HELP NEEDED - I think I purchased a counterfeit 1998 Dallas Poster - Seeking photos for comparison

oz6269

I'm seeking out high resolution close up pictures of an authentic Dallas 1998 to compare with a one I just purchased.

When the poster arrived my spider sense immediately went off.  It doesn't look like any other silk screened poster I own.  The smaller text has some pixelation.  The more I scrutinized it and compared it to some other pictures I saw online I became more suspicious.  The dark blues aren't a solid color.  The lighter blues don't have that lattice like effect.  I know the poster paper will be the dead giveaway, but it's in a frame an I'm reluctant to disassemble until I have all my claims filed.  Based on the look in general my hypothesis is somebody took a scan from the PJ vs Ames book and printed off a very nice poster printer.  

I'm 85% sure it's a fake, but I want to have overwhelming proof as I go after the seller. 

Thanks in advance for any help anyone can offer.

Dvdpenny72

Dvdpenny72

Loujoe

Ames sometimes uses glossy and thin paper. Were all of the older posters signed by artists? 

EM194007

Loujoe said:

 Were all of the older posters signed by artists? 

No. 

CopperTom

EM194007 said:

Loujoe said:

 Were all of the older posters signed by artists? 

No. 

But it looks like the SE were signed & numbered in this case.  XX/350

Loujoe

Good detective work. Hope op can figure out if it's real.
It's a shame to hear of fakes. If I wasn't sure and dropped fat cash on it, I'd try for a refund. 

2-feign-reluctance

I’d say you figured it out. I would return it. Also, just now put together the bullet through the slurpee thing on this poster. Better late than never! 

on2legs

If it’s from eBay... use the “not as described” route to get a refund.  

on2legs

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

oz6269

on2legs said:

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

This is what I purchased.  

oz6269

Dvdpenny72 said:

Dvdpenny72, Thank you for posting.  Please look at my pictures in the link below, and contrast vs what your poster looks like in person.  Especially the "Poster by AMES" area.  Is the dark blue speckled?  Does the "poster by AMES" have crisp lines? It certainly looks crisp in your pictures.

https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMPt0bh7PGuB7a3NlEyMJ0qzjv-SQHlrbqBu-yZ17ok4fH8qQkbhr_UfBzRw4Hs5g?key=bGJZQ2t6YzZKcXpHRWhQYXM2dmVhb01vNnRFZ0hn

SHZA

You outbid me. I'd say congrats, but...
Ebay's buyer protection is excellent though. The pics do look a bit suspect. Surprising that people are selling fakes of these. Pretty elaborate scam to get it framed too 

mace1229

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

This is what I purchased.  

Same guy and pictures used? I’d say that’s the mail in the coffin if that’s the same thing he keeps selling. Report him to ebay as selling fakes too. Not sure if they care, eBay seems to be about what makes money and not helping their community though

100 Pacer

SHZA said:

You outbid me. I'd say congrats, but...
Ebay's buyer protection is excellent though. The pics do look a bit suspect. Surprising that people are selling fakes of these. Pretty elaborate scam to get it framed too 

There have been fake ‘96s and ‘98s on the market for the last 20 years.

SHZA

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

You outbid me. I'd say congrats, but...
Ebay's buyer protection is excellent though. The pics do look a bit suspect. Surprising that people are selling fakes of these. Pretty elaborate scam to get it framed too 

There have been fake ‘96s and ‘98s on the market for the last 20 years.

Evidence, please 

on2legs

Your photos definitely don't look like the nice crisp, clean lines you get with a screen print.  There's a lot of noise around the edges that looks like a scanner was used and it's a reprint.

100 Pacer

SHZA said:

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

You outbid me. I'd say congrats, but...
Ebay's buyer protection is excellent though. The pics do look a bit suspect. Surprising that people are selling fakes of these. Pretty elaborate scam to get it framed too 

There have been fake ‘96s and ‘98s on the market for the last 20 years.

Evidence, please 

We’d have to hop in the DeLorean but sadly it’s down while I wait for parts to arrive.

