GOP

tbergs

Ron Johnson yet again proves he's garbage. What a racist asshole.

mickeyrat

maybe help debunk some talking points....

Undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been for 25 years

Danae King

The Columbus Dispatch

Every year, Arturo pays thousands of dollars in taxes from the revenue produced by his central Ohio-based painting company.

But he will never receive Social Security benefits. Or Medicare. Or Medicaid.

That's because Arturo, whose last name is not being used for his safety, is an undocumented immigrant from Mexico — one of about 6 million who pay taxes annually, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

More:One in eight Columbus essential workers is undocumented immigrant, study finds

A report from the office shows that 50% to 75% of undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been since the Internal Revenue Service created a program 25 years ago allowing people without a Social Security number to file taxes.

When it comes to state and local taxes, undocumented immigrants pay more than $11 billion a year, according to a 2017 report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, a nonpartisan nonprofit based in Washington, D.C. In Ohio, they paid $83.2 million in state and local taxes in 2017, according to the institute.

More:Undocumented immigrants' fear of arrest, deportation may keep them from COVID-19 vaccine

"When you hear people who are citizens — who may be against immigration or immigrants, especially undocumented — say, 'Oh, they're here and sucking up all the government resources and taking handouts and welfare.' That's not the case," said Jessica Rodriguez Bell, a Columbus immigration attorney who has undocumented clients.

"These people are not eligible for those benefits, and many times they're paying into the system like we are. It's frustrating to hear that a lot."

Still, many attorneys recommend their undocumented clients pay taxes, Rodriguez Bell said.

"The reason for that is that, one, it's income they've been paying in and are likely entitled to a refund of some sort," Rodriguez Bell said. "Then, also because in the future, even if they don't have a current immigration case pending or even if they're not eligible for relief at this time ... oftentimes you want to demonstrate good moral character and that you've been an upstanding citizen while you've been here."

Years of tax returns also establish that a person has been living in the United States, she said.

To some, though, the issue is not whether or not undocumented immigrants pay taxes, said Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Center for Immigration Studies, a Washington, D.C.-based conservative think tank.

"There's this sort of implicit assumption that if you pay your taxes everything else is fine," he said. "Paying your taxes doesn't wipe away everything else that you've done."

Krikorian said that the real question is what is the balance of taxes undocumented immigrants pay versus the services they consume. 

"There's no real debate about less-skilled workers," he said. "Whether they're legal or illegal, they use more in services than they pay in taxes." 

A 2010 report from another Washington, D.C., think tank, the Brookings Institution, however, suggests that while U.S.-citizen children of undocumented immigrants can be costly when they're young, those costs are paid out through a lifetime of taxes.

The mere act of filing taxes could be seen as a risk for undocumented immigrants because it could result in the federal government pursing legal action to return the immigrants to their home country. But Rodriguez-Bell said she hasn't seen any such negative consequences.

"The IRS is a separate department, so it's not something where we've ever seen information exchanged between the IRS and, say, ICE," she said, referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement. "This is not something that's going to get you in trouble, and you're not doing something illegal by doing that. It can only help your situation in the future if you are filing."

In 1996, the IRS created the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) to allow people working in the United States without Social Security numbers to pay taxes. It is a 9-digit number, the same length as a Social Security number, issued only to those who are not eligible for Social Security numbers. 

In order to help undocumented immigrants get a tax ID number and file, the IRS certifies what are called acceptance agents. There are 13 in Columbus, 79 in Ohio and more than 5,000 nationwide. 

Jorge Beltran, the owner of Belmont Services LLC, a tax preparation company on Columbus' Northwest Side, has been a certified acceptance agent with the IRS since 2008. The vast majority of Beltran's clients are undocumented immigrants, and he's passionate about letting people know that they pay taxes. 

More:Edith Espinal allowed to leave church sanctuary, must check in with ICE periodically

"Imagine if more people knew this," Beltran said. "These are not people asking for a handout. They're not asking for unemployment. They're not asking for any benefits. Even if they wanted to, they couldn't."

Consider his clients Javier and Norma — whose first names only are being used, as with other undocumented immigrants in this story, for their safety — who both worked in food service before the pandemic. In March 2020, Javier got laid off but had no access to unemployment or COVID-19 relief payments due to his status. Over the course of the rest of the year, he worked six different jobs to support his family, which includes their three U.S.-born children. 

The couple made $56,369 in 2020 and got a refund of $3,337, which made a big difference in their lives, Beltran said, possibly paying for five months of their rent. If they had Social Security numbers, they could've gotten $6,900 in federal COVID relief payments in 2020 to help support their family, Beltran said.

More:Miriam Vargas is second Columbus woman this month to leave sanctuary

"They contribute to all of our communities," he said. "They pay the school system from their taxes. They pay for the roads from their taxes, and they spend money they make in the grocery stores and movie theaters and everywhere but nobody knows about it."

Beltran shared the story of another two of his clients, Cirilo and Patricia, who live in Mount Vernon and have been in the country for almost 20 years. Cirilo works two jobs as a cook, but only made $26,784 last year, paying $3,706 in taxes. His earnings had to support his six children — four of whom have Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) status, allowing them to work and go to school legally, and two of whom were born in the United States.

