Meanwhile back in Israel

Halifax2TheMax

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

this.  would add criticizing a goverment, its policies and the actions derived from same is not antisemitic (semites are a broad classification anyway not exclusive) but rather pro-democracy, given said goverment is "the only democratic state in the mideast"

https://twitter.com/KellyScaletta/status/1784933392275886251?s=19

This is clearly a false claim.

the main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

Many protesters are chanting River to sea, which is antisemitism. Many Jewish students are being blamed and attacked on college campuses. These protests are mostly not peaceful.

There will likely be protests during the democratic convention in Chicago, which will draw comparisons to 1968, when Vietnam protesters made the democrats look unfit to lead, and Nixon won easily . Trump will say the same now, that Biden has lost control of the country. Eight months after this war began, and trump is still leading in the polls.

you familiar with the 1st amendment,  correct? many disagree with the some of the messaging and manner, but what was false about that specific tweet, stating quite clearly thoughts in general about protests and this topic.

I saw no endorsement of what you describe.

it would appear you fall in the  with us or against us mindset camp.

here , I hestitate to truly say what I want but your stance on the innocent civilians , MANY of which werent even born when that bloc was voted in, is abhorent at the least. no human being has any more value over another.

you're free to disagree. it IS still a free country ....

The protesters are breaking the law and deserve to be arrested.

those arrested should be investigated for every dollar received in their support. If any moneys are sourced from Middle East terrorist groups they should be thrown in prison. Let their terrorist ties be on their record and CVs for the rest of their lives.

Just taking a page from Hillel. You know, the student group funded by Israel to crush any dissent of Israel and pro-Palestinian voices on US college campuses? But they get a pass because they’re righteous, right?

Well, seems Bibi might have a few more things to worry about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-fears-icc-issue-arrest-warrants-netanyahu-gaza-war-hamas-rcna149739

Students are committing crimes on college campuses. Your best defense of that is two wrongs make a right? Students graduating now deserve their right to have a peaceful and joyous graduation within the next few weeks.

if the students protesting believe they are correct, and are willing to risk their careers and freedom, they should act like law abiding Americans, obtain a demonstration permit and protest peacefully and obey the law.

What do you mean by "mostly not peaceful"?  Are you saying that better than 50% of the protesters are committing crimes that are considered violent?  If so, that is demonstrably false.  If you are saying "not peaceful" means committing a crime, well I guess that would include trespassing but seems a stretch to call that "violent".  

It’s more Israeli propaganda hyperbole.  Seems an awful lot of Israel supporters showing up to peaceful pro-Palestine rallies and causing problems. Maybe they should be investigated for where their funding comes from? Tossed in jail if from any source from a sanctioned entity, like Putin on the ritz and Russia, Russia, Russia.

mrussel1

Halifax2TheMax said:

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

this.  would add criticizing a goverment, its policies and the actions derived from same is not antisemitic (semites are a broad classification anyway not exclusive) but rather pro-democracy, given said goverment is "the only democratic state in the mideast"

https://twitter.com/KellyScaletta/status/1784933392275886251?s=19

This is clearly a false claim.

the main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

Many protesters are chanting River to sea, which is antisemitism. Many Jewish students are being blamed and attacked on college campuses. These protests are mostly not peaceful.

There will likely be protests during the democratic convention in Chicago, which will draw comparisons to 1968, when Vietnam protesters made the democrats look unfit to lead, and Nixon won easily . Trump will say the same now, that Biden has lost control of the country. Eight months after this war began, and trump is still leading in the polls.

you familiar with the 1st amendment,  correct? many disagree with the some of the messaging and manner, but what was false about that specific tweet, stating quite clearly thoughts in general about protests and this topic.

I saw no endorsement of what you describe.

it would appear you fall in the  with us or against us mindset camp.

here , I hestitate to truly say what I want but your stance on the innocent civilians , MANY of which werent even born when that bloc was voted in, is abhorent at the least. no human being has any more value over another.

you're free to disagree. it IS still a free country ....

The protesters are breaking the law and deserve to be arrested.

those arrested should be investigated for every dollar received in their support. If any moneys are sourced from Middle East terrorist groups they should be thrown in prison. Let their terrorist ties be on their record and CVs for the rest of their lives.

Just taking a page from Hillel. You know, the student group funded by Israel to crush any dissent of Israel and pro-Palestinian voices on US college campuses? But they get a pass because they’re righteous, right?

Well, seems Bibi might have a few more things to worry about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-fears-icc-issue-arrest-warrants-netanyahu-gaza-war-hamas-rcna149739

Students are committing crimes on college campuses. Your best defense of that is two wrongs make a right? Students graduating now deserve their right to have a peaceful and joyous graduation within the next few weeks.

if the students protesting believe they are correct, and are willing to risk their careers and freedom, they should act like law abiding Americans, obtain a demonstration permit and protest peacefully and obey the law.

What do you mean by "mostly not peaceful"?  Are you saying that better than 50% of the protesters are committing crimes that are considered violent?  If so, that is demonstrably false.  If you are saying "not peaceful" means committing a crime, well I guess that would include trespassing but seems a stretch to call that "violent".  

