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September 11th, 2001

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  • hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of foreverPosts: 23,733
    Haha. I'm not a teenage-ish boy. Just a grown-ass woman who digs on getting her ya-ya's out where and when she can.

    GTA included.

    Thank you, but the pass is not needed!
  • camsjamcamsjam Posts: 375
    Running late as usual--everyone has already moved on but I wanted to tell my story here because I haven't written about it before. I don't believe we're "wallowing" Hugh's comment was right. We're sad, puzzled, angry and afraid and as humans we try to make sense of things and it's natural to point fingers and try to assign blame or vent anger. It's been 15 years but it's still is a painful day to remember yet I feel it is important to acknowledge thousands of people going to work on a ordinary day, just like we all do, had their lives taken in a brutally violent way.
    I was living in LA when my phone rang just after 6 in the morning. It was my Mom and she just said one word Honey? and I knew something was wrong. I asked and she just said turn on your TV. I tried to make sense of what I was looking at...smoking Towers. At first I thought there had been some horrible accident and she started crying and I heard the reporter say planes had hit the World Trade Center Towers. I watched in disbelief for awhile just stunned then thought I'd better get my ass to work. Hung up and about 10 minutes my phone rang again and it was one of my best friends saying Shit, you don't want to go to work today. I told I felt I had to and finished getting ready. I worked for an airline at a ticketing office and was scheduled to open the office with another agent. I drove down Sunset Blvd which is at that hour of the day usually a cluster fuck of miserable traffic and the streets were really empty. I figured most people were glued to the TV but where were all the people going to work?
    I arrived and saw a piece of notepaper with CLOSED TODAY taped on the door. I went in and called our supervisor who said they had been asking people to go down to the office by LAX to help handle the overload on the phone lines. However, Century Blvd going into the airport was being closed. LAX was considered a high risk target. She told me to go home and they would let me know when the office would reopen. I drove back home..again on mostly empty streets...in fucking LA!..and watched as things got worse. Plane hit the Pentagon, another plane missing thought to be highjacked, the Towers crumbling. The people jumping from the Towers was the most heartbreaking. There was a foreign reporter talking and I could see and worse, hear, the people falling behind him. I had been to the top and knew how very very high Windows of the World was. Those people trapped....just makes my stomach turn.
  • camsjamcamsjam Posts: 375
    I returned to work the next day and it's really a blur. All flights cancelled until ? planes and people stranded all over and people asking when will everything get back to a normal schedule? I remember people being kinder and more understanding mostly. There was an elderly French gentleman trying to go home. When I tried to explain I had no answers yet he said something like This is hurting all of us..we are all connected and I wanted to cry.
    My computer just decided to restart and update which made me realize I have been rambling on n on.
    Thank you ehbacon for this post and keeping true to the purpose---remembering and listing those lost. I'm not going to address some of the boorish comments a few people left. That cheapens the heart of the orginal thought here. I love this country--we're not always perfect or right--but we are all people in the world and if you feel the need to express your insensitive opinions to stir up the drama I feel sorry for you--
  • hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of foreverPosts: 23,733
    camsjam, thank you for sharing so eloquently and honestly what you experienced. I'm in LA and also drove on an empty Sunset Blvd. to work in Woodland Hills...had Howard Stern on the radio (bless him, he saved my sanity that morning) and kept checking the skies for planes. Nothing, totally empty. Streets too. Ended up going back home and watching the coverage with a mix of numbness, horror, profound sadness and overwhelming surreality.
  • I agree that seeing the people plummeting to earth was the most heart wrenching. Obviously, prior to their action, they were faced with melting or leaping. The desperation and hopelessness they must have felt at that moment could not have been more intense.

    It was an utterly shocking event and it was the mechanism for shaping the course of history.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 6,277

    I agree that seeing the people plummeting to earth was the most heart wrenching. Obviously, prior to their action, they were faced with melting or leaping. The desperation and hopelessness they must have felt at that moment could not have been more intense.

    It was an utterly shocking event and it was the mechanism for shaping the course of history.

    I think it was Brian Williams who said "Their best option was to jump to their death." That stuck with me.
  • I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives
  • g under pg under p Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero GalaxyPosts: 17,916

    I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives

    Interesting that you asked these questions.....I asked the same in my very first thread I posted here almost 10 years ago. It was called
    911 Mysteries, it was posted in the morning before heading to work and when I returned 7 pages had been posted. I knew then this community was the place for me the action was fast and furious.

