Swedish climate activist Greta Thunberg on cover of TIME

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Comments

  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813
    edited June 25
    I’m not a denier of climate change, 
    My favorite part of the whole thing is how we have data to study that is what, like 150 years in duration? We have no idea what we’re talking about, and the earth may have gone through more radical changes a million times before yet we’re so smart that we need to cower and assume it’s all over and that we’re horrible people.
    "I'm not a climate change denier, but let me push the right winged climate change deniers talking point of scientists not knowing anything and climate is always changing" 

    All things seem to point to you being a climate change denier. To the surprise of no one. 

    Or is the "what does it matters, nothing can be done anyways!" the next step after not being able to deny anymore but still not having to admit how fucking wrong the right has chosen to be on the issue?

    My guess is that you have been disregarding/denying climate change before(?) - if that is correct, how long ago was it that you had to admit to yourself that climate change is a thing? Even if you can't admit it fully because... scientists didn't live two million years ago. 

    My guess is, you are choosing to be shitty on the issue no matter how plain it is because you are stuck with:




    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 35,162
    Willful ignorance is a trait common among Trump supporters and climate change deniers. 

    And it's getting us closer and closer to this every day:



    chinese-happy.jpg
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 7,312
    PJ_Soul said:
    There are other ways to give the speeches without physically being there...perhaps these environmental lobbies should try that... 

    Or maybe before we keep have these so-called necessary meetings...they should have to at least prove they are meeting the Paris Targets...which most will never meet...
    Greta and others doing speeches > Meltdown doing, what I guess is, nothing
    Damn right.  As I type this I got my hummer running, for no reason other than I might need a coffee and I want the air running. It's a comfortable 73, outside, I got the air running full speed ahead, I cut six trees down for no other reason than to have a campfire, I let helium-filled balloons fly every night...basically, I am a realist, planet earth is past the point of no return...and so what...the human race needs to go extinct...
    It's the animals I'm concerned about. I agree we're past the point of no return for people, and there is no way in hell we're going to be able to change fast enough maintain things for ourselves, but we can still work our asses off to try and minimize the damage going forward in order to prevent yet more plant and animal species from being killed off than the huge number that already will be. Even if we make too much of the Earth inhabitable for ourselves, we still want to do our best not to leave the planet a grey, smoking disaster before we're gone. Also, humans aren't going extinct any time soon because of climate change - barring total nuclear annihilation or a massive asteroid impact we've still got a long ways to go. So in the meantime, probably better to do our best to keep shit as bearable as possible.
    Yes, the animals should be a concern...but the loss of habitat due to overpopulation is a problem...the one area David Suzuki and I agree, Canada is full...people in Asia can move North of them if things get that bad, same as middle eastern people...why do you want to allow millions in as climate illegal border hoppers, just to speed up the destruction of our habitat...and I also do no want Euro's immigrating here...I want people to stay where they are from and fix their problems, not come here and add to the problems...I also do not care about the economic benefits immigrants bring...I have travelled a great deal of this country, I know how harsh our winters are in much of the country, most immigrants will settle in Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver etc...they will just contribute to the urban sprawl...


  • RYMERYME Wisconsin Posts: 1,560
    PJ_Soul said:
    There are other ways to give the speeches without physically being there...perhaps these environmental lobbies should try that... 

    Or maybe before we keep have these so-called necessary meetings...they should have to at least prove they are meeting the Paris Targets...which most will never meet...
    Greta and others doing speeches > Meltdown doing, what I guess is, nothing
    Damn right.  As I type this I got my hummer running, for no reason other than I might need a coffee and I want the air running. It's a comfortable 73, outside, I got the air running full speed ahead, I cut six trees down for no other reason than to have a campfire, I let helium-filled balloons fly every night...basically, I am a realist, planet earth is past the point of no return...and so what...the human race needs to go extinct...
    It's the animals I'm concerned about. I agree we're past the point of no return for people, and there is no way in hell we're going to be able to change fast enough maintain things for ourselves, but we can still work our asses off to try and minimize the damage going forward in order to prevent yet more plant and animal species from being killed off than the huge number that already will be. Even if we make too much of the Earth inhabitable for ourselves, we still want to do our best not to leave the planet a grey, smoking disaster before we're gone. Also, humans aren't going extinct any time soon because of climate change - barring total nuclear annihilation or a massive asteroid impact we've still got a long ways to go. So in the meantime, probably better to do our best to keep shit as bearable as possible.
    Yes, the animals should be a concern...but the loss of habitat due to overpopulation is a problem...the one area David Suzuki and I agree, Canada is full...people in Asia can move North of them if things get that bad, same as middle eastern people...why do you want to allow millions in as climate illegal border hoppers, just to speed up the destruction of our habitat...and I also do no want Euro's immigrating here...I want people to stay where they are from and fix their problems, not come here and add to the problems...I also do not care about the economic benefits immigrants bring...I have travelled a great deal of this country, I know how harsh our winters are in much of the country, most immigrants will settle in Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver etc...they will just contribute to the urban sprawl...



