So this “Byrd Rule” has only been around since the 80’s and was sponsored by known former white supremecist leader Robert Byrd, and this is the excuse for why poor people can’t make 30k a year...hmmm it’s almost like southern racists and “former” racists have too much power.
Scio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,802
edited February 2021
while it means good things cant be forced through reconciliation it also means really shitty stuff cant either.
Biden knew his bill needed to pass with cooperation to get that piece included.
Since he's receiving pushback , reconciliation it is, minus a good thing. perhaps it gets included in a must pass spending bill....
or more modestly to 12, THEN bumped further up later. take what you can when you can.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
You really made a point in favor of Medicare for all and broader access to assistance and universal programs in general. The fact that people could make $15 and hour and still be left behind in our country is shameful.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
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Options
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,734
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
Totally agree.
A living wage needs to be aligned with cost of living according to where you live. I know we talked about this and it would be a lot of work, but the government employees are already in place, many of them with little to do. It could be done.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,802
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
most assistance based off of 2 or 3 times poverty level
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/average-rent-by-state I can attest to the fact that living in New Mexico as a single person making 30,000 with average rent cost of less than 900 is pretty much awful. Thank Hof those days are over. That being said a minimum of 30,000 a year is barely enough to survive in 2021 I’m sure.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
When I was single and 23 making $15/hr. was like being rich, but no way I could afford to provide for a family of 4 on that. I lived in a studio apt. that was $550/mo and my utilities amounted to less than $20 every month. With 2 parents working FT at that you could live a pretty decent life if your kids were school age and you didn't need to have childcare sucked out every month.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
most assistance based off of 2 or 3 times poverty level
If you make $45 a year and don't have a family you aren't getting assistance. If you have a family then yes you will.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
Yep. It’s not pretty and I don’t think many people are just how little 30k a year is
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
Yep. It’s not pretty and I don’t think many people are just how little 30k a year is
If you rent a room I can see this working and things hopefully get better. If you have a family? Forget it.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
Don't full time employees, even minimum wage, get health benefits?
I never said it was an easy or luxurious way to live. But that is why so many people in their 20s in LA and NYC live with room mates. I lived in LA until I was 30, I had just a few friends without room mates. TV, internet, cell phones aren't a right, many apartments include rent. So your utility bill could be 0, or at the least split 2 or 3 ways with room mates. Ramen is not the cheapest way to eat. Chicken at $1.97/lb is super cheap. Make variaties with chicken and rice and you can eat for less than Ramen. Smoking and drinking isn't a right. If you can't afford it, don't do it. There's a reason I didn't go out drinking in my 20s when I lived in LA, I couldn't afford it on a teacher's salary. You'd probably have a clunker of a car with no collision insurance. Your taxes seemed high to me. Did a tax estimate and got about $2400 in taxes for 30k. https://us.icalculator.info/salary-illustration/30000.html That include SSN and medicare, etc. Still it all was less than 5k taken out of their pay.
I'm not saying this is a life I'd want for everyone, but it is livable. I was living in San Diego when I did my student teaching, probably made 20k that year working part time outside of school/work. I had 2 room mates, had internet but no TV, pretty much never ate out, never went out drinking. Only cigars I smoked were what my dad gave me. Had an old car that probably wasn;t even work $2,000 (The old blue with fake wood minivan, what they drive in Malcom in the Middle). 31k for middle of nowhere is definitely livable for some guy in his 20s trying to make something. Wouldnt make it supporting any kids though.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
Don't full time employees, even minimum wage, get health benefits?
I never said it was an easy or luxurious way to live. But that is why so many people in their 20s in LA and NYC live with room mates. I lived in LA until I was 30, I had just a few friends without room mates. TV, internet, cell phones aren't a right, many apartments include rent. So your utility bill could be 0, or at the least split 2 or 3 ways with room mates. Ramen is not the cheapest way to eat. Chicken at $1.97/lb is super cheap. Make variaties with chicken and rice and you can eat for less than Ramen. Smoking and drinking isn't a right. If you can't afford it, don't do it. There's a reason I didn't go out drinking in my 20s when I lived in LA, I couldn't afford it on a teacher's salary. You'd probably have a clunker of a car with no collision insurance. Your taxes seemed high to me. Did a tax estimate and got about $2400 in taxes for 30k. https://us.icalculator.info/salary-illustration/30000.html That include SSN and medicare, etc. Still it all was less than 5k taken out of their pay.
