The coronavirus

JB56195

mrussel1 said:

lastexitlondon said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

That’s a good point on people that can’t be vaccinated for a medical reason. What are some of the medical reasons that would prevent someone from getting it?

people allergic to its ingredients, people on blood thinners, there are more. 

So they’ll be just as vulnerable even if we achieved herd immunity right? Since even vaccinated people can spread the virus. 

that I'm not sure on. we know that yes, people vaccinated can still spread it, but I think with pfiser it can actually prevent people from being infected, astrazeneca cannot. not sure about J&J. 

and it also matters about viral load. if you don't have enough virus to get sick yourself, how much you pass on would be lesser, thus also preventing others from getting very ill. But @oftenreading is the best person to speak on such things. 

None of these  vaccines  stops infection.  All are the  same in that sence. But they will stop illness  and hospitalizations in most. Some have still caught and sadly died and had 2 pfizer shots. Not many but some

I thought they stopped infections at a 90 to 95% clip (depending on which one) and prevent serious illness at a 99% rate.  Not accurate?

Yes, were finding out they're stopping infections.  Remember, we don't know 100% about how the vaccine and virus interact.  The scientists have been very slow to release information and that is on purpose.  That's the problem with peoples understanding of the scientific method.  Science observes repetitive occurrences until they become data/evidence.  When the evidence is overwhelming we then consider it a near approximation of the truth. 

The problem with the recent anti-science rhetoric is that if anything is stated and later found to be incorrect, then one side jumps out and says, "A-ha!  You were lying all along.  You're just a bunch of morons."  The reality is that science isn't perfect and it makes mistakes.  However the purity of science is that it is always seeking the truth and hence it will always correct itself.  Charlatans, con-men, incorrect theories, falsified data, etc. will always get disproven and corrected.  It just takes time.

I'm a urologist and have a BS in biology so if people have questions I'd be happy to answer.  I'm obviously not a virus expert and wouldn't purport to be one but I do have extensive daily updates from my health system and have done a lot of personal educating about this.

Here is a link to the CDC on vaccine infection prevention:

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/p0329-COVID-19-Vaccines.html

mickeyrat

JB56195 said:

mrussel1 said:

lastexitlondon said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

That’s a good point on people that can’t be vaccinated for a medical reason. What are some of the medical reasons that would prevent someone from getting it?

people allergic to its ingredients, people on blood thinners, there are more. 

So they’ll be just as vulnerable even if we achieved herd immunity right? Since even vaccinated people can spread the virus. 

that I'm not sure on. we know that yes, people vaccinated can still spread it, but I think with pfiser it can actually prevent people from being infected, astrazeneca cannot. not sure about J&J. 

and it also matters about viral load. if you don't have enough virus to get sick yourself, how much you pass on would be lesser, thus also preventing others from getting very ill. But @oftenreading is the best person to speak on such things. 

None of these  vaccines  stops infection.  All are the  same in that sence. But they will stop illness  and hospitalizations in most. Some have still caught and sadly died and had 2 pfizer shots. Not many but some

I thought they stopped infections at a 90 to 95% clip (depending on which one) and prevent serious illness at a 99% rate.  Not accurate?

Yes, were finding out they're stopping infections.  Remember, we don't know 100% about how the vaccine and virus interact.  The scientists have been very slow to release information and that is on purpose.  That's the problem with peoples understanding of the scientific method.  Science observes repetitive occurrences until they become data/evidence.  When the evidence is overwhelming we then consider it a near approximation of the truth. 

The problem with the recent anti-science rhetoric is that if anything is stated and later found to be incorrect, then one side jumps out and says, "A-ha!  You were lying all along.  You're just a bunch of morons."  The reality is that science isn't perfect and it makes mistakes.  However the purity of science is that it is always seeking the truth and hence it will always correct itself.  Charlatans, con-men, incorrect theories, falsified data, etc. will always get disproven and corrected.  It just takes time.

I'm a urologist and have a BS in biology so if people have questions I'd be happy to answer.  I'm obviously not a virus expert and wouldn't purport to be one but I do have extensive daily updates from my health system and have done a lot of personal educating about this.

Here is a link to the CDC on vaccine infection prevention:

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/p0329-COVID-19-Vaccines.html

WELCOME!!!!!!

