Bernie Sanders for President
Comments
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what dreams said:
Totally agree with mrussel1. I am so tired of being told that I only choose what I choose because I'm not informed.
I don't hate Bernie or his supporters just because I will support Clinton in the general. I totally agree that there is vast income inequality in this country. I just don't spend my days wondering about everybody else's income. I spend my days wondering what I can do for myself to improve my own lot. I absolutely reject the idea that the government can solve my problems or that somehow we need to elect Bernie so that all the corporations roll over and start handing out cake to the peasants.
Honestly, reading though all of Free's and brianlux's posts . . . They come across as desperate. I understand and appreciate the passion, but replaying the same old lines over and over, sometimes bolded, sometimes in caps, is not persuasive at all. You can only say the same things so many times before people stop listening, so yes, you are talking to a wall. Shouting louder each time isn't going to change that. It seems like an enormous waste of energy to think your campaign efforts on PJ.com is going to change the course of the election. But do carry on if you will.
First of all, you're posting in a Bernie Sanders for president thread, so if you believe you're being told something specific, perhaps maybe you should read another political thread.
And remind me who pretty much is the only one who posts info with credible sources, fact check and snopes here. Oh yeah, me! Yet, you think Brian and I are desperate.
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Sorry, I don't know how to attach links or copy and paste links on my phone, and since I don't consider posting on a Pearl Jam forum the equivalent of writing a doctoral thesis, I don't plan on learning how.
I second hedo's statement above about the lack of consideration for other people's intelligence in this thread. Calling other people uninformed while bragging about your "unbiased" Facebook news source is pretty lazy argumentation. You do, in fact, sound like my brother, the Trump supporter. All his "unbiased" news comes from Facebook as well.0 -
If you're using an iPhone or similar device and are interested in conversing on a current events site, you really would do well to learn how to copy and paste links. It just can't be that hard and I'm telling you this as one admittedly marginally adept at using electronic devices. I don't even know how to take a picture with my cell phone but if I were engaged in trading phone picture I would learn how to in probably less than two minutes.what dreams said:Sorry, I don't know how to attach links or copy and paste links on my phone, and since I don't consider posting on a Pearl Jam forum the equivalent of writing a doctoral thesis, I don't plan on learning how.
""unbiased" Facebook news source"? That's all that you seen anyone supporting Bernie here post? I don't think so. That sounds like a desperate attempt to disparage Sanders supporters. Are you sure you can't some up with something more substantial than that or are we just playing some "attack the opponent" video game here?what dreams said:I second hedo's statement above about the lack of consideration for other people's intelligence in this thread. Calling other people uninformed while bragging about your "unbiased" Facebook news source is pretty lazy argumentation. You do, in fact, sound like my brother, the Trump supporter. All his "unbiased" news comes from Facebook as well.
"It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
Yeah, this isn't dismissive at all, Brian. I hope you can see how the "attack the opponent" game has been played.Free said:what dreams said:Totally agree with mrussel1. I am so tired of being told that I only choose what I choose because I'm not informed.
I don't hate Bernie or his supporters just because I will support Clinton in the general. I totally agree that there is vast income inequality in this country. I just don't spend my days wondering about everybody else's income. I spend my days wondering what I can do for myself to improve my own lot. I absolutely reject the idea that the government can solve my problems or that somehow we need to elect Bernie so that all the corporations roll over and start handing out cake to the peasants.
Honestly, reading though all of Free's and brianlux's posts . . . They come across as desperate. I understand and appreciate the passion, but replaying the same old lines over and over, sometimes bolded, sometimes in caps, is not persuasive at all. You can only say the same things so many times before people stop listening, so yes, you are talking to a wall. Shouting louder each time isn't going to change that. It seems like an enormous waste of energy to think your campaign efforts on PJ.com is going to change the course of the election. But do carry on if you will.
First of all, you're posting in a Bernie Sanders for president thread, so if you believe you're being told something specific, perhaps maybe you should read another political thread.