I'm not saying this is a life I'd want for everyone, but it is livable. I was living in San Diego when I did my student teaching, probably made 20k that year working part time outside of school/work. I had 2 room mates, had internet but no TV, pretty much never ate out, never went out drinking. Only cigars I smoked were what my dad gave me. Had an old car that probably wasn;t even work $2,000 (The old blue with fake wood minivan, what they drive in Malcom in the Middle). 31k for middle of nowhere is definitely livable for some guy in his 20s trying to make something. Wouldnt make it supporting any kids though.
Employees pay a portion to have benefits, employers are required to offer but not foot the entire bill. Usually the lower wage the crappier benefits in my experience. Expect anywhere from 150-200 per check for employee cost.
Getting into apartments. You are gonna be living in some real shitholes at the 30k a year price point.
Obviously I’m not a party to the fun isn’t a right argument. People are born here and die here everyone is entitled to dignity and a life better than hardly getting by.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
Don't full time employees, even minimum wage, get health benefits?
I never said it was an easy or luxurious way to live. But that is why so many people in their 20s in LA and NYC live with room mates. I lived in LA until I was 30, I had just a few friends without room mates. TV, internet, cell phones aren't a right, many apartments include rent. So your utility bill could be 0, or at the least split 2 or 3 ways with room mates. Ramen is not the cheapest way to eat. Chicken at $1.97/lb is super cheap. Make variaties with chicken and rice and you can eat for less than Ramen. Smoking and drinking isn't a right. If you can't afford it, don't do it. There's a reason I didn't go out drinking in my 20s when I lived in LA, I couldn't afford it on a teacher's salary. You'd probably have a clunker of a car with no collision insurance. Your taxes seemed high to me. Did a tax estimate and got about $2400 in taxes for 30k. https://us.icalculator.info/salary-illustration/30000.html That include SSN and medicare, etc. Still it all was less than 5k taken out of their pay.
I'm not saying this is a life I'd want for everyone, but it is livable. I was living in San Diego when I did my student teaching, probably made 20k that year working part time outside of school/work. I had 2 room mates, had internet but no TV, pretty much never ate out, never went out drinking. Only cigars I smoked were what my dad gave me. Had an old car that probably wasn;t even work $2,000 (The old blue with fake wood minivan, what they drive in Malcom in the Middle). 31k for middle of nowhere is definitely livable for some guy in his 20s trying to make something. Wouldnt make it supporting any kids though.
Amazing how little tax gets taken out. I’m taxed at 33% I think...
I forgot to add a cell phone bill. Who doesn’t have one now?
Also if the company has over 50 employees they must offer health insurance.
So now lets get to the heart of the argument again as you said you did this when you were in your 20’s. That’s great but this isn’t looking to help that type of person. This is trying to help the person that this is THEIR life. They don’t have roommates, they have kids and a wife and most likely need a car. Oh yeah and I forgot clothes...
Look a young person might be able to hang but a family? Hell no.
So I have 2 problems with this. Too many careers at minimum wages and it’s not enough for a real living wage.
It is a start though. It brought up the discussion and it brought out dialogue so maybe we can figure this out.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
Don't full time employees, even minimum wage, get health benefits?
I never said it was an easy or luxurious way to live. But that is why so many people in their 20s in LA and NYC live with room mates. I lived in LA until I was 30, I had just a few friends without room mates. TV, internet, cell phones aren't a right, many apartments include rent. So your utility bill could be 0, or at the least split 2 or 3 ways with room mates. Ramen is not the cheapest way to eat. Chicken at $1.97/lb is super cheap. Make variaties with chicken and rice and you can eat for less than Ramen. Smoking and drinking isn't a right. If you can't afford it, don't do it. There's a reason I didn't go out drinking in my 20s when I lived in LA, I couldn't afford it on a teacher's salary. You'd probably have a clunker of a car with no collision insurance. Your taxes seemed high to me. Did a tax estimate and got about $2400 in taxes for 30k. https://us.icalculator.info/salary-illustration/30000.html That include SSN and medicare, etc. Still it all was less than 5k taken out of their pay.
