Hillary won more votes for President

Gern Blansten

http://www.politico.com/2016-election/results/map/president

Is this better? Same figures

Gern Blansten

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

So we're going to keep living in fantasyland, and keep it up that she has more votes. Way to Move on.

we all know that she lost. he is merely responding to the people claiming "more people voted trump", which is mathematically false. it really is that simple.

Thank you....I thought I was insane

Gern Blansten

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

benjs said:

It's not possible to attribute Clinton's loss or Trump's win to one factor, and trying to blame each other is part of the exact divisive rhetoric that I think (or at least hope) that we're all against. Not to be a walking cliche, but can't we just try to discuss and debate reasonably without resorting to insulting each other? Wouldn't that be more productive, and aren't we all interested in promoting productivity for the country and the world at large?

I am all for reasoned debate. Yet some people here continued to go after Bernie supporters for MONTHS. Turns out that they were wrong.

And they're still rooting for their weak Candidate that lost.

Meanwhile, it's because of the Democratic Party we have President Trump.

You think the democratic party would have won with bernie? I don't know about that. you don't think the country just wanted to swing back red like it usually does after 8 years of blue?

I don't think so. Bernie wouldn't have had to deal with the email issues, the bullshit Comey November surprise, etc. Plus....he wasn't a woman. Unfortunately our country is too backward to elect a woman....but it was fucking close.

This was a change election and even though Bernie was running as a Dem he was going to be "change."

benjs

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

benjs said:

It's not possible to attribute Clinton's loss or Trump's win to one factor, and trying to blame each other is part of the exact divisive rhetoric that I think (or at least hope) that we're all against. Not to be a walking cliche, but can't we just try to discuss and debate reasonably without resorting to insulting each other? Wouldn't that be more productive, and aren't we all interested in promoting productivity for the country and the world at large?

I am all for reasoned debate. Yet some people here continued to go after Bernie supporters for MONTHS. Turns out that they were wrong.

And they're still rooting for their weak Candidate that lost.

Meanwhile, it's because of the Democratic Party we have President Trump.

You think the democratic party would have won with bernie? I don't know about that. you don't think the country just wanted to swing back red like it usually does after 8 years of blue?

I don't think anyone can know that. Any kind of surmising what would've happened had Sanders been the nominee would be based on so many unknowns, including how people weigh so many factors: party allegiances, media coverage, male-dominant politics and/or society, white-dominant politics and/or society, American-dominant society, change, corruption. In addition, it would be based on how willing people are to buy in with or without critical thought. What matters now is the populace's ability to re-seize power from the political or wealthy elite - what happened yesterday should just be lessons learnt of the dangers of complacency, blind allegiance, and a populace that doesn't feel empowered in what's known as a democratic society.

pjalive21

Gern Blansten said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

benjs said:

It's not possible to attribute Clinton's loss or Trump's win to one factor, and trying to blame each other is part of the exact divisive rhetoric that I think (or at least hope) that we're all against. Not to be a walking cliche, but can't we just try to discuss and debate reasonably without resorting to insulting each other? Wouldn't that be more productive, and aren't we all interested in promoting productivity for the country and the world at large?

I am all for reasoned debate. Yet some people here continued to go after Bernie supporters for MONTHS. Turns out that they were wrong.

And they're still rooting for their weak Candidate that lost.

Meanwhile, it's because of the Democratic Party we have President Trump.

You think the democratic party would have won with bernie? I don't know about that. you don't think the country just wanted to swing back red like it usually does after 8 years of blue?

I don't think so. Bernie wouldn't have had to deal with the email issues, the bullshit Comey November surprise, etc. Plus....he wasn't a woman. Unfortunately our country is too backward to elect a woman....but it was fucking close.

This was a change election and even though Bernie was running as a Dem he was going to be "change."

I have to agree with Hugh here...it was inevitable to go red after 8 years of blue, but the surprise in all of that it was Trump and I may be in the minority but the word Socialism in any form would have prevented a Bernie win

Gern Blansten

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/306532-sanders-clinton-will-play-vital-role-in-future-of-the-democratic-party

Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) said Thursday that his former presidential rival, Hillary Clinton, will play a vital role in shaping the future for Democrats as the party seeks to recover from her disastrous election loss to Donald Trump.

