Western media lies about Syria exposed (Canadian journalist Eva Bartlett)
Comments
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It would be nice if we could get just one Syria related thread. It's a pain in the ass trying to navigate these 2 threads and comment on anything. This seems like the more likely thread to be ignored based on who started it and the specific nature.It's a hopeless situation...0
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polaris_x said:
when and where? ... here is a summary of all OPCW reports as it relates to Syria ... please show me where the OPCW confirms that the Syrian gov't used sarin on its public ...my2hands said:
OPCW confirmed the 2013 "Red Line" Sarin Gas attack and attributed it directly to the Syrian government and Assad The Peacemaker... henceforth the agreement to the so called destruction and removal of said capabilities...polaris_x said:
no ... Syria agreed as part of a tripartite agreement to dismantle all chemical weapons ... the OPCW confirms that ... they continue to inspect Syria with the latest being in November of last year ... no chemical weapons ... as others have pointed out there are elements in the latest report that some might point to that says maybe they still have chemical weapons ...mcgruff10 said:
so are you saying he has never used chemical weapons (2013) or hasn’t used them in the past year? I am genuinely interested.polaris_x said:
no ... because their source for this is social media postings from terrorists groups ...mcgruff10 said:Does this count as evidence? https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/04/14/french-report-lays-out-evidence-assad-forces-conducted-chemical-attack-civilians/517187002/French analysts examined photos taken in two locations that depicted the following symptoms consistent with a chemical attack:
- Suffocation or breathing difficulties,
- Mentions of a strong chlorine odor and presence of green smoke in the areas affected,
- Extreme salivation and secretions from the mouth and nose
- Cyanosis, or blue coloration of the skin due to poor oxygen flow.
- Burns to the skin and cornea.
"No deaths from mechanical injuries were visible," the report said. "All of these symptoms are characteristic of a chemical weapons attack, particularly choking agents and organophosphorus agents or hydrocyanic acid."
France's conclusions were supported by Trump administration officials Saturday afternoon who determined that both chlorine and sarin, a highly toxic nerve agent, were used on the civilians by the forces under Assad in the April 7 attack.
Their findings were based on first-hand accounts of military helicopters releasing barrel bombs, evidence of features and markings of the bombs consistent with those Syrian forces used in previous attacks, and photos and videos of victims exhibiting the effects of chemical exposure such as foaming at the mouth, said the officials who requested anonymity because they were not authorized to speak publicly.
please note this ... assad was accused last year about another sarin attack of which mattis said recently that the US still has no proof of that attack ... if you recall - trump launched a few missiles that did minimal damage last year ...
the claim of sarin gas use in Ghouta last year has been debunked ... general mattis recently admitted the US still does not have proof that a chemical attack was initiated by Assad ... please go through this thread as it relates to the logic of assad using chemical weapons, the timing of these attacks always occurring when trump says he's pulling out and when the so called rebels are about to lose ... also, look at the evidence that is provided ... often videos of rescuers showing dead children and what not ... expert analysis of those videos always show shocking inconsistencies ... and horrible inaccuracies ... see the video I posted showing the supposed chemical attack bomb that apparently fell through a roof ... broke a hole and then landed on a bed without damaging the bed!! ... the proof gov'ts refer to are all these social media posts that are horribly poor in production they are easily debunked ...
Or is that bullshit too?
https://www.opcw.org/special-sections/syria/the-fact-finding-mission/
actually, they have found and stated the Syrian government has used chemical weapons several times.... they are documented several times in the timeline above and on their website as well... took me about 30 seconds to find itI know none of this is going to change your mind, you honestly seem to far gone down the wormhole to comeback... but I feel at least someone needs to let you know you are completely wrong and sucking up fake news propaganda and being duped...