I'm not saying this is a life I'd want for everyone, but it is livable. I was living in San Diego when I did my student teaching, probably made 20k that year working part time outside of school/work. I had 2 room mates, had internet but no TV, pretty much never ate out, never went out drinking. Only cigars I smoked were what my dad gave me. Had an old car that probably wasn;t even work $2,000 (The old blue with fake wood minivan, what they drive in Malcom in the Middle). 31k for middle of nowhere is definitely livable for some guy in his 20s trying to make something. Wouldnt make it supporting any kids though.
Employees pay a portion to have benefits, employers are required to offer but not foot the entire bill. Usually the lower wage the crappier benefits in my experience. Expect anywhere from 150-200 per check for employee cost.
Getting into apartments. You are gonna be living in some real shitholes at the 30k a year price point.
Obviously I’m not a party to the fun isn’t a right argument. People are born here and die here everyone is entitled to dignity and a life better than hardly getting by.
You wouldn’t be stuck in a terrible apartment at that price. Depends where and what your standards are. If you don’t kind room mates you could actually get a nice apartment in Santa Monica within walking distance to the beach. If you can’t stand room mates, then yeah it’s be tough to find something good. Some parts of the country you can buy a 1500 square foot house and have a mortgage of $600. Go to nowhere Mississippi and buy a house for 120k, maybe a little outdated but nothing wrong with it. 31k isn’t poverty level.
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
Excellent question. This article seems to address some of that stating, "But because of improved incomes if the Raise the Wage Act were passed,
many workers and their families would no longer qualify for or need
public assistance programs, hence reducing the total government
expenditures on these programs."
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600 $600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
As head of a family, I couldn't live off that. If I was 25 and single, I could. I wouldn't be traveling to see Pearl Jam or going out to eat very often. But someone single, in a state where rent is under $1000, that is very doable. Not saying I would want to or don't feel for people who do and struggle. But 31k in nowhere USA is probably like making 60k in LA where a studio apartment can be $1500 a month.
You could afford heath insurance and a car too? Nope.
$31,000 salary Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680 $22,360 rent 700 x 12= 8400 $13,960 Utilities $200 x 12=$2400 $11,560 Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200 $6360 I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3. Do you smoke? Do you drink? If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year. So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
Don't full time employees, even minimum wage, get health benefits?
I never said it was an easy or luxurious way to live. But that is why so many people in their 20s in LA and NYC live with room mates. I lived in LA until I was 30, I had just a few friends without room mates. TV, internet, cell phones aren't a right, many apartments include rent. So your utility bill could be 0, or at the least split 2 or 3 ways with room mates. Ramen is not the cheapest way to eat. Chicken at $1.97/lb is super cheap. Make variaties with chicken and rice and you can eat for less than Ramen. Smoking and drinking isn't a right. If you can't afford it, don't do it. There's a reason I didn't go out drinking in my 20s when I lived in LA, I couldn't afford it on a teacher's salary. You'd probably have a clunker of a car with no collision insurance. Your taxes seemed high to me. Did a tax estimate and got about $2400 in taxes for 30k. https://us.icalculator.info/salary-illustration/30000.html That include SSN and medicare, etc. Still it all was less than 5k taken out of their pay.
I'm not saying this is a life I'd want for everyone, but it is livable. I was living in San Diego when I did my student teaching, probably made 20k that year working part time outside of school/work. I had 2 room mates, had internet but no TV, pretty much never ate out, never went out drinking. Only cigars I smoked were what my dad gave me. Had an old car that probably wasn;t even work $2,000 (The old blue with fake wood minivan, what they drive in Malcom in the Middle). 31k for middle of nowhere is definitely livable for some guy in his 20s trying to make something. Wouldnt make it supporting any kids though.
Amazing how little tax gets taken out. I’m taxed at 33% I think...
I forgot to add a cell phone bill. Who doesn’t have one now?
Also if the company has over 50 employees they must offer health insurance.
So now lets get to the heart of the argument again as you said you did this when you were in your 20’s. That’s great but this isn’t looking to help that type of person. This is trying to help the person that this is THEIR life. They don’t have roommates, they have kids and a wife and most likely need a car. Oh yeah and I forgot clothes...