  • benjsbenjs Toronto, ONPosts: 7,943
    PJ_Soul said:
    There are other ways to give the speeches without physically being there...perhaps these environmental lobbies should try that... 

    Or maybe before we keep have these so-called necessary meetings...they should have to at least prove they are meeting the Paris Targets...which most will never meet...
    Greta and others doing speeches > Meltdown doing, what I guess is, nothing
    Damn right.  As I type this I got my hummer running, for no reason other than I might need a coffee and I want the air running. It's a comfortable 73, outside, I got the air running full speed ahead, I cut six trees down for no other reason than to have a campfire, I let helium-filled balloons fly every night...basically, I am a realist, planet earth is past the point of no return...and so what...the human race needs to go extinct...
    It's the animals I'm concerned about. I agree we're past the point of no return for people, and there is no way in hell we're going to be able to change fast enough maintain things for ourselves, but we can still work our asses off to try and minimize the damage going forward in order to prevent yet more plant and animal species from being killed off than the huge number that already will be. Even if we make too much of the Earth inhabitable for ourselves, we still want to do our best not to leave the planet a grey, smoking disaster before we're gone. Also, humans aren't going extinct any time soon because of climate change - barring total nuclear annihilation or a massive asteroid impact we've still got a long ways to go. So in the meantime, probably better to do our best to keep shit as bearable as possible.
    Yes, the animals should be a concern...but the loss of habitat due to overpopulation is a problem...the one area David Suzuki and I agree, Canada is full...people in Asia can move North of them if things get that bad, same as middle eastern people...why do you want to allow millions in as climate illegal border hoppers, just to speed up the destruction of our habitat...and I also do no want Euro's immigrating here...I want people to stay where they are from and fix their problems, not come here and add to the problems...I also do not care about the economic benefits immigrants bring...I have travelled a great deal of this country, I know how harsh our winters are in much of the country, most immigrants will settle in Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver etc...they will just contribute to the urban sprawl...


    I'm not sure 'allowing millions in' is something PJ_Soul even alluded to (unless I missed something), so I'm not sure where your comment is coming from. With that said, our (Canada's) population would be in rapid decline if not for immigrants. If there's a way to mandate populating our rural areas, I'd be all for it. You're right that the concern is immigrants settling in our already overpopulated metropolitan cities. 
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813



    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907



    Ohhhhh Mike, really?  Please tell me this was photo-shopped by some right-wing nut case.
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 47,921
    edited June 26
    benjs said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    There are other ways to give the speeches without physically being there...perhaps these environmental lobbies should try that... 

    Or maybe before we keep have these so-called necessary meetings...they should have to at least prove they are meeting the Paris Targets...which most will never meet...
    Greta and others doing speeches > Meltdown doing, what I guess is, nothing
    Damn right.  As I type this I got my hummer running, for no reason other than I might need a coffee and I want the air running. It's a comfortable 73, outside, I got the air running full speed ahead, I cut six trees down for no other reason than to have a campfire, I let helium-filled balloons fly every night...basically, I am a realist, planet earth is past the point of no return...and so what...the human race needs to go extinct...
    It's the animals I'm concerned about. I agree we're past the point of no return for people, and there is no way in hell we're going to be able to change fast enough maintain things for ourselves, but we can still work our asses off to try and minimize the damage going forward in order to prevent yet more plant and animal species from being killed off than the huge number that already will be. Even if we make too much of the Earth inhabitable for ourselves, we still want to do our best not to leave the planet a grey, smoking disaster before we're gone. Also, humans aren't going extinct any time soon because of climate change - barring total nuclear annihilation or a massive asteroid impact we've still got a long ways to go. So in the meantime, probably better to do our best to keep shit as bearable as possible.
    Yes, the animals should be a concern...but the loss of habitat due to overpopulation is a problem...the one area David Suzuki and I agree, Canada is full...people in Asia can move North of them if things get that bad, same as middle eastern people...why do you want to allow millions in as climate illegal border hoppers, just to speed up the destruction of our habitat...and I also do no want Euro's immigrating here...I want people to stay where they are from and fix their problems, not come here and add to the problems...I also do not care about the economic benefits immigrants bring...I have travelled a great deal of this country, I know how harsh our winters are in much of the country, most immigrants will settle in Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver etc...they will just contribute to the urban sprawl...