Arturo and his wife, Nicole, a U.S. citizen whose family is from Mexico and who owns their painting company with him, are Beltran's clients as well. They employ 47 people and paid $118,250 in estimated taxes this year, according to Beltran.

'The Undocumented Lawyer':Edith Espinal's attorney featured in HBO documentary

"Talk about being productive members of society," he said. "Forty-seven people can feed their families, help pay the schools, whatever, with the employment they have and that's generated by this company.

More than $11,000 from the family's taxes went to the city of Columbus.

The couple started their business after Arturo got injured in his job as a butcher and was fired. He started working for a friend as a painter, but had always dreamed of working for himself and owning a business. So, with the help of a friend, they started their own business six years ago and now support themselves and their four children. 

'Back to being a refugee':Family displaced from Columbus apartments feels trauma again

"He comes from nothing in Mexico. His parents are farmers, and he has just a middle school, almost high school education," Nicole said, of her husband. "It was really important for him not to be stuck. He came to the United States to make something for himself, to provide a better future for his children."

Immigrants are here to make the country better, Nicole said. 

"This is what makes America great," she said. "immigrants coming here and finding their way and helping the country prosper, too." 

dking@dispatch.com

@DanaeKing

HughFreakingDillon

dignin said:

You don't need an ID to vote in Canada.

if you don't have ID you still need proof of you who are. kinda of the same process as a commissioner for oaths. but you can't just show up and vote without nothing. 

so yes, in essence, you do need an ID to vote in canada. 

edit for link:

https://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=vot&dir=ids&document=index&lang=e

tempo_n_groove

mickeyrat said:

maybe help debunk some talking points....

Undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been for 25 years

Danae King

The Columbus Dispatch

Every year, Arturo pays thousands of dollars in taxes from the revenue produced by his central Ohio-based painting company.

But he will never receive Social Security benefits. Or Medicare. Or Medicaid.

That's because Arturo, whose last name is not being used for his safety, is an undocumented immigrant from Mexico — one of about 6 million who pay taxes annually, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

More:One in eight Columbus essential workers is undocumented immigrant, study finds

A report from the office shows that 50% to 75% of undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been since the Internal Revenue Service created a program 25 years ago allowing people without a Social Security number to file taxes.

When it comes to state and local taxes, undocumented immigrants pay more than $11 billion a year, according to a 2017 report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, a nonpartisan nonprofit based in Washington, D.C. In Ohio, they paid $83.2 million in state and local taxes in 2017, according to the institute.

More:Undocumented immigrants' fear of arrest, deportation may keep them from COVID-19 vaccine

"When you hear people who are citizens — who may be against immigration or immigrants, especially undocumented — say, 'Oh, they're here and sucking up all the government resources and taking handouts and welfare.' That's not the case," said Jessica Rodriguez Bell, a Columbus immigration attorney who has undocumented clients.

"These people are not eligible for those benefits, and many times they're paying into the system like we are. It's frustrating to hear that a lot."

Still, many attorneys recommend their undocumented clients pay taxes, Rodriguez Bell said.

"The reason for that is that, one, it's income they've been paying in and are likely entitled to a refund of some sort," Rodriguez Bell said. "Then, also because in the future, even if they don't have a current immigration case pending or even if they're not eligible for relief at this time ... oftentimes you want to demonstrate good moral character and that you've been an upstanding citizen while you've been here."

Years of tax returns also establish that a person has been living in the United States, she said.

To some, though, the issue is not whether or not undocumented immigrants pay taxes, said Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Center for Immigration Studies, a Washington, D.C.-based conservative think tank.

"There's this sort of implicit assumption that if you pay your taxes everything else is fine," he said. "Paying your taxes doesn't wipe away everything else that you've done."

Krikorian said that the real question is what is the balance of taxes undocumented immigrants pay versus the services they consume. 

"There's no real debate about less-skilled workers," he said. "Whether they're legal or illegal, they use more in services than they pay in taxes." 

A 2010 report from another Washington, D.C., think tank, the Brookings Institution, however, suggests that while U.S.-citizen children of undocumented immigrants can be costly when they're young, those costs are paid out through a lifetime of taxes.

The mere act of filing taxes could be seen as a risk for undocumented immigrants because it could result in the federal government pursing legal action to return the immigrants to their home country. But Rodriguez-Bell said she hasn't seen any such negative consequences.

"The IRS is a separate department, so it's not something where we've ever seen information exchanged between the IRS and, say, ICE," she said, referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement. "This is not something that's going to get you in trouble, and you're not doing something illegal by doing that. It can only help your situation in the future if you are filing."

In 1996, the IRS created the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) to allow people working in the United States without Social Security numbers to pay taxes. It is a 9-digit number, the same length as a Social Security number, issued only to those who are not eligible for Social Security numbers. 

In order to help undocumented immigrants get a tax ID number and file, the IRS certifies what are called acceptance agents. There are 13 in Columbus, 79 in Ohio and more than 5,000 nationwide. 

Jorge Beltran, the owner of Belmont Services LLC, a tax preparation company on Columbus' Northwest Side, has been a certified acceptance agent with the IRS since 2008. The vast majority of Beltran's clients are undocumented immigrants, and he's passionate about letting people know that they pay taxes. 

