I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
I agree. The GOP/RNC should have stepped in and prevented that from happening.
Happy to see you advocating for DNC intervention. Remove Bernie as a candidate, the sooner the better.
FUCK DEMOCRACY
AM
I
RITE
The DNC gets to choose who they want to support and promote. It is not a public, democratic body. It is a private organization.
But you knew that.
That may be true, but requiring a majority in the general election to win it, makes it extremely difficult for anything but a duopoly to exist in the USA. Then, if those two parties are (practically speaking) the only avenues to the presidency, and one has to be vetted by the private organizations prior to being nominated, then I'd argue that he's right and it's just not a democratic process. You could argue that this is evidenced by the fact that it's only been one of the two major parties who's ever actually succeeded.
which is why we need ranked choice voting
that aside, has Bernie been vetted? where are the medical records he promised?
forget non-stop commercials about socialism: he was a deadbeat dad, no? his wife was embroiled in scandal, no? tell me more about his gangrape fantasies
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
I agree. The GOP/RNC should have stepped in and prevented that from happening.
Happy to see you advocating for DNC intervention. Remove Bernie as a candidate, the sooner the better.
FUCK DEMOCRACY
AM
I
RITE
The DNC gets to choose who they want to support and promote. It is not a public, democratic body. It is a private organization.
But you knew that.
That may be true, but requiring a majority in the general election to win it, makes it extremely difficult for anything but a duopoly to exist in the USA. Then, if those two parties are (practically speaking) the only avenues to the presidency, and one has to be vetted by the private organizations prior to being nominated, then I'd argue that he's right and it's just not a democratic process. You could argue that this is evidenced by the fact that it's only been one of the two major parties who's ever actually succeeded.
it's essentially the same process in canada, though. each party chooses their own leader. but in the states it's just a massively drawn out process so the party can be sure they are nominating the most popular candidate. people seem to think that the party is beholden to the convention, and it isn't. they mostly do choose the most popular candidate, but if they feel that they can't bring in swing voters or voters from the other party, it's well within their right to choose someone else. this whole "bernie got fucked in 2016" is hogwash. they can choose whomever they want.
in canada they just vote internally. and I'm thankful AF for that. i can't imagine if our federal elections took up half of each PM term. the system is beyond ridiculous.
I disagree. If a party, even a private party, portrays themselves as being for the people and giving the people s voice, and they don't, that is wrong. Bernie did get screwed in 2016, that isn't hogwash. When they clearly favor a candidate to give her an advantage, but then claim this is a fair process where we have the say, it may be legal and allowed by the constitution but it isn't right. And to be honest, the dems are paying for it now. If Bernie had won the nomination 4 years ago and lost to Trump then, they wouldnt be trying to do the same thing now.
I dunno. It's tough to say. We know due to those leaked memos that the DNC was definitely against Bernie, but Hillary did win enough delegates to secure the nomination. So I wouldn't call it a full-on screwing....
The full-on screwing of Bernie Sanders by the DNC is tentatively scheduled for July 16, 2020. I understand the arguments that the rules state that the party can pick their own candidate. But I agree with you, why even have caucuses and primary elections if that's the case?
to gauge public support. if it was OVERWHELMING in one candidate's favour, I'm sure they'd choose that one. But if it's close, and they still think one nominee has a better chance with swing voters and independents, they make that call.
Well if it's overwhelming, it's probably a majority and I think they have to give the nomination to a person that gets to that number (1,991). But if it's just a large plurality, they still get to make the call. And if it's Bernie, I'm not sure they give it to him. And I understand where they're coming from: I think Bernie would have a tough go against Trump just as they do. But I don't like any of the other candidates' chances much either. So if Bernie has a plurality, and they're left with the options of 1) nominate Bernie and lose, 2) or give it to Bloomberg or Biden, lose anyway, and piss off all the democrats that voted for Bernie, option 1 seems like the way to go...for the long run. If future elections mean anything to the Dems. They're so obsessed with Trump that I'm not sure they can even look that far ahead. But the once-passionate-about-politics-Bernie-supporter isn't coming out and voting Blue in 2022 if they feel Bernie was hosed, or in the 2024 presidential election.
when you've spent your career sticking your finger in the eyes of Democrats, insulting them, calling them elite, playing the victim and now flip flopping on your 2016 position, why would Bernie think he could build a coalition of delegates and super delegates to get him over the hump? He should have been building relationships for the past 20 years.
I don't disagree with this at all, but man, what a sad, sad system you've just outlined. You have to be in one party or the other just to have a shot at being president, and you have to be in the party's good graces by towing the company line. Bernie must think that building a coalition of voters is as important as building a coalition of delegates and superdelegates. Dumbass. You're building relationships with the wrong people, Bernie!
Not really. I'm not part of the party apparatus but I am part of the party. I'm registered, vote, have volunteered, etc. And Bernie has done nothing but insult Democrats like me, continuously. Think about it from your work perspective. Someone sits there and trashes you and your ideas year after year, in meeting after meeting. And then one day, they need you on a project that they are responsible for delivering to the CEO. How excited or committed are you in helping them out? The problem isn't that Bernie's ideas are to the left of most of the party, it's the way he has approached that disagreement. And now he will need not only the SDs, but the rank and file delegates as well. And he's trashed them all for years. Can't blame the delegates for being human. Bernie was never required to choose between the voters and the delegates. He could have had them both had he cared to try.