There was a fella named Piotr based in Europe on eBay selling fake ‘96s and ‘98s in the early 2000’s (the fake ‘96 Istanbul comes to mind - I strung him along for weeks before pointing out the obvious) and quite a few flooded the market. The fake ‘03 San Antonio/Houston that flooded the market as well. Many others sadly.

Loujoe

SweetDaddyLou

Wow that really sucks. I wish I had that poster, one of my top grails of all time to compare and provide some pics, but I don't have it. If it was me, I would reach out to Ames themselves and ask if they could confirm or verify anything regarding authenticity. Over the years I and I am sure others have spent a considerable amount of money on Ames stuff. I have spoken to them a few times for different reasons and they were always cool with me.  I would give them a call, get the person you spoke with email address and forward all the pics you have. You never know until you try. I guess best case scenario would be if it is indeed an original version, and that will get that sick feeling out of your stomach. Buying pre-framed posters, especially high end stuff like this one is always risking condition issues (edges, back of poster, etc) and I have personally tried to stay clear of these regardless of how much I would want to add to my collection. Good luck OP, I hope things work out the way you want them to. Ebay buyer protection would be your next step if it is not authentic.

SHZA

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

You outbid me. I'd say congrats, but...
Ebay's buyer protection is excellent though. The pics do look a bit suspect. Surprising that people are selling fakes of these. Pretty elaborate scam to get it framed too 

There have been fake ‘96s and ‘98s on the market for the last 20 years.

Evidence, please 

We’d have to hop in the DeLorean but sadly it’s down while I wait for parts to arrive.

There was a fella named Piotr based in Europe on eBay selling fake ‘96s and ‘98s in the early 2000’s (the fake ‘96 Istanbul comes to mind - I strung him along for weeks before pointing out the obvious) and quite a few flooded the market. The fake ‘03 San Antonio/Houston that flooded the market as well. Many others sadly.

Flux capacitator down? No problem, we just need to find a lightning strike.

What was the issue that revealed they were fake? These weren't selling for that much back then, seems odd that someone would go to the trouble of making fakes for a modest profit 

ST66483

Sorry if you got scammed OP, I can’t weigh in on this one.

With respect to past fakes there used to be a thread on the old BRY board about this comparing fakes to real. As @100 Pacer  mentioned there were a few confirmed fakes. My recollection is that Istanbul 96, Hartford 98, 03 Texas, 04 Showbox all come to mind, plus a few others (I think some other 98s, with at least one by Mr. Downtown, but I can’t recall if Dallas 98 was one of them or not). Some of the ‘tells’ were thinner paper, print quality, and at least one where they got the print press labelled wrong or missing (e.g. printed by .... was the wrong print company).  

Sorry Phoenix 98 was one of the others too. I believe it was the 98 Phoenix that credits Mr. Downtown it's legit, but credits Ames if it's a fake.

Good luck in getting your answer OP.

oz6269

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

You outbid me. I'd say congrats, but...
Ebay's buyer protection is excellent though. The pics do look a bit suspect. Surprising that people are selling fakes of these. Pretty elaborate scam to get it framed too 

There have been fake ‘96s and ‘98s on the market for the last 20 years.

Evidence, please 

We’d have to hop in the DeLorean but sadly it’s down while I wait for parts to arrive.

There was a fella named Piotr based in Europe on eBay selling fake ‘96s and ‘98s in the early 2000’s (the fake ‘96 Istanbul comes to mind - I strung him along for weeks before pointing out the obvious) and quite a few flooded the market. The fake ‘03 San Antonio/Houston that flooded the market as well. Many others sadly.

If the black red yellow forums were still around, there were several threads about fakes.  I know there are 100% fake Hartford 98s out there.  I'm pretty sure there are fake Boston 98s out there too.  These were actually silk screened fakes.  Digital fakes are newer to me but I don't pay attention like I once did.  

on2legs

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

This is what I purchased.  

Where was your seller based?  The auction that ended the other day said the seller was in Lansing, Michigan.

oz6269

on2legs said:

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

This is what I purchased.  

