This can't go ON!

Jlance00

Im hearing talks that concerts are the last thing to come back.  Maybe as late as Winter 2022?   Is now the time to start focusing on streaming shows?  I would certainly entertain the idea of "subscribing" to a pay per view event.  Sure the boys would feel strange playing hard to a empty room but if this crisis is going to go on for sometime maybe this is a way we can still feel somewhat normal? 

Fifthelement

Ugh!  I understand your desire, but I feel that live music is a communal give and take experience.  We feed on the energy and emotion of the band/artist and they feed on our energy.  An acoustic set would be fine, but a streaming, full-on concert with no audience? A definite no for me. 

PB11041

It's April 15th.  The situation just developed in front of our eyes.  In the most immediate sane terms, everything in the near term has to be extremely cautious.  But people trying to fingerprint the when and should of everything is totally arbitrary and designed to illicit awe and can be entirely wrong in their ridiculous effort to be "first" on a hot take.

  

PJNB

PB11041 said:

It's April 15th.  The situation just developed in front of our eyes.  In the most immediate sane terms, everything in the near term has to be extremely cautious.  But people trying to fingerprint the when and should of everything is totally arbitrary and designed to illicit awe and can be entirely wrong in their ridiculous effort to be "first" on a hot take.

  

This is where I sit too. Remember the models that said the US would be at 240,000 deaths even with social distancing by August? I do not fault them at all for giving those numbers out as I think that they were using the best numbers that they had at the time but one week later the new data cut that down to 1/4 of the size. All I am saying with this is it changes everyday/week and to make an assumption on it right now is a guess at best. 

Yes there is a likely hood that we have to wait for a magical vaccine to be produced and for us to be able to to go back to concerts but so many things can change for better or worse in those 12-18 months that they are estimating for us to need to produce one.

PB11041

PJNB said:

PB11041 said:

It's April 15th.  The situation just developed in front of our eyes.  In the most immediate sane terms, everything in the near term has to be extremely cautious.  But people trying to fingerprint the when and should of everything is totally arbitrary and designed to illicit awe and can be entirely wrong in their ridiculous effort to be "first" on a hot take.

  

This is where I sit too. Remember the models that said the US would be at 240,000 deaths even with social distancing by August? I do not fault them at all for giving those numbers out as I think that they were using the best numbers that they had at the time but one week later the new data cut that down to 1/4 of the size. All I am saying with this is it changes everyday/week and to make an assumption on it right now is a guess at best. 

Yes there is a likely hood that we have to wait for a magical vaccine to be produced and for us to be able to to go back to concerts but so many things can change for better or worse in those 12-18 months that they are estimating for us to need to produce one.

the other truth to the matter is that with a vaccine, the 12-18 month is built on both 'regulations' and expectancy for producers to be able to ramp up production.   Yes there is a part where they have to confirm testing, I am not ignoring or overlooking that, but, the other fact that people miss is that every vaccine is inherently a risk, there is nothing bullet proof.  I have gotten the annual influenza vaccine every year since 2009.  It is a protective measure but it guarantees nothing. I have definitely had the flu at least once in that time frame, probably twice.

The most likely doomsday scenario outcome for a more protracted period is less nothing happening until end of 2022, but rather the 95% shut down of international borders across the world.  In that anything other than goods for consumption and production will not travel internationally for perhaps a year or two.  

Countries, even as vast and wide spread as the US and Canada can do effective contact tracing, mitigation and containment within their own borders, but the airports are what caused this mass spreading.  Total and utter carelessness and fecklessness in screening.  

And before everyone says, ha they failed it this the first time, this was a worldwide failure and a very shitty job by an albiet important organization in the World Health Organization.   And there was no apparatus in place to more effectively attack this anywhere.  That is already being addressed by organizations that are better at planning, like Google and Apple.  They just are better and more invested in getting it right.  

josevolution

I’m ok with not attending any major events again even if it means I have seen my last concerts, I’m ok with just listening to music by myself I’ll have to really really think hard about attending the rescheduled shows...

