Constructive Criticism for the Ten Club

stone25

In my personal experience: the early entry "privilege" was useless during the Barcelona and Madrid shows. The reason I got in the 10C in the first place was to see the band as near as possible and SAFE. But the crowds were brutal, violent, agressive and we had to go back. In Madrid we just saw it from like Row 15. Plus, the tickets were standing, we bought them without option to chose from and at the most expensive prize range on the vecinity of 50 euro (which would be seated). So, to make a long story short, being a 10c member meant:

1.- paying more than rest of the non-10c fans, which got the same tickets at 38 euros. somebody took advantage of our faith in the band.

2.- missing the option to be seated or standing (I would have liked buying tickets for one show standing and one seated)

3.- getting into the venue 15 minutes earlier but forced to the back by brutes, some i regret to inform: wearing bracelets (i know this is not the case for everybody, but i'm not the only one either).


anyone mind sharing?

Stereotype

Yeah I can see your point. If I was a 10c member I would like to have it your way too. But I'm not.

I'm a Pearl Jam fan for a long long time...so why am I not a 10c member?
Well for a long time I didn't even know that such thing existed..see I'm into their music..I don't search band photos on the net and I don't really care which is their favourite beer...and I have nothing against people that do that, don't get me wrong. I am also a student, with not so many incomes (well I've got a scolarship.. (my dad left, and mom was long unemployed) so paying some extra money to be a so called member didn't seem so right to me- not that I wouldn't want better tickets...
To be honest, the fact that someone who's got 10c ticket, because he/she just got more money then I do, and because of that is standing 10 meters (or feet or whatever are your measures) closer to the stage than I do, is just repulsive. What if I deserve it more? Money is the least appropriate measure of that.
This month in Zagreb will be my first show (couldn't go when they were in my country Slovenia years back) and I am really happy that I will be able to go close to the stage..that is if i'm lucky but still..I have a chance..just like everybody else..I won't push and be violent, that really sucks I agree with you on that 100%..
Ok shit, I've lost it...All I wanted to say is..I understand you...you've paid some extra and want something more..it's how this world works...I'm sorry for that..but there is another perspective..

josevolution

stone25 wrote:

In my personal experience: the early entry "privilege" was useless during the Barcelona and Madrid shows. The reason I got in the 10C in the first place was to see the band as near as possible and SAFE. But the crowds were brutal, violent, agressive and we had to go back. In Madrid we just saw it from like Row 15. Plus, the tickets were standing, we bought them without option to chose from and at the most expensive prize range on the vecinity of 50 euro (which would be seated). So, to make a long story short, being a 10c member meant:

1.- paying more than rest of the non-10c fans, which got the same tickets at 38 euros. somebody took advantage of our faith in the band.

2.- missing the option to be seated or standing (I would have liked buying tickets for one show standing and one seated)

3.- getting into the venue 15 minutes earlier but forced to the back by brutes, some i regret to inform: wearing bracelets (i know this is not the case for everybody, but i'm not the only one either).


anyone mind sharing?

so the show you attended was it general admission ? on the floor.....

newagehippie

stone25 wrote:

In my personal experience: the early entry "privilege" was useless during the Barcelona and Madrid shows. The reason I got in the 10C in the first place was to see the band as near as possible and SAFE. But the crowds were brutal, violent, agressive and we had to go back. In Madrid we just saw it from like Row 15. Plus, the tickets were standing, we bought them without option to chose from and at the most expensive prize range on the vecinity of 50 euro (which would be seated). So, to make a long story short, being a 10c member meant:

1.- paying more than rest of the non-10c fans, which got the same tickets at 38 euros. somebody took advantage of our faith in the band.

2.- missing the option to be seated or standing (I would have liked buying tickets for one show standing and one seated)

3.- getting into the venue 15 minutes earlier but forced to the back by brutes, some i regret to inform: wearing bracelets (i know this is not the case for everybody, but i'm not the only one either).


anyone mind sharing?

I see your point. I went over to the Dublin gig, and it was my first experience with out seats. I must say it was a great expereience, the crowd wasn't very forceful, mostly everyone respected there small space. I am glad I went, and I ended up on the barrier, but if I could have my choice, I prefer the States shows, where there are seats, and no pit. Unfortunately, my number sux, so I never get closer than 15-20, except on a rare occasion, but over seas, with early admission, there is no seinority, it is based on who gets there first, so everyone has a chance...which is cool for us not so senior fans. On the otherhand, I couldn't deal with the pit everyshow...I much prefer to be 15 rows back and feel a little "safer" for lack of a better word. The 10C does what they can, and unfortunately they can't save the world in one day.......

