U.S. Soccer Thread

1262728293032»

Comments

  • Indifference71Indifference71 ChicagoPosts: 13,278
    I'm really trying not to hate on Berhalter too much but holy shit is he making it hard.  Those 3 subs that he brought on in the 2nd half were horrific.  Down a goal in he 80th minute and you bring on a fullback with your last sub.  Yikes.  He's in love with all of these mediocre MLS players.  It's ridiculous.

    Bradley has had a great career, but I think his time is up.  So many giveaways in the midfield last night and he's just too slow to make a significant impact anymore.  And can we please just stop it with Jozy and Zardes??  Weah and Sargent should be the strikers going forward....it's time to fully commit to the youth movement and move on from the past.
    6/18/03, 5/17/06, 6/30/06, 8/5/07, 6/22/08, 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 5/7/10, 9/3/11, 9/4/11, 7/19/13, 11/21/13, 11/23/13, 11/24/13, 10/17/14, 10/20/14, 4/18/16, 4/20/16, 5/2/16, 5/3/16, 8/20/16, 8/22/16
  • Indifference71Indifference71 ChicagoPosts: 13,278
    Fuck. That was coming for a good 15 minutes now
    What a horrific 2nd half.  And like I said Cliffy...it's like a home game for Mexico.  That's why the US never schedules any WC qualifiers here anymore...usually end up playing a road game.
    Crazy. Crowd is insane. Where the hell can they play? Columbus? Seattle?
    Yeah it sounds wild down there right now.  Was at a QC qualifier in 2009 vs Honduras at Soldier Field and US fans were outnumbered big time.  They've become more strategic when scheduling those games now in places like Columbus, Seattle, Kansas City, Salt Lake City...
    They definitely have though remember some criticism of the World Cup qualifying scheduling. The Costa Rica game 
    Yeah that's true.  Scheduling that Costa Rica game just outside of NYC was not a good move.  It sounds fucked up, but they really shouldn't schedule any qualifiers in any diverse big cities because it will just end up being a road game.  
    6/18/03, 5/17/06, 6/30/06, 8/5/07, 6/22/08, 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 5/7/10, 9/3/11, 9/4/11, 7/19/13, 11/21/13, 11/23/13, 11/24/13, 10/17/14, 10/20/14, 4/18/16, 4/20/16, 5/2/16, 5/3/16, 8/20/16, 8/22/16
  • JK_LivinJK_Livin South JerseyPosts: 7,188
    Congrats to the Women!!!

    Bradley and Jozy need to go. Rose Lavelle showed the men how its done with that foot cannon. Bring on the youth. Too much bitching and moaning about no calls from the men as well.
    Alright, alright, alright!
    Tom O.
    "I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
    -The Writer
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 29,272
    cutz said:
    This is where I struggle with this a bit.  I saw a breakdown of the money. It was something like a base of $75k of qualifying and making the team, then the next $175k was bonuses from winning.  This is where I struggle with it a bit. Based on what the women did, the $75k base is bonkers low it seems to me.  Would imagine the men get a good bit more.  Make those equal.

    That said, with the rest coming from bonuses, and a lot of that probably coming from FIFA, they just can't get the same pay there because FIFA is making sooooooooooo much more money off the men's world cup.
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 14,012
    cutz said:
    Well to be fair,  one deal is real money that's spent.  The other is only on paper.  
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 29,272
    I dont disagree with what anyone has said about the men last night but I do think this is fair.

    https://deadspin.com/the-usmnt-lost-the-gold-cup-final-and-thats-probably-o-1836187519
  • eddieceddiec Posts: 3,032
    cutz said:
    This is where I struggle with this a bit.  I saw a breakdown of the money. It was something like a base of $75k of qualifying and making the team, then the next $175k was bonuses from winning.  This is where I struggle with it a bit. Based on what the women did, the $75k base is bonkers low it seems to me.  Would imagine the men get a good bit more.  Make those equal.