this is coming from a guy that makes no excuses for past American foreign policy or military involvement
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Waaaaay too far down the worm hole.my2hands said:polaris_x said:
when and where? ... here is a summary of all OPCW reports as it relates to Syria ... please show me where the OPCW confirms that the Syrian gov't used sarin on its public ...my2hands said:
OPCW confirmed the 2013 "Red Line" Sarin Gas attack and attributed it directly to the Syrian government and Assad The Peacemaker... henceforth the agreement to the so called destruction and removal of said capabilities...polaris_x said:
no ... Syria agreed as part of a tripartite agreement to dismantle all chemical weapons ... the OPCW confirms that ... they continue to inspect Syria with the latest being in November of last year ... no chemical weapons ... as others have pointed out there are elements in the latest report that some might point to that says maybe they still have chemical weapons ...mcgruff10 said:
so are you saying he has never used chemical weapons (2013) or hasn’t used them in the past year? I am genuinely interested.polaris_x said:
no ... because their source for this is social media postings from terrorists groups ...mcgruff10 said:Does this count as evidence? https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/04/14/french-report-lays-out-evidence-assad-forces-conducted-chemical-attack-civilians/517187002/French analysts examined photos taken in two locations that depicted the following symptoms consistent with a chemical attack:
- Suffocation or breathing difficulties,
- Mentions of a strong chlorine odor and presence of green smoke in the areas affected,
- Extreme salivation and secretions from the mouth and nose
- Cyanosis, or blue coloration of the skin due to poor oxygen flow.
- Burns to the skin and cornea.
"No deaths from mechanical injuries were visible," the report said. "All of these symptoms are characteristic of a chemical weapons attack, particularly choking agents and organophosphorus agents or hydrocyanic acid."
France's conclusions were supported by Trump administration officials Saturday afternoon who determined that both chlorine and sarin, a highly toxic nerve agent, were used on the civilians by the forces under Assad in the April 7 attack.
Their findings were based on first-hand accounts of military helicopters releasing barrel bombs, evidence of features and markings of the bombs consistent with those Syrian forces used in previous attacks, and photos and videos of victims exhibiting the effects of chemical exposure such as foaming at the mouth, said the officials who requested anonymity because they were not authorized to speak publicly.
please note this ... assad was accused last year about another sarin attack of which mattis said recently that the US still has no proof of that attack ... if you recall - trump launched a few missiles that did minimal damage last year ...
the claim of sarin gas use in Ghouta last year has been debunked ... general mattis recently admitted the US still does not have proof that a chemical attack was initiated by Assad ... please go through this thread as it relates to the logic of assad using chemical weapons, the timing of these attacks always occurring when trump says he's pulling out and when the so called rebels are about to lose ... also, look at the evidence that is provided ... often videos of rescuers showing dead children and what not ... expert analysis of those videos always show shocking inconsistencies ... and horrible inaccuracies ... see the video I posted showing the supposed chemical attack bomb that apparently fell through a roof ... broke a hole and then landed on a bed without damaging the bed!! ... the proof gov'ts refer to are all these social media posts that are horribly poor in production they are easily debunked ...
Or is that bullshit too?
https://www.opcw.org/special-sections/syria/the-fact-finding-mission/
actually, they have found and stated the Syrian government has used chemical weapons several times.... they are documented several times in the timeline above and on their website as well... took me about 30 seconds to find itI know none of this is going to change your mind, you honestly seem to far gone down the wormhole to comeback... but I feel at least someone needs to let you know you are completely wrong and sucking up fake news propaganda and being duped...
this is coming from a guy that makes no excuses for past American foreign policy or military involvement
09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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Good stuff my2hands.
It really is a shame that otherwise intelligent people fall for this stuff.0 -
What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/
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It’s not new news. Been previously reported on in the West. You know, where there’s independent media and journalists who don’t go missing or show up dead on the side of the road.JC29856 said:What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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Like this?Halifax2TheMax said:
It’s not new news. Been previously reported on in the West. You know, where there’s independent media and journalists who don’t go missing or show up dead on the side of the road.JC29856 said:What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/
https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/oct/20/journalist-safety-turkey
Turkey is 'the west'...I mean....it's not...but they're part of NATO. If only Syria (or fragments of it) were too!
Just ignore the illegal weapons part, all good.