More:Edith Espinal allowed to leave church sanctuary, must check in with ICE periodically

"Imagine if more people knew this," Beltran said. "These are not people asking for a handout. They're not asking for unemployment. They're not asking for any benefits. Even if they wanted to, they couldn't."

Consider his clients Javier and Norma — whose first names only are being used, as with other undocumented immigrants in this story, for their safety — who both worked in food service before the pandemic. In March 2020, Javier got laid off but had no access to unemployment or COVID-19 relief payments due to his status. Over the course of the rest of the year, he worked six different jobs to support his family, which includes their three U.S.-born children. 

The couple made $56,369 in 2020 and got a refund of $3,337, which made a big difference in their lives, Beltran said, possibly paying for five months of their rent. If they had Social Security numbers, they could've gotten $6,900 in federal COVID relief payments in 2020 to help support their family, Beltran said.

More:Miriam Vargas is second Columbus woman this month to leave sanctuary

"They contribute to all of our communities," he said. "They pay the school system from their taxes. They pay for the roads from their taxes, and they spend money they make in the grocery stores and movie theaters and everywhere but nobody knows about it."

Beltran shared the story of another two of his clients, Cirilo and Patricia, who live in Mount Vernon and have been in the country for almost 20 years. Cirilo works two jobs as a cook, but only made $26,784 last year, paying $3,706 in taxes. His earnings had to support his six children — four of whom have Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) status, allowing them to work and go to school legally, and two of whom were born in the United States.

Arturo and his wife, Nicole, a U.S. citizen whose family is from Mexico and who owns their painting company with him, are Beltran's clients as well. They employ 47 people and paid $118,250 in estimated taxes this year, according to Beltran.

'The Undocumented Lawyer':Edith Espinal's attorney featured in HBO documentary

"Talk about being productive members of society," he said. "Forty-seven people can feed their families, help pay the schools, whatever, with the employment they have and that's generated by this company.

More than $11,000 from the family's taxes went to the city of Columbus.

The couple started their business after Arturo got injured in his job as a butcher and was fired. He started working for a friend as a painter, but had always dreamed of working for himself and owning a business. So, with the help of a friend, they started their own business six years ago and now support themselves and their four children. 

'Back to being a refugee':Family displaced from Columbus apartments feels trauma again

"He comes from nothing in Mexico. His parents are farmers, and he has just a middle school, almost high school education," Nicole said, of her husband. "It was really important for him not to be stuck. He came to the United States to make something for himself, to provide a better future for his children."

Immigrants are here to make the country better, Nicole said. 

"This is what makes America great," she said. "immigrants coming here and finding their way and helping the country prosper, too." 

dking@dispatch.com

@DanaeKing

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

mrussel1

tempo_n_groove said:

mickeyrat said:

maybe help debunk some talking points....

Undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been for 25 years

Danae King

The Columbus Dispatch

Every year, Arturo pays thousands of dollars in taxes from the revenue produced by his central Ohio-based painting company.

But he will never receive Social Security benefits. Or Medicare. Or Medicaid.

That's because Arturo, whose last name is not being used for his safety, is an undocumented immigrant from Mexico — one of about 6 million who pay taxes annually, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

More:One in eight Columbus essential workers is undocumented immigrant, study finds

A report from the office shows that 50% to 75% of undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been since the Internal Revenue Service created a program 25 years ago allowing people without a Social Security number to file taxes.

When it comes to state and local taxes, undocumented immigrants pay more than $11 billion a year, according to a 2017 report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, a nonpartisan nonprofit based in Washington, D.C. In Ohio, they paid $83.2 million in state and local taxes in 2017, according to the institute.

More:Undocumented immigrants' fear of arrest, deportation may keep them from COVID-19 vaccine

"When you hear people who are citizens — who may be against immigration or immigrants, especially undocumented — say, 'Oh, they're here and sucking up all the government resources and taking handouts and welfare.' That's not the case," said Jessica Rodriguez Bell, a Columbus immigration attorney who has undocumented clients.

"These people are not eligible for those benefits, and many times they're paying into the system like we are. It's frustrating to hear that a lot."

Still, many attorneys recommend their undocumented clients pay taxes, Rodriguez Bell said.

"The reason for that is that, one, it's income they've been paying in and are likely entitled to a refund of some sort," Rodriguez Bell said. "Then, also because in the future, even if they don't have a current immigration case pending or even if they're not eligible for relief at this time ... oftentimes you want to demonstrate good moral character and that you've been an upstanding citizen while you've been here."

Years of tax returns also establish that a person has been living in the United States, she said.

To some, though, the issue is not whether or not undocumented immigrants pay taxes, said Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Center for Immigration Studies, a Washington, D.C.-based conservative think tank.

"There's this sort of implicit assumption that if you pay your taxes everything else is fine," he said. "Paying your taxes doesn't wipe away everything else that you've done."

Krikorian said that the real question is what is the balance of taxes undocumented immigrants pay versus the services they consume. 

"There's no real debate about less-skilled workers," he said. "Whether they're legal or illegal, they use more in services than they pay in taxes." 

A 2010 report from another Washington, D.C., think tank, the Brookings Institution, however, suggests that while U.S.-citizen children of undocumented immigrants can be costly when they're young, those costs are paid out through a lifetime of taxes.

