*** President Joe Biden & Vice President Kamala Harris ***

mickeyrat

rgambs said:

For 4 years I'll stay on the "still fucking sharper than Trump ever was" train, but I don't think he should run again in 2024.  Assuming there are no major (legitimate) scandals in the administration, he should step aside and let Harris run against the GOP challenger.  In any case, stutter or not, I will just try to enjoy a POTUS who is a mature adult who thinks and speaks above a grade-school level.

that consistently exhibits compassion and empathy....

Ledbetterman10

rgambs said:

For 4 years I'll stay on the "still fucking sharper than Trump ever was" train, but I don't think he should run again in 2024.  Assuming there are no major (legitimate) scandals in the administration, he should step aside and let Harris run against the GOP challenger.  In any case, stutter or not, I will just try to enjoy a POTUS who is a mature adult who thinks and speaks above a grade-school level.

If he steps aside after his first term, she should primaried in 2024. She had such little support in the 2020 primary that I don't think she deserves to presumptive 2024 nominee just because Biden picked her as VP. Probably wouldn't be the best idea for the Dems to do this, because it would just cause in-fighting and division amongst the party. But her bombing in the 2020 primary with Dems might suggest that she'd struggle in a general election. 

Bentleyspop

mickeyrat said:

rgambs said:

For 4 years I'll stay on the "still fucking sharper than Trump ever was" train, but I don't think he should run again in 2024.  Assuming there are no major (legitimate) scandals in the administration, he should step aside and let Harris run against the GOP challenger.  In any case, stutter or not, I will just try to enjoy a POTUS who is a mature adult who thinks and speaks above a grade-school level.

that consistently exhibits compassion and empathy....

Uses common sense
Has morals and ethics
Understands the rule of law
Understand and believes in the constitution 
Cares about Americans and America
Doesn't encourage racist xenophobic behavior
Etc etc

rgambs

Ledbetterman10 said:

rgambs said:

For 4 years I'll stay on the "still fucking sharper than Trump ever was" train, but I don't think he should run again in 2024.  Assuming there are no major (legitimate) scandals in the administration, he should step aside and let Harris run against the GOP challenger.  In any case, stutter or not, I will just try to enjoy a POTUS who is a mature adult who thinks and speaks above a grade-school level.

If he steps aside after his first term, she should primaried in 2024. She had such little support in the 2020 primary that I don't think she deserves to presumptive 2024 nominee just because Biden picked her as VP. Probably wouldn't be the best idea for the Dems to do this, because it would just cause in-fighting and division amongst the party. But her bombing in the 2020 primary with Dems might suggest that she'd struggle in a general election. 

Yeah I don't necessarily think she has, or will have earned it, but primary during incumbency is just a bad idea for the party and for winning.  Again, assuming no major (legitimate) scandals, she will be the most recognizable and high-profile Democrat with the prospect of the smoothest transition possible.  I have to assume the GOP candidate in 2024 is going to be batshit crazy, because that's just how they roll nowadays, so her chances in the general shouldn't be any more or less than anyone else the DNC has in line.

Ledbetterman10

rgambs said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

rgambs said:

For 4 years I'll stay on the "still fucking sharper than Trump ever was" train, but I don't think he should run again in 2024.  Assuming there are no major (legitimate) scandals in the administration, he should step aside and let Harris run against the GOP challenger.  In any case, stutter or not, I will just try to enjoy a POTUS who is a mature adult who thinks and speaks above a grade-school level.

If he steps aside after his first term, she should primaried in 2024. She had such little support in the 2020 primary that I don't think she deserves to presumptive 2024 nominee just because Biden picked her as VP. Probably wouldn't be the best idea for the Dems to do this, because it would just cause in-fighting and division amongst the party. But her bombing in the 2020 primary with Dems might suggest that she'd struggle in a general election. 

Yeah I don't necessarily think she has, or will have earned it, but primary during incumbency is just a bad idea for the party and for winning.  Again, assuming no major (legitimate) scandals, she will be the most recognizable and high-profile Democrat with the prospect of the smoothest transition possible.  I have to assume the GOP candidate in 2024 is going to be batshit crazy, because that's just how they roll nowadays, so her chances in the general shouldn't be any more or less than anyone else the DNC has in line.