But that's why you can vote against him.
Well yeah I know. But that's not really the point I'm making. Bernie now needs the very party members (delegates and SD's) that he has insulted. So of course they are not going to be keen to support him, and would prefer it be another candidate. Bernie and his supporters see this as...I don't know...some sort of bias against old white guys from New England? But the reality is that he's never tried to build a coalition inside the Senate, inside the party or anything. So don't expect people to fall in love with you when you have less than half of the delegates entering the convention. It's his own damn fault and has nothing to do with policies.
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
I agree. The GOP/RNC should have stepped in and prevented that from happening.
Happy to see you advocating for DNC intervention. Remove Bernie as a candidate, the sooner the better.
FUCK DEMOCRACY
AM
I
RITE
The DNC gets to choose who they want to support and promote. It is not a public, democratic body. It is a private organization.
But you knew that.
That may be true, but requiring a majority in the general election to win it, makes it extremely difficult for anything but a duopoly to exist in the USA. Then, if those two parties are (practically speaking) the only avenues to the presidency, and one has to be vetted by the private organizations prior to being nominated, then I'd argue that he's right and it's just not a democratic process. You could argue that this is evidenced by the fact that it's only been one of the two major parties who's ever actually succeeded.
it's essentially the same process in canada, though. each party chooses their own leader. but in the states it's just a massively drawn out process so the party can be sure they are nominating the most popular candidate. people seem to think that the party is beholden to the convention, and it isn't. they mostly do choose the most popular candidate, but if they feel that they can't bring in swing voters or voters from the other party, it's well within their right to choose someone else. this whole "bernie got fucked in 2016" is hogwash. they can choose whomever they want.
in canada they just vote internally. and I'm thankful AF for that. i can't imagine if our federal elections took up half of each PM term. the system is beyond ridiculous.
I disagree. If a party, even a private party, portrays themselves as being for the people and giving the people s voice, and they don't, that is wrong. Bernie did get screwed in 2016, that isn't hogwash. When they clearly favor a candidate to give her an advantage, but then claim this is a fair process where we have the say, it may be legal and allowed by the constitution but it isn't right. And to be honest, the dems are paying for it now. If Bernie had won the nomination 4 years ago and lost to Trump then, they wouldnt be trying to do the same thing now.
I dunno. It's tough to say. We know due to those leaked memos that the DNC was definitely against Bernie, but Hillary did win enough delegates to secure the nomination. So I wouldn't call it a full-on screwing....
The full-on screwing of Bernie Sanders by the DNC is tentatively scheduled for July 16, 2020. I understand the arguments that the rules state that the party can pick their own candidate. But I agree with you, why even have caucuses and primary elections if that's the case?
to gauge public support. if it was OVERWHELMING in one candidate's favour, I'm sure they'd choose that one. But if it's close, and they still think one nominee has a better chance with swing voters and independents, they make that call.
Well if it's overwhelming, it's probably a majority and I think they have to give the nomination to a person that gets to that number (1,991). But if it's just a large plurality, they still get to make the call. And if it's Bernie, I'm not sure they give it to him. And I understand where they're coming from: I think Bernie would have a tough go against Trump just as they do. But I don't like any of the other candidates' chances much either. So if Bernie has a plurality, and they're left with the options of 1) nominate Bernie and lose, 2) or give it to Bloomberg or Biden, lose anyway, and piss off all the democrats that voted for Bernie, option 1 seems like the way to go...for the long run. If future elections mean anything to the Dems. They're so obsessed with Trump that I'm not sure they can even look that far ahead. But the once-passionate-about-politics-Bernie-supporter isn't coming out and voting Blue in 2022 if they feel Bernie was hosed, or in the 2024 presidential election.
when you've spent your career sticking your finger in the eyes of Democrats, insulting them, calling them elite, playing the victim and now flip flopping on your 2016 position, why would Bernie think he could build a coalition of delegates and super delegates to get him over the hump? He should have been building relationships for the past 20 years.
I don't disagree with this at all, but man, what a sad, sad system you've just outlined. You have to be in one party or the other just to have a shot at being president, and you have to be in the party's good graces by towing the company line. Bernie must think that building a coalition of voters is as important as building a coalition of delegates and superdelegates. Dumbass. You're building relationships with the wrong people, Bernie!
Not really. I'm not part of the party apparatus but I am part of the party. I'm registered, vote, have volunteered, etc. And Bernie has done nothing but insult Democrats like me, continuously. Think about it from your work perspective. Someone sits there and trashes you and your ideas year after year, in meeting after meeting. And then one day, they need you on a project that they are responsible for delivering to the CEO. How excited or committed are you in helping them out? The problem isn't that Bernie's ideas are to the left of most of the party, it's the way he has approached that disagreement. And now he will need not only the SDs, but the rank and file delegates as well. And he's trashed them all for years. Can't blame the delegates for being human. Bernie was never required to choose between the voters and the delegates. He could have had them both had he cared to try.
But that's why you can vote against him.
Well yeah I know. But that's not really the point I'm making. Bernie now needs the very party members (delegates and SD's) that he has insulted. So of course they are not going to be keen to support him, and would prefer it be another candidate. Bernie and his supporters see this as...I don't know...some sort of bias against old white guys from New England? But the reality is that he's never tried to build a coalition inside the Senate, inside the party or anything. So don't expect people to fall in love with you when you have less than half of the delegates entering the convention. It's his own damn fault and has nothing to do with policies.
