Should celebrities avoid talking politics to fans ?

ledvedderman

Godfather. said:

mrussel1 said:

Godfather. said:

I'd rather not listen to any celeb's political views, I didn't go to a show or watch a movie to listen to them talk about their political views
especially a concert, when I go to a concert the last thing I want to do is get pissed off over politics' while I'm trying to have a good time, and
these actors and actress' who use their celeb status to talk about their political views just really ruins it for me, then there's the athletes...look what happened to Kaepernick, I predicted he'd be job hunting and now look at his sorry ass, a free agent with no offers yet I believe.
how would your boss react if you used your work time and company name to push your political views ?

Kaepernick's issues stem from his sorry play, not from his politics. Lebron James has made political statements in the past.. think he will be an unsigned free agent any time soon?

mrussel1 said:

Godfather. said:

I'd rather not listen to any celeb's political views, I didn't go to a show or watch a movie to listen to them talk about their political views
especially a concert, when I go to a concert the last thing I want to do is get pissed off over politics' while I'm trying to have a good time, and
these actors and actress' who use their celeb status to talk about their political views just really ruins it for me, then there's the athletes...look what happened to Kaepernick, I predicted he'd be job hunting and now look at his sorry ass, a free agent with no offers yet I believe.
how would your boss react if you used your work time and company name to push your political views ?

Kaepernick's issues stem from his sorry play, not from his politics. Lebron James has made political statements in the past.. think he will be an unsigned free agent any time soon?

agree, but his refusal to stand during the national anthem ruined his popularity and interest from other teams.

Actually, Kap had one of the highest selling jerseys last year. I'd say that makes him quite popular.

Godfather.

well, we'll see if a team picks him up.
I'm not doubting any of your statements I'm just calling it like I see it and you all may see it quite differently then I.

jeffbr

He's an asshat, but my opinion predates his kneeling self-promotion. As a Seahawks fan, I can't stand him, and hope he ends up riding the pine for a CFL team.

Godfather.

jeffbr said:

He's an asshat, but my opinion predates his kneeling self-promotion. As a Seahawks fan, I can't stand him, and hope he ends up riding the pine for a CFL team.

HAHAHAHAHHA ! riding the pine ? that's great ! funny stuff.

Kat

In medieval times and before, minstrels would travel from village to village and town to town with entertainment, news and often political commentary to earn a living. Many had previously been entertainers at court. So it's a long tradition for entertainers to offer more than just entertainment. I'm proud that even today, they do more than just entertain.

PJ_Soul

They should talk about whatever they want to talk about. Plus, I think people with a public platform even kind of have a responsibility to speak up about important issues, if they have something to say. I respect people who advocate for what they believe in (assuming they're not advocating bigotry or other things that hurt people).

Annafalk

I also think they should talk about whatever they want to talk about, the scene is theirs,

Spiritual_Chaos

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

PJ_Soul

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

Well I find it particularly ridiculous to tell musicians to "shut up and sing". Music and art are rooted in dissent. Without political and sociological influences, and dissent, the subject of the art would suddenly be incredibly limited. I don't want to live in a world where music and art isn't largely influenced by these things. I can't fucking believe there are so many people out there who want to separate art and music from dissenting ideas and politics and social justice. It seriously boggles my mind. It's an affront to humanity, frankly.

mrussel1

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

PJ_Soul

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

mrussel1

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

Please provide me one case where someone in the US was arrested and convicted of sedition or similar crime about Iraq, Afghan, etc. Many of the protesters were committing vandalism. If you are protesting and some of the protesters are committing crimes, sometimes you get caught up in teh shuffle. I'm not defending that, but I'm not defending vandalism either. However, there is a very clear line between unlawful protests (private property, no permit, etc.) along with vandalism AND sedition or free speech violations. There's also a line between an arrest and a conviction.

Go Beavers

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

There's action being taken by some states to basically squash out protest by making laws that indirectly make a lot of protesting way more difficult or greenlight arresting protestors based on the actions of a few. Back in the Iraq War ramp up, there was strong social pressure to not speak out against it or question Bush jr.

PJ_Soul

mrussel1 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

Please provide me one case where someone in the US was arrested and convicted of sedition or similar crime about Iraq, Afghan, etc. Many of the protesters were committing vandalism. If you are protesting and some of the protesters are committing crimes, sometimes you get caught up in teh shuffle. I'm not defending that, but I'm not defending vandalism either. However, there is a very clear line between unlawful protests (private property, no permit, etc.) along with vandalism AND sedition or free speech violations. There's also a line between an arrest and a conviction.

I am talking about this kind of drive to muzzle protestors, and other similar efforts (this is the first link I got from google btw - I've seem many stories about it from many sources lately, and related. Not to mention all the footage from places like Standing Rock, where peaceful protestors are being attacked by militarized police forces): https://theintercept.com/2017/01/19/republican-lawmakers-in-five-states-propose-bills-to-criminalize-peaceful-protest/

mrussel1

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

Please provide me one case where someone in the US was arrested and convicted of sedition or similar crime about Iraq, Afghan, etc. Many of the protesters were committing vandalism. If you are protesting and some of the protesters are committing crimes, sometimes you get caught up in teh shuffle. I'm not defending that, but I'm not defending vandalism either. However, there is a very clear line between unlawful protests (private property, no permit, etc.) along with vandalism AND sedition or free speech violations. There's also a line between an arrest and a conviction.

I am talking about this kind of drive to muzzle protestors, and other similar efforts (this is the first link I got from google btw - I've seem many stories about it from many sources lately, and related): https://theintercept.com/2017/01/19/republican-lawmakers-in-five-states-propose-bills-to-criminalize-peaceful-protest/

A protest movement doesn't have the right to impede or endanger others that are not involved in the protest. I am a great supporter of protests and marches, but I'm not a supporter of fucking up the traffic. Here in Richmond several months ago, some BLM protesters blocked I-95 in the afternoon, creating hours of back up. That's my way home from work.... sorry, their beliefs don't supersede my right to get home and pick my daughter up from gymnastics, church, day care, etc.