And remind me who pretty much is the only one who posts info with credible sources, fact check and snopes here. Oh yeah, me! Yet, you think Brian and I are desperate.
And who is anyone to dictate what should or shouldn't be read (or participated in?) here. More BS, unfortunately.0 -
Not "attack the opponent." For some reason the two of you keep setting yourselves up as opponents.brianlux said:
If you're using an iPhone or similar device and are interested in conversing on a current events site, you really would do well to learn how to copy and paste links. It just can't be that hard and I'm telling you this as one admittedly marginally adept at using electronic devices. I don't even know how to take a picture with my cell phone but if I were engaged in trading phone picture I would learn how to in probably less than two minutes.what dreams said:Sorry, I don't know how to attach links or copy and paste links on my phone, and since I don't consider posting on a Pearl Jam forum the equivalent of writing a doctoral thesis, I don't plan on learning how.
""unbiased" Facebook news source"? That's all that you seen anyone supporting Bernie here post? I don't think so. That sounds like a desperate attempt to disparage Sanders supporters. Are you sure you can't some up with something more substantial than that or are we just playing some "attack the opponent" video game here?what dreams said:I second hedo's statement above about the lack of consideration for other people's intelligence in this thread. Calling other people uninformed while bragging about your "unbiased" Facebook news source is pretty lazy argumentation. You do, in fact, sound like my brother, the Trump supporter. All his "unbiased" news comes from Facebook as well.
I get you support Sanders to the death. I voted for him in the primary. But for goodness sakes, he's running as Democratic candidate, hoping to win the nomination so as to have the DNC machine at his disposal if he wins. I do find it pretty pathetic that if he were to win, all of the Clinton supporters who have worked damn hard for the party would have to support someone who just spits in their face day in and out? My god, if the Democratic party were so awful, then he should have run as the socialist independent that he is. I don't blame the DNC one bit for standing up to him. You can't run as a party candidate while shitting on the party.0 -
Dude, respectfully, you are uninformed.what dreams said:
Not "attack the opponent." For some reason the two of you keep setting yourselves up as opponents.brianlux said:
If you're using an iPhone or similar device and are interested in conversing on a current events site, you really would do well to learn how to copy and paste links. It just can't be that hard and I'm telling you this as one admittedly marginally adept at using electronic devices. I don't even know how to take a picture with my cell phone but if I were engaged in trading phone picture I would learn how to in probably less than two minutes.what dreams said:Sorry, I don't know how to attach links or copy and paste links on my phone, and since I don't consider posting on a Pearl Jam forum the equivalent of writing a doctoral thesis, I don't plan on learning how.
""unbiased" Facebook news source"? That's all that you seen anyone supporting Bernie here post? I don't think so. That sounds like a desperate attempt to disparage Sanders supporters. Are you sure you can't some up with something more substantial than that or are we just playing some "attack the opponent" video game here?what dreams said:I second hedo's statement above about the lack of consideration for other people's intelligence in this thread. Calling other people uninformed while bragging about your "unbiased" Facebook news source is pretty lazy argumentation. You do, in fact, sound like my brother, the Trump supporter. All his "unbiased" news comes from Facebook as well.
I get you support Sanders to the death. I voted for him in the primary. But for goodness sakes, he's running as Democratic candidate, hoping to win the nomination so as to have the DNC machine at his disposal if he wins. I do find it pretty pathetic that if he were to win, all of the Clinton supporters who have worked damn hard for the party would have to support someone who just spits in their face day in and out? My god, if the Democratic party were so awful, then he should have run as the socialist independent that he is. I don't blame the DNC one bit for standing up to him. You can't run as a party candidate while shitting on the party.