SPALMA

Same thing happened in Lisbon. I had guys' elbows in my face trying to push me back so they could get in front of me.

HAd to watch it from the back even though I waited 7.5 hours and was 2nd row in front of Mike.

The second night we bought first balcony (seated) tickets (a few were released the next morning) that were also general admission. Gave away my 10c tickets and bracelets. Ended up with the best seats in the house right off the side of the stage- we stood the whole show but had plenty of room to dance. And we could see everything.

But, it cost us the price of double tickets and a few bruises.

Niko80

I am pretty happy with the early entry privilege. I was at the barcelona show and both lisbon and I managed to get second/third row. I would never have gotten there unless I had a ten club ticket.

As for the moshing, I don't mind that. I dont push people around or anything, but I like to jump, dance and and sweat like a pig troughout the show. It makes the concert experience more memorable and fun. I have said this before, I dont like to have a seat. It takes away from the experience and it feels like going to a movie. Too many people use the chairs, sitting down and asking you to sit down too so that they can see. Its alot more fun when people around you are partying their asses off right in your face. It is so contageous(sp?) that you loose your own mind as well and join the party. I don't participate in moshing. I don't like the idea to loose half of the show because you are gonna jump into people and get pushed right back. Im concentrating on the music, but I'd like it to be a bit intense around me and it certainly was in Barcelona especially. I had so much fun in all the concerts.

On the other hand, I do consider the people standing around me and I am aware of their positions and movement. I am not intentionally hurting anyone as I go. I didnt get hurt during the barcelona gig, but I saw some people getting crowdsurfers shoes right in the head. Cant be comfy!

My take on this is that if you are just going to stand there watching, you might as well be doing that a little further back. The band has many times clarified that they feed off the crowd's energy. It makes much more sense for the people giving it all to be closest to the stage. I also think Eddie is sharing that view. He seems to be having a blast here in europe!

Peace..

Heineken Helen

I love the pits... I was at the barrier for Dublin and the Astoria and it was fantastic. I'm only 5'4 but people at both were generally respectful, especially Dublin and the barrier was padded there too and I like moving with the crowd when they're making me jump. I was seated in Verona and it was just as nice but different nice. We didn't have to in til 8.45 - got to our seats and the band was on 5 minutes later pretty much... and we had our own space and were still able to rock out but I dunno, I just love the closeness of the crowd in the pit.

dunkman

newagehippie wrote:

I see your point. I went over to the Dublin gig, and it was my first experience with out seats. I must say it was a great expereience, the crowd wasn't very forceful, mostly everyone respected there small space. I am glad I went, and I ended up on the barrier, but if I could have my choice, I prefer the States shows, where there are seats, and no pit. Unfortunately, my number sux, so I never get closer than 15-20, except on a rare occasion, but over seas, with early admission, there is no seinority, it is based on who gets there first, so everyone has a chance...which is cool for us not so senior fans. On the otherhand, I couldn't deal with the pit everyshow...I much prefer to be 15 rows back and feel a little "safer" for lack of a better word. The 10C does what they can, and unfortunately they can't save the world in one day.......

pussy

stone25

Stereotype wrote:

Yeah I can see your point. If I was a 10c member I would like to have it your way too. But I'm not.

I'm a Pearl Jam fan for a long long time...so why am I not a 10c member?
Well for a long time I didn't even know that such thing existed..see I'm into their music..I don't search band photos on the net and I don't really care which is their favourite beer...and I have nothing against people that do that, don't get me wrong. I am also a student, with not so many incomes (well I've got a scolarship.. (my dad left, and mom was long unemployed) so paying some extra money to be a so called member didn't seem so right to me- not that I wouldn't want better tickets...
To be honest, the fact that someone who's got 10c ticket, because he/she just got more money then I do, and because of that is standing 10 meters (or feet or whatever are your measures) closer to the stage than I do, is just repulsive. What if I deserve it more? Money is the least appropriate measure of that.
This month in Zagreb will be my first show (couldn't go when they were in my country Slovenia years back) and I am really happy that I will be able to go close to the stage..that is if i'm lucky but still..I have a chance..just like everybody else..I won't push and be violent, that really sucks I agree with you on that 100%..
Ok shit, I've lost it...All I wanted to say is..I understand you...you've paid some extra and want something more..it's how this world works...I'm sorry for that..but there is another perspective..