“She has a very important role to play,” Sanders said at a breakfast hosted by the Christian Science Monitor. “She got more votes than Mr. Trump and was the Democratic nominee, so it goes without saying she has a very important role to play in the Democratic Party. ... We will not agree on every issue, but her voice is an important one and needs to be heard.”
Sanders disputed the notion that his attacks against Clinton — most notably on her paid speeches to Wall Street banks — may have contributed to her defeat in the general election against Trump.

“At the end of the day my candidacy ended up being helpful,” Sanders said. “If we believe that candidates should not be anointed — the Republicans had 17 candidates for their position. We had a heated, issue-oriented campaign, and my campaign brought millions of people into the political process, most of whom voted for Hillary Clinton. It played a positive role.”

Clinton made her first post-election public appearance on Wednesday night since her stunning defeat that has left Democrats in rebuilding mode.

Speaking at a Children’s Defense Fund gala in Washington, D.C., Clinton talked about the emotionally wrenching days she’s endured since her surprise defeat.

“I will admit, coming here tonight wasn't the easiest thing for me," Clinton said. "There have been a few times this past week where all I wanted to do was curl up with a good book and our dogs and never leave the house again."

HughFreakingDillon

benjs said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

benjs said:

It's not possible to attribute Clinton's loss or Trump's win to one factor, and trying to blame each other is part of the exact divisive rhetoric that I think (or at least hope) that we're all against. Not to be a walking cliche, but can't we just try to discuss and debate reasonably without resorting to insulting each other? Wouldn't that be more productive, and aren't we all interested in promoting productivity for the country and the world at large?

I am all for reasoned debate. Yet some people here continued to go after Bernie supporters for MONTHS. Turns out that they were wrong.

And they're still rooting for their weak Candidate that lost.

Meanwhile, it's because of the Democratic Party we have President Trump.

You think the democratic party would have won with bernie? I don't know about that. you don't think the country just wanted to swing back red like it usually does after 8 years of blue?

I don't think anyone can know that. Any kind of surmising what would've happened had Sanders been the nominee would be based on so many unknowns, including how people weigh so many factors: party allegiances, media coverage, male-dominant politics and/or society, white-dominant politics and/or society, American-dominant society, change, corruption. In addition, it would be based on how willing people are to buy in with or without critical thought. What matters now is the populace's ability to re-seize power from the political or wealthy elite - what happened yesterday should just be lessons learnt of the dangers of complacency, blind allegiance, and a populace that doesn't feel empowered in what's known as a democratic society.

I agree with this. I don't know why so many people keep chanting "bernie would have won!". There is no way to know that. I don't think the US was ready for an admitted socialist either.

Gern Blansten

The forums have certainly been more pleasant and intelligent recently. Can't quite put my finger on why....

Gern Blansten

pjalive21 said:

Gern Blansten said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

benjs said:

It's not possible to attribute Clinton's loss or Trump's win to one factor, and trying to blame each other is part of the exact divisive rhetoric that I think (or at least hope) that we're all against. Not to be a walking cliche, but can't we just try to discuss and debate reasonably without resorting to insulting each other? Wouldn't that be more productive, and aren't we all interested in promoting productivity for the country and the world at large?

I am all for reasoned debate. Yet some people here continued to go after Bernie supporters for MONTHS. Turns out that they were wrong.

And they're still rooting for their weak Candidate that lost.

Meanwhile, it's because of the Democratic Party we have President Trump.

You think the democratic party would have won with bernie? I don't know about that. you don't think the country just wanted to swing back red like it usually does after 8 years of blue?

I don't think so. Bernie wouldn't have had to deal with the email issues, the bullshit Comey November surprise, etc. Plus....he wasn't a woman. Unfortunately our country is too backward to elect a woman....but it was fucking close.

This was a change election and even though Bernie was running as a Dem he was going to be "change."

I have to agree with Hugh here...it was inevitable to go red after 8 years of blue, but the surprise in all of that it was Trump and I may be in the minority but the word Socialism in any form would have prevented a Bernie win

That was my initial concern with Bernie. But I think Bernie would be (or would have been) able to confront the label and convince people that his policies would be better than Trump.