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Based on what? There's nothing in what "what dreams' wrote that could possibly lead someone to the conclusion that they are 'uninformed' about Sanders or Clinton. You really fail to see all the irony in your posts.Free said:
Dude, respectfully, you are uninformed.what dreams said:
Not "attack the opponent." For some reason the two of you keep setting yourselves up as opponents.brianlux said:
If you're using an iPhone or similar device and are interested in conversing on a current events site, you really would do well to learn how to copy and paste links. It just can't be that hard and I'm telling you this as one admittedly marginally adept at using electronic devices. I don't even know how to take a picture with my cell phone but if I were engaged in trading phone picture I would learn how to in probably less than two minutes.what dreams said:Sorry, I don't know how to attach links or copy and paste links on my phone, and since I don't consider posting on a Pearl Jam forum the equivalent of writing a doctoral thesis, I don't plan on learning how.
""unbiased" Facebook news source"? That's all that you seen anyone supporting Bernie here post? I don't think so. That sounds like a desperate attempt to disparage Sanders supporters. Are you sure you can't some up with something more substantial than that or are we just playing some "attack the opponent" video game here?what dreams said:I second hedo's statement above about the lack of consideration for other people's intelligence in this thread. Calling other people uninformed while bragging about your "unbiased" Facebook news source is pretty lazy argumentation. You do, in fact, sound like my brother, the Trump supporter. All his "unbiased" news comes from Facebook as well.
I get you support Sanders to the death. I voted for him in the primary. But for goodness sakes, he's running as Democratic candidate, hoping to win the nomination so as to have the DNC machine at his disposal if he wins. I do find it pretty pathetic that if he were to win, all of the Clinton supporters who have worked damn hard for the party would have to support someone who just spits in their face day in and out? My god, if the Democratic party were so awful, then he should have run as the socialist independent that he is. I don't blame the DNC one bit for standing up to him. You can't run as a party candidate while shitting on the party.0 -
Maybe so. It doesn't negate the fact that this thread appears to be a thread with only one or two posters actually supplying information, while others are about merely being critical of the candidate with little real debate or good discussion.hedonist said:
Yeah, this isn't dismissive at all, Brian. I hope you can see how the "attack the opponent" game has been played.Free said:what dreams said:Totally agree with mrussel1. I am so tired of being told that I only choose what I choose because I'm not informed.
I don't hate Bernie or his supporters just because I will support Clinton in the general. I totally agree that there is vast income inequality in this country. I just don't spend my days wondering about everybody else's income. I spend my days wondering what I can do for myself to improve my own lot. I absolutely reject the idea that the government can solve my problems or that somehow we need to elect Bernie so that all the corporations roll over and start handing out cake to the peasants.
Honestly, reading though all of Free's and brianlux's posts . . . They come across as desperate. I understand and appreciate the passion, but replaying the same old lines over and over, sometimes bolded, sometimes in caps, is not persuasive at all. You can only say the same things so many times before people stop listening, so yes, you are talking to a wall. Shouting louder each time isn't going to change that. It seems like an enormous waste of energy to think your campaign efforts on PJ.com is going to change the course of the election. But do carry on if you will.
First of all, you're posting in a Bernie Sanders for president thread, so if you believe you're being told something specific, perhaps maybe you should read another political thread.
And remind me who pretty much is the only one who posts info with credible sources, fact check and snopes here. Oh yeah, me! Yet, you think Brian and I are desperate.
And who is anyone to dictate what should or shouldn't be read (or participated in?) here. More BS, unfortunately.0 -
Ah, so laughing at someone and (unnecessarily) calling them uninformed IS real debate and good discussion.Free said:
Maybe so. It doesn't negate the fact that this thread appears to be a thread with only one or two posters actually supplying information, while others are about merely being critical of the candidate with little real debate or good discussion.hedonist said:
Yeah, this isn't dismissive at all, Brian. I hope you can see how the "attack the opponent" game has been played.Free said:what dreams said:Totally agree with mrussel1. I am so tired of being told that I only choose what I choose because I'm not informed.
I don't hate Bernie or his supporters just because I will support Clinton in the general. I totally agree that there is vast income inequality in this country. I just don't spend my days wondering about everybody else's income. I spend my days wondering what I can do for myself to improve my own lot. I absolutely reject the idea that the government can solve my problems or that somehow we need to elect Bernie so that all the corporations roll over and start handing out cake to the peasants.