I agree. More money doesnt mean you're a better fan. The thing with this thread is that a perfect scenario is utopic. We all love going to the shows but our views differ regarding whats fun and/or appropiate. I like this dialogue. I also want to add that the seniority thing sucks. I know younger fans that are much into the band than me, they will never get to see PJ with this seniority rule. It occurs to me that the 10c could alter tactics from one tour to the other, for example: on this tour we have early entry, next tour be seniority, then the nexto one: no 10c priviledges, next one (they'll never stop!) first come first served... it gives more opportunities to everybody.

i bet some people will find this laughable.

Heineken Helen

stone25 wrote:

I agree. More money doesnt mean you're a better fan. The thing with this thread is that a perfect scenario is utopic. We all love going to the shows but our views differ regarding whats fun and/or appropiate. I like this dialogue. I also want to add that the seniority thing sucks. I know younger fans that are much into the band than me, they will never get to see PJ with this seniority rule. It occurs to me that the 10c could alter tactics from one tour to the other, for example: on this tour we have early entry, next tour be seniority, then the nexto one: no 10c priviledges, next one (they'll never stop!) first come first served... it gives more opportunities to everybody.

i bet some people will find this laughable.

Or maybe if they had some computer system of randomly giving everyone chance at first couple of rows. I dunno... I can understand where they're coming from though and other bands are following where PJ started. It works to a certain extent - it doesn't work for other people though.

SPALMA

stone25 wrote:

I like this dialogue. I also want to add that the seniority thing sucks. I know younger fans that are much into the band than me, they will never get to see PJ with this seniority rule. It occurs to me that the 10c could alter tactics from one tour to the other, for example: on this tour we have early entry, next tour be seniority, then the nexto one: no 10c priviledges, next one (they'll never stop!) first come first served... it gives more opportunities to everybody.

Agreed.

Kirkwood

In Prague 20% of the standing audience is have their own space in front of the scene.(including me=). Why can´t every place has it like that???

Horos

When Ten came out it had a liner note that said "Send $1 to join the Tenclub" which I did for two years. Then they stopped sending any reminders and I lost my seniority. I rejoined to try and get better seats a decade later for $20 and with my lack of seniority lost out. Leaves me with a feeling that 10c doesn't practice PJs philosophy.

Aranarth

I'm a member for about 5 years now, and I don't regret it. I have no complaints whatsoever about early entry in the shows I've attended, and about the moshing, well, this is a rock n roll concert.

Dercheef

Aranarth wrote:

I'm a member for about 5 years now, and I don't regret it. I have no complaints whatsoever about early entry in the shows I've attended, and about the moshing, well, this is a rock n roll concert.

Agreed

Mirella

I agree, some people in this years crowd really really sucked! Too bad, they ruined it for many people who were well behaved and looking forward to having a good time. Ten Club may not be able to stop this, but the 'bad guys' included some with wristbands... I still have a hard time thinking back about the disappointment of some realy nice people after this "trading magic for facts". Some of my friends even got a bit wounded and had to be taken out of the crowd. One of my friends had it really bad because security _refused_ to help her out. There's a lot more critical remarks I could make about security, but I'll stick to the Ten Club criticism:

- it's sad indeed that 10C tickets were more expensive than normal ones

- the early entrance was a good idea, but at the same time you divide people here into more groups: those who were lucky to get 10Club tickets and those who were not, no matter if they were members for 10+ years (paying the international fee).

- the ticket sales were pretty stressful, especially for people who wanted to go to more than one concert; all at once, is there really no other way? I'd prefer a 'wishlist', if necessary combined with a lottery system (at least that's fair) and with preference for people in their own country.

- with the high prices it was not possible for some people to buy pairs. Why can't we buy single tickets?

- something positive to end with: all cases of ticket transfers to other Ten Club members I've seen went smoothly!

groetjes,
Mirella (2006: normal tickets to 7 concerts, other people's ten club tickets to 3 more, and 3 ten club tickets of my own, thanks to the help of other people who let me use their credit cards when mine did not work on D-Day)

Mirella

Heineken Helen wrote:

I love the pits... I was at the barrier for Dublin and the Astoria and it was fantastic. I'm only 5'4 but people at both were generally respectful, especially Dublin and the barrier was padded there too and I like moving with the crowd when they're making me jump. I was seated in Verona and it was just as nice but different nice. We didn't have to in til 8.45 - got to our seats and the band was on 5 minutes later pretty much... and we had our own space and were still able to rock out but I dunno, I just love the closeness of the crowd in the pit.