    Peace
    *We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti

    *MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
    .....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti

    *The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)


  • eddieceddiec Posts: 3,491

    I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives

    Question 2 cannot be answered. Unfortunately it may never be answered.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 6,277

    I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives

    1) There is video footage along with thousands of witnesses to 2 planes crashing into the towers. In no way was it a hoax, illusion, etc. Thousands of rescue workers were involved, and very little remains of the planes or the thousands of people who were known to die in the event were ever recovered. What more proof do you want that a plane can crash without leaving much of a trace?

    2) Probably not possible. But a jumbo jet fully loaded with jet fuel is a pretty darn big explosive. I never understand the debate that they could not have fallen without explosives. That is probably true, but we saw 2 very large explosives fly straight into the buildings. So why is this a topic?
  • That's great g under p - sorry I'm late to your thread :-).
  • g under pg under p Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero GalaxyPosts: 17,916
    edited September 2016

    That's great g under p - sorry I'm late to your thread :-).

    It ended up a couple pages later. Btw I just checked the 9/11 Mysteries thread is still there I couldn't believe it. Anyway, after looking at everything what I do know about the investigation into 9/11 and what actually happened I believe is quite different than what has been told to the public.

    Peace
    Post edited by g under p on
    *We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti

    *MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
    .....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti

    *The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)


  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,572
    mace1229 said:

    I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives

    1) There is video footage along with thousands of witnesses to 2 planes crashing into the towers. In no way was it a hoax, illusion, etc. Thousands of rescue workers were involved, and very little remains of the planes or the thousands of people who were known to die in the event were ever recovered. What more proof do you want that a plane can crash without leaving much of a trace?

    2) Probably not possible. But a jumbo jet fully loaded with jet fuel is a pretty darn big explosive. I never understand the debate that they could not have fallen without explosives. That is probably true, but we saw 2 very large explosives fly straight into the buildings. So why is this a topic?
    Number 1 is likely referring to the Pentagon, where the security footage remains sealed and the details are suspect.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • It's pretty well documented that the official story is full of holes. Like I said, I really don't want to start a heated argument. Seeing is believing though - there is absolutely no way one could ever doctor a video shown on 'live' TV correct? No way fake witnesses have ever been used in 'news' stories before right? Just saying, keep the minds open, check out some Youtube vids, decide for yourself. I assure you I'm not a conspiracy theorist or a nut job. Just someone who wishes Rock n Roll can still change the world.
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 35,080
    Good questions and why they and a few others have never been fully explained is a mystery. Same with the Kennedy shooting. There are some things we may never know.
    "I believe in the mystery, and I don't want to take it any further than that. Maybe what I mean by that is love."
    -John Densmore











  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 25,716

    It's pretty well documented that the official story is full of holes. Like I said, I really don't want to start a heated argument. Seeing is believing though - there is absolutely no way one could ever doctor a video shown on 'live' TV correct? No way fake witnesses have ever been used in 'news' stories before right? Just saying, keep the minds open, check out some Youtube vids, decide for yourself. I assure you I'm not a conspiracy theorist or a nut job. Just someone who wishes Rock n Roll can still change the world.

    fake witnesses? you are talking about downtown manhattan, one of the biggest cities in the world. literally (hundreds of?) thousands of people witnessed the event. Don't you think if something was fake someone after 15 years would have said something?
    also a piece of one of the planes was found between two buildings a few years ago.
    http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/26/us/new-york-9-11-plane-part/
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 25,716

    I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives

    #2 specifically wtc 7
    Many conspiracy theorists point to FEMA's preliminary report, which said there was relatively light damage to WTC 7 prior to its collapse. With the benefit of more time and resources, NIST researchers now support the working hypothesis that WTC 7 was far more compromised by falling debris than the FEMA report indicated. "The most important thing we found was that there was, in fact, physical damage to the south face of building 7," NIST's Sunder tells PM. "On about a third of the face to the center and to the bottom—approximately 10 stories—about 25 percent of the depth of the building was scooped out." NIST also discovered previously undocumented damage to WTC 7's upper stories and its southwest corner.

    NIST investigators believe a combination of intense fire and severe structural damage contributed to the collapse, though assigning the exact proportion requires more research. But NIST's analysis suggests the fall of WTC 7 was an example of "progressive collapse," a process in which the failure of parts of a structure ultimately creates strains that cause the entire building to come down. Videos of the fall of WTC 7 show cracks, or "kinks," in the building's facade just before the two penthouses disappeared into the structure, one after the other. The entire building fell in on itself, with the slumping east side of the structure pulling down the west side in a diagonal collapse.