The proposals, which strengthen or supplement existing laws addressing the blocking or obstructing of traffic, come in response to a string of high-profile highway closures and other actions led by Black Lives Matter activists and opponents of the Dakota Access Pipeline. Republicans reasonably expect an invigorated protest movement during the Trump years.

mrussel1

There's a difference between free speech and the belief that you have an unmitigated right to fuck things up for other people. Any law that sought to arrest someone for peaceful, non violent, non obstruction speech (which also includes written speech) would be struck down swiftly by the courts.

Go Beavers

mrussel1 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

Please provide me one case where someone in the US was arrested and convicted of sedition or similar crime about Iraq, Afghan, etc. Many of the protesters were committing vandalism. If you are protesting and some of the protesters are committing crimes, sometimes you get caught up in teh shuffle. I'm not defending that, but I'm not defending vandalism either. However, there is a very clear line between unlawful protests (private property, no permit, etc.) along with vandalism AND sedition or free speech violations. There's also a line between an arrest and a conviction.

I am talking about this kind of drive to muzzle protestors, and other similar efforts (this is the first link I got from google btw - I've seem many stories about it from many sources lately, and related): https://theintercept.com/2017/01/19/republican-lawmakers-in-five-states-propose-bills-to-criminalize-peaceful-protest/

A protest movement doesn't have the right to impede or endanger others that are not involved in the protest. I am a great supporter of protests and marches, but I'm not a supporter of fucking up the traffic. Here in Richmond several months ago, some BLM protesters blocked I-95 in the afternoon, creating hours of back up. That's my way home from work.... sorry, their beliefs don't supersede my right to get home and pick my daughter up from gymnastics, church, day care, etc.

The proposals, which strengthen or supplement existing laws addressing the blocking or obstructing of traffic, come in response to a string of high-profile highway closures and other actions led by Black Lives Matter activists and opponents of the Dakota Access Pipeline. Republicans reasonably expect an invigorated protest movement during the Trump years.

Driving unimpeded isn't a right. It's a side issue, but the sense of entitlement our culture has around driving grinds my gears (on my bike). And disruptive protests have been proven effective.

mrussel1

Go Beavers said:

mrussel1 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

Please provide me one case where someone in the US was arrested and convicted of sedition or similar crime about Iraq, Afghan, etc. Many of the protesters were committing vandalism. If you are protesting and some of the protesters are committing crimes, sometimes you get caught up in teh shuffle. I'm not defending that, but I'm not defending vandalism either. However, there is a very clear line between unlawful protests (private property, no permit, etc.) along with vandalism AND sedition or free speech violations. There's also a line between an arrest and a conviction.

I am talking about this kind of drive to muzzle protestors, and other similar efforts (this is the first link I got from google btw - I've seem many stories about it from many sources lately, and related): https://theintercept.com/2017/01/19/republican-lawmakers-in-five-states-propose-bills-to-criminalize-peaceful-protest/

A protest movement doesn't have the right to impede or endanger others that are not involved in the protest. I am a great supporter of protests and marches, but I'm not a supporter of fucking up the traffic. Here in Richmond several months ago, some BLM protesters blocked I-95 in the afternoon, creating hours of back up. That's my way home from work.... sorry, their beliefs don't supersede my right to get home and pick my daughter up from gymnastics, church, day care, etc.

The proposals, which strengthen or supplement existing laws addressing the blocking or obstructing of traffic, come in response to a string of high-profile highway closures and other actions led by Black Lives Matter activists and opponents of the Dakota Access Pipeline. Republicans reasonably expect an invigorated protest movement during the Trump years.

Driving unimpeded isn't a right. It's a side issue, but the sense of entitlement our culture has around driving grinds my gears (on my bike). And disruptive protests have been proven effective.

There are laws that prevent people from walking or even riding a bike on the interstate. So no, you don't have a right to drive unimpeded, but there are existing laws to keep people off the interstates (effectively the same thing for purposes of this argument) And blocking a city road is very clearly disorderly conduct (if a police officer orders you off the road specifically) and you could probably even get to jaywalking.

mrussel1

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Seems like a very american thing. The only ones I've heard the "shut up and just sing" comments from.
Never heard it about any swedish artists or from anyone I know here in Europe.

Absurd to try to dictate what an artist/person are allowed to do or not. They are not monkeys in cages. Their songs and messages are, often, more than entertainment.

It's almost like not being allowed to criticise your countries leader when he starts an unjust war. Oh wait, same country again.

...but I sing in the choir.

What we're trying to get to in America is judging people by individual actions, not by the country in which they live or broad groups who we may wrongly believe they are a part.

I'm trying to remember the cases where Americans were jailed because they criticized the war. I was a fierce critic but I don't remember not being "allowed" to voice my criticism. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I spent three years in jail and they gave me amnesia pills.

There is definitely a drive to muzzle protesters via arrests, so I think you might be underestimating how many people actually have been jailed because they criticize the government these days... it is happening.

There's action being taken by some states to basically squash out protest by making laws that indirectly make a lot of protesting way more difficult or greenlight arresting protestors based on the actions of a few. Back in the Iraq War ramp up, there was strong social pressure to not speak out against it or question Bush jr.

Pressure by whom? And pressure is not a law. People pressured the NBA to move the all star game out of NC, but no one got arrested about it. I'm fine with pressure, but let's not be hypocritical and not notice when the pressure being applied is coming from the left.

my2hands

Smellyman said:

You're right. Trump should avoid it.

thread should have ended here