Honestly, reading though all of Free's and brianlux's posts . . . They come across as desperate. I understand and appreciate the passion, but replaying the same old lines over and over, sometimes bolded, sometimes in caps, is not persuasive at all. You can only say the same things so many times before people stop listening, so yes, you are talking to a wall. Shouting louder each time isn't going to change that. It seems like an enormous waste of energy to think your campaign efforts on PJ.com is going to change the course of the election. But do carry on if you will.
First of all, you're posting in a Bernie Sanders for president thread, so if you believe you're being told something specific, perhaps maybe you should read another political thread.
And remind me who pretty much is the only one who posts info with credible sources, fact check and snopes here. Oh yeah, me! Yet, you think Brian and I are desperate.
And who is anyone to dictate what should or shouldn't be read (or participated in?) here. More BS, unfortunately.
Maybe so indeed, by some double standards.
Got it, and it's a shame.0 -
What if someone is complimenting the candidate with little real debate or good discussion? Is that okay with you?
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
I don't play your games.hedonist said:
Ah, so laughing at someone and (unnecessarily) calling them uninformed IS real debate and good discussion.Free said:
Maybe so. It doesn't negate the fact that this thread appears to be a thread with only one or two posters actually supplying information, while others are about merely being critical of the candidate with little real debate or good discussion.hedonist said:
Yeah, this isn't dismissive at all, Brian. I hope you can see how the "attack the opponent" game has been played.Free said:what dreams said:Totally agree with mrussel1. I am so tired of being told that I only choose what I choose because I'm not informed.
I don't hate Bernie or his supporters just because I will support Clinton in the general. I totally agree that there is vast income inequality in this country. I just don't spend my days wondering about everybody else's income. I spend my days wondering what I can do for myself to improve my own lot. I absolutely reject the idea that the government can solve my problems or that somehow we need to elect Bernie so that all the corporations roll over and start handing out cake to the peasants.
Honestly, reading though all of Free's and brianlux's posts . . . They come across as desperate. I understand and appreciate the passion, but replaying the same old lines over and over, sometimes bolded, sometimes in caps, is not persuasive at all. You can only say the same things so many times before people stop listening, so yes, you are talking to a wall. Shouting louder each time isn't going to change that. It seems like an enormous waste of energy to think your campaign efforts on PJ.com is going to change the course of the election. But do carry on if you will.
First of all, you're posting in a Bernie Sanders for president thread, so if you believe you're being told something specific, perhaps maybe you should read another political thread.
And remind me who pretty much is the only one who posts info with credible sources, fact check and snopes here. Oh yeah, me! Yet, you think Brian and I are desperate.
And who is anyone to dictate what should or shouldn't be read (or participated in?) here. More BS, unfortunately.
Maybe so indeed, by some double standards.
Got it, and it's a shame.0 -
Oh, the drama.0
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I don't want to play with you anyway, so there.Free said:
I don't play your games.hedonist said:
Ah, so laughing at someone and (unnecessarily) calling them uninformed IS real debate and good discussion.Free said:
Maybe so. It doesn't negate the fact that this thread appears to be a thread with only one or two posters actually supplying information, while others are about merely being critical of the candidate with little real debate or good discussion.hedonist said:
Yeah, this isn't dismissive at all, Brian. I hope you can see how the "attack the opponent" game has been played.Free said:what dreams said:Totally agree with mrussel1. I am so tired of being told that I only choose what I choose because I'm not informed.
I don't hate Bernie or his supporters just because I will support Clinton in the general. I totally agree that there is vast income inequality in this country. I just don't spend my days wondering about everybody else's income. I spend my days wondering what I can do for myself to improve my own lot. I absolutely reject the idea that the government can solve my problems or that somehow we need to elect Bernie so that all the corporations roll over and start handing out cake to the peasants.