    According to NIST, there was one primary reason for the building's failure: In an unusual design, the columns near the visible kinks were carrying exceptionally large loads, roughly 2000 sq. ft. of floor area for each floor. "What our preliminary analysis has shown is that if you take out just one column on one of the lower floors," Sunder notes, "it could cause a vertical progression of collapse so that the entire section comes down."

    There are two other possible contributing factors still under investigation: First, trusses on the fifth and seventh floors were designed to transfer loads from one set of columns to another. With columns on the south face apparently damaged, high stresses would likely have been communicated to columns on the building's other faces, thereby exceeding their load-bearing capacities.

    Second, a fifth-floor fire burned for up to 7 hours. "There was no firefighting in WTC 7," Sunder says. Investigators believe the fire was fed by tanks of diesel fuel that many tenants used to run emergency generators. Most tanks throughout the building were fairly small, but a generator on the fifth floor was connected to a large tank in the basement via a pressurized line. Says Sunder: "Our current working hypothesis is that this pressurized line was supplying fuel [to the fire] for a long period of time."

    WTC 7 might have withstood the physical damage it received, or the fire that burned for hours, but those combined factors—along with the building's unusual construction—were enough to set off the chain-reaction collapse.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 25,716

    I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives


    1: wreckage from flight 77 was found on the pentagon's lawn. pictures prove this.
    like I said, a piece of one of the plane's landing gear was found in between 2 buildings in nyc.
    While heading a Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) probe into the collapse of the towers, W. Gene Corley studied the airplane wreckage. A licensed structural engineer with Construction Technology Laboratories, a consulting firm based in Skokie, Ill., Corley and his team photographed aircraft debris on the roof of WTC 5, including a chunk of fuselage that clearly had passenger windows. "It's ... from the United Airlines plane that hit Tower 2," Corley states flatly. In reviewing crash footage taken by an ABC news crew, Corley was able to track the trajectory of the fragments he studied—including a section of the landing gear and part of an engine—as they tore through the South Tower, exited from the building's north side and fell from the sky.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • eddieceddiec Posts: 3,491
    In the history of skyscrapers only 3 have fallen with cause being attributed to fire.
    WTC 1,2 and 7
  • Jason PJason P Posts: 18,882
    oh boy ...
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 25,716
    eddiec said:

    In the history of skyscrapers only 3 have fallen with cause being attributed to fire.
    WTC 1,2 and 7

    fire caused by commercial airplanes.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • Yeah - I saw that airplane part in the buildings - even that has to have a question around it - was it lowered by a rope? - good grief, can't anything just be clear cut with this case? I read a portion of the 9/11 Mysteries thread. So what amazes me is that 9 years after that the same questions still need answered - which is why it would be great to get a real investigation. I really don't want to hear any NIST stories - it is well known the scientific community questioned just about all of their 'facts'. The fact is 47 stories fell into its own footprint in about 8-10 seconds - and a very large number of scientists and architects with nothing to gain by lying say it couldn't be anything other than controlled demolition. Who has something to gain by lying about this? Perhaps someone covering something up. I could also point to audio of firemen saying it's going to blow. Not to mention news reporters announcing on TV that the building fell - even though you can see the building in the background. Then someone else could say, well this might be fake - maybe a fake witness said it was a fireman who said this or that - just an endless circle. Which is why we should focus our energies on pushing for an investigation. I have 0 doubt in my mind that a real investigation would come no where close to same conclusion as the 'official' story.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 6,277
    rgambs said:

    mace1229 said:

    I am very curious to know if anyone out in the community has done their own research surrounding this day. Please don't say 'it's 2016, time to move on'. This statement saddens me. It really is our duty to ask questions and speak out about this event. Nothing would make me happier than seeing PJ get behind the push for facts. At this time, what could possibly be more important than providing the world with real facts about the biggest crime in mankind history?

    There are scientists, physicists, engineers, actors, musicians, etc all pushing for a re-investigation.
    See http://www.ae911truth.org/ or http://aa911.org/

    I'm not looking for a debate on this, just asking people to take a step back, forget what has been force fed to us as facts for 15 years and take a look for yourselves. You will be surprised at what you find out.

    If someone can prove to me these 2 items, then I will be able to move on, but so far no one has:
    1) 4 aluminum commercial airplanes can disappear into concrete/steel structures or into the ground with barely a trace (or no trace depending who you ask)
    2) 3 concrete/steel structures (two 110-story, one 47-story) buildings can collapse into their own footprint at free fall speed without explosives

    1) There is video footage along with thousands of witnesses to 2 planes crashing into the towers. In no way was it a hoax, illusion, etc. Thousands of rescue workers were involved, and very little remains of the planes or the thousands of people who were known to die in the event were ever recovered. What more proof do you want that a plane can crash without leaving much of a trace?