It’s more Israeli propaganda hyperbole.  Seems an awful lot of Israel supporters showing up to peaceful pro-Palestine rallies and causing problems. Maybe they should be investigated for where their funding comes from? Tossed in jail if from any source from a sanctioned entity, like Putin on the ritz and Russia, Russia, Russia.

These tussles have only happened in a few places and only recently that I have seen.  I don't buy it's over 50%.  I do buy that outside groups on both sides are seeking to escalate the issue.  It's time to end it.  And it's time for a ceasefire.  

There have been a fair number at VCU which is only ten min from where I sit right now.  I was thinking about going down and seeing for myself, but alas... I have a job.  I asked my son last night if anything was happening at JMU, which is a large school and he said nothing.  Everything is quiet.  It doesn't surprise me that there are actions at VCU, which is a heavy arts school, and places like UVA, W&M and JMU are quiet.  There are definitely different cultures on different campuses.  

mickeyrat

https://twitter.com/CBSMornings/status/1785647601829785745?s=19

Halifax2TheMax

Kick her out, she’s an antisemite.

Brown to consider divesting from Israeli-linked funds

Brown University administrators have agreed to take a vote on divestment, ending the encampment at the university as of 5 p.m. Tuesday.

It’s a victory for the antiwar protesters on campus who had been clamoring for the university to cut financial ties to Israel. This is the first time that the university will consider a vote on divestment.

Brown has always prided itself on resolving differences through dialog, debate and listening to each other,” Brown President Christina H. Paxson said in a message to students.

The university agreed to take a vote on divestment in October, after the students make their case on the topic to university officials. Five students will be allowed to meet with the Corporation of Brown University in May to present their arguments for divestment.

“This is a huge moment not only nationally but for the divestment movement on campus,” said Arman Deendar, a 21-year-old Brown junior and spokesperson for the Gaza Solidarity Encampment. “The energy on campus has been electric. … We’re riding on this win, riding on the collective organizing power of our community. It’s been a really, really joyous day.”

mrussel1

Yeah well it's just a vote, but I know that's how Brown got the camps removed.  By contrast Columbia affirmatively stated they will not divest.  Personally, I don't have a problem with either decision.  These are private institutions and this is a tough issue.  

Halifax2TheMax

mrussel1 said:

Yeah well it's just a vote, but I know that's how Brown got the camps removed.  By contrast Columbia affirmatively stated they will not divest.  Personally, I don't have a problem with either decision.  These are private institutions and this is a tough issue.  

Agreed. But supporters of Israel will tell you that even the discussion of divestment, never mind actually voting and doing it, is antisemitism. Fuck democracy, right? Students, alumni and the rest of society can vote with their wallets and feet. But you know, depending on which way you go, that’s also antisemitism.

cincybearcat

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

this.  would add criticizing a goverment, its policies and the actions derived from same is not antisemitic (semites are a broad classification anyway not exclusive) but rather pro-democracy, given said goverment is "the only democratic state in the mideast"

https://twitter.com/KellyScaletta/status/1784933392275886251?s=19

This is clearly a false claim.

the main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

Many protesters are chanting River to sea, which is antisemitism. Many Jewish students are being blamed and attacked on college campuses. These protests are mostly not peaceful.

There will likely be protests during the democratic convention in Chicago, which will draw comparisons to 1968, when Vietnam protesters made the democrats look unfit to lead, and Nixon won easily . Trump will say the same now, that Biden has lost control of the country. Eight months after this war began, and trump is still leading in the polls.

you familiar with the 1st amendment,  correct? many disagree with the some of the messaging and manner, but what was false about that specific tweet, stating quite clearly thoughts in general about protests and this topic.

I saw no endorsement of what you describe.

it would appear you fall in the  with us or against us mindset camp.

here , I hestitate to truly say what I want but your stance on the innocent civilians , MANY of which werent even born when that bloc was voted in, is abhorent at the least. no human being has any more value over another.

you're free to disagree. it IS still a free country ....

The protesters are breaking the law and deserve to be arrested.

those arrested should be investigated for every dollar received in their support. If any moneys are sourced from Middle East terrorist groups they should be thrown in prison. Let their terrorist ties be on their record and CVs for the rest of their lives.

Just taking a page from Hillel. You know, the student group funded by Israel to crush any dissent of Israel and pro-Palestinian voices on US college campuses? But they get a pass because they’re righteous, right?

Well, seems Bibi might have a few more things to worry about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-fears-icc-issue-arrest-warrants-netanyahu-gaza-war-hamas-rcna149739

Students are committing crimes on college campuses. Your best defense of that is two wrongs make a right? Students graduating now deserve their right to have a peaceful and joyous graduation within the next few weeks.

if the students protesting believe they are correct, and are willing to risk their careers and freedom, they should act like law abiding Americans, obtain a demonstration permit and protest peacefully and obey the law.

It’s always the ones complaining about “both sidesing” the most that do it on every topic to justify whatever side they think is correct.

Some of these protests have risen to critical. Breaking into buildings and occupying them. Maybe if it was Jan 6th some other people would care, but it’s April/may. 

cincybearcat

mickeyrat said:

tempo_n_groove said:

600 people arrested at NY colleges these past few days.  They are investigating to see if there are rebel rousers among the students.

saw a stat that 80% of arrestees aren't students....

