3M Ordered - No N95 Masks to Canada

myoung321

These invisible borders are just that.......DID YOU KNOW>>>>

 The passport requirements that are now in place actually began in 1941. In 1952, it was made illegal to enter or leave the United States without some type of passport being issued – this was true even during periods where there wasn’t a war going on somewhere in the world
 

myoung321

1ThoughtKnown said:

myoung321 said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

Really its almost hilarious. “We are Republicans and believe in a free market capitalist society! It’s worth what someone will pay for it! No matter where in the world we will sell it/buy it”

Pandemic happens - “That was made in the US and sold to Canada? No way... we need those. You can’t sell those! They have to stay here.”
All if sudden Republicans are lead by a true socialist. All companies are run by the state. He really is getting advice from Putin. Oh yeah and Alex Rodriguez.  

Check out our Healthcare System if you think companies don't run things,,

 Putin a Socialist?  good one!! Putin's ideology is using his political power to make him and his friends rich.. Like Trump 

Putin is a socialist.
Socialism is a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

As Lenin explained.. Socialism (in its truest sense) is the step prior to communism. The logic was a jump straight to communism would not be readily accepted. The Putin form of socialism is flawed as he is an authoritarian and corrupt.  The community as a whole is the government, but it is not run in the best interest of the people, but of Putin and his oligarch. It’s a giant scam on the Russian people. 

You are right. It’s a good one. 

Oligarchs and Putin own the means of production, distribution and exchange...   Did you read this before posting? haha

Spiritual_Chaos

1ThoughtKnown said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

In Sweden:

Karolinska University Hospital is now forced to dust off old respirators to meet the expected onslaught of severely ill corona patients.

At the same time, the National Board of Health is now warning that there is not enough equipment in the country.

- More respirators will be needed, says Taha Alexandersson at the National Board of Health and Welfare.

Close to Karolinska Hospital in Solna, the Swedish medical technology company Getinge manufactures thousands of new respirators - but they are [mainly] for export.

This isn’t totally clear. Does Getinge have thousands of respirators sitting in a warehouse (mainly) for export, or do they have orders for thousands of respirators for customers around the world for which they have already received payment and those. Customers are relying on their delivery? There is a difference. 

Undoubtedly, the Swedish National Board of Health, along with every other country in the world (other than South Korea and a few other Asian countries perhaps) chose to ignore experts warning for years of the real possibility of a pandemic and now are ill-prepared for the consequences. Governments in the future must be held accountable to have an emergency preparedness plan for a crisis of this (or lesser) magnitude.
 

edited for spelling (fackin iPhone)

From memory: 

Getinge makes 10.000 respirators (ventilators in english I guess) every year. This year they have the goal to make 16.000. 

200 have been able to be bought/booked by Sweden. The rest are being exported to customers internationally. So, yes I think it has all been paid for. Contracts written. 

But still, a Trump-person would just have said the contracts were void, and done some wartime-lawthing, gone all communist and taken the respiratorios for national needs.

Just posted it as a reference of private companies making things needed, and how it obviously is not just being sold on a national market.

Regarding your second paragraph about being ill prepared.

As a reference: 

In 1993, Sweden had 4300 ventilators. 900 was owned by the military, and 2100 was kept extra in a stockpile
In 2018, Sweden had 570 ventilators, 40 was owned by the military, and zero was kept extra in a stockpile.

Just saw a news segment about how our national stockpiles of material that we had during the cold war has been completely removed. We don't have it even as a system/concept anymore. Compared to Finland that still has their stockpiles, but are keeping it to themselves (forced to by a finnish law even):

1ThoughtKnown

myoung321 said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

myoung321 said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

Really its almost hilarious. “We are Republicans and believe in a free market capitalist society! It’s worth what someone will pay for it! No matter where in the world we will sell it/buy it”

Pandemic happens - “That was made in the US and sold to Canada? No way... we need those. You can’t sell those! They have to stay here.”
All if sudden Republicans are lead by a true socialist. All companies are run by the state. He really is getting advice from Putin. Oh yeah and Alex Rodriguez.  