Yeah that's true (especially the bolded parts). I just don't like her and some of the Dems I do like (Yang most of all, Pete and Amy to some degree), are likely going to have to sit on the sidelines. It will be interesting to see what Biden actually does in 2024. He'll be very old as we all know, but it's been a long time since a president didn't' run for re-election, so it'd definitely be strange. 

HughFreakingDillon

Harris/Yang 2024

The Juggler

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

HughFreakingDillon

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

unfortunately all that is too long for a hashtag. 

mickeyrat

HughFreakingDillon said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

unfortunately all that is too long for a hashtag. 

well it IS obama..... that dude can talk.

HughFreakingDillon

mickeyrat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

unfortunately all that is too long for a hashtag. 

well it IS obama..... that dude can talk.

he can, very eloquently and intelligently. my point is if it doesn't fit into a cute little sound bite, no one pays attention. 

mickeyrat

HughFreakingDillon said:

mickeyrat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

unfortunately all that is too long for a hashtag. 

well it IS obama..... that dude can talk.

he can, very eloquently and intelligently. my point is if it doesn't fit into a cute little sound bite, no one pays attention. 

yeah. I guessed thats what you meant. so if a person or group is pushing a policy agenda via twitter and a hashtag, umm fuck you.

you simply cannot impart all the necessary nuance in some of these bold ideas. #defundthepolice is a prime example. how in the fuck is anyone supposed to glean its around a shift in dollars to social services etc that would help prevent a police call in the first place. changes need to happen sooner rather than later but thats no way to get people on board.

CM189191

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Sorry Obama, I love you, but this is a horseshit take.

People have been shouting Reform the Police for years.  It didn't work and police kept killing black folks.

Now we are calling to Defund the Police, now people are listening.  And it's happening, too.  Here in Minneapolis to the tune of $8,000,000

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2020/11/30/minneapolis-mayor-calls-proposed-police-cuts-irresponsible

To put that into perspective,  2021 budget sets police department funding at $179,000,000

$8M is 7.4% reduction in spending on police

For additional perspective, Minneapolis proposed city budget is $1.47 Billion (down 6% from last year).  That makes the Police budget 12% of the total budget.

http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/www/groups/public/@finance/documents/webcontent/wcmsp-226230.pdf

In summary, ACAB and Fuck the Police

The Juggler

CM189191 said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Sorry Obama, I love you, but this is a horseshit take.

People have been shouting Reform the Police for years.  It didn't work and police kept killing black folks.

Now we are calling to Defund the Police, now people are listening.  And it's happening, too.  Here in Minneapolis to the tune of $8,000,000

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2020/11/30/minneapolis-mayor-calls-proposed-police-cuts-irresponsible

To put that into perspective,  2021 budget sets police department funding at $179,000,000

$8M is 7.4% reduction in spending on police

For additional perspective, Minneapolis proposed city budget is $1.47 Billion (down 6% from last year).  That makes the Police budget 12% of the total budget.

http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/www/groups/public/@finance/documents/webcontent/wcmsp-226230.pdf

In summary, ACAB and Fuck the Police

People are listening? It very likely cost the democrats the chance of regaining the senate. That is nice that you are getting some things done in Minnesota but real reform won't happen until you're able to communicate with the other half of the electorate more effectively. Messaging plays a huge factor. I think, and apparently Obama agrees, that "Defund the Police" is horrible messaging unless you're a member of the far left. 

CM189191

The Juggler said:

CM189191 said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Sorry Obama, I love you, but this is a horseshit take.

People have been shouting Reform the Police for years.  It didn't work and police kept killing black folks.