Right. And that is a huge problem. 

tempo_n_groove

Piers Morgan, whom i dislike, asked a good question. 

"Where are the parents?"  It does cost 100K a year to go there so that is a lot of money to possibly be kicked out.

mrussel1

tempo_n_groove said:

Piers Morgan, whom i dislike, asked a good question. 

"Where are the parents?"  It does cost 100K a year to go there so that is a lot of money to possibly be kicked out.

I guess Piers thinks parents can just call and yell at their adult kids or pull them out by the ear.  In other words,  why does he think parents have not communicated and asked them to leave.   If they even know they are in the encampment.

Said another way,  he has about ten assumptions built into that statement. 

tempo_n_groove

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Piers Morgan, whom i dislike, asked a good question. 

"Where are the parents?"  It does cost 100K a year to go there so that is a lot of money to possibly be kicked out.

I guess Piers thinks parents can just call and yell at their adult kids or pull them out by the ear.  In other words,  why does he think parents have not communicated and asked them to leave.   If they even know they are in the encampment.

Said another way,  he has about ten assumptions built into that statement. 

I guess you are right.  If your kid is dumb enough to break into Columbia with the other people then your kid isn't going to listen to anything you have to say.

mrussel1

tempo_n_groove said:

mrussel1 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Piers Morgan, whom i dislike, asked a good question. 

"Where are the parents?"  It does cost 100K a year to go there so that is a lot of money to possibly be kicked out.

I guess Piers thinks parents can just call and yell at their adult kids or pull them out by the ear.  In other words,  why does he think parents have not communicated and asked them to leave.   If they even know they are in the encampment.

Said another way,  he has about ten assumptions built into that statement. 

I guess you are right.  If your kid is dumb enough to break into Columbia with the other people then your kid isn't going to listen to anything you have to say.

If they even tell you what they're doing.  

Halifax2TheMax

We need Jared Dear Boy on this. Brandon should appoint him special envoy to the Middle East so he can earn his $2B Saudi investment.

Lerxst1992

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

this.  would add criticizing a goverment, its policies and the actions derived from same is not antisemitic (semites are a broad classification anyway not exclusive) but rather pro-democracy, given said goverment is "the only democratic state in the mideast"

https://twitter.com/KellyScaletta/status/1784933392275886251?s=19

This is clearly a false claim.

the main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

Many protesters are chanting River to sea, which is antisemitism. Many Jewish students are being blamed and attacked on college campuses. These protests are mostly not peaceful.

There will likely be protests during the democratic convention in Chicago, which will draw comparisons to 1968, when Vietnam protesters made the democrats look unfit to lead, and Nixon won easily . Trump will say the same now, that Biden has lost control of the country. Eight months after this war began, and trump is still leading in the polls.

you familiar with the 1st amendment,  correct? many disagree with the some of the messaging and manner, but what was false about that specific tweet, stating quite clearly thoughts in general about protests and this topic.

I saw no endorsement of what you describe.

it would appear you fall in the  with us or against us mindset camp.

here , I hestitate to truly say what I want but your stance on the innocent civilians , MANY of which werent even born when that bloc was voted in, is abhorent at the least. no human being has any more value over another.

you're free to disagree. it IS still a free country ....

The protesters are breaking the law and deserve to be arrested.

those arrested should be investigated for every dollar received in their support. If any moneys are sourced from Middle East terrorist groups they should be thrown in prison. Let their terrorist ties be on their record and CVs for the rest of their lives.

Just taking a page from Hillel. You know, the student group funded by Israel to crush any dissent of Israel and pro-Palestinian voices on US college campuses? But they get a pass because they’re righteous, right?

Well, seems Bibi might have a few more things to worry about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-fears-icc-issue-arrest-warrants-netanyahu-gaza-war-hamas-rcna149739

Students are committing crimes on college campuses. Your best defense of that is two wrongs make a right? Students graduating now deserve their right to have a peaceful and joyous graduation within the next few weeks.

if the students protesting believe they are correct, and are willing to risk their careers and freedom, they should act like law abiding Americans, obtain a demonstration permit and protest peacefully and obey the law.

What do you mean by "mostly not peaceful"?  Are you saying that better than 50% of the protesters are committing crimes that are considered violent?  If so, that is demonstrably false.  If you are saying "not peaceful" means committing a crime, well I guess that would include trespassing but seems a stretch to call that "violent".  

(Edit, a lot of the violent protesters may not be students, but I am not sure that matters if the more peaceful protesting students support the protest and the cause)

I would say it’s absolutely true, although it should not be held to that “50% threshold.” Twenty percent of protesters can cause violence and make a school unsafe, and ruin once in a lifetime graduation experience for an entire senior class.

Many colleges have cancelled classes due to the protests. They do this for fear of safety of the students. Within the last 24 hours Columbia and UCLA had violence on their campuses. I’m sure I could find many more.


But the big problem is the democrats biggest supporters, young voters,  the last few presidential elections dating back to 2008 are abandoning Biden. I didn’t find the cross tabs in the below cnn poll, but Biden is behind 51-40 among voters under 35 and overall 52% say they would not consider ever voting for Biden. With the democrat electoral college disadvantage , that’s damning. Best I can tell, the demo out of line with 2020 is the youth vote.