Check out our Healthcare System if you think companies don't run things,,

 Putin a Socialist?  good one!! Putin's ideology is using his political power to make him and his friends rich.. Like Trump 

Putin is a socialist.
Socialism is a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

As Lenin explained.. Socialism (in its truest sense) is the step prior to communism. The logic was a jump straight to communism would not be readily accepted. The Putin form of socialism is flawed as he is an authoritarian and corrupt.  The community as a whole is the government, but it is not run in the best interest of the people, but of Putin and his oligarch. It’s a giant scam on the Russian people. 

You are right. It’s a good one. 

Oligarchs and Putin own the means of production, distribution and exchange...   Did you read this before posting? haha

I’m not sure why should continue to engage with you as you do not discuss this with any intelligence.  None of this was the point of my original post so I’m going to say we can agree to disagree. It is unimportant to me if you think Putin is or isn’t a socialist  (although he would like nothing more than a return to the USSR which stands for the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics an authoritarian socialist government he is trying to emulate) 

If you understand the chekists and how basically the old KGB wanted (and under Putin are) running what is now Russia you may understand. Socialism is a term which has been bastardized (mostly by conservatives in the US - it’s not Bernie Sanders).  As I stated in another post,
socialism is an ideology created by Lenin as a step towards Communism, basically that you couldn’t do it all at once. 

Putin Russia could be a softer example of national socialism shown in Nazi Germany (officially the National Socialist German Workers' Party or Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (NSDAP))

The term "National Socialism" arose out of attempts to create a nationalist redefinition of "socialism", as an alternative to both Marxist socialism and free market capitalism.

I suggest you worry less about me reading what I wrote and read some more yourself. Just because some oligarchs get rich does not indicate the political ideology behind Putin is not socialist. 

mickeyrat

and the above has what to do with N95 masks ordered, paid for and not being delivered because of a fuckstick whos clueless ordered them seized?

1ThoughtKnown

mickeyrat said:

and the above has what to do with N95 masks ordered, paid for and not being delivered because of a fuckstick whos clueless ordered them seized?

Nothing... but the other poster took the conversation that way... it’s how these things go, like any conversation in real life 

1ThoughtKnown

Spiritual_Chaos said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

In Sweden:

Karolinska University Hospital is now forced to dust off old respirators to meet the expected onslaught of severely ill corona patients.

At the same time, the National Board of Health is now warning that there is not enough equipment in the country.

- More respirators will be needed, says Taha Alexandersson at the National Board of Health and Welfare.

Close to Karolinska Hospital in Solna, the Swedish medical technology company Getinge manufactures thousands of new respirators - but they are [mainly] for export.

This isn’t totally clear. Does Getinge have thousands of respirators sitting in a warehouse (mainly) for export, or do they have orders for thousands of respirators for customers around the world for which they have already received payment and those. Customers are relying on their delivery? There is a difference. 

Undoubtedly, the Swedish National Board of Health, along with every other country in the world (other than South Korea and a few other Asian countries perhaps) chose to ignore experts warning for years of the real possibility of a pandemic and now are ill-prepared for the consequences. Governments in the future must be held accountable to have an emergency preparedness plan for a crisis of this (or lesser) magnitude.
 

edited for spelling (fackin iPhone)

From memory: 

Getinge makes 10.000 respirators (ventilators in english I guess) every year. This year they have the goal to make 16.000. 

200 have been able to be bought/booked by Sweden. The rest are being exported to customers internationally. So, yes I think it has all been paid for. Contracts written. 

But still, a Trump-person would just have said the contracts were void, and done some wartime-lawthing, gone all communist and taken the respiratorios for national needs.

Just posted it as a reference of private companies making things needed, and how it obviously is not just being sold on a national market.

Regarding your second paragraph about being ill prepared.