This topic really brings out the best of this place...anti-war people facing off against...everyone else. The centre-left/centre-right republicrat crowd, unified in their vilification of Assad. One side eyeing regime change/shift in the balance of regional power (without admitting it, usually)...the other side supporting some weird notion of saving Syrians with patriot missiles. Nothing like a good ol' bombing, and the russian bear to bring murica together again.
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Is that what you see going on here? I'm not for forced regime change and don't think random missile strikes are the liberators of a troubled nation. Several here have said they aren't sure what the solution is so you can ease up on the moral high ground since you seem to think you know what's best. Are you bothered that so many don't see Assad as a good guy based on the presented evidence?Drowned Out said:
Like this?Halifax2TheMax said:
It’s not new news. Been previously reported on in the West. You know, where there’s independent media and journalists who don’t go missing or show up dead on the side of the road.JC29856 said:What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/
https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/oct/20/journalist-safety-turkey
Turkey is 'the west'...I mean....it's not...but they're part of NATO. If only Syria (or fragments of it) were too!
Just ignore the illegal weapons part, all good.
This topic really brings out the best of this place...anti-war people facing off against...everyone else. The centre-left/centre-right republicrat crowd, unified in their vilification of Assad. One side eyeing regime change/shift in the balance of regional power (without admitting it, usually)...the other side supporting some weird notion of saving Syrians with patriot missiles. Nothing like a good ol' bombing, and the russian bear to bring murica together again.It's a hopeless situation...0 -
sorry ... no time to rebut anything right now ... will do later ...
but a report from OAN ... a conservative news station from the US ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnkhQu-e0n0
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just quickly ... that timeline looks like its sourced from the same manipulative organizations ... if you are quoting human rights watch - it's problematic .. i posted all the OPCW reports on Syria ...
also note this ... Syria had chemical weapons no doubt but they've also been at war with terrorists ... possible that some of the stockpiles in the hands of terrorists before OPCW disposal ..
also look for Robert Fisk's report on Douma ... msm journalist from the independent who has been waging their war on Syria went into Douma today ...
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Erdogans' Turkey is "the west" because it joined NATO 70 years ago? There has been building pressure to have them removed, for some of the issues mentioned in your article (among other things), and you know it
C'mon lol0 -
I have no interest in defending Assad, or any other politician.tbergs said:
Is that what you see going on here? I'm not for forced regime change and don't think random missile strikes are the liberators of a troubled nation. Several here have said they aren't sure what the solution is so you can ease up on the moral high ground since you seem to think you know what's best. Are you bothered that so many don't see Assad as a good guy based on the presented evidence?Drowned Out said:
Like this?Halifax2TheMax said:
It’s not new news. Been previously reported on in the West. You know, where there’s independent media and journalists who don’t go missing or show up dead on the side of the road.JC29856 said:What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/
https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/oct/20/journalist-safety-turkey
Turkey is 'the west'...I mean....it's not...but they're part of NATO. If only Syria (or fragments of it) were too!
Just ignore the illegal weapons part, all good.
This topic really brings out the best of this place...anti-war people facing off against...everyone else. The centre-left/centre-right republicrat crowd, unified in their vilification of Assad. One side eyeing regime change/shift in the balance of regional power (without admitting it, usually)...the other side supporting some weird notion of saving Syrians with patriot missiles. Nothing like a good ol' bombing, and the russian bear to bring murica together again.
Im frustrated that people I normally agree with, whose opinions I respect on many topics, have resorted to pretty outrageous ad hominems against Polaris.
There are people arguing the US position while still asking what the US has to gain in Syria. Shouldn’t that be the 101 of this topic, before picking a side?
My position is the moral high ground, like most people think theres is. But I say with full confidence that none of this would have happened without US imperialism in the region. Further involvement, masked as altruism by those seeking it, only makes the situation worse. I don’t buy that there is any different motive behind this air strike, no matter the short term goal...the openly stated end game of regime change has never changed.0 -
here is msm robert fisk's report on douma ...