 I raised this point seven months ago, many said wait and see, once they see its trump as nominee they’ll come back. Well that didn’t happen   and the young vote is apparently digging in, welcoming back trump with their support of a totalitarian mid east terrorist nation. How ironic.

CNN — 

Unrest on college campuses is driven in part by an opposition to an unpopular Democratic president’s support for Israel. Add in the fact that Democrats are holding their national convention in Chicago this year, and it’s not hard to hear echoes of 1968, when the protest movement collided with mainstream politics.

The pro-Palestinian movement in the US today is a far cry from the anti-war movement of the 1960s, but the angst and frustration of young Americans is clear and growing. It extends far beyond their views of the Middle East, and it is a major threat to President Joe Biden’s campaign to keep Donald Trump from returning to the White House.

Trump leads Biden among young people

Young voters are part of Democrats’ natural base of support, but Biden is actually 11 percentage points behind Trump among young voters 18-34 in a head-to-head match in a CNN poll conducted by SSRS and released over the weekend.

mrussel1

Lerxst1992 said:

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

this.  would add criticizing a goverment, its policies and the actions derived from same is not antisemitic (semites are a broad classification anyway not exclusive) but rather pro-democracy, given said goverment is "the only democratic state in the mideast"

https://twitter.com/KellyScaletta/status/1784933392275886251?s=19

This is clearly a false claim.

the main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

Many protesters are chanting River to sea, which is antisemitism. Many Jewish students are being blamed and attacked on college campuses. These protests are mostly not peaceful.

There will likely be protests during the democratic convention in Chicago, which will draw comparisons to 1968, when Vietnam protesters made the democrats look unfit to lead, and Nixon won easily . Trump will say the same now, that Biden has lost control of the country. Eight months after this war began, and trump is still leading in the polls.

you familiar with the 1st amendment,  correct? many disagree with the some of the messaging and manner, but what was false about that specific tweet, stating quite clearly thoughts in general about protests and this topic.

I saw no endorsement of what you describe.

it would appear you fall in the  with us or against us mindset camp.

here , I hestitate to truly say what I want but your stance on the innocent civilians , MANY of which werent even born when that bloc was voted in, is abhorent at the least. no human being has any more value over another.

you're free to disagree. it IS still a free country ....

The protesters are breaking the law and deserve to be arrested.

those arrested should be investigated for every dollar received in their support. If any moneys are sourced from Middle East terrorist groups they should be thrown in prison. Let their terrorist ties be on their record and CVs for the rest of their lives.

Just taking a page from Hillel. You know, the student group funded by Israel to crush any dissent of Israel and pro-Palestinian voices on US college campuses? But they get a pass because they’re righteous, right?

Well, seems Bibi might have a few more things to worry about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-fears-icc-issue-arrest-warrants-netanyahu-gaza-war-hamas-rcna149739

Students are committing crimes on college campuses. Your best defense of that is two wrongs make a right? Students graduating now deserve their right to have a peaceful and joyous graduation within the next few weeks.

if the students protesting believe they are correct, and are willing to risk their careers and freedom, they should act like law abiding Americans, obtain a demonstration permit and protest peacefully and obey the law.

What do you mean by "mostly not peaceful"?  Are you saying that better than 50% of the protesters are committing crimes that are considered violent?  If so, that is demonstrably false.  If you are saying "not peaceful" means committing a crime, well I guess that would include trespassing but seems a stretch to call that "violent".  

(Edit, a lot of the violent protesters may not be students, but I am not sure that matters if the more peaceful protesting students support the protest and the cause)

I would say it’s absolutely true, although it should not be held to that “50% threshold.” Twenty percent of protesters can cause violence and make a school unsafe, and ruin once in a lifetime graduation experience for an entire senior class.

Many colleges have cancelled classes due to the protests. They do this for fear of safety of the students. Within the last 24 hours Columbia and UCLA had violence on their campuses. I’m sure I could find many more.


But the big problem is the democrats biggest supporters, young voters,  the last few presidential elections dating back to 2008 are abandoning Biden. I didn’t find the cross tabs in the below cnn poll, but Biden is behind 51-40 among voters under 35 and overall 52% say they would not consider ever voting for Biden. With the democrat electoral college disadvantage , that’s damning. Best I can tell, the demo out of line with 2020 is the youth vote.

 I raised this point seven months ago, many said wait and see, once they see its trump as nominee they’ll come back. Well that didn’t happen   and the young vote is apparently digging in, welcoming back trump with their support of a totalitarian mid east terrorist nation. How ironic.

CNN — 

Unrest on college campuses is driven in part by an opposition to an unpopular Democratic president’s support for Israel. Add in the fact that Democrats are holding their national convention in Chicago this year, and it’s not hard to hear echoes of 1968, when the protest movement collided with mainstream politics.

The pro-Palestinian movement in the US today is a far cry from the anti-war movement of the 1960s, but the angst and frustration of young Americans is clear and growing. It extends far beyond their views of the Middle East, and it is a major threat to President Joe Biden’s campaign to keep Donald Trump from returning to the White House.