I'm just bitching about the system here. It's not even about Bernie. The whole primary system sucks. A year-and-a-half of a primary campaign, then four months of a general election campaign? Kamala Harris, who didn't even make it to Iowa, will have participated in more presidential debates in 2019-2020 than Trump? I hate that stuff. I also hate how spread out the elections are (who will be left when my state of Pennsylvania, an important swing-state, gets to vote?), and you already know my stance on the superdelegates.
The part about candiates dropping out before your state votes drives me the most nuts. I don't donate money to a political canidates, but for people that do, that must suck if you donate to (or even simply volunteer for) a primary candiate and then they're gone before you even get chance to vote. Happened in 2016 to a friend of mine that loves the Bush family and wanted to vote for Jeb. He even donated $1,000 to Jeb's campagin. But he didn't get to vote for him because Jeb was long-gone by time Pennsylvania came around.
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
I agree. The GOP/RNC should have stepped in and prevented that from happening.
Happy to see you advocating for DNC intervention. Remove Bernie as a candidate, the sooner the better.
FUCK DEMOCRACY
AM
I
RITE
The DNC gets to choose who they want to support and promote. It is not a public, democratic body. It is a private organization.
But you knew that.
That may be true, but requiring a majority in the general election to win it, makes it extremely difficult for anything but a duopoly to exist in the USA. Then, if those two parties are (practically speaking) the only avenues to the presidency, and one has to be vetted by the private organizations prior to being nominated, then I'd argue that he's right and it's just not a democratic process. You could argue that this is evidenced by the fact that it's only been one of the two major parties who's ever actually succeeded.
it's essentially the same process in canada, though. each party chooses their own leader. but in the states it's just a massively drawn out process so the party can be sure they are nominating the most popular candidate. people seem to think that the party is beholden to the convention, and it isn't. they mostly do choose the most popular candidate, but if they feel that they can't bring in swing voters or voters from the other party, it's well within their right to choose someone else. this whole "bernie got fucked in 2016" is hogwash. they can choose whomever they want.
in canada they just vote internally. and I'm thankful AF for that. i can't imagine if our federal elections took up half of each PM term. the system is beyond ridiculous.
I disagree. If a party, even a private party, portrays themselves as being for the people and giving the people s voice, and they don't, that is wrong. Bernie did get screwed in 2016, that isn't hogwash. When they clearly favor a candidate to give her an advantage, but then claim this is a fair process where we have the say, it may be legal and allowed by the constitution but it isn't right. And to be honest, the dems are paying for it now. If Bernie had won the nomination 4 years ago and lost to Trump then, they wouldnt be trying to do the same thing now.
I dunno. It's tough to say. We know due to those leaked memos that the DNC was definitely against Bernie, but Hillary did win enough delegates to secure the nomination. So I wouldn't call it a full-on screwing....
The full-on screwing of Bernie Sanders by the DNC is tentatively scheduled for July 16, 2020. I understand the arguments that the rules state that the party can pick their own candidate. But I agree with you, why even have caucuses and primary elections if that's the case?
to gauge public support. if it was OVERWHELMING in one candidate's favour, I'm sure they'd choose that one. But if it's close, and they still think one nominee has a better chance with swing voters and independents, they make that call.
Well if it's overwhelming, it's probably a majority and I think they have to give the nomination to a person that gets to that number (1,991). But if it's just a large plurality, they still get to make the call. And if it's Bernie, I'm not sure they give it to him. And I understand where they're coming from: I think Bernie would have a tough go against Trump just as they do. But I don't like any of the other candidates' chances much either. So if Bernie has a plurality, and they're left with the options of 1) nominate Bernie and lose, 2) or give it to Bloomberg or Biden, lose anyway, and piss off all the democrats that voted for Bernie, option 1 seems like the way to go...for the long run. If future elections mean anything to the Dems. They're so obsessed with Trump that I'm not sure they can even look that far ahead. But the once-passionate-about-politics-Bernie-supporter isn't coming out and voting Blue in 2022 if they feel Bernie was hosed, or in the 2024 presidential election.
when you've spent your career sticking your finger in the eyes of Democrats, insulting them, calling them elite, playing the victim and now flip flopping on your 2016 position, why would Bernie think he could build a coalition of delegates and super delegates to get him over the hump? He should have been building relationships for the past 20 years.
I don't disagree with this at all, but man, what a sad, sad system you've just outlined. You have to be in one party or the other just to have a shot at being president, and you have to be in the party's good graces by towing the company line. Bernie must think that building a coalition of voters is as important as building a coalition of delegates and superdelegates. Dumbass. You're building relationships with the wrong people, Bernie!
Not really. I'm not part of the party apparatus but I am part of the party. I'm registered, vote, have volunteered, etc. And Bernie has done nothing but insult Democrats like me, continuously. Think about it from your work perspective. Someone sits there and trashes you and your ideas year after year, in meeting after meeting. And then one day, they need you on a project that they are responsible for delivering to the CEO. How excited or committed are you in helping them out? The problem isn't that Bernie's ideas are to the left of most of the party, it's the way he has approached that disagreement. And now he will need not only the SDs, but the rank and file delegates as well. And he's trashed them all for years. Can't blame the delegates for being human. Bernie was never required to choose between the voters and the delegates. He could have had them both had he cared to try.
But that's why you can vote against him.