F Me In The Brain

josevolution said:

I’m ok with not attending any major events again even if it means I have seen my last concerts, I’m ok with just listening to music by myself I’ll have to really really think hard about attending the rescheduled shows...

Agree - tests that show we are immune (or not) are the only way I see things being opened up.

I guess they could decide to go straight 'Survival of the Fittest' and move forward with an approach to let the weak, old, and sick die...but it would be a surprise. 

cp3iverson

I have no desire to go to a concert any time soon unless they start playing Speedways and i can sit on the bleachers ten feet from anyone else. 

CROJAM95

no one knows yet

figure nothing this year, hopeful for 2021, but be prepared to sit out longer

SmallestOceans

Realistically, the band will have played less than 30 shows in a 5 year span from the end of Summer 2016 to 2021.

pjsteelerfan

people don't know what is going to be going on a month from now, much less 2 years from now. 

on2legs

Maybe... the bright side will be that once we are truly though all of this, the band will have new found appreciation for touring and will do a mega tour to make up for lost time.

hedonist

josevolution said:

I’m ok with not attending any major events again even if it means I have seen my last concerts, I’m ok with just listening to music by myself I’ll have to really really think hard about attending the rescheduled shows...

Yeah, similar feelings here.  I'm happy to have music right now if only in the digital sense.  Getting it live in a venue just isn't a priority for me these days...though it'd be a hell of an escape from these days.

Zod

on2legs said:

Maybe... the bright side will be that once we are truly though all of this, the band will have new found appreciation for touring and will do a mega tour to make up for lost time.

I doubt that.  Maybe they do a bigger than normal PJ tour.   I'm not sure they'd ever do something I'd consider mega.   Those are bands that relentlessly tour for 2 (or more) years after dropping a new album.  100s of shows within a few years kind of thing. 

I could see PJ doing a tour thats big for PJ.  Instead of maybe 30 shows, they do 40 to 50 in a single year?

cp3iverson

SmallestOceans said:

Realistically, the band will have played less than 30 shows in a 5 year span from the end of Summer 2016 to 2021.

True.  But still beats Nirvana, AIC with Layne, etc.    im just glad they’re still around man.  Their generation of peers did not last like previous generations.  

PJNB

on2legs said:

Maybe... the bright side will be that once we are truly though all of this, the band will have new found appreciation for touring and will do a mega tour to make up for lost time.

Maybe but I feel like this year was that year for them already. We were going to get 45 shows or more this year plus I am guessing a healthy amount of shows in 2021. For Pearl Jam touring standards that is. 

Vedd Hedd

PB11041 said:

PJNB said:

PB11041 said:

It's April 15th.  The situation just developed in front of our eyes.  In the most immediate sane terms, everything in the near term has to be extremely cautious.  But people trying to fingerprint the when and should of everything is totally arbitrary and designed to illicit awe and can be entirely wrong in their ridiculous effort to be "first" on a hot take.

  

This is where I sit too. Remember the models that said the US would be at 240,000 deaths even with social distancing by August? I do not fault them at all for giving those numbers out as I think that they were using the best numbers that they had at the time but one week later the new data cut that down to 1/4 of the size. All I am saying with this is it changes everyday/week and to make an assumption on it right now is a guess at best. 

Yes there is a likely hood that we have to wait for a magical vaccine to be produced and for us to be able to to go back to concerts but so many things can change for better or worse in those 12-18 months that they are estimating for us to need to produce one.

the other truth to the matter is that with a vaccine, the 12-18 month is built on both 'regulations' and expectancy for producers to be able to ramp up production.   Yes there is a part where they have to confirm testing, I am not ignoring or overlooking that, but, the other fact that people miss is that every vaccine is inherently a risk, there is nothing bullet proof.  I have gotten the annual influenza vaccine every year since 2009.  It is a protective measure but it guarantees nothing. I have definitely had the flu at least once in that time frame, probably twice.

my guess is that you caught a different flu from the one you were vaccinated for.  This vaccine would likely be more accurate in defending against this virus.  That said...we might have to get vaccinated every 2-3 years if the vaccine only helps for a certain period of time.  Or we might have a vaccine like the polio vaccine, which is lifetime, essentially.  Who knows.  