I've always loved pits and was all for general admission, going to concerts since the early nineties including the wildest ones. But I've experienced too many assholes now in 2006, something I never expected in a Pearl Jam crowd. Right now, I'm either for small clubs or all seated concerts . Let those fools find other places to hurt people to 'enjoy' themselves. I don't mind sweat and I like to jump too, don't mind people touching eachother while partying... but people trying to give you brain or other damage just to get your spot are not my kind of crowd.

groetjes,
Mirella

Obi Once

Things I'd like to see better:

- Actually GET 10C tickets next time

- 1st have the 'locals' know they can order tickets, e.g. thru E-mail (and let them have 1st pick) than place them in 'public sale' online. I heard so many language in the 10C line, most not Dutch.

- Have a seperate front area at every venue, Arnhem was great, Antwerp kinda messy.

the_real_thinair

seats or a FOS area for 10C members in europe sounds great, but it also would mean a lot less $$$ (or rather €€€'s) for the band because less tickets can be sold and security would cost more. in order to offer FOS or seats for fan club members in europe the international 10C fee and extra fee per ticket would need to be raised to compensate for the loss. so how does a $50 membership fee and €25 extra per 10C ticket sound to you?

thinair

p.s. oh, and they would also have to charge more for posters. let's say €35 for ames posters and €45 klausen posters...

Jennytree

If I had to sit down at a PJ show or have seats there I think I'd go mad!!! I'm delighted I joined 10c, mostly because I met some legend people in the queue, and I get presale tickets, they inform me about everything I need to know without asking, and put up with a lot of people who give out... and we get free stuff! tbh, €30 a year isn't exactly breaking the bank! I'm willing to pay that to have a second chance to buy tickets for shows.

So, basically what you are after is a little 10c pit, with couches and someone serving you tea! It ain't gonna happen...

bootlegger10

stone25 wrote:

I agree. More money doesnt mean you're a better fan. .

It's fucking $20 a year. We aren't talking about 5,000 dollars here. If you don't have $20 a year for the Ten Club then you shouldn't be going to shows in general. Use the money you do have for something more responsible. And not paying $20 to be in the Ten Club does mean you aren't a better fan.

toaster

Obi Once wrote:

- 1st have the 'locals' know they can order tickets, e.g. thru E-mail (and let them have 1st pick) than place them in 'public sale' online. I heard so many language in the 10C line, most not Dutch.

See, that I don't understand. Why should the locals have the 1st pick? Pearl Jam doesn't stop in every country in Europe, so why should the ones who are lucky enough to have them in their country/city have the 1st pick before people who didn't have a chanse to see Pearl Jam in their own country? Aren't those people who travel for hours, even days to get there just as dedicated fans as the others? I just think we "deserve" to get just as good seats as the people in that country, or at least a chanse to get just as good seats

GyöngyLekvár

come on guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! what is this complaining all about??? why people always have to complain about something??? why you cant just appreciate that you can join the fan club if you choose to (for not a terrific amount of money you get newsletter, holiday single and possible other opportunities), and we shall be happy that they do early entry, which means they do try to provide something special for the fans!!! obviously they cannot please everybody, but they really bloody do try!!!!

Mirella

toaster wrote:

See, that I don't understand. Why should the locals have the 1st pick? Pearl Jam doesn't stop in every country in Europe, so why should the ones who are lucky enough to have them in their country/city have the 1st pick before people who didn't have a chanse to see Pearl Jam in their own country? Aren't those people who travel for hours, even days to get there just as dedicated fans as the others? I just think we "deserve" to get just as good seats as the people in that country, or at least a chanse to get just as good seats

In a perfect situation every country has at least one Pearl Jam concert . But it is a bit sour that people were unable to get Ten Club tickets in their own country. I mean: with around 300 10C tickets per concert you've got all people in one country covered, on average. With the worldwide competition chances are smaller. Pure logic. People who don't travel may think it's unfair to not have a guarantee for a Ten Club ticket, and I can relate to that to some extend. It feels a bit strange to see other people in the fanclub line while you have 'normal' tickets.
I happen to like the international character of the Ten Club lines; that's something to sherish, good for world peace in the long term (apart from the few people fighting to get in front )

groetjes,
Mirella

newagehippie

dunkman1974 wrote:

pussy

Nice.....where were you in Dublin....oh yeah...in the back with the wifey...:D

Buru

newagehippie wrote:

Nice.....where were you in Dublin....oh yeah...in the back with the wifey...:D

that was below the belt



I think a separate Pit is a good idea, for TC members and those who get there early enough.