Look a young person might be able to hang but a family? Hell no.
So I have 2 problems with this. Too many careers at minimum wages and it’s not enough for a real living wage.
It is a start though. It brought up the discussion and it brought out dialogue so maybe we can figure this out.
I agree. My point was 31k isn’t that bad for everyone. I did it out of college, so did hundreds of thousands of others. It was fine. I couldn’t do it now with a family. I also think some people don’t know how to struggle. At some point in the last 20 years a cell phone went from a luxury to a necessity. Same with Internet and cable TV. And in this conversation even going out drinking is required to have dignity in life. Those things are all nice. None are a necessity. None are required to live a life of dignity. 31k is manageable if you’re just starting out of college. It is not for a family or a single mom.
Is it just me or did democrats just kill $15/hr in favor of keeping procedural measures in place that were installed largely to benefit racist southern policies of yesteryear?
Scio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,802
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,802
the entire fucking system was set up by racists. get the fuck over it
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
the entire fucking system was set up by racists. get the fuck over it
Or address and make systemic attempts to heal the wound instead of continuing to let it fester and infect a nation?
Did you just “get the fuck over” your alcoholism? Or does that require continuous and systemic changes, sometimes uncomfortable ones, to perpetuate a state of healing and a sense of well being?
It’s not just the minimum wage either, what happens when all of the things Biden and democrats campaigned on get overruled by the Byrd rule and a fear of abolishing the filibuster? At least the new administration will be free to drop bombs.
Scio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,734
It’s not just the minimum wage either, what happens when all of the things Biden and democrats campaigned on get overruled by the Byrd rule and a fear of abolishing the filibuster? At least the new administration will be free to drop bombs.
This reminds me that, because of the way power and ruling work, if I expect to be mostly happy with ANY president and administration I am only fooling myself and am going to be disappointed. I am far more satisfied having a Biden administration that I ever was having a Trump administration, but I will always be far from fully satisfied with the Biden administration and will be critical of it. As we all should be.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
It’s not just the minimum wage either, what happens when all of the things Biden and democrats campaigned on get overruled by the Byrd rule and a fear of abolishing the filibuster? At least the new administration will be free to drop bombs.
This reminds me that, because of the way power and ruling work, if I expect to be mostly happy with ANY president and administration I am only fooling myself and am going to be disappointed. I am far more satisfied having a Biden administration that I ever was having a Trump administration, but I will always be far from fully satisfied with the Biden administration and will be critical of it. As we all should be.
Yes Brian. I agree I am much happier with Biden than the trump administration. That bar was set pretty low for us all. And I will continue to be as critical of Dems and Biden as I was before Trump lowered t he bar. It’s not enough for me to be happy that no real progress gets made just because someone other than trump is presiding, quite simply I don’t think anything is going to get done without a bunch of dissatisfied people organizing and letting the current administration know how they feel and what they expect going into the mid terms.
Sad part is we’re back to the same old same old now. Old joe takes us back to the status quo America that got us into this shit, the rulers and the rich against everyone else. Military blunders, horrible foreign policy, domestic class separation. If there’s no trump next time, I’ll vote for any outsider, regardless of what party they hail from- gotta get rid of the swamp so the people have a voice.
Comments
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
If it goes through and people are able to make more and some be above the ridiculously low "poverty line" and make more that would mean a bunch of people will lose their section 8 and other welfare benefits. If you make more and it puts you over the benefits line it still wouldn't be enough to help you pay for the healthcare, housing or food assistance that is provided.
I wonder how many people this would hurt rather than help?
Thoughts?
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Costco Will Raise Minimum Wage to $16 an Hour, C.E.O. Says - The New York Times (nytimes.com)
If you are getting public assistance and you get the increase in wage from the Min wage act I don't see how you would be able to afford the healthcare, housing and food that was assisted before. Those 3 things are expensive and an increase of $7 after taxes won't be helping you afford those 3 them.
Minimum wage $15x40hrs= $600
$600 x 52 is $31,000.
I couldn't live off of this in a poorer community anywhere, USA.
Next question.
