Jill Stein for President

pjalive21

hedonist said:

Just me, or has no one mentioned anything about her VP choice?

ill be honest up until you said something I forgot who it was and that alone puts on the breaks for me with her...thanks for bringing that up

Ajamu Baraka...guy is pretty extreme

brianlux

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

hedonist

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

brianlux

hedonist said:

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

No worries, Hedo. I was sincerely wondering why some others here expressed what sounds like disapproval. I honestly don't know much more about Baraka than what I posted.

Would be interesting to have an ex-president named Barack and a VP named Baraka.

PJ_Soul

brianlux said:

hedonist said:

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

No worries, Hedo. I was sincerely wondering why some others here expressed what sounds like disapproval. I honestly don't know much more about Baraka than what I posted.

Would be interesting to have an ex-president named Barack and a VP named Baraka.

I just looked him up to see if there was any reason for someone to say he seemed extreme in some ways. He is certainly an outspoken activist with very specific ideals, and some bigger dolts find just that to be extremist, lol. But anyway, I did find this quote (wiki): Baraka has criticized efforts to "Americanize" black radicals and to assimilate African Americans into the American middle class, writing: "Saner people would call that process genocide, but in the U.S. it is called racial progress."[20] Referencing Black Panther activist Assata Shakur, Baraka argued that black radical activists could never obtain true freedom "while the American government and American capitalism remain intact."[20]"

I can see why some not unreasonable people would see such an idea as extreme.

pjalive21

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

hedonist said:

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

No worries, Hedo. I was sincerely wondering why some others here expressed what sounds like disapproval. I honestly don't know much more about Baraka than what I posted.

Would be interesting to have an ex-president named Barack and a VP named Baraka.

I just looked him up to see if there was any reason for someone to say he seemed extreme in some ways. He is certainly an outspoken activist with very specific ideals, and some bigger dolts find just that to be extremist, lol. But anyway, I did find this quote (wiki): Baraka has criticized efforts to "Americanize" black radicals and to assimilate African Americans into the American middle class, writing: "Saner people would call that process genocide, but in the U.S. it is called racial progress."[20] Referencing Black Panther activist Assata Shakur, Baraka argued that black radical activists could never obtain true freedom "while the American government and American capitalism remain intact."[20]"

I can see why some not unreasonable people would see such an idea as extreme.

I like some of what he has to say but everything with this guy is about race TPP and NAFTA holding down black people??? I mean im against TPP and NAFTA, but he is stretching on this point big time

"""Baraka has termed trade deals a "Black issue" both domestically and internationally.[23][24] He asserts that the TPP "is a weapon to maintain U.S. global hegemony by denying the fundamental economic, social and cultural rights of millions of people in order to benefit a parasitic white minority ruling class in the U.S."[23] He has stated that poverty and disruption of black communities in many US cities and among peoples in Latin America are the result of NAFTA.[23][24]"""

PJ_Soul

pjalive21 said:

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

hedonist said:

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

No worries, Hedo. I was sincerely wondering why some others here expressed what sounds like disapproval. I honestly don't know much more about Baraka than what I posted.

Would be interesting to have an ex-president named Barack and a VP named Baraka.

I just looked him up to see if there was any reason for someone to say he seemed extreme in some ways. He is certainly an outspoken activist with very specific ideals, and some bigger dolts find just that to be extremist, lol. But anyway, I did find this quote (wiki): Baraka has criticized efforts to "Americanize" black radicals and to assimilate African Americans into the American middle class, writing: "Saner people would call that process genocide, but in the U.S. it is called racial progress."[20] Referencing Black Panther activist Assata Shakur, Baraka argued that black radical activists could never obtain true freedom "while the American government and American capitalism remain intact."[20]"

I can see why some not unreasonable people would see such an idea as extreme.

I like some of what he has to say but everything with this guy is about race TPP and NAFTA holding down black people??? I mean im against TPP and NAFTA, but he is stretching on this point big time

"""Baraka has termed trade deals a "Black issue" both domestically and internationally.[23][24] He asserts that the TPP "is a weapon to maintain U.S. global hegemony by denying the fundamental economic, social and cultural rights of millions of people in order to benefit a parasitic white minority ruling class in the U.S."[23] He has stated that poverty and disruption of black communities in many US cities and among peoples in Latin America are the result of NAFTA.[23][24]"""

Yeah, it's a little much. He definitely has a one track mind that I think could cause him to really see things in a skewed and incorrect context at times.
Anyway, I guess it doesn't much matter. It's not like he'll ever be VP or anything.

brianlux

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

hedonist said:

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

No worries, Hedo. I was sincerely wondering why some others here expressed what sounds like disapproval. I honestly don't know much more about Baraka than what I posted.