P34RL J4MM3R

josevolution said:

I’m ok with not attending any major events again even if it means I have seen my last concerts, I’m ok with just listening to music by myself I’ll have to really really think hard about attending the rescheduled shows...

This is the main thing I am struggling with. I am NOT OK with having seen my last concert or attended my last baseball game with my son.  Live events and travel for work and pleasure are very important to me.  It will take me a long time and a lot of grief to come to this new normal if that's the case.  I thrive on in-person, human contact, the last month has already been rough, don't want to live the rest of my life this way.

rb173565

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

PB11041

Vedd Hedd said:

PB11041 said:

PJNB said:

PB11041 said:

It's April 15th.  The situation just developed in front of our eyes.  In the most immediate sane terms, everything in the near term has to be extremely cautious.  But people trying to fingerprint the when and should of everything is totally arbitrary and designed to illicit awe and can be entirely wrong in their ridiculous effort to be "first" on a hot take.

  

This is where I sit too. Remember the models that said the US would be at 240,000 deaths even with social distancing by August? I do not fault them at all for giving those numbers out as I think that they were using the best numbers that they had at the time but one week later the new data cut that down to 1/4 of the size. All I am saying with this is it changes everyday/week and to make an assumption on it right now is a guess at best. 

Yes there is a likely hood that we have to wait for a magical vaccine to be produced and for us to be able to to go back to concerts but so many things can change for better or worse in those 12-18 months that they are estimating for us to need to produce one.

the other truth to the matter is that with a vaccine, the 12-18 month is built on both 'regulations' and expectancy for producers to be able to ramp up production.   Yes there is a part where they have to confirm testing, I am not ignoring or overlooking that, but, the other fact that people miss is that every vaccine is inherently a risk, there is nothing bullet proof.  I have gotten the annual influenza vaccine every year since 2009.  It is a protective measure but it guarantees nothing. I have definitely had the flu at least once in that time frame, probably twice.

my guess is that you caught a different flu from the one you were vaccinated for.  This vaccine would likely be more accurate in defending against this virus.  That said...we might have to get vaccinated every 2-3 years if the vaccine only helps for a certain period of time.  Or we might have a vaccine like the polio vaccine, which is lifetime, essentially.  Who knows.  

Flu vaccines attempt cocktails essentially to try to predict the seasonal outbreaks.  Polio, measles, are different and the vaccines that are developed act differently for those diseases.  For a single vaccine to work for this would be almost impossible, which is why there are nearly 80 in varying degrees of clinic trial already.  

This virus is forever part of the ecosystem.  You are not going to eradicate it, just weaken it and substantially lessen its impact.  People will be dying of covid-19 forever, the same way people die from various strains of influenza every year.  The death rate from influenza simply is acceptable because it is spread over longer time periods during each season because people built up immunity to the various strains.

mcdevittpb

rb173565 said:

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

Here’s the deal.  This is a brand new virus strand that the world, human beings, and scientists, have never seen before.  And it’s highly contagious. Human beings, who have not been infected, have not developed an immunity to the virus yet. Until there is a vaccine for this, the world is not 100% safe from the Covid 19 virus. 

PJNB

rb173565 said:

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

Your number is ways off on seasonal flu deaths on that timeframe. The highest amount of deaths from the regular flu in recent years was the late 2017-2018 flu season that killed 80,000 estimated people. This was the year that they think that the vaccine was the wrong strain and did not work effectively. Normally 12,000 - 55,000 people die a year in the US from the flu. 

I will agree with you however that some things are being blown out of proportion. I do not think that is intentional from the medical experts but they are just going off of the information that the testing is showing them. Of course the media runs with it especially the worse case scenarios. Also it will be easy to be a Monday morning quarterback on this when it is all said and done but living in it and prior to it you 100% need to be prepared for a worse case scenario. 