Trump leads Biden among young people

Young voters are part of Democrats’ natural base of support, but Biden is actually 11 percentage points behind Trump among young voters 18-34 in a head-to-head match in a CNN poll conducted by SSRS and released over the weekend.

How can use "mostly" and not mean over 50%?  At that point, you are just defining the word for yourself with no common meaning.  How do you say 20% are causing problems and that equates to "mostly"?  

Regarding the polling, I don't buy it.  The problem with the bad polling and responses are going to be exasperated, the younger the demographic.  Plus, abortion will be the key messaging strategy for the democrats the closer we get to the fall.  And if there is a ceasefire, this will not be an issue in the election.  The delegations are on their way to Cairo now, so we'll see what happens.  

Lerxst1992

Halifax2TheMax said:

mrussel1 said:

Yeah well it's just a vote, but I know that's how Brown got the camps removed.  By contrast Columbia affirmatively stated they will not divest.  Personally, I don't have a problem with either decision.  These are private institutions and this is a tough issue.  

Agreed. But supporters of Israel will tell you that even the discussion of divestment, never mind actually voting and doing it, is antisemitism. Fuck democracy, right? Students, alumni and the rest of society can vote with their wallets and feet. But you know, depending on which way you go, that’s also antisemitism.

It’s not the divestment that’s antisemitic. Who cares, the colleges should do and invest how they see fit. What is antisemitism, as I stated yesterday, is that a main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite, her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” - students should be responsible for who they decide to partner with, if they want to be treated like adults. If not, they should stick to the classrooms.

there’s been alot of reply to my comment this morning about violent protest and it seems many believe that since some of the violence is from non students, that makes the student behavior acceptable. It’s actually the opposite that’s true. The George Floyd protests worked because the organizers tried very hard to make them peaceful.

maybe students should take a closer look at who their partners are in these protests before they conclude a terrorist authoritarian nation is worth throwing away Biden and welcoming back trump 

benjs

Lerxst1992 said:

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

this.  would add criticizing a goverment, its policies and the actions derived from same is not antisemitic (semites are a broad classification anyway not exclusive) but rather pro-democracy, given said goverment is "the only democratic state in the mideast"

https://twitter.com/KellyScaletta/status/1784933392275886251?s=19

This is clearly a false claim.

the main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

Many protesters are chanting River to sea, which is antisemitism. Many Jewish students are being blamed and attacked on college campuses. These protests are mostly not peaceful.

There will likely be protests during the democratic convention in Chicago, which will draw comparisons to 1968, when Vietnam protesters made the democrats look unfit to lead, and Nixon won easily . Trump will say the same now, that Biden has lost control of the country. Eight months after this war began, and trump is still leading in the polls.

you familiar with the 1st amendment,  correct? many disagree with the some of the messaging and manner, but what was false about that specific tweet, stating quite clearly thoughts in general about protests and this topic.

I saw no endorsement of what you describe.

it would appear you fall in the  with us or against us mindset camp.

here , I hestitate to truly say what I want but your stance on the innocent civilians , MANY of which werent even born when that bloc was voted in, is abhorent at the least. no human being has any more value over another.

you're free to disagree. it IS still a free country ....

The protesters are breaking the law and deserve to be arrested.

those arrested should be investigated for every dollar received in their support. If any moneys are sourced from Middle East terrorist groups they should be thrown in prison. Let their terrorist ties be on their record and CVs for the rest of their lives.

Just taking a page from Hillel. You know, the student group funded by Israel to crush any dissent of Israel and pro-Palestinian voices on US college campuses? But they get a pass because they’re righteous, right?

Well, seems Bibi might have a few more things to worry about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-fears-icc-issue-arrest-warrants-netanyahu-gaza-war-hamas-rcna149739

Students are committing crimes on college campuses. Your best defense of that is two wrongs make a right? Students graduating now deserve their right to have a peaceful and joyous graduation within the next few weeks.

if the students protesting believe they are correct, and are willing to risk their careers and freedom, they should act like law abiding Americans, obtain a demonstration permit and protest peacefully and obey the law.

What do you mean by "mostly not peaceful"?  Are you saying that better than 50% of the protesters are committing crimes that are considered violent?  If so, that is demonstrably false.  If you are saying "not peaceful" means committing a crime, well I guess that would include trespassing but seems a stretch to call that "violent".  

(Edit, a lot of the violent protesters may not be students, but I am not sure that matters if the more peaceful protesting students support the protest and the cause)

I would say it’s absolutely true, although it should not be held to that “50% threshold.” Twenty percent of protesters can cause violence and make a school unsafe, and ruin once in a lifetime graduation experience for an entire senior class.

Many colleges have cancelled classes due to the protests. They do this for fear of safety of the students. Within the last 24 hours Columbia and UCLA had violence on their campuses. I’m sure I could find many more.


But the big problem is the democrats biggest supporters, young voters,  the last few presidential elections dating back to 2008 are abandoning Biden. I didn’t find the cross tabs in the below cnn poll, but Biden is behind 51-40 among voters under 35 and overall 52% say they would not consider ever voting for Biden. With the democrat electoral college disadvantage , that’s damning. Best I can tell, the demo out of line with 2020 is the youth vote.