Honestly, reading though all of Free's and brianlux's posts . . . They come across as desperate. I understand and appreciate the passion, but replaying the same old lines over and over, sometimes bolded, sometimes in caps, is not persuasive at all. You can only say the same things so many times before people stop listening, so yes, you are talking to a wall. Shouting louder each time isn't going to change that. It seems like an enormous waste of energy to think your campaign efforts on PJ.com is going to change the course of the election. But do carry on if you will.
First of all, you're posting in a Bernie Sanders for president thread, so if you believe you're being told something specific, perhaps maybe you should read another political thread.
And remind me who pretty much is the only one who posts info with credible sources, fact check and snopes here. Oh yeah, me! Yet, you think Brian and I are desperate.
And who is anyone to dictate what should or shouldn't be read (or participated in?) here. More BS, unfortunately.
Maybe so indeed, by some double standards.
Got it, and it's a shame.
(regressing is fun, isn't it?)
All I'm saying is that it's possible to discuss and debate, and leave dickishness and condescension at the door.
Can't be that difficult, right?0 -
Free, haven't you noticed a pattern between you and everyone that doesn't love Sanders? Haven't you noticed the conflict that invariably ensues, with you as the common denominator?
I know that Hedonist is probably center right... GodFather is definitely right wing, PJSoul seems to be solidly left, Brian is very left, etc. But everyone else seems to be able to discuss the candidates, even passionately, without it devolving. I've disagreed with just about everyone here on some point or another, but it manages to stay civil. It would be great if you could think about that for a few minutes before your next post.0 -
Am I left or far left on your scale?mrussel1 said:Free, haven't you noticed a pattern between you and everyone that doesn't love Sanders? Haven't you noticed the conflict that invariably ensues, with you as the common denominator?
I know that Hedonist is probably center right... GodFather is definitely right wing, PJSoul seems to be solidly left, Brian is very left, etc. But everyone else seems to be able to discuss the candidates, even passionately, without it devolving. I've disagreed with just about everyone here on some point or another, but it manages to stay civil. It would be great if you could think about that for a few minutes before your next post.0 -
I'm pretty sure you're right of center.PJfanwillneverleave1 said:
Am I left or far left on your scale?mrussel1 said:Free, haven't you noticed a pattern between you and everyone that doesn't love Sanders? Haven't you noticed the conflict that invariably ensues, with you as the common denominator?
I know that Hedonist is probably center right... GodFather is definitely right wing, PJSoul seems to be solidly left, Brian is very left, etc. But everyone else seems to be able to discuss the candidates, even passionately, without it devolving. I've disagreed with just about everyone here on some point or another, but it manages to stay civil. It would be great if you could think about that for a few minutes before your next post.
Edit - and I think you're Canadian, correct? Or at least not an American. You've made references as if you're not in the States.0 -
Shitting on the party? Isn't it the duty of party members to call bullshit when they see it? Besides, as I see it, Bernie is more Democrat than Hillary who is more Republican conservative than Progressive Democrat- by a long shot, really.what dreams said:
Not "attack the opponent." For some reason the two of you keep setting yourselves up as opponents.brianlux said:
If you're using an iPhone or similar device and are interested in conversing on a current events site, you really would do well to learn how to copy and paste links. It just can't be that hard and I'm telling you this as one admittedly marginally adept at using electronic devices. I don't even know how to take a picture with my cell phone but if I were engaged in trading phone picture I would learn how to in probably less than two minutes.what dreams said:Sorry, I don't know how to attach links or copy and paste links on my phone, and since I don't consider posting on a Pearl Jam forum the equivalent of writing a doctoral thesis, I don't plan on learning how.
""unbiased" Facebook news source"? That's all that you seen anyone supporting Bernie here post? I don't think so. That sounds like a desperate attempt to disparage Sanders supporters. Are you sure you can't some up with something more substantial than that or are we just playing some "attack the opponent" video game here?what dreams said:I second hedo's statement above about the lack of consideration for other people's intelligence in this thread. Calling other people uninformed while bragging about your "unbiased" Facebook news source is pretty lazy argumentation. You do, in fact, sound like my brother, the Trump supporter. All his "unbiased" news comes from Facebook as well.