Mike D88

rb173565 said:

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

This is a bad take. You only owe the reduced number of deaths with COVID-19 to the steps that have been taken through social distancing. Unfortunately, when that ends up working, we get galaxy brains like you pointing out that the projections didn't come true. Yeah, because we did something about it!

Nothing has been blown out of proportion. If you let this thing run its course, more people will need care than can be provided care. Anyone above that baseline suffers and dies. And anyone who needs care for other illnesses and trauma will not be able to get it.

PB11041

PJNB said:

rb173565 said:

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

Your number is ways off on seasonal flu deaths on that timeframe. The highest amount of deaths from the regular flu in recent years was the late 2017-2018 flu season that killed 80,000 estimated people. This was the year that they think that the vaccine was the wrong strain and did not work effectively. Normally 12,000 - 55,000 people die a year in the US from the flu. 

I will agree with you however that some things are being blown out of proportion. I do not think that is intentional from the medical experts but they are just going off of the information that the testing is showing them. Of course the media runs with it especially the worse case scenarios. Also it will be easy to be a Monday morning quarterback on this when it is all said and done but living in it and prior to it you 100% need to be prepared for a worse case scenario. 

I believe that US official figure (which is really a projected estimate) is worldwide, just from a US source of data.

That all being said, right now to avoid a really crazy thing in which say several million people died of a novel disease, a shut down, while incredibly unsettling was necessary to get some grounding.  Unlike 1918-19 where it was not really logistically practical to do anything, now we can and by and large have.   For the near term this was the thing to do.  The next near term there will have to be tactical distancing and lockdown done where people in specific age brackets and those with specific health issues will have likely have to maintain in distancing where as large portions of the population will not.  

Whether or not there are going to be rock concerts is kind of irrelevant, but you are not going to have social distancing for 2 years.  

tempo_n_groove

josevolution said:

I’m ok with not attending any major events again even if it means I have seen my last concerts, I’m ok with just listening to music by myself I’ll have to really really think hard about attending the rescheduled shows...

Masks and defogging areas going in and out of the concert!

RS65573

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

I’m ok with not attending any major events again even if it means I have seen my last concerts, I’m ok with just listening to music by myself I’ll have to really really think hard about attending the rescheduled shows...

Masks and defogging areas going in and out of the concert!

Not wrong, but I am so out in that situation. 

Spartanacus

I guess they could decide to go straight 'Survival of the Fittest' and move forward with an approach to let the weak, old, and sick die...but it would be a surprise.  

As bad as that sounds, that is how nature was intended to work, and that is how it works best.  And because humans think we're so damn special, eventually we are going to destroy this planet to the point where nobody will survive unless we colonize Mars.  So yes, at least a modified version of 'survival of the fittest' plan needs to go on.  This virus is not indiscriminately killing everyone it touches.  The overwhelming majority are the old, sick, and unfortunately the compromised (with a very small % of seemingly healthy young people).  If this continues into the Summer, Fall, etc. we'll all be in a world of hurt...not just the old and sick.  Yes, sporting events and finally live concerts will be the last thing to come back, but I hope they do sooner (NJ & OHANA) rather than later.  #buyerbeware #attendatyourownrisk #prochoice

pjhawks

PB11041 said:

PJNB said:

rb173565 said:

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

Your number is ways off on seasonal flu deaths on that timeframe. The highest amount of deaths from the regular flu in recent years was the late 2017-2018 flu season that killed 80,000 estimated people. This was the year that they think that the vaccine was the wrong strain and did not work effectively. Normally 12,000 - 55,000 people die a year in the US from the flu. 

I will agree with you however that some things are being blown out of proportion. I do not think that is intentional from the medical experts but they are just going off of the information that the testing is showing them. Of course the media runs with it especially the worse case scenarios. Also it will be easy to be a Monday morning quarterback on this when it is all said and done but living in it and prior to it you 100% need to be prepared for a worse case scenario. 

I believe that US official figure (which is really a projected estimate) is worldwide, just from a US source of data.