The mere act of filing taxes could be seen as a risk for undocumented immigrants because it could result in the federal government pursing legal action to return the immigrants to their home country. But Rodriguez-Bell said she hasn't seen any such negative consequences.

"The IRS is a separate department, so it's not something where we've ever seen information exchanged between the IRS and, say, ICE," she said, referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement. "This is not something that's going to get you in trouble, and you're not doing something illegal by doing that. It can only help your situation in the future if you are filing."

In 1996, the IRS created the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) to allow people working in the United States without Social Security numbers to pay taxes. It is a 9-digit number, the same length as a Social Security number, issued only to those who are not eligible for Social Security numbers. 

In order to help undocumented immigrants get a tax ID number and file, the IRS certifies what are called acceptance agents. There are 13 in Columbus, 79 in Ohio and more than 5,000 nationwide. 

Jorge Beltran, the owner of Belmont Services LLC, a tax preparation company on Columbus' Northwest Side, has been a certified acceptance agent with the IRS since 2008. The vast majority of Beltran's clients are undocumented immigrants, and he's passionate about letting people know that they pay taxes. 

More:Edith Espinal allowed to leave church sanctuary, must check in with ICE periodically

"Imagine if more people knew this," Beltran said. "These are not people asking for a handout. They're not asking for unemployment. They're not asking for any benefits. Even if they wanted to, they couldn't."

Consider his clients Javier and Norma — whose first names only are being used, as with other undocumented immigrants in this story, for their safety — who both worked in food service before the pandemic. In March 2020, Javier got laid off but had no access to unemployment or COVID-19 relief payments due to his status. Over the course of the rest of the year, he worked six different jobs to support his family, which includes their three U.S.-born children. 

The couple made $56,369 in 2020 and got a refund of $3,337, which made a big difference in their lives, Beltran said, possibly paying for five months of their rent. If they had Social Security numbers, they could've gotten $6,900 in federal COVID relief payments in 2020 to help support their family, Beltran said.

More:Miriam Vargas is second Columbus woman this month to leave sanctuary

"They contribute to all of our communities," he said. "They pay the school system from their taxes. They pay for the roads from their taxes, and they spend money they make in the grocery stores and movie theaters and everywhere but nobody knows about it."

Beltran shared the story of another two of his clients, Cirilo and Patricia, who live in Mount Vernon and have been in the country for almost 20 years. Cirilo works two jobs as a cook, but only made $26,784 last year, paying $3,706 in taxes. His earnings had to support his six children — four of whom have Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) status, allowing them to work and go to school legally, and two of whom were born in the United States.

Arturo and his wife, Nicole, a U.S. citizen whose family is from Mexico and who owns their painting company with him, are Beltran's clients as well. They employ 47 people and paid $118,250 in estimated taxes this year, according to Beltran.

'The Undocumented Lawyer':Edith Espinal's attorney featured in HBO documentary

"Talk about being productive members of society," he said. "Forty-seven people can feed their families, help pay the schools, whatever, with the employment they have and that's generated by this company.

More than $11,000 from the family's taxes went to the city of Columbus.

The couple started their business after Arturo got injured in his job as a butcher and was fired. He started working for a friend as a painter, but had always dreamed of working for himself and owning a business. So, with the help of a friend, they started their own business six years ago and now support themselves and their four children. 

'Back to being a refugee':Family displaced from Columbus apartments feels trauma again

"He comes from nothing in Mexico. His parents are farmers, and he has just a middle school, almost high school education," Nicole said, of her husband. "It was really important for him not to be stuck. He came to the United States to make something for himself, to provide a better future for his children."

Immigrants are here to make the country better, Nicole said. 

"This is what makes America great," she said. "immigrants coming here and finding their way and helping the country prosper, too." 

dking@dispatch.com

@DanaeKing

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

They pay sales taxes... and the fault for them getting paid under the table is on their employers, who enable the law breaking and break the law themselves.  They are also not paying taxes required. Seems to me the undocumented immigrants are no worse, or even 'less worse'.  At least we can understand why they want to work and are working. 

cincybearcat

tempo_n_groove said:

mickeyrat said:

maybe help debunk some talking points....

Undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been for 25 years

Danae King

The Columbus Dispatch

Every year, Arturo pays thousands of dollars in taxes from the revenue produced by his central Ohio-based painting company.

But he will never receive Social Security benefits. Or Medicare. Or Medicaid.

That's because Arturo, whose last name is not being used for his safety, is an undocumented immigrant from Mexico — one of about 6 million who pay taxes annually, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

More:One in eight Columbus essential workers is undocumented immigrant, study finds

A report from the office shows that 50% to 75% of undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been since the Internal Revenue Service created a program 25 years ago allowing people without a Social Security number to file taxes.

When it comes to state and local taxes, undocumented immigrants pay more than $11 billion a year, according to a 2017 report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, a nonpartisan nonprofit based in Washington, D.C. In Ohio, they paid $83.2 million in state and local taxes in 2017, according to the institute.