Now we are calling to Defund the Police, now people are listening.  And it's happening, too.  Here in Minneapolis to the tune of $8,000,000

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2020/11/30/minneapolis-mayor-calls-proposed-police-cuts-irresponsible

To put that into perspective,  2021 budget sets police department funding at $179,000,000

$8M is 7.4% reduction in spending on police

For additional perspective, Minneapolis proposed city budget is $1.47 Billion (down 6% from last year).  That makes the Police budget 12% of the total budget.

http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/www/groups/public/@finance/documents/webcontent/wcmsp-226230.pdf

In summary, ACAB and Fuck the Police

People are listening? It very likely cost the democrats the chance of regaining the senate. That is nice that you are getting some things done in Minnesota but real reform won't happen until you're able to communicate with the other half of the electorate more effectively. Messaging plays a huge factor. I think, and apparently Obama agrees, that "Defund the Police" is horrible messaging unless you're a member of the far left. 

Fuck the other half of the electorate. If people in backward ass Kentucky want to live in a poverty stricken police state, let them. States like Minnesota will continue to leave them in the dust. Defund Kentucky!

static111

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Wait I thought “defund the police” was bad because you had to explain it? But apparently whatever that diarrhea is, is somehow much easier for people to digest 🙄.  This putting aside that no politician ran on the defund the police platform. 

static111

CM189191 said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Sorry Obama, I love you, but this is a horseshit take.

People have been shouting Reform the Police for years.  It didn't work and police kept killing black folks.

Now we are calling to Defund the Police, now people are listening.  And it's happening, too.  Here in Minneapolis to the tune of $8,000,000

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2020/11/30/minneapolis-mayor-calls-proposed-police-cuts-irresponsible

To put that into perspective,  2021 budget sets police department funding at $179,000,000

$8M is 7.4% reduction in spending on police

For additional perspective, Minneapolis proposed city budget is $1.47 Billion (down 6% from last year).  That makes the Police budget 12% of the total budget.

http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/www/groups/public/@finance/documents/webcontent/wcmsp-226230.pdf

In summary, ACAB and Fuck the Police

This is exactly how I feel. Here in Austin we defunded the budget a symbolic $150 million and that translates to $20million actual reduction in budget which is great.  Also we are tearing down the main police station that runs up against I35. The time for incrementalism and getting the other side on board is over. Nothing has changed in 30 plus years. It’s time for drastic action. Time may heal all wounds eventually but direct action works faster.

The Juggler

static111 said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Wait I thought “defund the police” was bad because you had to explain it? But apparently whatever that diarrhea is, is somehow much easier for people to digest 🙄.  This putting aside that no politician ran on the defund the police platform. 

Hey how'd flipping the senate work out for democrats? How about not saying "defund the police" at all because it sounds to casual observers that you want to just get rid of the fucking police. lol. 

It doesn't matter if anyone specifically ran on "defunding the police" or not. The moment it became a thing and a slogan and a hashtag for the left, Trump and the republicans seized on it because they knew it would benefit them more politically and they were right. That is why they tried to make it seem as if Biden wanted to defund the police when he came out said the opposite. I live in suburban Philadelphia and every republican ad mentioned it. Not lying. Literally every single one. It was absolute horseshit but it didn't matter. Didn't matter if the candidate they were targeting was for or against it. They managed to successfully brand most of the democrats as lawless hippies who wanted to abolish the police force. 

That's what I am talking about. I know they do not really want to abolish the police. But republicans made a lot of people believe that is what they intended and as a result.......the democrats are left hoping for two hail mary's in Georgia next month. 

The Juggler

CM189191 said:

The Juggler said:

CM189191 said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Sorry Obama, I love you, but this is a horseshit take.

People have been shouting Reform the Police for years.  It didn't work and police kept killing black folks.

Now we are calling to Defund the Police, now people are listening.  And it's happening, too.  Here in Minneapolis to the tune of $8,000,000

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2020/11/30/minneapolis-mayor-calls-proposed-police-cuts-irresponsible

To put that into perspective,  2021 budget sets police department funding at $179,000,000

$8M is 7.4% reduction in spending on police

For additional perspective, Minneapolis proposed city budget is $1.47 Billion (down 6% from last year).  That makes the Police budget 12% of the total budget.

http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/www/groups/public/@finance/documents/webcontent/wcmsp-226230.pdf

In summary, ACAB and Fuck the Police

People are listening? It very likely cost the democrats the chance of regaining the senate. That is nice that you are getting some things done in Minnesota but real reform won't happen until you're able to communicate with the other half of the electorate more effectively. Messaging plays a huge factor. I think, and apparently Obama agrees, that "Defund the Police" is horrible messaging unless you're a member of the far left. 