 I raised this point seven months ago, many said wait and see, once they see its trump as nominee they’ll come back. Well that didn’t happen   and the young vote is apparently digging in, welcoming back trump with their support of a totalitarian mid east terrorist nation. How ironic.

CNN — 

Unrest on college campuses is driven in part by an opposition to an unpopular Democratic president’s support for Israel. Add in the fact that Democrats are holding their national convention in Chicago this year, and it’s not hard to hear echoes of 1968, when the protest movement collided with mainstream politics.

The pro-Palestinian movement in the US today is a far cry from the anti-war movement of the 1960s, but the angst and frustration of young Americans is clear and growing. It extends far beyond their views of the Middle East, and it is a major threat to President Joe Biden’s campaign to keep Donald Trump from returning to the White House.

Trump leads Biden among young people

Young voters are part of Democrats’ natural base of support, but Biden is actually 11 percentage points behind Trump among young voters 18-34 in a head-to-head match in a CNN poll conducted by SSRS and released over the weekend.

To assume that only 20 out of 100 protesters are violent, instead of 50 out of 100, you're still making an outlandish assumption and seemingly criticizing the act of protest at all, lest bad eggs get into the mix. By the same kind of logic, should we abolish the police too?

On polls and definitively stating that Biden's results are inextricably linked to his Israel policy:
1. Polls are notoriously underfunded and under-sampled, and regardless of who's showing as ahead, they should be ignored from an absolute numbers perspective (especially in this era where media is sensationalized and we have diminishing attention spans). If the argument is that Biden's weakening is due to Israeli behaviour, we should be scrutinizing trend lines comparing changes in approval before and after pivotal events (i.e. October 7th), rather than doing a before/after with only the 'after'. 
2. Every year that goes on, I would assume that youth will be less and less likely to participate in surveys. I'm 34 and I don't even pick up the phone when I don't know the number. It's a reasonable assumption that the prominent youth who would participate in political surveys, are politically active/informed citizens - which represents the minority of the population, and certainly of the youth population.
3. CNN points out that Biden's worst issue approval rating is the war between Israel and Hamas in Gaza, yet why didn't it ask about the relative importance of the issue compared to others (ie abortion, the economy, etc)? Wouldn't that be important to know if the argument is that Biden's handling of this has harmed his electability?
4. CNN only states that this youth cohort largely disapproves of his handling: that doesn't come with any suggestion that there's outsized youth support for either Palestinians or Israelis - that's just an assumption made to justify a position. 

More wasted words from both Lerxst1992, and from me.

Lerxst1992

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mrussel1 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mickeyrat said:

this.  would add criticizing a goverment, its policies and the actions derived from same is not antisemitic (semites are a broad classification anyway not exclusive) but rather pro-democracy, given said goverment is "the only democratic state in the mideast"

https://twitter.com/KellyScaletta/status/1784933392275886251?s=19

This is clearly a false claim.

the main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

Many protesters are chanting River to sea, which is antisemitism. Many Jewish students are being blamed and attacked on college campuses. These protests are mostly not peaceful.

There will likely be protests during the democratic convention in Chicago, which will draw comparisons to 1968, when Vietnam protesters made the democrats look unfit to lead, and Nixon won easily . Trump will say the same now, that Biden has lost control of the country. Eight months after this war began, and trump is still leading in the polls.

you familiar with the 1st amendment,  correct? many disagree with the some of the messaging and manner, but what was false about that specific tweet, stating quite clearly thoughts in general about protests and this topic.

I saw no endorsement of what you describe.

it would appear you fall in the  with us or against us mindset camp.

here , I hestitate to truly say what I want but your stance on the innocent civilians , MANY of which werent even born when that bloc was voted in, is abhorent at the least. no human being has any more value over another.

you're free to disagree. it IS still a free country ....

The protesters are breaking the law and deserve to be arrested.

those arrested should be investigated for every dollar received in their support. If any moneys are sourced from Middle East terrorist groups they should be thrown in prison. Let their terrorist ties be on their record and CVs for the rest of their lives.

Just taking a page from Hillel. You know, the student group funded by Israel to crush any dissent of Israel and pro-Palestinian voices on US college campuses? But they get a pass because they’re righteous, right?

Well, seems Bibi might have a few more things to worry about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-fears-icc-issue-arrest-warrants-netanyahu-gaza-war-hamas-rcna149739

Students are committing crimes on college campuses. Your best defense of that is two wrongs make a right? Students graduating now deserve their right to have a peaceful and joyous graduation within the next few weeks.

if the students protesting believe they are correct, and are willing to risk their careers and freedom, they should act like law abiding Americans, obtain a demonstration permit and protest peacefully and obey the law.

What do you mean by "mostly not peaceful"?  Are you saying that better than 50% of the protesters are committing crimes that are considered violent?  If so, that is demonstrably false.  If you are saying "not peaceful" means committing a crime, well I guess that would include trespassing but seems a stretch to call that "violent".  

(Edit, a lot of the violent protesters may not be students, but I am not sure that matters if the more peaceful protesting students support the protest and the cause)

I would say it’s absolutely true, although it should not be held to that “50% threshold.” Twenty percent of protesters can cause violence and make a school unsafe, and ruin once in a lifetime graduation experience for an entire senior class.