I get you support Sanders to the death. I voted for him in the primary. But for goodness sakes, he's running as Democratic candidate, hoping to win the nomination so as to have the DNC machine at his disposal if he wins. I do find it pretty pathetic that if he were to win, all of the Clinton supporters who have worked damn hard for the party would have to support someone who just spits in their face day in and out? My god, if the Democratic party were so awful, then he should have run as the socialist independent that he is. I don't blame the DNC one bit for standing up to him. You can't run as a party candidate while shitting on the party.
And, no, believe it or not I am not that loyal a Bernie fan. Loyal enough to defend strongly what I believe, yes. To the death, no way.
“I would never betray a friend to serve a cause. Never reject a friend to help an institution. Great nations may fall in ruin before I would sell a friend to save them.” –Edward Abbey
We may meet at a show one day and get along fantastically. I would stay true to that Abbey quote. Politics is not that personal to me. It's a much bigger picture than me and you.
"It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
^^^
Yes.
Centre right?
shhhh, don't tell anyone.0 -
I guess I'm uninformed enough to check the source of what you claimed to be an "unbiased" news article, only to see that the source itself unabashedly calls itself a progressive news source. I'm just pointing out how intellectually dishonest you are.Free said:
Dude, respectfully, you are uninformed.what dreams said:
Not "attack the opponent." For some reason the two of you keep setting yourselves up as opponents.brianlux said:
If you're using an iPhone or similar device and are interested in conversing on a current events site, you really would do well to learn how to copy and paste links. It just can't be that hard and I'm telling you this as one admittedly marginally adept at using electronic devices. I don't even know how to take a picture with my cell phone but if I were engaged in trading phone picture I would learn how to in probably less than two minutes.what dreams said:Sorry, I don't know how to attach links or copy and paste links on my phone, and since I don't consider posting on a Pearl Jam forum the equivalent of writing a doctoral thesis, I don't plan on learning how.
""unbiased" Facebook news source"? That's all that you seen anyone supporting Bernie here post? I don't think so. That sounds like a desperate attempt to disparage Sanders supporters. Are you sure you can't some up with something more substantial than that or are we just playing some "attack the opponent" video game here?what dreams said:I second hedo's statement above about the lack of consideration for other people's intelligence in this thread. Calling other people uninformed while bragging about your "unbiased" Facebook news source is pretty lazy argumentation. You do, in fact, sound like my brother, the Trump supporter. All his "unbiased" news comes from Facebook as well.
I get you support Sanders to the death. I voted for him in the primary. But for goodness sakes, he's running as Democratic candidate, hoping to win the nomination so as to have the DNC machine at his disposal if he wins. I do find it pretty pathetic that if he were to win, all of the Clinton supporters who have worked damn hard for the party would have to support someone who just spits in their face day in and out? My god, if the Democratic party were so awful, then he should have run as the socialist independent that he is. I don't blame the DNC one bit for standing up to him. You can't run as a party candidate while shitting on the party.
The real irony is how awful a spokesperson you are for your candidate. I truly did like Bernie enough early in the process to vote for him in March. But following this thread since then has totally turned me off to him in so many ways. It has *informed* me enough to believe that he really would be a horrible president. Thank you for showing me the error of my ways through all of your *informing.* I've read every article you've posted in this thread, and you are single-handedly responsible for my no longer supporting Sanders. You really can't blame the main stream media for that. They did a much better job at getting me to push that Sanders button than you ever could. That is what I call irony.
We will see how many Bernie voters leave the fold in the general. Based on past elections, it won't be enough to turn the presidency over to Trump. Good riddance to the ones who don't vote for HRC. They're just a bunch of unsuccessful high-jackers, as far as I can tell, who can't form a viable party of their own so they tried to steal this one.0 -
No Goddammit... This board is in 'Merica... and we spell it Center in these here parts.PJfanwillneverleave1 said:^^^
Yes.
Centre right?
shhhh, don't tell anyone.0
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