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/syria-chemical-attack-gas-douma-robert-fisk-ghouta-damascus-a8307726.html
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I saw Fisk speak a few years back… He was based out of Lebanon at the time, not sure about now. But if he lived in Lebanon he’s obviously a Russian stoogepolaris_x said:here is msm robert fisk's report on douma ...
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/syria-chemical-attack-gas-douma-robert-fisk-ghouta-damascus-a8307726.html
Post edited by Drowned Out on0 -
thanks man ... it's ok ... like i said ... i think because i've heard all the vitriol online before that I totally expected it .. i care only for the people of syria ... if we pay witness to the suffering of the libyan and yemenese - we should take pause when the same people want to do the same to another country ... that's all i ever hope for people here ... to not just blindly believe everything they've seen .. iregardless of the name on the website or the author - i fell i've posted compelling evidence that not is exactly what it seems ... but all I get is anger from some people ...Drowned Out said:
I have no interest in defending Assad, or any other politician.tbergs said:
Is that what you see going on here? I'm not for forced regime change and don't think random missile strikes are the liberators of a troubled nation. Several here have said they aren't sure what the solution is so you can ease up on the moral high ground since you seem to think you know what's best. Are you bothered that so many don't see Assad as a good guy based on the presented evidence?Drowned Out said:
Like this?Halifax2TheMax said:
It’s not new news. Been previously reported on in the West. You know, where there’s independent media and journalists who don’t go missing or show up dead on the side of the road.JC29856 said:What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/
https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/oct/20/journalist-safety-turkey
Turkey is 'the west'...I mean....it's not...but they're part of NATO. If only Syria (or fragments of it) were too!
Just ignore the illegal weapons part, all good.
This topic really brings out the best of this place...anti-war people facing off against...everyone else. The centre-left/centre-right republicrat crowd, unified in their vilification of Assad. One side eyeing regime change/shift in the balance of regional power (without admitting it, usually)...the other side supporting some weird notion of saving Syrians with patriot missiles. Nothing like a good ol' bombing, and the russian bear to bring murica together again.
Im frustrated that people I normally agree with, whose opinions I respect on many topics, have resorted to pretty outrageous ad hominems against Polaris.
There are people arguing the US position while still asking what the US has to gain in Syria. Shouldn’t that be the 101 of this topic, before picking a side?
My position is the moral high ground, like most people think theres is. But I say with full confidence that none of this would have happened without US imperialism in the region. Further involvement, masked as altruism by those seeking it, only makes the situation worse. I don’t buy that there is any different motive behind this air strike, no matter the short term goal...the openly stated end game of regime change has never changed.
in any case - i appreciate that with no personal position on this matter you are defending me ... appreciate it ...
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oh I’m sure you know my position. We’ve been aligned for the most part on this topic since day one. In the end, Assad should remain in power for now. I am 100% opposed to US military action in the region. I just know that no world leader is innocent, so like you I support what I feel is best for the Syrian people. Ousting Assad with no viable plan To support those people would be a nightmare right now.polaris_x said:
thanks man ... it's ok ... like i said ... i think because i've heard all the vitriol online before that I totally expected it .. i care only for the people of syria ... if we pay witness to the suffering of the libyan and yemenese - we should take pause when the same people want to do the same to another country ... that's all i ever hope for people here ... to not just blindly believe everything they've seen .. iregardless of the name on the website or the author - i fell i've posted compelling evidence that not is exactly what it seems ... but all I get is anger from some people ...Drowned Out said:
I have no interest in defending Assad, or any other politician.tbergs said:
Is that what you see going on here? I'm not for forced regime change and don't think random missile strikes are the liberators of a troubled nation. Several here have said they aren't sure what the solution is so you can ease up on the moral high ground since you seem to think you know what's best. Are you bothered that so many don't see Assad as a good guy based on the presented evidence?Drowned Out said:
Like this?Halifax2TheMax said:
It’s not new news. Been previously reported on in the West. You know, where there’s independent media and journalists who don’t go missing or show up dead on the side of the road.JC29856 said:What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/
https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/oct/20/journalist-safety-turkey
Turkey is 'the west'...I mean....it's not...but they're part of NATO. If only Syria (or fragments of it) were too!