Would be interesting to have an ex-president named Barack and a VP named Baraka.

I just looked him up to see if there was any reason for someone to say he seemed extreme in some ways. He is certainly an outspoken activist with very specific ideals, and some bigger dolts find just that to be extremist, lol. But anyway, I did find this quote (wiki): Baraka has criticized efforts to "Americanize" black radicals and to assimilate African Americans into the American middle class, writing: "Saner people would call that process genocide, but in the U.S. it is called racial progress."[20] Referencing Black Panther activist Assata Shakur, Baraka argued that black radical activists could never obtain true freedom "while the American government and American capitalism remain intact."[20]"

I can see why some not unreasonable people would see such an idea as extreme.

I don't see his statement as extreme at all. You've shown support for Native Americans in various threads so I assume you understand how assimilation has been a form of genocide for Natives- not as extreme as small pox infested blankets and outright murder, but if you study the history, it is just as much a form of genocide. The same thing has been applied to African Americans throughout our history. So is not referring to an intelligent opposition to this and any form of assimilation "extreme" rather inaccurate?

PJ_Soul

brianlux said:

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

hedonist said:

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

No worries, Hedo. I was sincerely wondering why some others here expressed what sounds like disapproval. I honestly don't know much more about Baraka than what I posted.

Would be interesting to have an ex-president named Barack and a VP named Baraka.

I just looked him up to see if there was any reason for someone to say he seemed extreme in some ways. He is certainly an outspoken activist with very specific ideals, and some bigger dolts find just that to be extremist, lol. But anyway, I did find this quote (wiki): Baraka has criticized efforts to "Americanize" black radicals and to assimilate African Americans into the American middle class, writing: "Saner people would call that process genocide, but in the U.S. it is called racial progress."[20] Referencing Black Panther activist Assata Shakur, Baraka argued that black radical activists could never obtain true freedom "while the American government and American capitalism remain intact."[20]"

I can see why some not unreasonable people would see such an idea as extreme.

I don't see his statement as extreme at all. You've shown support for Native Americans in various threads so I assume you understand how assimilation has been a form of genocide for Natives- not as extreme as small pox infested blankets and outright murder, but if you study the history, it is just as much a form of genocide. The same thing has been applied to African Americans throughout our history. So is not referring to an intelligent opposition to this and any form of assimilation "extreme" rather inaccurate?

I know the history and I think you know where I stand. Come on Brian. Saying that African Americans joining the middle class is genocide to sane people? Given reality, that is pretty extreme.

brianlux

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

hedonist said:

brianlux said:

What is it about Baraka some of you find unfavorable? Him criticizing those who want to "assimilate African Americans"? His being against the death penalty? His being opposed to incarcerating people on marijuana-related charges? His condemnation of NAFTA? His criticism of Katrina disaster relief? His humanitarian stance?

Something else?

Easy there! From here, I was asking a straightforward and sincere question since he/the topic hadn't been addressed among all the praises of Stein.

*edit as I read one comment incorrectly.

No worries, Hedo. I was sincerely wondering why some others here expressed what sounds like disapproval. I honestly don't know much more about Baraka than what I posted.

Would be interesting to have an ex-president named Barack and a VP named Baraka.

I just looked him up to see if there was any reason for someone to say he seemed extreme in some ways. He is certainly an outspoken activist with very specific ideals, and some bigger dolts find just that to be extremist, lol. But anyway, I did find this quote (wiki): Baraka has criticized efforts to "Americanize" black radicals and to assimilate African Americans into the American middle class, writing: "Saner people would call that process genocide, but in the U.S. it is called racial progress."[20] Referencing Black Panther activist Assata Shakur, Baraka argued that black radical activists could never obtain true freedom "while the American government and American capitalism remain intact."[20]"

I can see why some not unreasonable people would see such an idea as extreme.

I don't see his statement as extreme at all. You've shown support for Native Americans in various threads so I assume you understand how assimilation has been a form of genocide for Natives- not as extreme as small pox infested blankets and outright murder, but if you study the history, it is just as much a form of genocide. The same thing has been applied to African Americans throughout our history. So is not referring to an intelligent opposition to this and any form of assimilation "extreme" rather inaccurate?