We need to get you and giventopostfalsehoods together...

F Me In The Brain

It hurts when I pee.....
JK.

Good luck sharing real info with the Twitter Doctors.

HughFreakingDillon

K-12 going remote learning on wednesday until May 30th. should be an interesting few weeks working at home with both my daughters here. oh well, make the best of it, daddy daughter style. go out for bike rides at lunch, etc. 

Spunkie

^Ya, I was thinking of you when I saw that news. A few weeks back, I was wondering if my daughter's in-class learning would make it to the end of the year without disruption. It seems we will, as we come down from our third peak.

We played a lot of hooky this spring! Happy outdoors Mother's day!

PJNB

Some good news

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1391544648372469764?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1391544648372469764%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=

https://twitter.com/NYTScience/status/1391430663950196739?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1391430663950196739%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=

mrussel1

PJNB said:

Some good news

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1391544648372469764?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1391544648372469764%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=

https://twitter.com/NYTScience/status/1391430663950196739?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1391430663950196739%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=

This means that not wearing masks and refusing to take vaccines is finally turned the corner and is working.  Great news! 

HughFreakingDillon

LOL

HughFreakingDillon

yeah, we would have been out of this a lot faster had we just lived as normal, mrussel1. come on. 

cincybearcat

HughFreakingDillon said:

yeah, we would have been out of this a lot faster had we just lived as normal, mrussel1. come on. 

Well it's kinda true isn't it?  More people would have died right but herd immunity would have been reached.  Isn't that what the 1918 pandemic charts showed of the different cities?

Not saying it was the right choice, cause I don;t think it would have been, but I'll go look for those charts

mrussel1

cincybearcat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

yeah, we would have been out of this a lot faster had we just lived as normal, mrussel1. come on. 

Well it's kinda true isn't it?  More people would have died right but herd immunity would have been reached.  Isn't that what the 1918 pandemic charts showed of the different cities?

Not saying it was the right choice, cause I don;t think it would have been, but I'll go look for those charts

After much internal debate, I have decided that having restaurants close for a time and some negative GDP is probably better than millions up millions of additional human deaths.  It was a close call, ended up flipping some coins, used a magic 8 ball and did some Rock/Scissors/Paper, but ultimately decided that human life is more important than positive GDP.  

HughFreakingDillon

cincybearcat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

yeah, we would have been out of this a lot faster had we just lived as normal, mrussel1. come on. 

Well it's kinda true isn't it?  More people would have died right but herd immunity would have been reached.  Isn't that what the 1918 pandemic charts showed of the different cities?

Not saying it was the right choice, cause I don;t think it would have been, but I'll go look for those charts

Hard to say, really, that we now know people can be reinfected. the vaccine at least provides some security from nasty sickness and death. but yeah, sure, i suppose technically it would have been faster to just do nothing. 

guess i'll have to watch the wording of my sarcasm next time. lol

mrussel1

HughFreakingDillon said:

cincybearcat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

yeah, we would have been out of this a lot faster had we just lived as normal, mrussel1. come on. 

Well it's kinda true isn't it?  More people would have died right but herd immunity would have been reached.  Isn't that what the 1918 pandemic charts showed of the different cities?

Not saying it was the right choice, cause I don;t think it would have been, but I'll go look for those charts

Hard to say, really, that we now know people can be reinfected. the vaccine at least provides some security from nasty sickness and death. but yeah, sure, i suppose technically it would have been faster to just do nothing. 

guess i'll have to watch the wording of my sarcasm next time. lol

Your sarcasm was perfectly clear. 

brianlux

tish said:

^Ya, I was thinking of you when I saw that news. A few weeks back, I was wondering if my daughter's in-class learning would make it to the end of the year without disruption. It seems we will, as we come down from our third peak.

We played a lot of hooky this spring! Happy outdoors Mother's day.

Fun! 

I'm envious.  I would love to go horse riding more often but the three time I've ridden went like this:

First time:  Horse knows I'm a newbie, takes off running, scares me to death!

Second time:  Visiting a friend in Tennessee, he takes me riding.  I get on the horse.  The horse looks at me with a look that says, "You don't have a fucking clue about any of this, do you?" and refuses to budge.