Just ignore the illegal weapons part, all good.
This topic really brings out the best of this place...anti-war people facing off against...everyone else. The centre-left/centre-right republicrat crowd, unified in their vilification of Assad. One side eyeing regime change/shift in the balance of regional power (without admitting it, usually)...the other side supporting some weird notion of saving Syrians with patriot missiles. Nothing like a good ol' bombing, and the russian bear to bring murica together again.
Im frustrated that people I normally agree with, whose opinions I respect on many topics, have resorted to pretty outrageous ad hominems against Polaris.
There are people arguing the US position while still asking what the US has to gain in Syria. Shouldn’t that be the 101 of this topic, before picking a side?
My position is the moral high ground, like most people think theres is. But I say with full confidence that none of this would have happened without US imperialism in the region. Further involvement, masked as altruism by those seeking it, only makes the situation worse. I don’t buy that there is any different motive behind this air strike, no matter the short term goal...the openly stated end game of regime change has never changed.
in any case - i appreciate that with no personal position on this matter you are defending me ... appreciate it ...0 -
By Anthony Deutsch
THE HAGUE (Reuters) - Western countries accused Moscow on Monday of preventing inspectors from reaching the site of a suspected poison gas attack in Syria and said Russians or Syrians may have tampered with evidence on the ground.
The United States, Britain and France launched air strikes on Saturday against what they described as three Syrian chemical weapons targets in retaliation for a suspected gas attack that killed scores of people in the Damascus suburb of Douma on April 7.
Syria and its ally Russia deny using poison gas during their offensive this month, in which they seized the town that had been the last major rebel stronghold near the capital.
Inspectors from the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) went to Syria last week to inspect the Douma site but have yet to gain access to the town, which is now under government control after the rebels withdrew.
"It is our understanding the Russians may have visited the attack site," U.S. Ambassador Kenneth Ward said at a meeting of the OPCW in The Hague on Monday.
"It is our concern that they may have tampered with it with the intent of thwarting the efforts of the OPCW Fact-Finding Mission to conduct an effective investigation," he said. His comments at the closed-door meeting were obtained by Reuters.
Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov denied that Moscow had interfered with any evidence: "I can guarantee that Russia has not tampered with the site," he told the BBC in an interview.
Earlier, Britain's delegation to the OPCW accused Russia and the Syrian government of preventing the international watchdog's inspectors from reaching Douma.
The inspectors aim to collect samples, interview witnesses and document evidence to determine whether banned toxic munitions were used, although they are not permitted to assign blame for the attack.
"Unfettered access is essential," the British delegation said in a statement. "Russia and Syria must cooperate."
Moscow blamed the delay on the Western air strikes. Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said the British accusation that Russia was to blame for holding up the inspections was "groundless".
"We called for an objective investigation. This was at the very beginning after this information [of the attack] appeared. Therefore allegations of this towards Russia are groundless," Peskov said.
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......0 -
Really glad to see you posting here again - I've missed your eloquent insight. Quite frankly, I don't know who to trust (and I think an argument can be made for skepticism from all parties), but until someone can explain how military action leads to positive outcome, complete with risk mitigation strategies, I don't see why military attacks should be the de facto action.Drowned Out said:
oh I’m sure you know my position. We’ve been aligned for the most part on this topic since day one. In the end, Assad should remain in power for now. I am 100% opposed to US military action in the region. I just know that no world leader is innocent, so like you I support what I feel is best for the Syrian people. Ousting Assad with no viable plan To support those people would be a nightmare right now.polaris_x said:
thanks man ... it's ok ... like i said ... i think because i've heard all the vitriol online before that I totally expected it .. i care only for the people of syria ... if we pay witness to the suffering of the libyan and yemenese - we should take pause when the same people want to do the same to another country ... that's all i ever hope for people here ... to not just blindly believe everything they've seen .. iregardless of the name on the website or the author - i fell i've posted compelling evidence that not is exactly what it seems ... but all I get is anger from some people ...Drowned Out said:
I have no interest in defending Assad, or any other politician.tbergs said:
Is that what you see going on here? I'm not for forced regime change and don't think random missile strikes are the liberators of a troubled nation. Several here have said they aren't sure what the solution is so you can ease up on the moral high ground since you seem to think you know what's best. Are you bothered that so many don't see Assad as a good guy based on the presented evidence?Drowned Out said:
Like this?Halifax2TheMax said:
It’s not new news. Been previously reported on in the West. You know, where there’s independent media and journalists who don’t go missing or show up dead on the side of the road.JC29856 said:What does the DC think tank Arms Control Association post about Jaish-al-Islam?