I know the history and I think you know where I stand. Come on Brian. Saying that African Americans joining the middle class is genocide to sane people? Given reality, that is pretty extreme.

I think his point is that assimilation is more than just joining the middle class. I can only imagine the frustration of black activists generation upon generation. Progress at a snails pace is the American way.

But what do I know? Baraka knows far more about all this than I do and it is just one facet of the man. His position includes "an agenda of economic, social, racial, gender, climate, indigenous and immigrant justice." Sounds good to me.

http://www.jill2016.com/jill_stein_selects_ajamu_baraka_as_vp

lukin2006

"government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth" - gettysburg address

Doesn't say anywhere in that line that you must have 30 years at the taxpayer trough to be a politician...

It also doest say anywhere in that line that politicians are the only one that should decide.

You could almost interpret that line to mean direct democracy

Jill Stein is every bit qualified to be president, even more qualified than the shit for candidates that dominate our nightly news with garbage...

PJfanwillneverleave1

lukin2006 said:

Jill Stein is every bit qualified to be president, even more qualified than the shit for candidates that dominate our nightly news with garbage...

American

brianlux

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

lukin2006 said:

Jill Stein is every bit qualified to be president, even more qualified than the shit for candidates that dominate our nightly news with garbage...

American

Oh are you missing out, haha!

lukin2006 said:

"government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth" - gettysburg address

Doesn't say anywhere in that line that you must have 30 years at the taxpayer trough to be a politician...

It also doest say anywhere in that line that politicians are the only one that should decide.

You could almost interpret that line to mean direct democracy

Jill Stein is every bit qualified to be president, even more qualified than the shit for candidates that dominate our nightly news with garbage...

Absolutely. Too bad more of us don't believe this.

JC29856

The saddest part of this election isn't Clinton's career corruption or Trumps escapades, it's that Stein won't garner 5% of the vote.

lukin2006

JC29856 said:

The saddest part of this election isn't Clinton's career corruption or Trumps escapades, it's that Stein won't garner 5% of the vote.

True...even sadder considering Clinton and Trumps unpopularity...

rgambs

lukin2006 said:

"government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth" - gettysburg address

Doesn't say anywhere in that line that you must have 30 years at the taxpayer trough to be a politician...

It also doest say anywhere in that line that politicians are the only one that should decide.

You could almost interpret that line to mean direct democracy

Jill Stein is every bit qualified to be president, even more qualified than the shit for candidates that dominate our nightly news with garbage...

I agree in spirit, but I have practical concerns.
It is a hell of a big job. More important than having experience at such a big job is having a network of competent, experienced people you trust and rely on to fill cabinet positions and to advise you.
Does Stein have such a network? Surely ahe can find competent, experienced people to advise her, but personal and professional relationships take time to develop and mature.

Everyone scorns the backroom dealings, the maneuvering and dealing, but that is how things get done in the world, in both personal and professional relationships.
You can't expect great results if you go to your boss, family, friend, or spouse and say: "I need you to go out on a limb for me, you have to compromise yourself and you might fall and get hurt but I can't promise I will reciprocate because I might have to compromise on something that's important, and I just can't do that."
It isn't a great strategy and Stein will have to employ it with many people that are complete strangers.
How does she get what she wants done without comitting evil compromises that her followers will scorn her for when nobody owes her any favors and she can't promise them anything in return?

Free

lukin2006 said:

JC29856 said:

The saddest part of this election isn't Clinton's career corruption or Trumps escapades, it's that Stein won't garner 5% of the vote.

True...even sadder considering Clinton and Trumps unpopularity...

Don't you know... mostly everyone loves a circus.

lukin2006

Clinton's campaign chair John Podesta's brother Tony is the top US lobbyist for Saudi Arabia. #FollowTheMoney https://t.co/kPbH4vsXal

— Dr. Jill Stein (@DrJillStein) November 2, 2016

brianlux

JC29856 said:

The saddest part of this election isn't Clinton's career corruption or Trumps escapades, it's that Stein won't garner 5% of the vote.

It's not likely to happen but not giving up on it. There could be a lot of people just not saying they will vote for Stein yet who will. Maybe even a few of them around these parts.

g under p

JC29856 said:

The saddest part of this election isn't Clinton's career corruption or Trumps escapades, it's that Stein won't garner 5% of the vote.

I certainly hope she does get 5% but I doubt it being here in Florida. I voted for her and I'm hoping she gets that 5% so that in the next election presidential elections they will be a mandate for a third party.

Peace