Poverty line is $12,000. That is about 3K under a minimum wage full time job. Will America raise the poverty line to follow suit of the higher wage? If they do then we are back to square 1 again.
Thoughts?
most assistance based off of 2 or 3 times poverty level
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
I can attest to the fact that living in New Mexico as a single person making 30,000 with average rent cost of less than 900 is pretty much awful. Thank Hof those days are over. That being said a minimum of 30,000 a year is barely enough to survive in 2021 I’m sure.
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
$31,000 salary
Taxes on income at 28% We will give them a cheaper tax rate, is $8680
$22,360
rent 700 x 12= 8400
$13,960
Utilities $200 x 12=$2400
$11,560
Food. Let's say they eat Ramen mostly so $100 x 52= $5200
$6360
I'll stop there with $5360 left. If you have a car you either have a note, insurance and gas to pay or maybe all 3.
Do you smoke?
Do you drink?
If you need health insurance the cheapest out there I believe is $350 a month so that puts you at $4200 a year.
So you have $1160 left after paying all your bills and I was very lenient with the bills so you aren't doing anything and never getting out of the hole that you are in and you sure as hell aren't driving a car because no car has a maintenance cost of $1160 a year.
So if you option for the car then you would drop the insurance. You can't have both.
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
I never said it was an easy or luxurious way to live. But that is why so many people in their 20s in LA and NYC live with room mates. I lived in LA until I was 30, I had just a few friends without room mates. TV, internet, cell phones aren't a right, many apartments include rent. So your utility bill could be 0, or at the least split 2 or 3 ways with room mates. Ramen is not the cheapest way to eat. Chicken at $1.97/lb is super cheap. Make variaties with chicken and rice and you can eat for less than Ramen.
Smoking and drinking isn't a right. If you can't afford it, don't do it. There's a reason I didn't go out drinking in my 20s when I lived in LA, I couldn't afford it on a teacher's salary.
You'd probably have a clunker of a car with no collision insurance.
Your taxes seemed high to me. Did a tax estimate and got about $2400 in taxes for 30k.
https://us.icalculator.info/salary-illustration/30000.html That include SSN and medicare, etc. Still it all was less than 5k taken out of their pay.
I'm not saying this is a life I'd want for everyone, but it is livable. I was living in San Diego when I did my student teaching, probably made 20k that year working part time outside of school/work. I had 2 room mates, had internet but no TV, pretty much never ate out, never went out drinking. Only cigars I smoked were what my dad gave me. Had an old car that probably wasn;t even work $2,000 (The old blue with fake wood minivan, what they drive in Malcom in the Middle). 31k for middle of nowhere is definitely livable for some guy in his 20s trying to make something. Wouldnt make it supporting any kids though.
Getting into apartments. You are gonna be living in some real shitholes at the 30k a year price point.
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
I forgot to add a cell phone bill. Who doesn’t have one now?
Also if the company has over 50 employees they must offer health insurance.
So now lets get to the heart of the argument again as you said you did this when you were in your 20’s. That’s great but this isn’t looking to help that type of person. This is trying to help the person that this is THEIR life. They don’t have roommates, they have kids and a wife and most likely need a car. Oh yeah and I forgot clothes...
Look a young person might be able to hang but a family? Hell no.
So I have 2 problems with this. Too many careers at minimum wages and it’s not enough for a real living wage.
It is a start though. It brought up the discussion and it brought out dialogue so maybe we can figure this out.
I also think some people don’t know how to struggle. At some point in the last 20 years a cell phone went from a luxury to a necessity. Same with Internet and cable TV. And in this conversation even going out drinking is required to have dignity in life. Those things are all nice. None are a necessity. None are required to live a life of dignity. 31k is manageable if you’re just starting out of college. It is not for a family or a single mom.
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Did you just “get the fuck over” your alcoholism? Or does that require continuous and systemic changes, sometimes uncomfortable ones, to perpetuate a state of healing and a sense of well being?
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
This reminds me that, because of the way power and ruling work, if I expect to be mostly happy with ANY president and administration I am only fooling myself and am going to be disappointed. I am far more satisfied having a Biden administration that I ever was having a Trump administration, but I will always be far from fully satisfied with the Biden administration and will be critical of it. As we all should be.
There are no kings inside the gates of eden