The Democratic Presidential Debates

The Juggler

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Gonna be over a lot sooner than many of us thought. 

Funny to see Tulsi still there. 

JimmyV

It's already over. 

The Juggler

JimmyV said:

It's already over. 

Yeah pretty much. The only state Bernie is projected to win coming up is Washington.

If Biden crushes him next week and the crushes him in Florida the next week, game, set, match. 

mrussel1

The Juggler said:

JimmyV said:

It's already over. 

Yeah pretty much. The only state Bernie is projected to win coming up is Washington.

If Biden crushes him next week and the crushes him in Florida the next week, game, set, match. 

I'll go further, Bernie needs a decisive Michigan win next week.  You have to think Biden wins FL MS and GA pretty cleanly.  So a close loss or win for Biden in Michigan could be lights out.  States after that are like MO, MD, and even PA.  These are great states for Joe.

Spiritual_Chaos

JimmyV said:

It's already over. 

JimmyV

The horse race doesn't matter. Biden is going to be the nominee. Bernie's candidacy is over. Dems getting buyer's remorse as these primaries march on might not be the worst case scenario but it would be a bad one. . 

Spiritual_Chaos

Biden should give Bernie the VP slot just for the heck of it. 

CM189191

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Biden should give Bernie the VP slot just for the heck of it. 

no

Ledbetterman10

JimmyV said:

The horse race doesn't matter. Biden is going to be the nominee. Bernie's candidacy is over. Dems getting buyer's remorse as these primaries march on might not be the worst case scenario but it would be a bad one. . 

It's just such a sad system that of all those people that declared themselves to be candidates, the one that's going to emerge has failed in two presidential runs, and is showing major signs of decline. Even sadder is that despite that, he probably does have the best chance to beat Trump. 

It seems like the two best ways to become a major party nominee during my lifetime is to be a master politician like Bill Clinton, Obama, and Trump, or to simply hang around for a very long time like Dole, Kerry, McCain, and Hillary. And unfortunately, Biden falls into the second category. Here's hoping he gets a better outcome that than those four did. 

JimmyV

Ledbetterman10 said:

JimmyV said:

The horse race doesn't matter. Biden is going to be the nominee. Bernie's candidacy is over. Dems getting buyer's remorse as these primaries march on might not be the worst case scenario but it would be a bad one. . 

It's just such a sad system that of all those people that declared themselves to be candidates, the one that's going to emerge has failed in two presidential runs, and is showing major signs of decline. Even sadder is that despite that, he probably does have the best chance to beat Trump. 

It seems like the two best ways to become a major party nominee during my lifetime is to be a master politician like Bill Clinton, Obama, and Trump, or to simply hang around for a very long time like Dole, Kerry, McCain, and Hillary. And unfortunately, Biden falls into the second category. Here's hoping he gets a better outcome that than those four did. 

Yeah, I don't know how to fix it but it does feel increasingly like our primary system is one more in a series that is beginning to fail. 

Spiritual_Chaos

CM189191 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Biden should give Bernie the VP slot just for the heck of it. 

no

no, "yes".

CM189191

JimmyV said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

JimmyV said:

The horse race doesn't matter. Biden is going to be the nominee. Bernie's candidacy is over. Dems getting buyer's remorse as these primaries march on might not be the worst case scenario but it would be a bad one. . 

It's just such a sad system that of all those people that declared themselves to be candidates, the one that's going to emerge has failed in two presidential runs, and is showing major signs of decline. Even sadder is that despite that, he probably does have the best chance to beat Trump. 

It seems like the two best ways to become a major party nominee during my lifetime is to be a master politician like Bill Clinton, Obama, and Trump, or to simply hang around for a very long time like Dole, Kerry, McCain, and Hillary. And unfortunately, Biden falls into the second category. Here's hoping he gets a better outcome that than those four did. 

Yeah, I don't know how to fix it but it does feel increasingly like our primary system is one more in a series that is beginning to fail. 

it's seems easy to blame the system

but voters only have a voice if they actually show up to vote

mrussel1

^Yep!  Can't argue with the data.  