    That said, with the rest coming from bonuses, and a lot of that probably coming from FIFA, they just can't get the same pay there because FIFA is making sooooooooooo much more money off the men's world cup.
    Agreed. Many of the games this tournament were played to half-full arenas. That never happens in the Men's World Cup where it's nearly impossible to get a ticket. There has to be some correlation between overall financial intake and player salaries. Should the Thailand women make as much as the Ivory Coast men? I'm all for equal salaries in the modern workforce, but in sports it has to be based on the overall revenue of said sport. The European tour in golf doesn't come close to the PGA tour because of this reason. It's not gender biased, it's financially motivated.
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 20,113
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2019/03/07/world-cup-soccer-pay-disparity-between-men-and-women-is-justified/?fbclid=IwAR1UCJBCbI0w0i_m2gbwyahsZ1MkdNfUi2ArlF2F2wgCl7JpsLMErJ_OmZY#15c8a9a56da4

    Revenue Disparity Explains Pay Disparity Between Soccer World Cup's Men And Women

    News today that France earned $38 million from FIFA for winning soccer's World Cup in Russia, while the women's champion in France this summer will earn just $4 million, has prompted outrage.

    The total prize money for the Women's World Cup in France this July will be $30 million compared with total prize money of $440 million for the men's teams at the 2022 World Cup in Qatar.

    “The difference between the men’s and women’s prize money is ridiculous,” Tatjana Haenni, who oversaw women’s soccer for FIFA before stepping down in 2017, said, according to the Associated Press. “It’s really disappointing the gap between the men’s and women’s World Cups got bigger. It sends the wrong message.”

    Nonsense. When viewed appropriately—based on how much money they generate—women actually make more than men.

    As Dwight Jaynes pointed out four years ago after the U.S. women beat Japan to capture the World Cup in Vancouver, there is a big difference in the revenue available to pay the teams. The Women's World Cup brought in almost $73 million, of which the players got 13%. The 2010 men's World Cup in South Africa made almost $4 billion, of which 9% went to the players.

    The men still pull the World Cup money wagon. The men's World Cup in Russia generated over $6 billion in revenue, with the participating teams sharing $400 million, less than 7% of revenue. Meanwhile, the Women's World Cup is expected to earn $131 million for the full four-year cycle 2019-22 and dole out $30 million to the participating teams.


    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 14,012
    mcgruff10 said:
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2019/03/07/world-cup-soccer-pay-disparity-between-men-and-women-is-justified/?fbclid=IwAR1UCJBCbI0w0i_m2gbwyahsZ1MkdNfUi2ArlF2F2wgCl7JpsLMErJ_OmZY#15c8a9a56da4

    Revenue Disparity Explains Pay Disparity Between Soccer World Cup's Men And Women

    News today that France earned $38 million from FIFA for winning soccer's World Cup in Russia, while the women's champion in France this summer will earn just $4 million, has prompted outrage.

    The total prize money for the Women's World Cup in France this July will be $30 million compared with total prize money of $440 million for the men's teams at the 2022 World Cup in Qatar.

    “The difference between the men’s and women’s prize money is ridiculous,” Tatjana Haenni, who oversaw women’s soccer for FIFA before stepping down in 2017, said, according to the Associated Press. “It’s really disappointing the gap between the men’s and women’s World Cups got bigger. It sends the wrong message.”

    Nonsense. When viewed appropriately—based on how much money they generate—women actually make more than men.

    As Dwight Jaynes pointed out four years ago after the U.S. women beat Japan to capture the World Cup in Vancouver, there is a big difference in the revenue available to pay the teams. The Women's World Cup brought in almost $73 million, of which the players got 13%. The 2010 men's World Cup in South Africa made almost $4 billion, of which 9% went to the players.

    The men still pull the World Cup money wagon. The men's World Cup in Russia generated over $6 billion in revenue, with the participating teams sharing $400 million, less than 7% of revenue. Meanwhile, the Women's World Cup is expected to earn $131 million for the full four-year cycle 2019-22 and dole out $30 million to the participating teams.