More:Undocumented immigrants' fear of arrest, deportation may keep them from COVID-19 vaccine

"When you hear people who are citizens — who may be against immigration or immigrants, especially undocumented — say, 'Oh, they're here and sucking up all the government resources and taking handouts and welfare.' That's not the case," said Jessica Rodriguez Bell, a Columbus immigration attorney who has undocumented clients.

"These people are not eligible for those benefits, and many times they're paying into the system like we are. It's frustrating to hear that a lot."

Still, many attorneys recommend their undocumented clients pay taxes, Rodriguez Bell said.

"The reason for that is that, one, it's income they've been paying in and are likely entitled to a refund of some sort," Rodriguez Bell said. "Then, also because in the future, even if they don't have a current immigration case pending or even if they're not eligible for relief at this time ... oftentimes you want to demonstrate good moral character and that you've been an upstanding citizen while you've been here."

Years of tax returns also establish that a person has been living in the United States, she said.

To some, though, the issue is not whether or not undocumented immigrants pay taxes, said Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Center for Immigration Studies, a Washington, D.C.-based conservative think tank.

"There's this sort of implicit assumption that if you pay your taxes everything else is fine," he said. "Paying your taxes doesn't wipe away everything else that you've done."

Krikorian said that the real question is what is the balance of taxes undocumented immigrants pay versus the services they consume. 

"There's no real debate about less-skilled workers," he said. "Whether they're legal or illegal, they use more in services than they pay in taxes." 

A 2010 report from another Washington, D.C., think tank, the Brookings Institution, however, suggests that while U.S.-citizen children of undocumented immigrants can be costly when they're young, those costs are paid out through a lifetime of taxes.

The mere act of filing taxes could be seen as a risk for undocumented immigrants because it could result in the federal government pursing legal action to return the immigrants to their home country. But Rodriguez-Bell said she hasn't seen any such negative consequences.

"The IRS is a separate department, so it's not something where we've ever seen information exchanged between the IRS and, say, ICE," she said, referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement. "This is not something that's going to get you in trouble, and you're not doing something illegal by doing that. It can only help your situation in the future if you are filing."

In 1996, the IRS created the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) to allow people working in the United States without Social Security numbers to pay taxes. It is a 9-digit number, the same length as a Social Security number, issued only to those who are not eligible for Social Security numbers. 

In order to help undocumented immigrants get a tax ID number and file, the IRS certifies what are called acceptance agents. There are 13 in Columbus, 79 in Ohio and more than 5,000 nationwide. 

Jorge Beltran, the owner of Belmont Services LLC, a tax preparation company on Columbus' Northwest Side, has been a certified acceptance agent with the IRS since 2008. The vast majority of Beltran's clients are undocumented immigrants, and he's passionate about letting people know that they pay taxes. 

More:Edith Espinal allowed to leave church sanctuary, must check in with ICE periodically

"Imagine if more people knew this," Beltran said. "These are not people asking for a handout. They're not asking for unemployment. They're not asking for any benefits. Even if they wanted to, they couldn't."

Consider his clients Javier and Norma — whose first names only are being used, as with other undocumented immigrants in this story, for their safety — who both worked in food service before the pandemic. In March 2020, Javier got laid off but had no access to unemployment or COVID-19 relief payments due to his status. Over the course of the rest of the year, he worked six different jobs to support his family, which includes their three U.S.-born children. 

The couple made $56,369 in 2020 and got a refund of $3,337, which made a big difference in their lives, Beltran said, possibly paying for five months of their rent. If they had Social Security numbers, they could've gotten $6,900 in federal COVID relief payments in 2020 to help support their family, Beltran said.

More:Miriam Vargas is second Columbus woman this month to leave sanctuary

"They contribute to all of our communities," he said. "They pay the school system from their taxes. They pay for the roads from their taxes, and they spend money they make in the grocery stores and movie theaters and everywhere but nobody knows about it."

Beltran shared the story of another two of his clients, Cirilo and Patricia, who live in Mount Vernon and have been in the country for almost 20 years. Cirilo works two jobs as a cook, but only made $26,784 last year, paying $3,706 in taxes. His earnings had to support his six children — four of whom have Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) status, allowing them to work and go to school legally, and two of whom were born in the United States.

Arturo and his wife, Nicole, a U.S. citizen whose family is from Mexico and who owns their painting company with him, are Beltran's clients as well. They employ 47 people and paid $118,250 in estimated taxes this year, according to Beltran.

'The Undocumented Lawyer':Edith Espinal's attorney featured in HBO documentary

"Talk about being productive members of society," he said. "Forty-seven people can feed their families, help pay the schools, whatever, with the employment they have and that's generated by this company.

More than $11,000 from the family's taxes went to the city of Columbus.

The couple started their business after Arturo got injured in his job as a butcher and was fired. He started working for a friend as a painter, but had always dreamed of working for himself and owning a business. So, with the help of a friend, they started their own business six years ago and now support themselves and their four children. 

'Back to being a refugee':Family displaced from Columbus apartments feels trauma again

"He comes from nothing in Mexico. His parents are farmers, and he has just a middle school, almost high school education," Nicole said, of her husband. "It was really important for him not to be stuck. He came to the United States to make something for himself, to provide a better future for his children."

Immigrants are here to make the country better, Nicole said. 