Where was your seller based?  The auction that ended the other day said the seller was in Lansing, Michigan.

Yes.  It said Lansing and the return address said Lansing.  

I actually don't think the seller faked it.  I think he was sold a fake based on our interactions.  The question is did he know he was selling a fake or not.  

SHZA

ST66483 said:

Sorry if you got scammed OP, I can’t weigh in on this one.

With respect to past fakes there used to be a thread on the old BRY board about this comparing fakes to real. As @100 Pacer  mentioned there were a few confirmed fakes. My recollection is that Istanbul 96, Hartford 98, 03 Texas, 04 Showbox all come to mind, plus a few others (I think some other 98s, with at least one by Mr. Downtown, but I can’t recall if Dallas 98 was one of them or not). Some of the ‘tells’ were thinner paper, print quality, and at least one where they got the print press labelled wrong or missing (e.g. printed by .... was the wrong print company).  

Sorry Phoenix 98 was one of the others too. I believe it was the 98 Phoenix that credits Mr. Downtown it's legit, but credits Ames if it's a fake.

Good luck in getting your answer OP.

This thread has some good info. About Raleigh in particular. Also if the print size is off or paper quality 

https://community.pearljam.com/discussion/10044/possible-fake-posters-on-ebay-just-a-warning/p1

on2legs

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

This is what I purchased.  

Where was your seller based?  The auction that ended the other day said the seller was in Lansing, Michigan.

Yes.  It said Lansing and the return address said Lansing.  

I actually don't think the seller faked it.  I think he was sold a fake based on our interactions.  The question is did he know he was selling a fake or not.  

So you have the one that closed on Feb 11 or you have a different one?

cundall23

I just wanted to add that the signature on mine is at the bottom right under "Arena"  and the number is at the bottom left.  I have also seen both under "Arena" as well.

2-feign-reluctance

SHZA said:

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

100 Pacer said:

SHZA said:

You outbid me. I'd say congrats, but...
Ebay's buyer protection is excellent though. The pics do look a bit suspect. Surprising that people are selling fakes of these. Pretty elaborate scam to get it framed too 

There have been fake ‘96s and ‘98s on the market for the last 20 years.

Evidence, please 

We’d have to hop in the DeLorean but sadly it’s down while I wait for parts to arrive.

There was a fella named Piotr based in Europe on eBay selling fake ‘96s and ‘98s in the early 2000’s (the fake ‘96 Istanbul comes to mind - I strung him along for weeks before pointing out the obvious) and quite a few flooded the market. The fake ‘03 San Antonio/Houston that flooded the market as well. Many others sadly.

Flux capacitator down? No problem, we just need to find a lightning strike.

What was the issue that revealed they were fake? These weren't selling for that much back then, seems odd that someone would go to the trouble of making fakes for a modest profit 

1.21 jigawatts of trouble all.  

oz6269

on2legs said:

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

This is what I purchased.  

Where was your seller based?  The auction that ended the other day said the seller was in Lansing, Michigan.

Yes.  It said Lansing and the return address said Lansing.  

I actually don't think the seller faked it.  I think he was sold a fake based on our interactions.  The question is did he know he was selling a fake or not.  

So you have the one that closed on Feb 11 or you have a different one?

I have the one that closed on Feb 11.

on2legs

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

oz6269 said:

on2legs said:

A framed Dallas just sold on eBay.... hopefully not another fake.  Doesn’t appear to be signed either. And seller has zero feedback. 

This is what I purchased.  

Where was your seller based?  The auction that ended the other day said the seller was in Lansing, Michigan.

Yes.  It said Lansing and the return address said Lansing.  

I actually don't think the seller faked it.  I think he was sold a fake based on our interactions.  The question is did he know he was selling a fake or not.  

So you have the one that closed on Feb 11 or you have a different one?

I have the one that closed on Feb 11.

Gotcha.  I think I got confused that there were two of these floating around.  It certainly sounds possible the seller is unaware that it’s a possible fake.  Although the zero feedback seems like a red flag.  I hope you are able to resolve it one way or the other, OP.  Good luck!