That all being said, right now to avoid a really crazy thing in which say several million people died of a novel disease, a shut down, while incredibly unsettling was necessary to get some grounding.  Unlike 1918-19 where it was not really logistically practical to do anything, now we can and by and large have.   For the near term this was the thing to do.  The next near term there will have to be tactical distancing and lockdown done where people in specific age brackets and those with specific health issues will have likely have to maintain in distancing where as large portions of the population will not.  

Weather or not there are going to be rock concerts is kind of irrelevant, but you are not going to have social distancing for 2 years.  

agree. there is a happy medium between no events until 2022 and this is has been overblown (which people saying this really have no clue).  we will start to come back in some form in the next month or two but with restrictions. maybe 12-18 months before we go back to what was normal before this but we will not continue social distancing at this level for more than a few months.  it's just not practical.  one of the biggest reasons for social distancing was to not overrun our hospitals with too many cases.  as we have done social distancing we are also increasing capacity at our hospitals.  it's not like we are doing nothing during this social distancing to help us deal with it in the future.  we will be better prepared at our hospitals for the next wave.  i am pretty confident there will be football with fans in the fall and shows next year.  

Spartanacus

PB11041 said:

PJNB said:

rb173565 said:

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

Your number is ways off on seasonal flu deaths on that timeframe. The highest amount of deaths from the regular flu in recent years was the late 2017-2018 flu season that killed 80,000 estimated people. This was the year that they think that the vaccine was the wrong strain and did not work effectively. Normally 12,000 - 55,000 people die a year in the US from the flu. 

I will agree with you however that some things are being blown out of proportion. I do not think that is intentional from the medical experts but they are just going off of the information that the testing is showing them. Of course the media runs with it especially the worse case scenarios. Also it will be easy to be a Monday morning quarterback on this when it is all said and done but living in it and prior to it you 100% need to be prepared for a worse case scenario. 

I believe that US official figure (which is really a projected estimate) is worldwide, just from a US source of data.

That all being said, right now to avoid a really crazy thing in which say several million people died of a novel disease, a shut down, while incredibly unsettling was necessary to get some grounding.  Unlike 1918-19 where it was not really logistically practical to do anything, now we can and by and large have.   For the near term this was the thing to do.  The next near term there will have to be tactical distancing and lockdown done where people in specific age brackets and those with specific health issues will have likely have to maintain in distancing where as large portions of the population will not.  

Weather or not there are going to be rock concerts is kind of irrelevant, but you are not going to have social distancing for 2 years.  

Here are the real numbers:  the recent high death mark for the seasonal flu a couple years ago estimated that as many as 650,000 people died worldwide and 61,000 in the US.  The low mark every year is estimated at about 290,000 worldwide and 12,000 in the US. 

We are going to have to take our foot off the brakes after a few months (August seems right to me), let people do their thing again, and see how it goes.  It would suck to have 100K US deaths a year from COVID-19 (even with a vaccine), but that may be a new part of reality. 

We are not going to cancel large gatherings forever, unless this consistently takes out millions of Americans a year.  I really think that the 2.2M US deaths figure they through out there was far fetched.  I am not afraid of the flu (though I've felt near death before from it), nor am I afraid of this...of course I'd prefer to always remain healthy, but not if I have to give up sports and concerts forever.  

eddiec

rb173565 said:

there's so much i wish i could say on this topic but the real question is why this is going on at all. seriously! U.S. official figures were that from jan 1st - march 20th over 110,000 people died due to regular/seasonal flu, i.e. 1375 per day on average. did they shut down the world and destroy the world economy and peoples lives. the answer is no! i'm not saying people aren't dying, they are i'm just saying that the whole situation has been blown out of all proportion. the media have been instrumental in instilling fear into everybody, millions die every year from malnutrition, starvation or unclean water and no-one cares. hell, a million people every year commit suicide, so a bit of perspective

A lot of people care. 

vaggar99

It might as be 2032, all infectious diseases eradicated, and Pearl Jam will still have chosen to bypass Houston TX