    I'm not sure 'allowing millions in' is something PJ_Soul even alluded to (unless I missed something), so I'm not sure where your comment is coming from. With that said, our (Canada's) population would be in rapid decline if not for immigrants. If there's a way to mandate populating our rural areas, I'd be all for it. You're right that the concern is immigrants settling in our already overpopulated metropolitan cities. 
    You're right, I did not allude to "wanting to allow millions in as climate illegal border hoppers, just to speed up the destruction of our habitat" at all. And the fact that more immigrants/migrants will flock to the cities and create overpopulation in them is one of the reasons I already gave for considering moving out of one of them and high tailing it to Newfoundland.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 7,312
    PJ_Soul said:
    benjs said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    There are other ways to give the speeches without physically being there...perhaps these environmental lobbies should try that... 

    Or maybe before we keep have these so-called necessary meetings...they should have to at least prove they are meeting the Paris Targets...which most will never meet...
    Greta and others doing speeches > Meltdown doing, what I guess is, nothing
    Damn right.  As I type this I got my hummer running, for no reason other than I might need a coffee and I want the air running. It's a comfortable 73, outside, I got the air running full speed ahead, I cut six trees down for no other reason than to have a campfire, I let helium-filled balloons fly every night...basically, I am a realist, planet earth is past the point of no return...and so what...the human race needs to go extinct...
    It's the animals I'm concerned about. I agree we're past the point of no return for people, and there is no way in hell we're going to be able to change fast enough maintain things for ourselves, but we can still work our asses off to try and minimize the damage going forward in order to prevent yet more plant and animal species from being killed off than the huge number that already will be. Even if we make too much of the Earth inhabitable for ourselves, we still want to do our best not to leave the planet a grey, smoking disaster before we're gone. Also, humans aren't going extinct any time soon because of climate change - barring total nuclear annihilation or a massive asteroid impact we've still got a long ways to go. So in the meantime, probably better to do our best to keep shit as bearable as possible.
    Yes, the animals should be a concern...but the loss of habitat due to overpopulation is a problem...the one area David Suzuki and I agree, Canada is full...people in Asia can move North of them if things get that bad, same as middle eastern people...why do you want to allow millions in as climate illegal border hoppers, just to speed up the destruction of our habitat...and I also do no want Euro's immigrating here...I want people to stay where they are from and fix their problems, not come here and add to the problems...I also do not care about the economic benefits immigrants bring...I have travelled a great deal of this country, I know how harsh our winters are in much of the country, most immigrants will settle in Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver etc...they will just contribute to the urban sprawl...


    I'm not sure 'allowing millions in' is something PJ_Soul even alluded to (unless I missed something), so I'm not sure where your comment is coming from. With that said, our (Canada's) population would be in rapid decline if not for immigrants. If there's a way to mandate populating our rural areas, I'd be all for it. You're right that the concern is immigrants settling in our already overpopulated metropolitan cities. 
    You're right, I did not allude to "wanting to allow millions in as climate illegal border hoppers, just to speed up the destruction of our habitat" at all. And the fact that more immigrants/migrants will flock to the cities and create overpopulation in them is one of the reasons I already gave for considering moving out of one of them and high tailing it to Newfoundland.
    You are certainly free to live where you choose...Newfoundland seems a little extreme.  I worked with a school teacher from Newfoundland, and has since moved back...something to consider...as he puts, Newfoundland has 2 seasons, winter and August 23rd...

    You are the one that was pushing these Syrian Refugees...many who have 7 and 8 kids...
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813

    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813
    Greta got a shout out at Eddies Dusseldorf show and ”I wont back down” was dedicated to her. 
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907
    Greta got a shout out at Eddies Dusseldorf show and ”I wont back down” was dedicated to her. 
    Nice!
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    That little boat!  I hope she doesn't get sea sick. 
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813
    edited July 30
    brianlux said:
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    That little boat!  I hope she doesn't get sea sick. 
    Haha. Thought the same.

    Re-read the AOC/Greta talk also. Inspiring.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907
    brianlux said:
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    That little boat!  I hope she doesn't get sea sick. 
    Haha. Thought the same.