Well yeah I know. But that's not really the point I'm making. Bernie now needs the very party members (delegates and SD's) that he has insulted. So of course they are not going to be keen to support him, and would prefer it be another candidate. Bernie and his supporters see this as...I don't know...some sort of bias against old white guys from New England? But the reality is that he's never tried to build a coalition inside the Senate, inside the party or anything. So don't expect people to fall in love with you when you have less than half of the delegates entering the convention. It's his own damn fault and has nothing to do with policies.
Also doesn't help when you already have the DSA types barking about all the primary challenges they're setting up. It's their right to do it, but you're sticking your neck out if you're trying to take over a party. There's a big reward but the risk is alienation, right up to Bernie.
Thomas Friedman: Democrats, here’s the sure-fire way to defeat Donald Trump
If this election turns out to be just between a self-proclaimed
socialist and an undiagnosed sociopath, we will be in a terrible,
terrible place as a country. How do we prevent that?
That’s all I
am thinking about right now. My short answer is that the Democrats have
to do something extraordinary — forge a national unity ticket the likes
of which they have never forged before. And that’s true even if
Democrats nominate someone other than Bernie Sanders.
What would
this super ticket look like? Well, I suggest Sanders — and Michael
Bloomberg, who seems to be his most viable long-term challenger — lay it
out this way:
“I want people to know that if I am the Democratic
nominee these will be my Cabinet choices — my team of rivals. I want Amy
Klobuchar as my vice president. Her decency, experience and moderation
will be greatly appreciated across America and particularly in the
Midwest. I want Mike Bloomberg (or Bernie Sanders) as my secretary of
the Treasury. Our plans for addressing income inequality are actually
not that far apart, and if we can blend them together it will be great
for the country and reassure markets. I want Joe Biden as my secretary
of state. No one in our party knows the world better or has more
credibility with our allies than Joe. I will ask Elizabeth Warren to
serve as health and human services secretary. No one could bring more
energy and intellect to the task of expanding health care for more
Americans than Senator Warren.
“I want Kamala Harris for attorney
general. She has the toughness and integrity needed to clean up the
corrupt mess Donald Trump has created in our Justice Department. I would
like Mayor Pete as homeland security secretary; his intelligence and
military background would make him a quick study in that job. I would
like Tom Steyer to head a new Cabinet position: secretary of national
infrastructure. We’re going to rebuild America, not just build a wall on
the border with Mexico. And I am asking Cory Booker, the former mayor
of Newark, to become secretary of housing and urban development. Who
would bring more passion to the task of revitalizing our inner cities
than Cory?
“I am asking Mitt Romney to be my commerce secretary.
He is the best person to promote American business and technology abroad
— and it is vital that the public understands that my government will
be representing all Americans, including Republicans. I would
like Andrew Yang to be energy secretary, overseeing our nuclear
stockpile and renewable energy innovation. He’d be awesome.
“I am
asking Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez to serve as our U.N. ambassador.
Can you imagine how our international standing would improve with youth
worldwide with her representing next-gen America? And I want Sen.
Michael Bennet, the former superintendent of the Denver Public Schools,
to be my secretary of education. No one understands education reform
better than he does. Silicon Valley Congressman Ro Khanna would be an
ideal secretary of labor, balancing robots and workers to create “new
collar” jobs.
“Finally, I am asking William H. McRaven, the
retired Navy admiral who commanded the U.S. Special Operations Command
from 2011 to 2014 and oversaw the 2011 Navy SEAL raid that killed Osama
bin Laden, to be my defense secretary. Admiral McRaven, more than any
other retired military officer, has had the courage and integrity to
speak out against the way President Trump has politicized our
intelligence agencies.
MORE AT LINK
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
After tonight's debate, and having just a few more days to mail my ballot, I've decided to go with Bernie after all. Pete blew it with his phony and arrogant attacks on Sanders and the others have worn thin on me. Bernie it is for me!
You are the first winner.
Everyone climbing on the Bernie Bandwagon gets a free one. Congrats sir!
So tell me who would beat Trump if not Bernie?
someone who is interested in uniting people, instead of dividing them
I believe the "we need to unite" thing is a pundit and political air castle thing without base in reality. People have argued that the low turnout in the early states was because they were content with whoever got elected. Anyone being better than Trump.
Lol.. yeah.... okey... no need to go down your list any further it seems.. Put your life savings on Steyer. And I keep mine on the most beloved senator in the country, Bernie Sanders.
Steyer stands a better chance against Trump than Bernie does. He'll lose too though.
Bernie will get his ass kicked in the swing states that matter. Wisconsin Michigan Pennsylvania Florida Ohio none of these states are going to go for Bernie.
Panic Over Sanders Unsupported By Data
Some Democrats are freaking out now that Bernie Sanders is the frontrunner for the nomination, but the polling data doesn't support their fears that he would lose and lose big against Trump.
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
bernie has 43 delegates the rest of the field has 54 combined
why does this look like you are refuting your own post?
It's still less than 50%. No way they are changing the rules for an outsider
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
bernie has 43 delegates the rest of the field has 54 combined
why does this look like you are refuting your own post?
It's still less than 50%. No way they are changing the rules for an outsider
Hate to break it to you, but Bernie is dishonest too. Like really dishonest. About how he’ll pay for or where the money will come from to pay for all the free stuff. And that it’ll happen when he’s POTUS. Also, doesn’t promising free stuff to everyone, besides being dishonest, equate to bribery? Bernie’s buying votes with stuff that’s not legal tender. How dishonest. And where are his medical records? He might not make it to his inauguration.