Fuck the other half of the electorate. If people in backward ass Kentucky want to live in a poverty stricken police state, let them. States like Minnesota will continue to leave them in the dust. Defund Kentucky!

Well, yeah, but...... it's attitudes like that that help explain why republicans are likely going to retain the senate. 

You can say "fuck the other half of the electorate" and think your side is right all the time, all you want. But you still need a portion of those voters to vote for your candidates, and alienating them with dumb slogans that don't even really mean what they say ain't the way to do it, sister!

CM189191

The Juggler said:

static111 said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Wait I thought “defund the police” was bad because you had to explain it? But apparently whatever that diarrhea is, is somehow much easier for people to digest 🙄.  This putting aside that no politician ran on the defund the police platform. 

Hey how'd flipping the senate work out for democrats? How about not saying "defund the police" at all because it sounds to casual observers that you want to just get rid of the fucking police. lol. 

It doesn't matter if anyone specifically ran on "defunding the police" or not. The moment it became a thing and a slogan and a hashtag for the left, Trump and the republicans seized on it because they knew it would benefit them more politically and they were right. That is why they tried to make it seem as if Biden wanted to defund the police when he came out said the opposite. I live in suburban Philadelphia and every republican ad mentioned it. Not lying. Literally every single one. It was absolute horseshit but it didn't matter. Didn't matter if the candidate they were targeting was for or against it. They managed to successfully brand most of the democrats as lawless hippies who wanted to abolish the police force. 

That's what I am talking about. I know they do not really want to abolish the police. But republicans made a lot of people believe that is what they intended and as a result.......the democrats are left hoping for two hail mary's in Georgia next month. 

Lawless hippies who want to abolish the police force? Those are libertarians. And libertarians are just embarrassed Republicans.

Who cares what the other side's messaging is? Just ignore them and move forward. Let them wallow in their own squalor.  Don't give them credibility by saying " no no no that's not what we meant ". 

Defund the police is exactly what we meant.  And they should pray we don't alter the agreement further. Disband the police, disband ICE, defund the military. 

CM189191

CM189191 said:

The Juggler said:

static111 said:

The Juggler said:

Had the Dems operated as Obama is suggesting here, they might not be in a position where they need to sweat out a couple long shot runoffs in Georgia to reclaim the senate. Thank god Joe Biden was at the top of the ticket

Wait I thought “defund the police” was bad because you had to explain it? But apparently whatever that diarrhea is, is somehow much easier for people to digest 🙄.  This putting aside that no politician ran on the defund the police platform. 

Hey how'd flipping the senate work out for democrats? How about not saying "defund the police" at all because it sounds to casual observers that you want to just get rid of the fucking police. lol. 

It doesn't matter if anyone specifically ran on "defunding the police" or not. The moment it became a thing and a slogan and a hashtag for the left, Trump and the republicans seized on it because they knew it would benefit them more politically and they were right. That is why they tried to make it seem as if Biden wanted to defund the police when he came out said the opposite. I live in suburban Philadelphia and every republican ad mentioned it. Not lying. Literally every single one. It was absolute horseshit but it didn't matter. Didn't matter if the candidate they were targeting was for or against it. They managed to successfully brand most of the democrats as lawless hippies who wanted to abolish the police force. 

That's what I am talking about. I know they do not really want to abolish the police. But republicans made a lot of people believe that is what they intended and as a result.......the democrats are left hoping for two hail mary's in Georgia next month. 

Lawless hippies who want to abolish the police force? Those are libertarians. And libertarians are just embarrassed Republicans.

Who cares what the other side's messaging is? Just ignore them and move forward. Let them wallow in their own squalor.  Don't give them credibility by saying " no no no that's not what we meant ". 

Defund the police is exactly what we meant.  And they should pray we don't alter the agreement further. Disband the police, disband ICE, defund the military. 

I forgot about DHS and TSA, fuck those guys too