    Re-read the AOC/Greta talk also. Inspiring.
    Yeah, I like that interview.  AOC is a little big for her britches sometimes, but with a little luck she will find a little more humility and eventually deserve her desired standing.  Greta is just amazing.  No ego, no bullshit, a great mind and a massive amount of courage.
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • benjsbenjs Toronto, ONPosts: 7,943
    brianlux said:
    brianlux said:
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    That little boat!  I hope she doesn't get sea sick. 
    Haha. Thought the same.

    Re-read the AOC/Greta talk also. Inspiring.
    Yeah, I like that interview.  AOC is a little big for her britches sometimes, but with a little luck she will find a little more humility and eventually deserve her desired standing.  Greta is just amazing.  No ego, no bullshit, a great mind and a massive amount of courage.
    I love the 'bigness' of AOC's personality, she's got megaphone-like characteristics that I think will continue to serve her well when she couples it with authenticity like she does. 
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907
    benjs said:
    brianlux said:
    brianlux said:
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    That little boat!  I hope she doesn't get sea sick. 
    Haha. Thought the same.

    Re-read the AOC/Greta talk also. Inspiring.
    Yeah, I like that interview.  AOC is a little big for her britches sometimes, but with a little luck she will find a little more humility and eventually deserve her desired standing.  Greta is just amazing.  No ego, no bullshit, a great mind and a massive amount of courage.
    I love the 'bigness' of AOC's personality, she's got megaphone-like characteristics that I think will continue to serve her well when she couples it with authenticity like she does. 
    I think if all the attention doesn't go to her head and she keeps focused, she could be great.  I guess I'm just naturally cautious in my optimism with pretty much anyone in the political arena these days.  The potential is there though, that's for sure. 
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813
    benjs said:
    brianlux said:
    brianlux said:
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    That little boat!  I hope she doesn't get sea sick. 
    Haha. Thought the same.

    Re-read the AOC/Greta talk also. Inspiring.
    Yeah, I like that interview.  AOC is a little big for her britches sometimes, but with a little luck she will find a little more humility and eventually deserve her desired standing.  Greta is just amazing.  No ego, no bullshit, a great mind and a massive amount of courage.
    I love the 'bigness' of AOC's personality, she's got megaphone-like characteristics that I think will continue to serve her well when she couples it with authenticity like she does. 
    brianlux said:
    benjs said:
    brianlux said:
    brianlux said:
    She will sail to New York.



    From DN:
    - We still have a window of time when things are in our own hands - but that window is closing fast. That's why I've decided to make this trip now. Over the past year, millions of young people have raised their voices to wake up world leaders and see the climate crisis. In the coming months, in New York and Santiago, it will prove whether they have listened, she writes.
    That little boat!  I hope she doesn't get sea sick. 
    Haha. Thought the same.

    Re-read the AOC/Greta talk also. Inspiring.
    Yeah, I like that interview.  AOC is a little big for her britches sometimes, but with a little luck she will find a little more humility and eventually deserve her desired standing.  Greta is just amazing.  No ego, no bullshit, a great mind and a massive amount of courage.
    I love the 'bigness' of AOC's personality, she's got megaphone-like characteristics that I think will continue to serve her well when she couples it with authenticity like she does. 
    I think if all the attention doesn't go to her head and she keeps focused, she could be great.  I guess I'm just naturally cautious in my optimism with pretty much anyone in the political arena these days.  The potential is there though, that's for sure. 
    The problem with idealistic young people in politics is that the system will turn them into politicians. Hopefully AOC can survive it!
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813


    Presidential candidate Jay Inslee commends on the Swedish climate activist Greta Thunberg.

    In connection with the Democrats' debate in Detroit, he pointed out that Thunberg is the obvious Nobel laureate.

    "To me, she is the most inspiring person in the world right now," he says.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907


    Presidential candidate Jay Inslee commends on the Swedish climate activist Greta Thunberg.

    In connection with the Democrats' debate in Detroit, he pointed out that Thunberg is the obvious Nobel laureate.

    "To me, she is the most inspiring person in the world right now," he says.
    That would be great!
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813

    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,813

    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907

    Very cool that she got that ride.
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 14,208
    edited August 20
    the right winger, climate deniers hate her here in Australia 

    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,907
    the right winger, climate deniers hate her here in Australia 

    That sucks.  Probably here as well.
    “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.”
    -Aldous Huxley
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.









  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 14,208
    brianlux said:
    the right winger, climate deniers hate her here in Australia 

    That sucks.  Probably here as well.
    All I see is nasty comments about her by grown men, bullying a child. 
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
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