https://southfront.org/syrian-islamist-group-jaysh-al-islam-admits-using-forbidden-weapons-against-kurds-in-aleppo/
https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/oct/20/journalist-safety-turkey
Turkey is 'the west'...I mean....it's not...but they're part of NATO. If only Syria (or fragments of it) were too!
Just ignore the illegal weapons part, all good.
This topic really brings out the best of this place...anti-war people facing off against...everyone else. The centre-left/centre-right republicrat crowd, unified in their vilification of Assad. One side eyeing regime change/shift in the balance of regional power (without admitting it, usually)...the other side supporting some weird notion of saving Syrians with patriot missiles. Nothing like a good ol' bombing, and the russian bear to bring murica together again.
Im frustrated that people I normally agree with, whose opinions I respect on many topics, have resorted to pretty outrageous ad hominems against Polaris.
There are people arguing the US position while still asking what the US has to gain in Syria. Shouldn’t that be the 101 of this topic, before picking a side?
My position is the moral high ground, like most people think theres is. But I say with full confidence that none of this would have happened without US imperialism in the region. Further involvement, masked as altruism by those seeking it, only makes the situation worse. I don’t buy that there is any different motive behind this air strike, no matter the short term goal...the openly stated end game of regime change has never changed.
in any case - i appreciate that with no personal position on this matter you are defending me ... appreciate it ...'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 10 -
I'm not attacking anybody... I'm attacking nonsense fake news propaganda... cheerleading for Assad the Peacemaker... I mean c'mon
If you cared so much about the Syrian people you would show a little more concern for them being oppressed, tortured, murdered, incarcerated, raped, bombed, and gassed by their own leader and government, who has also invited the Russian military to the slaughter party...
You refuse to recognize basic facts such as Arab spring protests, the resulting crackdown, international reporters being on the ground in Syria at any time, documented atrocities committed by the Assad regime, use of chemical weapons by the Assad regime, and your star witness being a blogger for RT who's an Assad/Putin lapdog...
Now, as far as the destabilization of the region by western meddling and the invasion of Iraq, we agree... but we all know that shit goes way back... red lining... the shah... etc... etc... etc... but anyway, I didn't support the Iraq war... still dont... haven't supported any war in my lifetime really... I think W and Cheney are legitimate war criminals for the authorization/ordering of torture and black sites... I think Guantanamo is fucking disgusting and a violation of basic human civil rights... I was alive and well in those years and posted here, so you can see I've been consistent on that from jump street... im no johnny come lately... but just because Nazi Germany and Euro Fascism ultimately grew out of the ashes of WW1 and international isolationism doesn't mean you ignore the problem because it could have been avoided... evil simply cannot be ignored
Also, you've never seen me advocate for any missile strike or military strike of any kind... I honestly dont know what I would support or what's appropriate in this situation... but I believe there are times in life when the powerful need to protect the powerless...
The same reason society needs police, who sometimes have to take drastic action with deadly force, the world is not currently some magical utopia where all 7 billion of us get along and smoke joints around a camp fire, unfortunately... we can talk about peace all we want... we can dream like John Lennon... but unfortunately its still just a fucking dream, to think otherwise is naive and unrealistic...
I believe in love... I believe in peace... but I know the opposite also exists in this world
Just be glad none of us need a gasmask0 -
ABC's Diane Sawyer's piece on Syria and Assad in 2007 ... pre-regime change campaign ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=12&v=lpN8zp3oHc8
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