Many colleges have cancelled classes due to the protests. They do this for fear of safety of the students. Within the last 24 hours Columbia and UCLA had violence on their campuses. I’m sure I could find many more.


But the big problem is the democrats biggest supporters, young voters,  the last few presidential elections dating back to 2008 are abandoning Biden. I didn’t find the cross tabs in the below cnn poll, but Biden is behind 51-40 among voters under 35 and overall 52% say they would not consider ever voting for Biden. With the democrat electoral college disadvantage , that’s damning. Best I can tell, the demo out of line with 2020 is the youth vote.

 I raised this point seven months ago, many said wait and see, once they see its trump as nominee they’ll come back. Well that didn’t happen   and the young vote is apparently digging in, welcoming back trump with their support of a totalitarian mid east terrorist nation. How ironic.

CNN — 

Unrest on college campuses is driven in part by an opposition to an unpopular Democratic president’s support for Israel. Add in the fact that Democrats are holding their national convention in Chicago this year, and it’s not hard to hear echoes of 1968, when the protest movement collided with mainstream politics.

The pro-Palestinian movement in the US today is a far cry from the anti-war movement of the 1960s, but the angst and frustration of young Americans is clear and growing. It extends far beyond their views of the Middle East, and it is a major threat to President Joe Biden’s campaign to keep Donald Trump from returning to the White House.

Trump leads Biden among young people

Young voters are part of Democrats’ natural base of support, but Biden is actually 11 percentage points behind Trump among young voters 18-34 in a head-to-head match in a CNN poll conducted by SSRS and released over the weekend.

How can use "mostly" and not mean over 50%?  At that point, you are just defining the word for yourself with no common meaning.  How do you say 20% are causing problems and that equates to "mostly"?  

Regarding the polling, I don't buy it.  The problem with the bad polling and responses are going to be exasperated, the younger the demographic.  Plus, abortion will be the key messaging strategy for the democrats the closer we get to the fall.  And if there is a ceasefire, this will not be an issue in the election.  The delegations are on their way to Cairo now, so we'll see what happens.  

Many of the protests have been violent. I never intended for that to be an accounting of the percentage of students being violent.



the George Floyd protest organizers took extraordinary measures to do everything they could to make sure their protests were peaceful. Pro Palestinian student protesters are likely unaware their partners in these protests include the main college protest organizer - Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite. her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” 

if students want to influence adult decisions like university investments, they should be held accountable for the actions of their partners in these protests

mrussel1

Lerxst1992 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

mrussel1 said:

Yeah well it's just a vote, but I know that's how Brown got the camps removed.  By contrast Columbia affirmatively stated they will not divest.  Personally, I don't have a problem with either decision.  These are private institutions and this is a tough issue.  

Agreed. But supporters of Israel will tell you that even the discussion of divestment, never mind actually voting and doing it, is antisemitism. Fuck democracy, right? Students, alumni and the rest of society can vote with their wallets and feet. But you know, depending on which way you go, that’s also antisemitism.

It’s not the divestment that’s antisemitic. Who cares, the colleges should do and invest how they see fit. What is antisemitism, as I stated yesterday, is that a main college protest organizer is Nerdeen Kiswani, a known anti semite, her organization explicitly calls for the complete eradication of Israel, including for Israel to be “wiped off the map” - students should be responsible for who they decide to partner with, if they want to be treated like adults. If not, they should stick to the classrooms.

there’s been alot of reply to my comment this morning about violent protest and it seems many believe that since some of the violence is from non students, that makes the student behavior acceptable. It’s actually the opposite that’s true. The George Floyd protests worked because the organizers tried very hard to make them peaceful.

maybe students should take a closer look at who their partners are in these protests before they conclude a terrorist authoritarian nation is worth throwing away Biden and welcoming back trump 

You're saying maybe students should be more mature.  I won't hold my breath on that one.  

mickeyrat

https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-05-01-2024-7cbf7c696989cdc3a22383c823fb2e0e   Blinken presses Hamas to seal cease-fire with Israel, says 'the time is now' for a deal

 

Blinken presses Hamas to seal cease-fire with Israel, says 'the time is now' for a deal

By MATTHEW LEE, SAMY MAGDY and SAM MEDNICK

51 mins ago

JERUSALEM (AP) — U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken hiked up pressure on Hamas on Wednesday to accept the latest proposal for a cease-fire with Israel, saying the “time is now” for an agreement that would free hostages and bring a pause in the nearly seven months of war in Gaza.

But a key sticking point appeared to remain — whether the deal would completely end Israel's offensive as Hamas has demanded.

Blinken met with Israeli leaders throughout the day on the last stop of his seventh visit to the region since the war erupted in October, trying to push through what has been an elusive deal between Israel and Hamas. The U.S. and fellow mediators Egypt and Qatar hope to avert an Israeli offensive into the southern Gaza town of Rafah, where some 1.4 million Palestinians are sheltering.

Throughout months of talks, Hamas has said the freeing of all the hostages it holds must bring a permanent halt to the war and the withdrawal of Israeli troops from Gaza.