As a reference: 

In 1993, Sweden had 4300 ventilators. 900 was owned by the military, and 2100 was kept extra in a stockpile
In 2018, Sweden had 570 ventilators, 40 was owned by the military, and zero was kept extra in a stockpile.

Just saw a news segment about how our national stockpiles of material that we had during the cold war has been completely removed. We don't have it even as a system/concept anymore. Compared to Finland that still has their stockpiles, but are keeping it to themselves (forced to by a finnish law even):

Isn’t that amazing? To have 80% less ventilators in the space of 25 years. Those decisions are generally made in government as dollars are squeezed to pay for god knows what. 

The hypocrisy of it is that here in Canada for example, it is law that employers are prepared for any foreseen emergency situation in the workplace. Employers must have a plan to ensure workers receive medical attention in a timely fashion. 

  But the government itself does not have a plan for an emergency they were very aware of. Larry Brilliant for one has been warning governments for years a pandemic was not only possible, but probable. Why isn’t the media asking these tough questions? Where was the plan? Why did you choose to ignore the experts? Why do we have so few ventilators compared to the early 90s, etc.

Spiritual_Chaos

1ThoughtKnown said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

In Sweden:

Karolinska University Hospital is now forced to dust off old respirators to meet the expected onslaught of severely ill corona patients.

At the same time, the National Board of Health is now warning that there is not enough equipment in the country.

- More respirators will be needed, says Taha Alexandersson at the National Board of Health and Welfare.

Close to Karolinska Hospital in Solna, the Swedish medical technology company Getinge manufactures thousands of new respirators - but they are [mainly] for export.

This isn’t totally clear. Does Getinge have thousands of respirators sitting in a warehouse (mainly) for export, or do they have orders for thousands of respirators for customers around the world for which they have already received payment and those. Customers are relying on their delivery? There is a difference. 

Undoubtedly, the Swedish National Board of Health, along with every other country in the world (other than South Korea and a few other Asian countries perhaps) chose to ignore experts warning for years of the real possibility of a pandemic and now are ill-prepared for the consequences. Governments in the future must be held accountable to have an emergency preparedness plan for a crisis of this (or lesser) magnitude.
 

edited for spelling (fackin iPhone)

From memory: 

Getinge makes 10.000 respirators (ventilators in english I guess) every year. This year they have the goal to make 16.000. 

200 have been able to be bought/booked by Sweden. The rest are being exported to customers internationally. So, yes I think it has all been paid for. Contracts written. 

But still, a Trump-person would just have said the contracts were void, and done some wartime-lawthing, gone all communist and taken the respiratorios for national needs.

Just posted it as a reference of private companies making things needed, and how it obviously is not just being sold on a national market.

Regarding your second paragraph about being ill prepared.

As a reference: 

In 1993, Sweden had 4300 ventilators. 900 was owned by the military, and 2100 was kept extra in a stockpile
In 2018, Sweden had 570 ventilators, 40 was owned by the military, and zero was kept extra in a stockpile.

Just saw a news segment about how our national stockpiles of material that we had during the cold war has been completely removed. We don't have it even as a system/concept anymore. Compared to Finland that still has their stockpiles, but are keeping it to themselves (forced to by a finnish law even):

Isn’t that amazing? To have 80% less ventilators in the space of 25 years. Those decisions are generally made in government as dollars are squeezed to pay for god knows what. 

My guess would be because of the new fashion-term that swept the nation:

New Public Management (NPM) is an approach to running public service organizations that is used in government and public service institutions and agencies, at both sub-national and national levels. The term was first introduced by academics in the UK and Australia[1][full citation needed] to describe approaches that were developed during the 1980s as part of an effort to make the public service more "businesslike" and to improve its efficiency by using private sector management models.

1ThoughtKnown

Spiritual_Chaos said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

In Sweden:

Karolinska University Hospital is now forced to dust off old respirators to meet the expected onslaught of severely ill corona patients.