And issuing more TC tickets, they simply are not enough

toaster

Mirella wrote:

In a perfect situation every country has at least one Pearl Jam concert . But it is a bit sour that people were unable to get Ten Club tickets in their own country. I mean: with around 300 10C tickets per concert you've got all people in one country covered, on average. With the worldwide competition chances are smaller. Pure logic. People who don't travel may think it's unfair to not have a guarantee for a Ten Club ticket, and I can relate to that to some extend. It feels a bit strange to see other people in the fanclub line while you have 'normal' tickets.
I happen to like the international character of the Ten Club lines; that's something to sherish, good for world peace in the long term (apart from the few people fighting to get in front )

groetjes,
Mirella

yes, in a perfect world pearl jam would tour around the whole world every year
bBut as long as that won't happen; why punish the ones who actually spends a lot of time, money and effort on getting to the concerts because it isn't in their country? If anything, they've probably worked a lot more to get to the concert than the "locals". I completly understand where you're coming from though, I just find it a bit unfair as long as people travel to other countries when Pearl Jam doesn't play in their own

All in all, I like the system they had this tour. 10c tickets and then those who get there early enough can get into the front area, worked fine in Berlin at least..

SoonForgotten2

I think the one thing that needs to change is that Europeans should have the first chance for Euro tickets. Let US 10C members have a chance to buy tickets for the Euro shows after a period of time that allows Euro members a chance to get tickets. After all we do pay more for our memberships and they play here so rarely. Plus from much of what I've seen, US members bought up tickets on the chance they'd be able to make it over. Many transfer offers or extra tickets came from US members who either couldn't make the trip themselves or who had a friend who couldn't. This is nothing against the US members who did come over. I met some great fans, but there was definitely a flip side to that and I was really amazed how somehow all the US members managed to get 10C tickets to shows that myself and other Euro fans found impossible.

newagehippie

SoonForgotten2 wrote:

I think the one thing that needs to change is that Europeans should have the first chance for Euro tickets. Let US 10C members have a chance to buy tickets for the Euro shows after a period of time that allows Euro members a chance to get tickets. After all we do pay more for our memberships and they play here so rarely. Plus from much of what I've seen, US members bought up tickets on the chance they'd be able to make it over. Many transfer offers or extra tickets came from US members who either couldn't make the trip themselves or who had a friend who couldn't. This is nothing against the US members who did come over. I met some great fans, but there was definitely a flip side to that and I was really amazed how somehow all the US members managed to get 10C tickets to shows that myself and other Euro fans found impossible.

That's like saying "let the people who live in the state that the concert is in have first dibs", and I sorta agree. But it should be limited to having priority to only one show, the rest is a crap shoot. Although, I prefer past years when all 10C memebers who wanted to purchase tix could...after all it is the majority of their fan base.......

SoonForgotten2

newagehippie wrote:

That's like saying "let the people who live in the state that the concert is in have first dibs", and I sorta agree. But it should be limited to having priority to only one show, the rest is a crap shoot. Although, I prefer past years when all 10C memebers who wanted to purchase tix could...after all it is the majority of their fan base.......

Don't forget that most shows had only 150 pairs of tickets and some had 100 (from what I've heard). In the US, I know that fan club seats had been limited to 10% of the venue capacity- which is a hell of a lot more than 300 tickets. I disagree about the state issue because they don't hit all the states. I'm saying that at the least the continent should get priority- the same would go for South America and Australia. There's a difference between driving a few hours to another state or even a 2-3 hour flight compared to crossing oceans. That's cool if you're actually going to do that, but I think the continents' fans should have first dibs, especially when there are so few tickets available in the first place.

newagehippie

SoonForgotten2 wrote:

Don't forget that most shows had only 150 pairs of tickets and some had 100 (from what I've heard). In the US, I know that fan club seats had been limited to 10% of the venue capacity- which is a hell of a lot more than 300 tickets. I disagree about the state issue because they don't hit all the states. I'm saying that at the least the continent should get priority- the same would go for South America and Australia. There's a difference between driving a few hours to another state or even a 2-3 hour flight compared to crossing oceans. That's cool if you're actually going to do that, but I think the continents' fans should have first dibs, especially when there are so few tickets available in the first place.

With the offset in the # of fans in the states/ticket, to the number of fans in other countries/ticket, I don't think it was too different. If it makes you feel any better, Dublin was the only show I got `10C tix for, I was shut out on all of the US shows I attended.....