---

ISRAEL-HAMAS WAR

House passes bill to expand definition of antisemitism amid growing campus protests over Gaza war

The Latest | In Israel, Blinken pushes Hamas to agree on Gaza cease-fire deal

Nonstop Mideast coverage of Israel-Hamas war pauses for protests and police action at US schools

US Navy ship and other vessels visible off Gaza's coast amid efforts to boost aid

The proposed deal now at the center of talks raises that possibility, according to leaked details that were confirmed by an Egyptian official and a Hamas official. But Hamas is seeking to strengthen the language to ensure a complete withdrawal of Israeli troops from the entire Gaza Strip, the Egyptian official said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss the internal negotiations. The group said it is likely to give its response to the proposal on Thursday.

In public, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has staunchly rejected stopping the war before Hamas is destroyed. In a sign of the challenges in the negotiations, Netanyahu in his talks with Blinken on Wednesday repeated his vow to launch the offensive on Rafah, which he says is Hamas' last stronghold in Gaza.

Blinken said Israel has made “very important” compromises in cease-fire efforts and it is now up to Hamas to get the deal done.

“There’s no time for further haggling. The deal is there,” Blinken said, shortly before he was to leave Israel.

Earlier in the day, he said in talks with Israel’s ceremonial President Isaac Herzog in Tel Aviv that Hamas would bear the blame for any failure to get a deal. “No delays, no excuses. The time is now,” he said.

Blinken said the deal would also allow much needed food, medicine and water to get into Gaza, where the war has sparked a humanitarian crisis, pushed northern Gaza to the brink of famine and driven around 80% of the population of 2.3 million from their homes.

Blinken said there has been “meaningful progress” in efforts to increase the flow of aid. On Wednesday, Israel reopened its Erez crossing for deliveries into northern Gaza for the first time since it was damaged in Hamas’ Oct. 7 attack.

Hanging over the cease-fire negotiations is the possibility of an Israeli attack on Rafah, where more than half of Gaza’s population has fled, cramming into vast tent camps and other shelters. On Tuesday, Netanyahu vowed to go ahead with the assault with or without a cease-fire deal.

“The operation in Rafah doesn’t depend on anything. The prime minister made this clear to Secretary Blinken,” Netanyahu’s office said after the two met Wednesday. Hard-line members of Netanyahu's coalition, on whom he depends to keep his government in power, have railed against any deal that prevents a Rafah attack as a victory for Hamas.

The United States has staunchly supported Israel’s campaign of bombardment and ground offensives in Gaza since Hamas’ unprecedented attack on Oct. 7 into southern Israel. But the U.S. has grown increasingly critical of the staggering toll borne by Palestinian civilians and has been outspoken against a move on Rafah. American officials say they oppose a major offensive but that if Israel conducts one, it must first evacuate civilians.

In Rafah, Palestinians clung to hope that, after months of reported near-deals, this time a cease-fire would be sealed and avert an attack.

Salwa Abu Hatab, a woman who fled Khan Younis who is now in a tent camp, said she wants to go home.

“Do you think we like life in tents? We are tired and suffering,” she said. "Every day they say there is a truce and negotiations, and in the end it fails. We hope they will succeed this time."

“If the invasion happens, we do not know where to go," said Enas Syam, a woman from Gaza City carrying her child in the camp. “There is no safe place left.”

Israeli airstrikes in Gaza continued. Late Tuesday, a strike hit a house in Rafah, killing at least two children, according to hospital authorities. An Associated Press journalist saw the children’s bodies at Abu Yousef al-Najjar hospital as their relatives mourned.

The Israel-Hamas war was sparked by the Oct. 7 raid into southern Israel in which militants killed around 1,200 people, mostly civilians, and abducted around 250 hostages. Hamas is believed to still hold around 100 hostages and the remains of more than 30 others.

Since then, Israel's campaign in Gaza has killed more than 34,000 Palestinians, according to local health officials, and wreaked vast destruction.

Throughout his regional visit, with previous stops in Saudi Arabia and Jordan, Blinken urged Hamas to accept the cease-fire proposal, calling it “extraordinarily generous” on Israel’s part.

The cease-fire proposal lays out three stages of six to seven weeks each, according to details first reported in the Lebanese newspaper Al-Akhbar, which is close to Hamas and the Lebanese Hezbollah militant group.

The first phase would bring a pause during which Hamas would release women and elderly civilians in exchange for the release of hundreds of Palestinian prisoners in Israeli jails. In a series of timed steps, Israeli troops would withdraw from a coastal road in Gaza, then from central Gaza and displaced people would return north.

In the meantime, talks would start on restoring “a permanent calm,” the Egyptian official said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss the internal negotiations.

The next stage would bring implementation of the calm, including Hamas’ release of all remaining hostages — soldiers and civilians — and a withdrawal of Israeli forces out of Gaza. The Egyptian official said Hamas sees the language about the withdrawal as too vague and wants to specify a complete withdrawal to avoid different interpretations.

The last stage would see the release of bodies of dead hostages and the start of a five-year reconstruction plan. The plan says that Hamas would agree not to rebuild its military arsenal.

___

Magdy reported from Cairo and Mednick from Tel Aviv, Israel.

___

Follow AP’s coverage of the war at https://apnews.com/hub/israel-hamas-war