About how he’ll pay for or where the money will come from to pay for all the free stuff. And that it’ll happen when he’s POTUS. Also, doesn’t promising free stuff to everyone, besides being dishonest, equate to bribery?
Tax-funded stuff isn't "free stuff". Never been a problem understanding it over here. So I don't think that is hard to understand for the voters over there either. It's also listed on his website how he'll pay for it. And he has always been able to say how the money needed will be collected for it, so he has stated where it would come from. Speaking of being dishonest 2TheMax.
About how he’ll pay for or where the money will come from to pay for all the free stuff. And that it’ll happen when he’s POTUS. Also, doesn’t promising free stuff to everyone, besides being dishonest, equate to bribery?
Tax-funded stuff isn't "free stuff". Never been a problem understanding it over here. So I don't think that is hard to understand for the voters over there either. It's also listed on his website how he'll pay for it. And he has always been able to say how the money needed will be collected for it, so he has stated where it would come from. Speaking of being dishonest 2TheMax.
All of which needs to be passed by Congress. Bernie never talks about that, it’s just platitudes about how the rich are too rich and the poor are too poor. $30 Trillion. Sorry but Americans don’t like big scary price tags or socialists. Bernie is dishonest claiming all that free stuff becomes reality. It ain’t happening.
About how he’ll pay for or where the money will come from to pay for all the free stuff. And that it’ll happen when he’s POTUS. Also, doesn’t promising free stuff to everyone, besides being dishonest, equate to bribery?
Tax-funded stuff isn't "free stuff". Never been a problem understanding it over here. So I don't think that is hard to understand for the voters over there either. It's also listed on his website how he'll pay for it. And he has always been able to say how the money needed will be collected for it, so he has stated where it would come from. Speaking of being dishonest 2TheMax.
All of which needs to be passed by Congress. Bernie never talks about that, it’s just platitudes about how the rich are too rich and the poor are too poor. $30 Trillion. Sorry but Americans don’t like big scary price tags or socialists. Bernie is dishonest claiming all that free stuff becomes reality. It ain’t happening.
About how he’ll pay for or where the money will come from to pay for all the free stuff. And that it’ll happen when he’s POTUS. Also, doesn’t promising free stuff to everyone, besides being dishonest, equate to bribery?
Tax-funded stuff isn't "free stuff". Never been a problem understanding it over here. So I don't think that is hard to understand for the voters over there either. It's also listed on his website how he'll pay for it. And he has always been able to say how the money needed will be collected for it, so he has stated where it would come from. Speaking of being dishonest 2TheMax.
All of which needs to be passed by Congress. Bernie never talks about that, it’s just platitudes about how the rich are too rich and the poor are too poor. $30 Trillion. Sorry but Americans don’t like big scary price tags or socialists. Bernie is dishonest claiming all that free stuff becomes reality. It ain’t happening.
Steven Spielberg is making better movies than Len Wiseman.
Steven is 73. Len is 46.
It is not platitudes (that would be Phony Petes area). For a country run by the elites greed and disdain for peoples human worth, it means that for normal people:
How much does their healthcare and medicine cost now in trillions? Because, man this does come off as... off:
ITS IS TOO EXPENSIVE TO LOWER OUR COSTS AND HAVE PEOPLE NOT DIE!
And you, have fun at the next Len Wiseman movie you go watch just because he is young. yummy.
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
After tonight's debate, and having just a few more days to mail my ballot, I've decided to go with Bernie after all. Pete blew it with his phony and arrogant attacks on Sanders and the others have worn thin on me. Bernie it is for me!
You are the first winner.
Everyone climbing on the Bernie Bandwagon gets a free one. Congrats sir!
So tell me who would beat Trump if not Bernie?
someone who is interested in uniting people, instead of dividing them
I believe the "we need to unite" thing is a pundit and political air castle thing without base in reality. People have argued that the low turnout in the early states was because they were content with whoever got elected. Anyone being better than Trump.
Lol.. yeah.... okey... no need to go down your list any further it seems.. Put your life savings on Steyer. And I keep mine on the most beloved senator in the country, Bernie Sanders.
Steyer stands a better chance against Trump than Bernie does. He'll lose too though.
Bernie will get his ass kicked in the swing states that matter. Wisconsin Michigan Pennsylvania Florida Ohio none of these states are going to go for Bernie.
Panic Over Sanders Unsupported By Data
Some Democrats are freaking out now that Bernie Sanders is the frontrunner for the nomination, but the polling data doesn't support their fears that he would lose and lose big against Trump.
About how he’ll pay for or where the money will come from to pay for all the free stuff. And that it’ll happen when he’s POTUS. Also, doesn’t promising free stuff to everyone, besides being dishonest, equate to bribery?
Tax-funded stuff isn't "free stuff". Never been a problem understanding it over here. So I don't think that is hard to understand for the voters over there either. It's also listed on his website how he'll pay for it. And he has always been able to say how the money needed will be collected for it, so he has stated where it would come from. Speaking of being dishonest 2TheMax.
All of which needs to be passed by Congress. Bernie never talks about that, it’s just platitudes about how the rich are too rich and the poor are too poor. $30 Trillion. Sorry but Americans don’t like big scary price tags or socialists. Bernie is dishonest claiming all that free stuff becomes reality. It ain’t happening.