At the same time, the National Board of Health is now warning that there is not enough equipment in the country.

- More respirators will be needed, says Taha Alexandersson at the National Board of Health and Welfare.

Close to Karolinska Hospital in Solna, the Swedish medical technology company Getinge manufactures thousands of new respirators - but they are [mainly] for export.

This isn’t totally clear. Does Getinge have thousands of respirators sitting in a warehouse (mainly) for export, or do they have orders for thousands of respirators for customers around the world for which they have already received payment and those. Customers are relying on their delivery? There is a difference. 

Undoubtedly, the Swedish National Board of Health, along with every other country in the world (other than South Korea and a few other Asian countries perhaps) chose to ignore experts warning for years of the real possibility of a pandemic and now are ill-prepared for the consequences. Governments in the future must be held accountable to have an emergency preparedness plan for a crisis of this (or lesser) magnitude.
 

edited for spelling (fackin iPhone)

From memory: 

Getinge makes 10.000 respirators (ventilators in english I guess) every year. This year they have the goal to make 16.000. 

200 have been able to be bought/booked by Sweden. The rest are being exported to customers internationally. So, yes I think it has all been paid for. Contracts written. 

But still, a Trump-person would just have said the contracts were void, and done some wartime-lawthing, gone all communist and taken the respiratorios for national needs.

Just posted it as a reference of private companies making things needed, and how it obviously is not just being sold on a national market.

Regarding your second paragraph about being ill prepared.

As a reference: 

In 1993, Sweden had 4300 ventilators. 900 was owned by the military, and 2100 was kept extra in a stockpile
In 2018, Sweden had 570 ventilators, 40 was owned by the military, and zero was kept extra in a stockpile.

Just saw a news segment about how our national stockpiles of material that we had during the cold war has been completely removed. We don't have it even as a system/concept anymore. Compared to Finland that still has their stockpiles, but are keeping it to themselves (forced to by a finnish law even):

Isn’t that amazing? To have 80% less ventilators in the space of 25 years. Those decisions are generally made in government as dollars are squeezed to pay for god knows what. 

My guess would be because of the new fashion-term that swept the nation:

New Public Management (NPM) is an approach to running public service organizations that is used in government and public service institutions and agencies, at both sub-national and national levels. The term was first introduced by academics in the UK and Australia[1][full citation needed] to describe approaches that were developed during the 1980s as part of an effort to make the public service more "businesslike" and to improve its efficiency by using private sector management models.

Right. The (incorrect) theory that government should be run like a business or household. This creates a lack of vision, because unlike the CEO of a company who is looking 5-10 years ahead (with a COO handling shorter term decisions and keeping the CEO abreast), the leader of a government is looking at most 4 years ahead and how they can get re-elected.  Flawed logic. 

Spunkie

Question to PM this am: Was that shipment blocked last night?
Answer: Conversations ongoing. Canada expects shipment. More - keep supplies/services flowing across border chat.

(It has been almost the 48 hours that Trudeau quoted on Saturday morning when these supplies were expected.)

Meltdown99

500 thousand mask were held up at the border today have now been released and are on there way to Ontario.

Meltdown99

nvm

blueandwhite

Honestly, it doesn't surprise me that the US is looking to block the export of respirators to Canada and Mexico. As a Canadian, I think it's important to remember that the US is a political neighbour and not necessarily an ally of friend to Canada. America has its own concerns and it is unsurprising that they they would put their interests first. There isn't much point for Canada to retaliate however as we are a smaller country and the US can completely steamroll us if we decide to play hardball. Even if the 500 thousand respirators that are being held up do manage to get through I don't think we should be expecting any more shipments, whether we have paid for them or not. Canadians need to stop pretending that Americans are our allies, business partners or friends. We are a satellite nation. We need the US far more than they need us and Canadians need to remember that most Americans couldn't care less about their neighbours to the North or South.

hedonist

blueandwhite said:

Honestly, it doesn't surprise me that the US is looking to block the export of respirators to Canada and Mexico. As a Canadian, I think it's important to remember that the US is a political neighbour and not necessarily an ally of friend to Canada. America has its own concerns and it is unsurprising that they they would put their interests first. There isn't much point for Canada to retaliate however as we are a smaller country and the US can completely steamroll us if we decide to play hardball. Even if the 500 thousand respirators that are being held up do manage to get through I don't think we should be expecting any more shipments, whether we have paid for them or not. Canadians need to stop pretending that Americans are our allies, business partners or friends. We are a satellite nation. We need the US far more than they need us and Canadians need to remember that most Americans couldn't care less about their neighbours to the North or South.

I beg to differ on the bolded part.  Please don't speak for this American!

Spiritual_Chaos

We have been strengthening our military presence on our island of Gotland because of the threat of Russian expansion -- but I am starting to think I should write a letter to our King about using it as a jumpo-off point for a full scale take over of Finland and their stockpile of good quality medical equipment. 

Spunkie

Meltdown99 said:

500 thousand mask were held up at the border today have now been released and are on there way to Ontario.

Thanks for the information. What supplies was Trudeau talking about Saturday with a chartered plane though?

Spunkie

hedonist said:

blueandwhite said:

Honestly, it doesn't surprise me that the US is looking to block the export of respirators to Canada and Mexico. As a Canadian, I think it's important to remember that the US is a political neighbour and not necessarily an ally of friend to Canada. America has its own concerns and it is unsurprising that they they would put their interests first. There isn't much point for Canada to retaliate however as we are a smaller country and the US can completely steamroll us if we decide to play hardball. Even if the 500 thousand respirators that are being held up do manage to get through I don't think we should be expecting any more shipments, whether we have paid for them or not. Canadians need to stop pretending that Americans are our allies, business partners or friends. We are a satellite nation. We need the US far more than they need us and Canadians need to remember that most Americans couldn't care less about their neighbours to the North or South.

I beg to differ on the bolded part.  Please don't speak for this American!

Thanks girl! That makes me feel warm and fuzzy all over!

stuckinline

nvm

stuckinline

blueandwhite said:

Honestly, it doesn't surprise me that the US is looking to block the export of respirators to Canada and Mexico. As a Canadian, I think it's important to remember that the US is a political neighbour and not necessarily an ally of friend to Canada. America has its own concerns and it is unsurprising that they they would put their interests first. There isn't much point for Canada to retaliate however as we are a smaller country and the US can completely steamroll us if we decide to play hardball. Even if the 500 thousand respirators that are being held up do manage to get through I don't think we should be expecting any more shipments, whether we have paid for them or not. Canadians need to stop pretending that Americans are our allies, business partners or friends. We are a satellite nation. We need the US far more than they need us and Canadians need to remember that most Americans couldn't care less about their neighbours to the North or South.

@blueandwhite Please do not speak for this American.

F Me In The Brain

blueandwhite said:

Honestly, it doesn't surprise me that the US is looking to block the export of respirators to Canada and Mexico. As a Canadian, I think it's important to remember that the US is a political neighbour and not necessarily an ally of friend to Canada. America has its own concerns and it is unsurprising that they they would put their interests first. There isn't much point for Canada to retaliate however as we are a smaller country and the US can completely steamroll us if we decide to play hardball. Even if the 500 thousand respirators that are being held up do manage to get through I don't think we should be expecting any more shipments, whether we have paid for them or not. Canadians need to stop pretending that Americans are our allies, business partners or friends. We are a satellite nation. We need the US far more than they need us and Canadians need to remember that most Americans couldn't care less about their neighbours to the North or South.

As someone that grew up in a border state (VT) I even love people from Quebec.  (!!!). Lol

Seriously, though, I have made many friends over the years and consider Canada to be a great neighbor of ours.  Love Canada.

Ok, not as much Mexico.  .