JC29856

JC29856

HughFreakingDillon

Gern Blansten said:

The forums have certainly been more pleasant and intelligent recently. Can't quite put my finger on why....

Gern Blansten

JC29856 said:

lolobugg

Gern Blansten said:

pjalive21 said:

Gern Blansten said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

benjs said:

It's not possible to attribute Clinton's loss or Trump's win to one factor, and trying to blame each other is part of the exact divisive rhetoric that I think (or at least hope) that we're all against. Not to be a walking cliche, but can't we just try to discuss and debate reasonably without resorting to insulting each other? Wouldn't that be more productive, and aren't we all interested in promoting productivity for the country and the world at large?

I am all for reasoned debate. Yet some people here continued to go after Bernie supporters for MONTHS. Turns out that they were wrong.

And they're still rooting for their weak Candidate that lost.

Meanwhile, it's because of the Democratic Party we have President Trump.

You think the democratic party would have won with bernie? I don't know about that. you don't think the country just wanted to swing back red like it usually does after 8 years of blue?

I don't think so. Bernie wouldn't have had to deal with the email issues, the bullshit Comey November surprise, etc. Plus....he wasn't a woman. Unfortunately our country is too backward to elect a woman....but it was fucking close.

This was a change election and even though Bernie was running as a Dem he was going to be "change."

I have to agree with Hugh here...it was inevitable to go red after 8 years of blue, but the surprise in all of that it was Trump and I may be in the minority but the word Socialism in any form would have prevented a Bernie win

That was my initial concern with Bernie. But I think Bernie would be (or would have been) able to confront the label and convince people that his policies would be better than Trump.

I believe this too.

JimmyV

lolobugg said:

Gern Blansten said:

pjalive21 said:

Gern Blansten said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Free said:

benjs said:

It's not possible to attribute Clinton's loss or Trump's win to one factor, and trying to blame each other is part of the exact divisive rhetoric that I think (or at least hope) that we're all against. Not to be a walking cliche, but can't we just try to discuss and debate reasonably without resorting to insulting each other? Wouldn't that be more productive, and aren't we all interested in promoting productivity for the country and the world at large?

I am all for reasoned debate. Yet some people here continued to go after Bernie supporters for MONTHS. Turns out that they were wrong.

And they're still rooting for their weak Candidate that lost.

Meanwhile, it's because of the Democratic Party we have President Trump.

You think the democratic party would have won with bernie? I don't know about that. you don't think the country just wanted to swing back red like it usually does after 8 years of blue?

I don't think so. Bernie wouldn't have had to deal with the email issues, the bullshit Comey November surprise, etc. Plus....he wasn't a woman. Unfortunately our country is too backward to elect a woman....but it was fucking close.

This was a change election and even though Bernie was running as a Dem he was going to be "change."

I have to agree with Hugh here...it was inevitable to go red after 8 years of blue, but the surprise in all of that it was Trump and I may be in the minority but the word Socialism in any form would have prevented a Bernie win

That was my initial concern with Bernie. But I think Bernie would be (or would have been) able to confront the label and convince people that his policies would be better than Trump.

I believe this too.

Agreed. He would have competed for every last vote from workers and students in Wisconsin and Michigan. It isn't a guarantee he would have won but the map was unlikely to look like it does with him in the race.

unsung

JC29856

http://ijr.com/the-political-edit/2016/11/726656-most-donald-trump-supporters-are-voting-against-hillary-clinton-not-for-trump/

JC29856

Votes against Hilliary, not for Trump, not to mention the pissed off Bernie supporters that voted Trump.

JimmyV

Sigh...

The Electoral College did the exact job it was intended to do. Democrats do not have an Electoral College problem. They had a Hillary Clinton problem.

polaris_x

JimmyV said:

Sigh...

The Electoral College did the exact job it was intended to do. Democrats do not have an Electoral College problem. They had a Hillary Clinton problem.

The electoral college has failed americans since it's inception ... in reality, it's because of the electoral college that there were 2 horrible candidates for POTUS ...