Steven Spielberg is making better movies than Len Wiseman.
Steven is 73. Len is 46.
It is not platitudes (that would be Phony Petes area). For a country run by the elites greed and disdain for peoples human worth, it means that for normal people:
How much does their healthcare and medicine cost now in trillions? Because, man this does come off as... off:
ITS IS TOO EXPENSIVE TO LOWER OUR COSTS AND HAVE PEOPLE NOT DIE!
And you, have fun at the next Len Wiseman movie you go watch just because he is young. yummy.
Your pilfered charts, graphs, and twitter posts aren’t telling me anything I don’t already know about the US healthcare system and those in other parts of the world. What you and Bernie aren’t telling me is anything about Bernie’s health or how he’s going to get his domestic agenda passed by two houses of Congress so he can sign into law all this free stuff. That’s dishonest. Because as soon as a dem is POTUS, deficits will matter again.
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
I just posted the first thing making the point off google while waiting on feedback on the closeup of the Gorilla straining her wrist.
dont see how your article disputes anything though.
I guy advocating for the elimination of social security, Medicaid and Medicare pointing out how much healthcare costs in the US is your source to back your argument? Good to know. So when Bernie gets M4A written as legislation, good ol Peter Peterson can spend millions defeating it. Sounds like a great winning strategy. Peter thanks you for the clicks.
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
I just posted the first thing making the point off google while waiting on feedback on the closeup of the Gorilla straining her wrist.
dont see how your article disputes anything though.
I guy advocating for the elimination of social security, Medicaid and Medicare pointing out how much healthcare costs in the US is your source to back your argument? Good to know. So when Bernie gets M4A written as legislation, good ol Peter Peterson can spend millions defeating it. Sounds like a great winning strategy. Peter thanks you for the clicks.
Still don’t see how it disputes anything—
— does the US pay roughly double what other major countries with universal health care do or not?
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
The GOP rules are very different than the DNC. Most states award their delegates on a winner take all basis similar to the electoral college. Trump won slot of early states with well under 50%.
Many experts surmise if the 2016 gop nominating contest was played under democratic rules, trump very well might never have become president.
Bernies big chance is California. If he gets a blowout win there he might get into the 40% range of total delegates. Anything less than 40% heading into the DNC and Bernie is done. He is not a democrat nor running on democratic values.
About how he’ll pay for or where the money will come from to pay for all the free stuff. And that it’ll happen when he’s POTUS. Also, doesn’t promising free stuff to everyone, besides being dishonest, equate to bribery?
Tax-funded stuff isn't "free stuff". Never been a problem understanding it over here. So I don't think that is hard to understand for the voters over there either. It's also listed on his website how he'll pay for it. And he has always been able to say how the money needed will be collected for it, so he has stated where it would come from. Speaking of being dishonest 2TheMax.
All of which needs to be passed by Congress. Bernie never talks about that, it’s just platitudes about how the rich are too rich and the poor are too poor. $30 Trillion. Sorry but Americans don’t like big scary price tags or socialists. Bernie is dishonest claiming all that free stuff becomes reality. It ain’t happening.
Steven Spielberg is making better movies than Len Wiseman.
Steven is 73. Len is 46.
It is not platitudes (that would be Phony Petes area). For a country run by the elites greed and disdain for peoples human worth, it means that for normal people:
How much does their healthcare and medicine cost now in trillions? Because, man this does come off as... off:
ITS IS TOO EXPENSIVE TO LOWER OUR COSTS AND HAVE PEOPLE NOT DIE!
And you, have fun at the next Len Wiseman movie you go watch just because he is young. yummy.
Your pilfered charts, graphs, and twitter posts aren’t telling me anything I don’t already know about the US healthcare system and those in other parts of the world. What you and Bernie aren’t telling me is anything about Bernie’s health or how he’s going to get his domestic agenda passed by two houses of Congress so he can sign into law all this free stuff. That’s dishonest. Because as soon as a dem is POTUS, deficits will matter again.
Steven is 73? He looks 93.
How it gets passed? It would have to be a wave election. Despite the positive polls Chaos posted ( many other state swing polls are more favorable to trump over sanders) a 2 or 3 % margin will not bring the wave needed to get the attention of Congress. That's a big reason I'm skeptical of Sanders chances.
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
The GOP rules are very different than the DNC. Most states award their delegates on a winner take all basis similar to the electoral college. Trump won slot of early states with well under 50%.
Many experts surmise if the 2016 gop nominating contest was played under democratic rules, trump very well might never have become president.
Bernies big chance is California. If he gets a blowout win there he might get into the 40% range of total delegates. Anything less than 40% heading into the DNC and Bernie is done. He is not a democrat nor running on democratic values.
I don't know if I'd say that he's done. He could always run as an independent. I mean, why not if no one else is going to beat Trump anyway?
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
I just posted the first thing making the point off google while waiting on feedback on the closeup of the Gorilla straining her wrist.
dont see how your article disputes anything though.
I guy advocating for the elimination of social security, Medicaid and Medicare pointing out how much healthcare costs in the US is your source to back your argument? Good to know. So when Bernie gets M4A written as legislation, good ol Peter Peterson can spend millions defeating it. Sounds like a great winning strategy. Peter thanks you for the clicks.
Still don’t see how it disputes anything—
— does the US pay roughly double what other major countries with universal health care do or not?