    2) Probably not possible. But a jumbo jet fully loaded with jet fuel is a pretty darn big explosive. I never understand the debate that they could not have fallen without explosives. That is probably true, but we saw 2 very large explosives fly straight into the buildings. So why is this a topic?
    Number 1 is likely referring to the Pentagon, where the security footage remains sealed and the details are suspect.
    I know the most common theories about the planes disappearing involve the pentagon and the crash in PA. But to answer the question that it can happen, I think the twin towers pretty well proves that it is possible for a plane to be nearly completely destroyed in a crash though.

    I have seen videos, watched the documentary "Spare Change," and all theories I've seen just don't come close to adding up for me. I wouldn't tell someone to "move on" because its been 15 years, but I just don't think there has been enough evidence, any really, to support the number of theories that have floated around. Not to mention they would require the involvement of hundreds of people, all willing to kill thousands of innocent American civilians for various number of reasons, and somehow all have remained silent. 4 planes did disappear, with known people on board who had families and are accounted for, that is indisputable. I have yet to hear one logical theory as to what happened to all those people if in fact the crash sites were staged. The only thing that does make sense is 2 crashed into the towers, 1 into the pentagon and 1 into some fields in PA.
  • jeffbrjeffbr SeattlePosts: 7,177
    Yup. These conspiracy theories (even if the conspiracy theorists don't like them called that) are kooky. To believe them is to believe the government had planes full of passengers executed (or perhaps shipped to some secret detention center for the rest of their lives). Real people were aboard those planes. Real people saw those planes in flight. Real people lost loved ones who were on those flights. A coordinated effort, if these conspiracy theories are to be believed, would have had to involve hundreds, if not thousands of co-conspirators. It is difficult to keep something secret among a handful of people. How do hundreds, or thousands of people perpetrate this fraud without anyone knowing, and keep it secret for so long?
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 25,716
    why would any of the wtc buildings be blown up using explosives? how could you plant the explosives in that short amount of time in tower 1/2?
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • dignindignin Posts: 8,992
    jeffbr said:

    Yup. These conspiracy theories (even if the conspiracy theorists don't like them called that) are kooky. To believe them is to believe the government had planes full of passengers executed (or perhaps shipped to some secret detention center for the rest of their lives). Real people were aboard those planes. Real people saw those planes in flight. Real people lost loved ones who were on those flights. A coordinated effort, if these conspiracy theories are to be believed, would have had to involve hundreds, if not thousands of co-conspirators. It is difficult to keep something secret among a handful of people. How do hundreds, or thousands of people perpetrate this fraud without anyone knowing, and keep it secret for so long?

    Kooky is being polite.

    It's all covered here.

    http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/a49/1227842/

    and here

    http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/design/a3524/4278874/
  • I appreciate all these comments. I too used to reject every other hypothesis I heard - until I decided to research myself. I hope that more will do the same. The recent comments are too restrictive however - correct that we don't know how many people were involved in this act do we? Maybe 100, maybe 1000. I do know that very large sums of money do wonderful things. Are we 100% positive there were planes? This is one of the questions I asked myself. I'm telling you, I just started from scratch. All I know is, having the Pentagon get hit, losing the entire world trade center complex in the capital of the world, and having a commercial jet disappear into a very small hole (after flying upside down) in PA without any military involvement from the best damn military in the world is just as hard for me to believe as the rest of them. And we have been fed info for 15 years the fact that a guy across the world with 19 buddies took over planes with box cutters. Not to mention most of those pilots were probably ex-military pilots and well trained in self defense. I do believe one of the pilots was even a boxer. There are sites from pilots as well that pretty much question every aspect of those flights (500 mph at that altitude?). Please take a little time and check some out.
  • Oh no - someone went the Popular Mechanics route. Oh man, my work is really cut out for me. Come on PJ folks!
    I have visions of PJ performing a 9/11 truth concert in the middle of NY city - just like Midnight Oil did on a flat bed truck way back in 1990 in front of the Exxon building. Man, that would be sweet...
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 25,716
    I posted the popular mechanic article and it is pretty legit. Can you disprove any of those articles or is everything just speculation?
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 31,917
    lol

    This argument is rehashed once a year and every year it is just as crazy. It's only a couple weeks late this year...
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