5% awful british comedy. 

and no one was killed ON jenny jones. it was a few days after the taping. 

Halifax2TheMax

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

brianlux

HughFreakingDillon said:

we see just as much violence in entertainment up here as you folks do. our entertainment is basically 85% american. 10% canadian, 5% awful british comedy. 

and no one was killed ON jenny jones. it was a few days after the taping. 

What's your take on why there is more violence in the U.S. 
Is it what H2TM says here (surely a part of it)?  Or are we just inherently more prone to violence?  I really am not sure.

Halifax2TheMax said:

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

HughFreakingDillon

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

we see just as much violence in entertainment up here as you folks do. our entertainment is basically 85% american. 10% canadian, 5% awful british comedy. 

and no one was killed ON jenny jones. it was a few days after the taping. 

What's your take on why there is more violence in the U.S. 
Is it what H2TM says here (surely a part of it)?  Or are we just inherently more prone to violence?  I really am not sure.

Halifax2TheMax said:

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

I think it's a combination of things. 

1) access to guns
2) gun culture in the US (buying into the idea that the US was "born of violence" and that the constitution is like the bible)
3) mental health issues

we all have #3. But we don't all have #'s 1 and 2. So yes, I basically agree with Halifax. 

bootlegger10

Halifax2TheMax said:

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

Why haven't you killed someone with an AR-15 yet if the gun is the main reason this is happening?  Or have you?  

We can talk about why so many people are motivated to do what they are doing.  Access to an AR-15 is not the cause, but the tool and of course we should ban automatic weapons.  

Halifax2TheMax

bootlegger10 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

Why haven't you killed someone with an AR-15 yet if the gun is the main reason this is happening?  Or have you?  

We can talk about why so many people are motivated to do what they are doing.  Access to an AR-15 is not the cause, but the tool and of course we should ban automatic weapons.  

Because I don't care to spend the rest of my life in prison. Denial is not a river in Egypt. Access to "firearms" and "responsible" gun owners are the cause. It takes a whole other level of effort to stab or beat someone to death, particularly multiple victims.

I'll ask you and see if you can answer, seeing how others on here either can't or are afraid to, if AR15s and other semi-automatic assault rifles (firearms made to kill people as efficiently as possible) are banned, would you be unable to defend yourself and would you consider your 2A to be violated?

HughFreakingDillon

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

bootlegger10

Halifax2TheMax said:

bootlegger10 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

Why haven't you killed someone with an AR-15 yet if the gun is the main reason this is happening?  Or have you?  

We can talk about why so many people are motivated to do what they are doing.  Access to an AR-15 is not the cause, but the tool and of course we should ban automatic weapons.  

Because I don't care to spend the rest of my life in prison. Denial is not a river in Egypt. Access to "firearms" and "responsible" gun owners are the cause. It takes a whole other level of effort to stab or beat someone to death, particularly multiple victims.

I'll ask you and see if you can answer, seeing how others on here either can't or are afraid to, if AR15s and other semi-automatic assault rifles (firearms made to kill people as efficiently as possible) are banned, would you be unable to defend yourself and would you consider your 2A to be violated?

I don’t own a gun.  I am not a legal expert so I can’t answer if my rights are violated but personally I would not feel my rights are violated. I shouldn’t have the right to own a weapon that can kill that many people in seconds.  

Halifax2TheMax

HughFreakingDillon said:

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

How many people who have ready access to firearms would stab or beat someone in a fit of anger or revenge, jealousy, frustration, etc.? Way fewer than what we see with guns laying around.

I don't just say stupid things on the interwebs but people shoot people because they're wimps and would never throw a punch or stab someone, never mind 10-15 people at a turn. Firearms make killing much less personal, intimate and a hell of a lot easier.

Easier to speed in a Prius or Honda Fit or Porsche?

HughFreakingDillon

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

How many people who have ready access to firearms would stab or beat someone in a fit of anger or revenge, jealousy, frustration, etc.? Way fewer than what we see with guns laying around.

I don't just say stupid things on the interwebs but people shoot people because they're wimps and would never throw a punch or stab someone, never mind 10-15 people at a turn. Firearms make killing much less personal, intimate and a hell of a lot easier.

Easier to speed in a Prius or Honda Fit or Porsche?

you take these guns out of the hands of nutjobs and yes, the mass shootings would stop. But that still doesn't mean the gun is the "cause". it's the tool used to get to the effect. 

Halifax2TheMax

HughFreakingDillon said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

How many people who have ready access to firearms would stab or beat someone in a fit of anger or revenge, jealousy, frustration, etc.? Way fewer than what we see with guns laying around.

I don't just say stupid things on the interwebs but people shoot people because they're wimps and would never throw a punch or stab someone, never mind 10-15 people at a turn. Firearms make killing much less personal, intimate and a hell of a lot easier.

Easier to speed in a Prius or Honda Fit or Porsche?

you take these guns out of the hands of nutjobs and yes, the mass shootings would stop. But that still doesn't mean the gun is the "cause". it's the tool used to get to the effect. 

“Nut jobs?” If “responsible” gun owners, from manufacturers to end user/owner were in fact “responsible,” you wouldn’t see half the carnage you see today. Denying that the easy access to firearms isn’t part of the “cause” is why nothing will change.

Thoughts and prayers, prayers and thoughts.

static111

HughFreakingDillon said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

How many people who have ready access to firearms would stab or beat someone in a fit of anger or revenge, jealousy, frustration, etc.? Way fewer than what we see with guns laying around.

I don't just say stupid things on the interwebs but people shoot people because they're wimps and would never throw a punch or stab someone, never mind 10-15 people at a turn. Firearms make killing much less personal, intimate and a hell of a lot easier.