Bernie's M4A won't address this, though. Between his own proposal and studies he cites, he:
- Overestimates the amount of revenue he'll be able to bring in - Underestimates the utilization increases that come with no patient cost share - Ignores the downstream consequences of slashing provider payments by 40% - Ignores the employment impact of the taxes he plans to levy on businesses
It's daunting even when he puts the most optimistic blush on every aspect of the plan. There's a reason it couldn't even be implemented in his home state.
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
There is no realistic scenario where Democrats take the nomination away from Bernie at the convention and then unify in sufficient numbers to beat Trump. It would be suicide.
The Peter G Peterson Foundation is your source @Spiritual_Chaos For the above healthcare spending chart? Do you look into any of the information you post prior to posting it or are you just throwing shit out there? You’re beginning to lose all credibility. Like Bernie.
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
I agree. The GOP/RNC should have stepped in and prevented that from happening.
Happy to see you advocating for DNC intervention. Remove Bernie as a candidate, the sooner the better.
FUCK DEMOCRACY
AM
I
RITE
The DNC gets to choose who they want to support and promote. It is not a public, democratic body. It is a private organization.
But you knew that.
That may be true, but requiring a majority in the general election to win it, makes it extremely difficult for anything but a duopoly to exist in the USA. Then, if those two parties are (practically speaking) the only avenues to the presidency, and one has to be vetted by the private organizations prior to being nominated, then I'd argue that he's right and it's just not a democratic process. You could argue that this is evidenced by the fact that it's only been one of the two major parties who's ever actually succeeded.
which is why we need ranked choice voting
that aside, has Bernie been vetted? where are the medical records he promised?
forget non-stop commercials about socialism: he was a deadbeat dad, no? his wife was embroiled in scandal, no? tell me more about his gangrape fantasies
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
I agree. The GOP/RNC should have stepped in and prevented that from happening.
Happy to see you advocating for DNC intervention. Remove Bernie as a candidate, the sooner the better.
FUCK DEMOCRACY
AM
I
RITE
The DNC gets to choose who they want to support and promote. It is not a public, democratic body. It is a private organization.
But you knew that.
That may be true, but requiring a majority in the general election to win it, makes it extremely difficult for anything but a duopoly to exist in the USA. Then, if those two parties are (practically speaking) the only avenues to the presidency, and one has to be vetted by the private organizations prior to being nominated, then I'd argue that he's right and it's just not a democratic process. You could argue that this is evidenced by the fact that it's only been one of the two major parties who's ever actually succeeded.
which is why we need ranked choice voting
that aside, has Bernie been vetted? where are the medical records he promised?
forget non-stop commercials about socialism: he was a deadbeat dad, no? his wife was embroiled in scandal, no? tell me more about his gangrape fantasies
...the list goes on...
Beware the person who chooses their own opponent
that aside, has Bernie been vetted?
where are the medical records he promised?
forget non-stop commercials about socialism:
he was a deadbeat dad, no?
his wife was embroiled in scandal, no?
tell me more about his gangrape fantasies
...crickets...
why hasnt biden been vetted about saying he’s running for the senate?
.... crickets?
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
I like warren, and it's too bad she's sliding in the polls. she makes the most sense and actually tells you what her plans are and how she'll do it.
friendly reminder that only 5% of the delegates have been declared there's a long road ahead as more candidates drop out, those delegates will migrate to the more moderate candidates who remain (that won't be bernie)
That is exactly what everyone said about Trump 4 years ago. Everyone said "don't worry, as some of the other 15 candidates drop out then their votes will not go to Trump." But that is exactly what happened. I'm guessing it will happen here too. Bernie only needs about 20% of the other voters when they drop to keep the lead, and that isnt much.
The GOP rules are very different than the DNC. Most states award their delegates on a winner take all basis similar to the electoral college. Trump won slot of early states with well under 50%.
Many experts surmise if the 2016 gop nominating contest was played under democratic rules, trump very well might never have become president.
Bernies big chance is California. If he gets a blowout win there he might get into the 40% range of total delegates. Anything less than 40% heading into the DNC and Bernie is done. He is not a democrat nor running on democratic values.
Dead on, although I don't know that even 40% of CA and TX will get him to a tipping point. He needs to win with majorities in some states I believe, to make his nomination inevitable. Great point on the 'winner take all' statement. Winning CA at 35% is meaningful in optics for the media, but not necessarily from a delegate or convention perspective.
The one thing that Sanders has not really been vetted on is his flip on immigration. Prior to 2015, his immigration views were very much in line with the Republicans. He argued for years that mass immigration drives down the wages of American workers. But once Trump got in (and took over) that lane in 2015, Sanders sure changed his tune. Now he's as far left as someone can be on immigration.
Comments
The part about candiates dropping out before your state votes drives me the most nuts. I don't donate money to a political canidates, but for people that do, that must suck if you donate to (or even simply volunteer for) a primary candiate and then they're gone before you even get chance to vote. Happened in 2016 to a friend of mine that loves the Bush family and wanted to vote for Jeb. He even donated $1,000 to Jeb's campagin. But he didn't get to vote for him because Jeb was long-gone by time Pennsylvania came around.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
Thomas Friedman: Democrats, here’s the sure-fire way to defeat Donald Trump
If this election turns out to be just between a self-proclaimed socialist and an undiagnosed sociopath, we will be in a terrible, terrible place as a country. How do we prevent that?