"This is what makes America great," she said. "immigrants coming here and finding their way and helping the country prosper, too." 

dking@dispatch.com

@DanaeKing

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

There is this. Got friends in Cali that use the labor outside Home Depot for some work.

Regardless, just fix entering the country and a process to stay and stop letting it be a free for all or blaming immigrants for all the problems we face.

mrussel1

cincybearcat said:

tempo_n_groove said:

mickeyrat said:

maybe help debunk some talking points....

Undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been for 25 years

Danae King

The Columbus Dispatch

Every year, Arturo pays thousands of dollars in taxes from the revenue produced by his central Ohio-based painting company.

But he will never receive Social Security benefits. Or Medicare. Or Medicaid.

That's because Arturo, whose last name is not being used for his safety, is an undocumented immigrant from Mexico — one of about 6 million who pay taxes annually, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

More:One in eight Columbus essential workers is undocumented immigrant, study finds

A report from the office shows that 50% to 75% of undocumented immigrants pay billions in taxes each year — and have been since the Internal Revenue Service created a program 25 years ago allowing people without a Social Security number to file taxes.

When it comes to state and local taxes, undocumented immigrants pay more than $11 billion a year, according to a 2017 report from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, a nonpartisan nonprofit based in Washington, D.C. In Ohio, they paid $83.2 million in state and local taxes in 2017, according to the institute.

More:Undocumented immigrants' fear of arrest, deportation may keep them from COVID-19 vaccine

"When you hear people who are citizens — who may be against immigration or immigrants, especially undocumented — say, 'Oh, they're here and sucking up all the government resources and taking handouts and welfare.' That's not the case," said Jessica Rodriguez Bell, a Columbus immigration attorney who has undocumented clients.

"These people are not eligible for those benefits, and many times they're paying into the system like we are. It's frustrating to hear that a lot."

Still, many attorneys recommend their undocumented clients pay taxes, Rodriguez Bell said.

"The reason for that is that, one, it's income they've been paying in and are likely entitled to a refund of some sort," Rodriguez Bell said. "Then, also because in the future, even if they don't have a current immigration case pending or even if they're not eligible for relief at this time ... oftentimes you want to demonstrate good moral character and that you've been an upstanding citizen while you've been here."

Years of tax returns also establish that a person has been living in the United States, she said.

To some, though, the issue is not whether or not undocumented immigrants pay taxes, said Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Center for Immigration Studies, a Washington, D.C.-based conservative think tank.

"There's this sort of implicit assumption that if you pay your taxes everything else is fine," he said. "Paying your taxes doesn't wipe away everything else that you've done."

Krikorian said that the real question is what is the balance of taxes undocumented immigrants pay versus the services they consume. 

"There's no real debate about less-skilled workers," he said. "Whether they're legal or illegal, they use more in services than they pay in taxes." 

A 2010 report from another Washington, D.C., think tank, the Brookings Institution, however, suggests that while U.S.-citizen children of undocumented immigrants can be costly when they're young, those costs are paid out through a lifetime of taxes.

The mere act of filing taxes could be seen as a risk for undocumented immigrants because it could result in the federal government pursing legal action to return the immigrants to their home country. But Rodriguez-Bell said she hasn't seen any such negative consequences.

"The IRS is a separate department, so it's not something where we've ever seen information exchanged between the IRS and, say, ICE," she said, referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement. "This is not something that's going to get you in trouble, and you're not doing something illegal by doing that. It can only help your situation in the future if you are filing."

In 1996, the IRS created the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) to allow people working in the United States without Social Security numbers to pay taxes. It is a 9-digit number, the same length as a Social Security number, issued only to those who are not eligible for Social Security numbers. 

In order to help undocumented immigrants get a tax ID number and file, the IRS certifies what are called acceptance agents. There are 13 in Columbus, 79 in Ohio and more than 5,000 nationwide. 

Jorge Beltran, the owner of Belmont Services LLC, a tax preparation company on Columbus' Northwest Side, has been a certified acceptance agent with the IRS since 2008. The vast majority of Beltran's clients are undocumented immigrants, and he's passionate about letting people know that they pay taxes. 

More:Edith Espinal allowed to leave church sanctuary, must check in with ICE periodically

"Imagine if more people knew this," Beltran said. "These are not people asking for a handout. They're not asking for unemployment. They're not asking for any benefits. Even if they wanted to, they couldn't."

Consider his clients Javier and Norma — whose first names only are being used, as with other undocumented immigrants in this story, for their safety — who both worked in food service before the pandemic. In March 2020, Javier got laid off but had no access to unemployment or COVID-19 relief payments due to his status. Over the course of the rest of the year, he worked six different jobs to support his family, which includes their three U.S.-born children. 

The couple made $56,369 in 2020 and got a refund of $3,337, which made a big difference in their lives, Beltran said, possibly paying for five months of their rent. If they had Social Security numbers, they could've gotten $6,900 in federal COVID relief payments in 2020 to help support their family, Beltran said.

More:Miriam Vargas is second Columbus woman this month to leave sanctuary

"They contribute to all of our communities," he said. "They pay the school system from their taxes. They pay for the roads from their taxes, and they spend money they make in the grocery stores and movie theaters and everywhere but nobody knows about it."