    I won't rest until every player in the WNBA makes the same as the NBA.
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 20,113
    mrussel1 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2019/03/07/world-cup-soccer-pay-disparity-between-men-and-women-is-justified/?fbclid=IwAR1UCJBCbI0w0i_m2gbwyahsZ1MkdNfUi2ArlF2F2wgCl7JpsLMErJ_OmZY#15c8a9a56da4

    Revenue Disparity Explains Pay Disparity Between Soccer World Cup's Men And Women

    News today that France earned $38 million from FIFA for winning soccer's World Cup in Russia, while the women's champion in France this summer will earn just $4 million, has prompted outrage.

    The total prize money for the Women's World Cup in France this July will be $30 million compared with total prize money of $440 million for the men's teams at the 2022 World Cup in Qatar.

    “The difference between the men’s and women’s prize money is ridiculous,” Tatjana Haenni, who oversaw women’s soccer for FIFA before stepping down in 2017, said, according to the Associated Press. “It’s really disappointing the gap between the men’s and women’s World Cups got bigger. It sends the wrong message.”

    Nonsense. When viewed appropriately—based on how much money they generate—women actually make more than men.

    As Dwight Jaynes pointed out four years ago after the U.S. women beat Japan to capture the World Cup in Vancouver, there is a big difference in the revenue available to pay the teams. The Women's World Cup brought in almost $73 million, of which the players got 13%. The 2010 men's World Cup in South Africa made almost $4 billion, of which 9% went to the players.

    The men still pull the World Cup money wagon. The men's World Cup in Russia generated over $6 billion in revenue, with the participating teams sharing $400 million, less than 7% of revenue. Meanwhile, the Women's World Cup is expected to earn $131 million for the full four-year cycle 2019-22 and dole out $30 million to the participating teams.


    I won't rest until every player in the WNBA makes the same as the NBA.
    Lol. Dude that s some funny shit right there. 
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,319
    edited July 9
    mcgruff10 said:
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2019/03/07/world-cup-soccer-pay-disparity-between-men-and-women-is-justified/?fbclid=IwAR1UCJBCbI0w0i_m2gbwyahsZ1MkdNfUi2ArlF2F2wgCl7JpsLMErJ_OmZY#15c8a9a56da4

    Revenue Disparity Explains Pay Disparity Between Soccer World Cup's Men And Women

    News today that France earned $38 million from FIFA for winning soccer's World Cup in Russia, while the women's champion in France this summer will earn just $4 million, has prompted outrage.

    The total prize money for the Women's World Cup in France this July will be $30 million compared with total prize money of $440 million for the men's teams at the 2022 World Cup in Qatar.

    “The difference between the men’s and women’s prize money is ridiculous,” Tatjana Haenni, who oversaw women’s soccer for FIFA before stepping down in 2017, said, according to the Associated Press. “It’s really disappointing the gap between the men’s and women’s World Cups got bigger. It sends the wrong message.”

    Nonsense. When viewed appropriately—based on how much money they generate—women actually make more than men.

    As Dwight Jaynes pointed out four years ago after the U.S. women beat Japan to capture the World Cup in Vancouver, there is a big difference in the revenue available to pay the teams. The Women's World Cup brought in almost $73 million, of which the players got 13%. The 2010 men's World Cup in South Africa made almost $4 billion, of which 9% went to the players.

    The men still pull the World Cup money wagon. The men's World Cup in Russia generated over $6 billion in revenue, with the participating teams sharing $400 million, less than 7% of revenue. Meanwhile, the Women's World Cup is expected to earn $131 million for the full four-year cycle 2019-22 and dole out $30 million to the participating teams.


    I was surprised being in Germany while the German team played - and no one cared. No one cared to watch the game. That would obviously not be the case if the mens team played. Viewership of the womens world cup must be next to nothing compared to the mens tournament. So obviously they draw in less money from all directions into the tournament.

    Hopefully the status and popularity keep increasing. 