Easier to speed in a Prius or Honda Fit or Porsche?

you take these guns out of the hands of nutjobs and yes, the mass shootings would stop. But that still doesn't mean the gun is the "cause". it's the tool used to get to the effect. 

I would say the cause of the high body counts is definitely the type of gun used.

Gern Blansten

static111 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

How many people who have ready access to firearms would stab or beat someone in a fit of anger or revenge, jealousy, frustration, etc.? Way fewer than what we see with guns laying around.

I don't just say stupid things on the interwebs but people shoot people because they're wimps and would never throw a punch or stab someone, never mind 10-15 people at a turn. Firearms make killing much less personal, intimate and a hell of a lot easier.

Easier to speed in a Prius or Honda Fit or Porsche?

you take these guns out of the hands of nutjobs and yes, the mass shootings would stop. But that still doesn't mean the gun is the "cause". it's the tool used to get to the effect. 

I would say the cause of the high body counts is definitely the type of gun used.

absolutely....and no one expects mass shootings to stop. We just want to make obtaining the weapons as difficult as possible. It isn't unreasonable to have a waiting period and detailed background check.

HughFreakingDillon

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

we see just as much violence in entertainment up here as you folks do. our entertainment is basically 85% american. 10% canadian, 5% awful british comedy. 

and no one was killed ON jenny jones. it was a few days after the taping. 

What's your take on why there is more violence in the U.S. 
Is it what H2TM says here (surely a part of it)?  Or are we just inherently more prone to violence?  I really am not sure.

Halifax2TheMax said:

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

I think it's a combination of things. 

1) access to guns
2) gun culture in the US (buying into the idea that the US was "born of violence" and that the constitution is like the bible)
3) mental health issues

we all have #3. But we don't all have #'s 1 and 2. So yes, I basically agree with Halifax. 

HughFreakingDillon

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

How many people who have ready access to firearms would stab or beat someone in a fit of anger or revenge, jealousy, frustration, etc.? Way fewer than what we see with guns laying around.

I don't just say stupid things on the interwebs but people shoot people because they're wimps and would never throw a punch or stab someone, never mind 10-15 people at a turn. Firearms make killing much less personal, intimate and a hell of a lot easier.

Easier to speed in a Prius or Honda Fit or Porsche?

you take these guns out of the hands of nutjobs and yes, the mass shootings would stop. But that still doesn't mean the gun is the "cause". it's the tool used to get to the effect. 

“Nut jobs?” If “responsible” gun owners, from manufacturers to end user/owner were in fact “responsible,” you wouldn’t see half the carnage you see today. Denying that the easy access to firearms isn’t part of the “cause” is why nothing will change.

Thoughts and prayers, prayers and thoughts.

see above

Halifax2TheMax

HughFreakingDillon said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

AR15's aren't the cause. anymore than a car is the cause of someone speeding. it's the tool that allows the capability, but it's not the cause. your computer isn't the cause of you saying stupid things online. lol

How many people who have ready access to firearms would stab or beat someone in a fit of anger or revenge, jealousy, frustration, etc.? Way fewer than what we see with guns laying around.

I don't just say stupid things on the interwebs but people shoot people because they're wimps and would never throw a punch or stab someone, never mind 10-15 people at a turn. Firearms make killing much less personal, intimate and a hell of a lot easier.

Easier to speed in a Prius or Honda Fit or Porsche?

you take these guns out of the hands of nutjobs and yes, the mass shootings would stop. But that still doesn't mean the gun is the "cause". it's the tool used to get to the effect. 

“Nut jobs?” If “responsible” gun owners, from manufacturers to end user/owner were in fact “responsible,” you wouldn’t see half the carnage you see today. Denying that the easy access to firearms isn’t part of the “cause” is why nothing will change.

Thoughts and prayers, prayers and thoughts.

see above

So it’s not the same as speeding?

brianlux

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

we see just as much violence in entertainment up here as you folks do. our entertainment is basically 85% american. 10% canadian, 5% awful british comedy. 

and no one was killed ON jenny jones. it was a few days after the taping. 

What's your take on why there is more violence in the U.S. 
Is it what H2TM says here (surely a part of it)?  Or are we just inherently more prone to violence?  I really am not sure.

Halifax2TheMax said:

Any excuse but the relative ease with which firearms are available and accessed. Any.

I think it's a combination of things. 

1) access to guns
2) gun culture in the US (buying into the idea that the US was "born of violence" and that the constitution is like the bible)
3) mental health issues

we all have #3. But we don't all have #'s 1 and 2. So yes, I basically agree with Halifax. 

Yeah, I can go along with that.  But I do somehow sense that we Americans are more prone to violence and that at least exacerbates the issue.  In any  case, I totally agree easy access to guns here is a major MAJOR factor. 

Bentleyspop

stuckinline

New York Gov. Kathy Hochul (D) signed 10 gun-related bills Monday that will bar those younger than 21 from buying or owning semi-automatic rifles, ban the purchase of body armor for most civilians and strengthen the state’s red flag laws, among other provisions.
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/new-york-gun-control-laws_n_629e44fee4b0b1100a6789a5

tbergs

stuckinline said:

New York Gov. Kathy Hochul (D) signed 10 gun-related bills Monday that will bar those younger than 21 from buying or owning semi-automatic rifles, ban the purchase of body armor for most civilians and strengthen the state’s red flag laws, among other provisions.
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/new-york-gun-control-laws_n_629e44fee4b0b1100a6789a5

And when the next shooting happens in NY, instead of looking for ways to prevent/limit such incidents, republicans will just point to this and say, see, nothing the democrats do would have prevented this. Must be nice just playing devil's advocate all the time and not having to worry about actually doing anything, but still hold office.