Beltran shared the story of another two of his clients, Cirilo and Patricia, who live in Mount Vernon and have been in the country for almost 20 years. Cirilo works two jobs as a cook, but only made $26,784 last year, paying $3,706 in taxes. His earnings had to support his six children — four of whom have Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) status, allowing them to work and go to school legally, and two of whom were born in the United States.

Arturo and his wife, Nicole, a U.S. citizen whose family is from Mexico and who owns their painting company with him, are Beltran's clients as well. They employ 47 people and paid $118,250 in estimated taxes this year, according to Beltran.

'The Undocumented Lawyer':Edith Espinal's attorney featured in HBO documentary

"Talk about being productive members of society," he said. "Forty-seven people can feed their families, help pay the schools, whatever, with the employment they have and that's generated by this company.

More than $11,000 from the family's taxes went to the city of Columbus.

The couple started their business after Arturo got injured in his job as a butcher and was fired. He started working for a friend as a painter, but had always dreamed of working for himself and owning a business. So, with the help of a friend, they started their own business six years ago and now support themselves and their four children. 

'Back to being a refugee':Family displaced from Columbus apartments feels trauma again

"He comes from nothing in Mexico. His parents are farmers, and he has just a middle school, almost high school education," Nicole said, of her husband. "It was really important for him not to be stuck. He came to the United States to make something for himself, to provide a better future for his children."

Immigrants are here to make the country better, Nicole said. 

"This is what makes America great," she said. "immigrants coming here and finding their way and helping the country prosper, too." 

dking@dispatch.com

@DanaeKing

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

There is this. Got friends in Cali that use the labor outside Home Depot for some work.

Regardless, just fix entering the country and a process to stay and stop letting it be a free for all or blaming immigrants for all the problems we face.

Your friends are criminals that are enabling the situation.  Don't blame the workers.

Merkin Baller

nvm

FiveBelow

Less than $600 and a 1099 is not necessary. Lots of labor ready jobs can be handled for less than $600, no need to shame someone you don't know without knowing the details of the labor they provided.

Merkin Baller

@mrussel1 does bring up a great point. 

There's a deafening amount of silence about American companies that employ undocumented immigrants from the people beating the drums loudest about how big a problem illegal immigration is. 

tempo_n_groove

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

They pay sales taxes... and the fault for them getting paid under the table is on their employers, who enable the law breaking and break the law themselves.  They are also not paying taxes required. Seems to me the undocumented immigrants are no worse, or even 'less worse'.  At least we can understand why they want to work and are working. 

Yes and the property they rent has taxes but it's not the same.  Local city and state taxes miss out on this.

This happens in pretty much every restaurant and landscaping business here in NY.  I remember reading an article where the workers mailed most of their money back home and none of it was ever spent here.

FiveBelow

Merkin Baller said:

@mrussel1 does bring up a great point. 

There's a deafening amount of silence about American companies that employ undocumented immigrants from the people beating the drums loudest about how big a problem illegal immigration is. 

The biggest issue is that documents are easily obtained via the black market and business owners are not document authenticators.

mrussel1

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

They pay sales taxes... and the fault for them getting paid under the table is on their employers, who enable the law breaking and break the law themselves.  They are also not paying taxes required. Seems to me the undocumented immigrants are no worse, or even 'less worse'.  At least we can understand why they want to work and are working. 

Yes and the property they rent has taxes but it's not the same.  Local city and state taxes miss out on this.

This happens in pretty much every restaurant and landscaping business here in NY.  I remember reading an article where the workers mailed most of their money back home and none of it was ever spent here.

That doesn't pass the sniff test.  An undocumented worker will likely be working for less than minimum wage, or dirt cheap.  For them to be able to live here but still send "most" of their money back to Mexico/Central America doesn't seem possible.  

But again, it's about who is paying them.  They would not be drawn here if they could not work under the table. 

Ledbetterman10

Merkin Baller said:

@mrussel1 does bring up a great point. 

There's a deafening amount of silence about American companies that employ undocumented immigrants from the people beating the drums loudest about how big a problem illegal immigration is. 

Trump himself is the biggest example of this. 

tempo_n_groove

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

They pay sales taxes... and the fault for them getting paid under the table is on their employers, who enable the law breaking and break the law themselves.  They are also not paying taxes required. Seems to me the undocumented immigrants are no worse, or even 'less worse'.  At least we can understand why they want to work and are working. 

Yes and the property they rent has taxes but it's not the same.  Local city and state taxes miss out on this.

This happens in pretty much every restaurant and landscaping business here in NY.  I remember reading an article where the workers mailed most of their money back home and none of it was ever spent here.

That doesn't pass the sniff test.  An undocumented worker will likely be working for less than minimum wage, or dirt cheap.  For them to be able to live here but still send "most" of their money back to Mexico/Central America doesn't seem possible.  

But again, it's about who is paying them.  They would not be drawn here if they could not work under the table. 

They make $150 a day standing outside of Homedepot when they do work.  The others that have the kitchen jobs and landscaping jobs get paid well too.  They aren't making under minimum wage.

tempo_n_groove

FiveBelow said:

Merkin Baller said:

@mrussel1 does bring up a great point. 

There's a deafening amount of silence about American companies that employ undocumented immigrants from the people beating the drums loudest about how big a problem illegal immigration is. 