That’s all I am thinking about right now. My short answer is that the Democrats have to do something extraordinary — forge a national unity ticket the likes of which they have never forged before. And that’s true even if Democrats nominate someone other than Bernie Sanders.
What would this super ticket look like? Well, I suggest Sanders — and Michael Bloomberg, who seems to be his most viable long-term challenger — lay it out this way:
“I want people to know that if I am the Democratic nominee these will be my Cabinet choices — my team of rivals. I want Amy Klobuchar as my vice president. Her decency, experience and moderation will be greatly appreciated across America and particularly in the Midwest. I want Mike Bloomberg (or Bernie Sanders) as my secretary of the Treasury. Our plans for addressing income inequality are actually not that far apart, and if we can blend them together it will be great for the country and reassure markets. I want Joe Biden as my secretary of state. No one in our party knows the world better or has more credibility with our allies than Joe. I will ask Elizabeth Warren to serve as health and human services secretary. No one could bring more energy and intellect to the task of expanding health care for more Americans than Senator Warren.
“I want Kamala Harris for attorney general. She has the toughness and integrity needed to clean up the corrupt mess Donald Trump has created in our Justice Department. I would like Mayor Pete as homeland security secretary; his intelligence and military background would make him a quick study in that job. I would like Tom Steyer to head a new Cabinet position: secretary of national infrastructure. We’re going to rebuild America, not just build a wall on the border with Mexico. And I am asking Cory Booker, the former mayor of Newark, to become secretary of housing and urban development. Who would bring more passion to the task of revitalizing our inner cities than Cory?
“I am asking Mitt Romney to be my commerce secretary. He is the best person to promote American business and technology abroad — and it is vital that the public understands that my government will be representing all Americans, including Republicans. I would like Andrew Yang to be energy secretary, overseeing our nuclear stockpile and renewable energy innovation. He’d be awesome.
“I am asking Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez to serve as our U.N. ambassador. Can you imagine how our international standing would improve with youth worldwide with her representing next-gen America? And I want Sen. Michael Bennet, the former superintendent of the Denver Public Schools, to be my secretary of education. No one understands education reform better than he does. Silicon Valley Congressman Ro Khanna would be an ideal secretary of labor, balancing robots and workers to create “new collar” jobs.
“Finally, I am asking William H. McRaven, the retired Navy admiral who commanded the U.S. Special Operations Command from 2011 to 2014 and oversaw the 2011 Navy SEAL raid that killed Osama bin Laden, to be my defense secretary. Admiral McRaven, more than any other retired military officer, has had the courage and integrity to speak out against the way President Trump has politicized our intelligence agencies.
MORE AT LINK
Just gonna leave this here:
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Tax-funded stuff isn't "free stuff". Never been a problem understanding it over here. So I don't think that is hard to understand for the voters over there either. It's also listed on his website how he'll pay for it. And he has always been able to say how the money needed will be collected for it, so he has stated where it would come from. Speaking of being dishonest 2TheMax.
Don't ask me. In a computer system? File cabinet? He should provide what has been stated is needed to compete or told would be provided.
You might not either.-
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/02/27/electing-an-older-candidate-carries-risks-just-ask-life-insurance-industry/
All of which needs to be passed by Congress. Bernie never talks about that, it’s just platitudes about how the rich are too rich and the poor are too poor. $30 Trillion. Sorry but Americans don’t like big scary price tags or socialists. Bernie is dishonest claiming all that free stuff becomes reality. It ain’t happening.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Would be 79 as POTUS. Un-frigging-believable.
Steven is 73. Len is 46.
It is not platitudes (that would be Phony Petes area). For a country run by the elites greed and disdain for peoples human worth, it means that for normal people:
How much does their healthcare and medicine cost now in trillions? Because, man this does come off as... off:
ITS IS TOO EXPENSIVE TO LOWER OUR COSTS AND HAVE PEOPLE NOT DIE!
And you, have fun at the next Len Wiseman movie you go watch just because he is young. yummy.
Steven is 73? He looks 93.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
https://www.latimes.com/business/la-xpm-2012-oct-02-la-fi-hiltzik-20121003-story.html
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
I just posted the first thing making the point off google while waiting on feedback on the closeup of the Gorilla straining her wrist.
dont see how your article disputes anything though.
Who, dare I ask, is "The Gorilla"?
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
— does the US pay roughly double what other major countries with universal health care do or not?
The GOP rules are very different than the DNC. Most states award their delegates on a winner take all basis similar to the electoral college. Trump won slot of early states with well under 50%.
Many experts surmise if the 2016 gop nominating contest was played under democratic rules, trump very well might never have become president.
Bernies big chance is California. If he gets a blowout win there he might get into the 40% range of total delegates. Anything less than 40% heading into the DNC and Bernie is done. He is not a democrat nor running on democratic values.
How it gets passed? It would have to be a wave election. Despite the positive polls Chaos posted ( many other state swing polls are more favorable to trump over sanders) a 2 or 3 % margin will not bring the wave needed to get the attention of Congress. That's a big reason I'm skeptical of Sanders chances.
- Overestimates the amount of revenue he'll be able to bring in
- Underestimates the utilization increases that come with no patient cost share
- Ignores the downstream consequences of slashing provider payments by 40%
- Ignores the employment impact of the taxes he plans to levy on businesses
It's daunting even when he puts the most optimistic blush on every aspect of the plan. There's a reason it couldn't even be implemented in his home state.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
Of all time
...crickets...
.... crickets?
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com