Third time:  Well, either third time's a charm or I was very, very lucky.  The horse owner tell me, "Don't worry, Starlet is a very forgiving horse." Sure enough, she puts up with my naivete and we get in a decent ride.

Horse are smart.  Most would never put up with me. 

Spunkie

brianlux said:

tish said:

^Ya, I was thinking of you when I saw that news. A few weeks back, I was wondering if my daughter's in-class learning would make it to the end of the year without disruption. It seems we will, as we come down from our third peak.

We played a lot of hooky this spring! Happy outdoors Mother's day.

Fun! 

I'm envious.  I would love to go horse riding more often but the three time I've ridden went like this:

First time:  Horse knows I'm a newbie, takes off running, scares me to death!

Second time:  Visiting a friend in Tennessee, he takes me riding.  I get on the horse.  The horse looks at me with a look that says, "You don't have a fucking clue about any of this, do you?" and refuses to budge.

Third time:  Well, either third time's a charm or I was very, very lucky.  The horse owner tell me, "Don't worry, Starlet is a very forgiving horse." Sure enough, she puts up with my naivete and we get in a decent ride.

Horse are smart.  Most would never put up with me. 

Nice to hear from you Briguy. Hope you're getting in some outdoor time! My current situation is at camp. A camper at the next site over is playing the violin, quite beautifullly, I might add. Geese honk, wood chops fill the green scented air.

I hate that I have to wait 3 days over the weekend for an update in BC. On Mondays, I can't make an informed decision before I pack my kid off to school!

I used to ride a white horse named Surprise. Once on a trail ride he bolted back home. SURPRISE!

OnWis97

nicknyr15 said:

josevolution said:

nicknyr15 said:

73,000 people at the Canelo fight last night in Texas. 

I’m sure the virus was strong with this crowd! 

I guess we have to wait and see. Regardless of politics we should be all be rooting against that happening no?

Well, I cannot in good conscience cheer for thousands of people to catch the illness and then spread to to many, many thousands of others.  That said, the lack of news from that Rangers game has probably been a double-edged sword. So if there is no known spread from this, I hope to find out why. Even if that "why" is related to some very low incidents of testing.

Taken at face value, what does the lack of fallout from the Rangers game tell us?  Is it over? (I mean, no, obviously)  Have we over-estimated the impact on bigger groups? Were masks properly used by almost all (I highly doubt that). Were any other precautions taken that aren't norms? Were temperatures taken on the way in?  Is testing way down in DFW or the State of Texas? Was the roof open or closed (I really should know that one). And I know this fight is in the same state, but I wonder whether there are variables that can be compared in case the results turn out differently.

Weston1283

OnWis97 said:

nicknyr15 said:

josevolution said:

nicknyr15 said:

73,000 people at the Canelo fight last night in Texas. 

I’m sure the virus was strong with this crowd! 

I guess we have to wait and see. Regardless of politics we should be all be rooting against that happening no?

Well, I cannot in good conscience cheer for thousands of people to catch the illness and then spread to to many, many thousands of others.  That said, the lack of news from that Rangers game has probably been a double-edged sword. So if there is no known spread from this, I hope to find out why. Even if that "why" is related to some very low incidents of testing.

Taken at face value, what does the lack of fallout from the Rangers game tell us?  Is it over? (I mean, no, obviously)  Have we over-estimated the impact on bigger groups? Were masks properly used by almost all (I highly doubt that). Were any other precautions taken that aren't norms? Were temperatures taken on the way in?  Is testing way down in DFW or the State of Texas? Was the roof open or closed (I really should know that one). And I know this fight is in the same state, but I wonder whether there are variables that can be compared in case the results turn out differently.

Between this and what the CDC has been saying the last 1-2 weeks, my biggest take away is

If you’re outdoors or in an indoor area with excellent filtration (planes etc) you’re probably fine.  

But if you’re in a small room indoors or anywhere inside without good filtration, that’s where the spread is really happening

OnWis97

Weston1283 said:

OnWis97 said:

nicknyr15 said:

josevolution said:

nicknyr15 said:

73,000 people at the Canelo fight last night in Texas. 

I’m sure the virus was strong with this crowd! 

I guess we have to wait and see. Regardless of politics we should be all be rooting against that happening no?