The biggest issue is that documents are easily obtained via the black market and business owners are not document authenticators.

True story.

In 2005 I was in Louisiana building a federal prison and to work there required background checks.  One company had 42 of their employees comeback with SS numbers from deceased people.  Those 42 people never showed back up for work.

mrussel1

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

They pay sales taxes... and the fault for them getting paid under the table is on their employers, who enable the law breaking and break the law themselves.  They are also not paying taxes required. Seems to me the undocumented immigrants are no worse, or even 'less worse'.  At least we can understand why they want to work and are working. 

Yes and the property they rent has taxes but it's not the same.  Local city and state taxes miss out on this.

This happens in pretty much every restaurant and landscaping business here in NY.  I remember reading an article where the workers mailed most of their money back home and none of it was ever spent here.

That doesn't pass the sniff test.  An undocumented worker will likely be working for less than minimum wage, or dirt cheap.  For them to be able to live here but still send "most" of their money back to Mexico/Central America doesn't seem possible.  

But again, it's about who is paying them.  They would not be drawn here if they could not work under the table. 

They make $150 a day standing outside of Homedepot when they do work.  The others that have the kitchen jobs and landscaping jobs get paid well too.  They aren't making under minimum wage.

Interesting that you know the going rate.  But it's irrelevant if they send the money back or not.  I'm just not buying "most".  Either way, the only reason it's happening is because criminal business owners are willing to pay under the table to undocumented workers, and then not paying their fair share of taxes.

FiveBelow

tempo_n_groove said:

FiveBelow said:

Merkin Baller said:

@mrussel1 does bring up a great point. 

There's a deafening amount of silence about American companies that employ undocumented immigrants from the people beating the drums loudest about how big a problem illegal immigration is. 

The biggest issue is that documents are easily obtained via the black market and business owners are not document authenticators.

True story.

In 2005 I was in Louisiana building a federal prison and to work there required background checks.  One company had 42 of their employees comeback with SS numbers from deceased people.  Those 42 people never showed back up for work.

We get notices from SS a couple times a year concerning this very issue. All we can do is make copies of the documents we are provided and make sure applications are correctly filled out, after that there is not much a business owner can do. To your point of sending money back home, I can say that is very common as well. We have quite a few green card and visa employees who come here for about half the year and are able to take care of their entire families back home.

tempo_n_groove

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

They pay sales taxes... and the fault for them getting paid under the table is on their employers, who enable the law breaking and break the law themselves.  They are also not paying taxes required. Seems to me the undocumented immigrants are no worse, or even 'less worse'.  At least we can understand why they want to work and are working. 

Yes and the property they rent has taxes but it's not the same.  Local city and state taxes miss out on this.

This happens in pretty much every restaurant and landscaping business here in NY.  I remember reading an article where the workers mailed most of their money back home and none of it was ever spent here.

That doesn't pass the sniff test.  An undocumented worker will likely be working for less than minimum wage, or dirt cheap.  For them to be able to live here but still send "most" of their money back to Mexico/Central America doesn't seem possible.  

But again, it's about who is paying them.  They would not be drawn here if they could not work under the table. 

They make $150 a day standing outside of Homedepot when they do work.  The others that have the kitchen jobs and landscaping jobs get paid well too.  They aren't making under minimum wage.

Interesting that you know the going rate.  But it's irrelevant if they send the money back or not.  I'm just not buying "most".  Either way, the only reason it's happening is because criminal business owners are willing to pay under the table to undocumented workers, and then not paying their fair share of taxes.

Why is it interesting?  Information is key.

You mention business'.  Wasn't a law signed by Bush Dubya that penalized a company if they got caught hiring undocumented workers?  Did that go away?  

mickeyrat

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

What about the ones that work for cash that don't pay taxes?  

They pay sales taxes... and the fault for them getting paid under the table is on their employers, who enable the law breaking and break the law themselves.  They are also not paying taxes required. Seems to me the undocumented immigrants are no worse, or even 'less worse'.  At least we can understand why they want to work and are working. 

Yes and the property they rent has taxes but it's not the same.  Local city and state taxes miss out on this.

This happens in pretty much every restaurant and landscaping business here in NY.  I remember reading an article where the workers mailed most of their money back home and none of it was ever spent here.

That doesn't pass the sniff test.  An undocumented worker will likely be working for less than minimum wage, or dirt cheap.  For them to be able to live here but still send "most" of their money back to Mexico/Central America doesn't seem possible.  

But again, it's about who is paying them.  They would not be drawn here if they could not work under the table. 

They make $150 a day standing outside of Homedepot when they do work.  The others that have the kitchen jobs and landscaping jobs get paid well too.  They aren't making under minimum wage.

Interesting that you know the going rate.  But it's irrelevant if they send the money back or not.  I'm just not buying "most".  Either way, the only reason it's happening is because criminal business owners are willing to pay under the table to undocumented workers, and then not paying their fair share of taxes.

Why is it interesting?  Information is key.

You mention business'.  Wasn't a law signed by Bush Dubya that penalized a company if they got caught hiring undocumented workers?  Did that go away?  

actually signed? not sure about that.

I do know requirement for e-verify was pushed back on hard and eventually dropped to voluntary.