Plus, we can't sit around and expect every cycle we're going to have an FDR, JFK, Obama, Clinton.. they are once in a generation at best.  After that, we should hope for a candidate that is competent, empathetic, and represents our values.  I'd love if we had an Obama every time, but it's not reality. The R's had Reagan, and now a generation later they have Trump...for better or worse. 

pjl44

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Biden should give Bernie the VP slot just for the heck of it. 

JimmyV

CM189191 said:

JimmyV said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

JimmyV said:

The horse race doesn't matter. Biden is going to be the nominee. Bernie's candidacy is over. Dems getting buyer's remorse as these primaries march on might not be the worst case scenario but it would be a bad one. . 

It's just such a sad system that of all those people that declared themselves to be candidates, the one that's going to emerge has failed in two presidential runs, and is showing major signs of decline. Even sadder is that despite that, he probably does have the best chance to beat Trump. 

It seems like the two best ways to become a major party nominee during my lifetime is to be a master politician like Bill Clinton, Obama, and Trump, or to simply hang around for a very long time like Dole, Kerry, McCain, and Hillary. And unfortunately, Biden falls into the second category. Here's hoping he gets a better outcome that than those four did. 

Yeah, I don't know how to fix it but it does feel increasingly like our primary system is one more in a series that is beginning to fail. 

it's seems easy to blame the system

but voters only have a voice if they actually show up to vote

Voter turnout will never not be a problem. At least not in our lifetimes. But inspired people will show up more readily than uninspired. The system these last two cycles has done a crap job of producing inspiring candidates. 

Spiritual_Chaos

Real life.

https://twitter.com/RepKenBuck/status/1235944686910660609?s=20

Ledbetterman10

mrussel1 said:

^Yep!  Can't argue with the data.  

Plus, we can't sit around and expect every cycle we're going to have an FDR, JFK, Obama, Clinton.. they are once in a generation at best.  After that, we should hope for a candidate that is competent, empathetic, and represents our values.  I'd love if we had an Obama every time, but it's not reality. The R's had Reagan, and now a generation later they have Trump...for better or worse. 

Yeah but don't ya feel there's a "glass ceiling" so to speak that someone like an Andrew Yang (for example) simply can't possibly break through when there's a Biden in the race? I get what you're saying about those Obama-types not coming around too often. They could break through. I just wish you didn't have to be an Obama-type to break through the "established" candidates. 

Ledbetterman10

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Real life.

https://twitter.com/RepKenBuck/status/1235944686910660609?s=20

Talk about a dumb thing to say. But in somewhat of the same token, I haven't seen a single post on this board about Chuck Schumer leading an angry mob outside the Supreme Court and making threats. That's strange. 

JimmyV

mrussel1 said:

^Yep!  Can't argue with the data.  

Plus, we can't sit around and expect every cycle we're going to have an FDR, JFK, Obama, Clinton.. they are once in a generation at best.  After that, we should hope for a candidate that is competent, empathetic, and represents our values.  I'd love if we had an Obama every time, but it's not reality. The R's had Reagan, and now a generation later they have Trump...for better or worse. 

Republicans had three terms of George Bushes in between Reagan and Trump. 

mrussel1

Ledbetterman10 said:

mrussel1 said:

^Yep!  Can't argue with the data.  

Plus, we can't sit around and expect every cycle we're going to have an FDR, JFK, Obama, Clinton.. they are once in a generation at best.  After that, we should hope for a candidate that is competent, empathetic, and represents our values.  I'd love if we had an Obama every time, but it's not reality. The R's had Reagan, and now a generation later they have Trump...for better or worse. 

Yeah but don't ya feel there's a "glass ceiling" so to speak that someone like an Andrew Yang (for example) simply can't possibly break through when there's a Biden in the race? I get what you're saying about those Obama-types not coming around too often. They could break through. I just wish you didn't have to be an Obama-type to break through the "established" candidates. 

No offense to Yang, but his policies were a real problem.  UBI is a non-starter for the vast majority of Americans, even me.  He also needs charisma.  I thought it was mildly interesting, but certainly not charismatic.  If you're not charismatic, and your policies are meh, why wouldn't the average Democrat go with the person they've watched for decades, saw as VP, etc.?  It's perfectly rational.  Obama put it all together, good policies, charisma, youth, energy, once in a lifetime.  Yang isn't in the same ballpark