Well, I cannot in good conscience cheer for thousands of people to catch the illness and then spread to to many, many thousands of others.  That said, the lack of news from that Rangers game has probably been a double-edged sword. So if there is no known spread from this, I hope to find out why. Even if that "why" is related to some very low incidents of testing.

Taken at face value, what does the lack of fallout from the Rangers game tell us?  Is it over? (I mean, no, obviously)  Have we over-estimated the impact on bigger groups? Were masks properly used by almost all (I highly doubt that). Were any other precautions taken that aren't norms? Were temperatures taken on the way in?  Is testing way down in DFW or the State of Texas? Was the roof open or closed (I really should know that one). And I know this fight is in the same state, but I wonder whether there are variables that can be compared in case the results turn out differently.

Between this and what the CDC has been saying the last 1-2 weeks, my biggest take away is

If you’re outdoors or in an indoor area with excellent filtration (planes etc) you’re probably fine.  

But if you’re in a small room indoors or anywhere inside without good filtration, that’s where the spread is really happening

That could be why most of the stories I've seen about spreader events are weddings and family reunions (i.e., those stories where a dozen people at the same wedding were positive and four of them died) but I don't feel like really large events have led to any stories.

Weston1283

OnWis97 said:

Weston1283 said:

OnWis97 said:

nicknyr15 said:

josevolution said:

nicknyr15 said:

73,000 people at the Canelo fight last night in Texas. 

I’m sure the virus was strong with this crowd! 

I guess we have to wait and see. Regardless of politics we should be all be rooting against that happening no?

Well, I cannot in good conscience cheer for thousands of people to catch the illness and then spread to to many, many thousands of others.  That said, the lack of news from that Rangers game has probably been a double-edged sword. So if there is no known spread from this, I hope to find out why. Even if that "why" is related to some very low incidents of testing.

Taken at face value, what does the lack of fallout from the Rangers game tell us?  Is it over? (I mean, no, obviously)  Have we over-estimated the impact on bigger groups? Were masks properly used by almost all (I highly doubt that). Were any other precautions taken that aren't norms? Were temperatures taken on the way in?  Is testing way down in DFW or the State of Texas? Was the roof open or closed (I really should know that one). And I know this fight is in the same state, but I wonder whether there are variables that can be compared in case the results turn out differently.

Between this and what the CDC has been saying the last 1-2 weeks, my biggest take away is

If you’re outdoors or in an indoor area with excellent filtration (planes etc) you’re probably fine.  

But if you’re in a small room indoors or anywhere inside without good filtration, that’s where the spread is really happening

That could be why most of the stories I've seen about spreader events are weddings and family reunions (i.e., those stories where a dozen people at the same wedding were positive and four of them died) but I don't feel like really large events have led to any stories.

Yeah.  I’ve always found it interesting how I don’t think I’ve ever heard a single story about pilots and flight attendants spreading the virus at an abnormal rate.  I think the studies out there regarding planes being safe are accurate.

PJPOWER

Weston1283 said:

OnWis97 said:

nicknyr15 said:

josevolution said:

nicknyr15 said:

73,000 people at the Canelo fight last night in Texas. 

I’m sure the virus was strong with this crowd! 

I guess we have to wait and see. Regardless of politics we should be all be rooting against that happening no?

Well, I cannot in good conscience cheer for thousands of people to catch the illness and then spread to to many, many thousands of others.  That said, the lack of news from that Rangers game has probably been a double-edged sword. So if there is no known spread from this, I hope to find out why. Even if that "why" is related to some very low incidents of testing.

Taken at face value, what does the lack of fallout from the Rangers game tell us?  Is it over? (I mean, no, obviously)  Have we over-estimated the impact on bigger groups? Were masks properly used by almost all (I highly doubt that). Were any other precautions taken that aren't norms? Were temperatures taken on the way in?  Is testing way down in DFW or the State of Texas? Was the roof open or closed (I really should know that one). And I know this fight is in the same state, but I wonder whether there are variables that can be compared in case the results turn out differently.

Between this and what the CDC has been saying the last 1-2 weeks, my biggest take away is

If you’re outdoors or in an indoor area with excellent filtration (planes etc) you’re probably fine.  

But if you’re in a small room indoors or anywhere inside without good filtration, that’s where the spread is really happening

Maybe the cure is beer and hotdogs