    And I'm guessing in the US it looks different, with the womens team being so popular and soccer not having had as big of a grip on the sports scene as in Europe.
    The man they call my enemy. I've seen his eyes, he looks just like me - A mirror...
  • Jason PJason P Posts: 18,141
    “If the US men ever won ...” :rofl:
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,727
    edited July 9
    mcgruff10 said:
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2019/03/07/world-mocup-soccer-pay-disparity-between-men-and-women-is-justified/?fbclid=IwAR1UCJBCbI0w0i_m2gbwyahsZ1MkdNfUi2ArlF2F2wgCl7JpsLMErJ_OmZY#15c8a9a56da4

    Revenue Disparity Explains Pay Disparity Between Soccer World Cup's Men And Women

    News today that France earned $38 million from FIFA for winning soccer's World Cup in Russia, while the women's champion in France this summer will earn just $4 million, has prompted outrage.

    The total prize money for the Women's World Cup in France this July will be $30 million compared with total prize money of $440 million for the men's teams at the 2022 World Cup in Qatar.

    “The difference between the men’s and women’s prize money is ridiculous,” Tatjana Haenni, who oversaw women’s soccer for FIFA before stepping down in 2017, said, according to the Associated Press. “It’s really disappointing the gap between the men’s and women’s World Cups got bigger. It sends the wrong message.”

    Nonsense. When viewed appropriately—based on how much money they generate—women actually make more than men.

    As Dwight Jaynes pointed out four years ago after the U.S. women beat Japan to capture the World Cup in Vancouver, there is a big difference in the revenue available to pay the teams. The Women's World Cup brought in almost $73 million, of which the players got 13%. The 2010 men's World Cup in South Africa made almost $4 billion, of which 9% went to the players.

    The men still pull the World Cup money wagon. The men's World Cup in Russia generated over $6 billion in revenue, with the participating teams sharing $400 million, less than 7% of revenue. Meanwhile, the Women's World Cup is expected to earn $131 million for the full four-year cycle 2019-22 and dole out $30 million to the participating teams.


    article is disingenuous in the break down.

    reality is however its split among them 32 teams split 400 million.

    womens side 24 teams split 30 million.....

    seems the writer pointing out mens split a mere 7% tries to make it seem like they didnt get that much.....
    Post edited by mickeyrat on
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • MayDay10MayDay10 Posts: 10,112
    Money coming in is the crux of it.  Cant just level it off IMO.  

    There is a similar type of thing on a smaller scale with women's pro hockey.  The players want better pay, insurance, other perks that professional teams get... but the problem is, they play like 20 games and average about 1,000 fans per game, with no television, Id assume little/no corporate seating, limited sponsorship, etc.  Players walked out and the league (which was growing) is eating itself.  The players want the NHL to take it over, but Im sure the NHL is a bit tentative looking at the big picture and the whole 'equal pay' movement.
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 20,490
    MayDay10 said:
    Money coming in is the crux of it.  Cant just level it off IMO.  

    There is a similar type of thing on a smaller scale with women's pro hockey.  The players want better pay, insurance, other perks that professional teams get... but the problem is, they play like 20 games and average about 1,000 fans per game, with no television, Id assume little/no corporate seating, limited sponsorship, etc.  Players walked out and the league (which was growing) is eating itself.  The players want the NHL to take it over, but Im sure the NHL is a bit tentative looking at the big picture and the whole 'equal pay' movement.
    I've yet to watch a full WNBA game or a Womens hockey game.  

    Diana Turasi was AMAZING to watch in college but the talent peaks there.  

    Womens soccer and Tennis though?  That is a better caliber of sportsmanship
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,319
    edited July 12
    Here might be some perspective on the equal pay-thing:

    Megan Rapinoe talks equal pay and Donald Trump | Pod Save America


    The man they call my enemy. I've seen his eyes, he looks just like me - A mirror...
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 34,774
    Here might be some perspective on the equal pay-thing:

    Megan Rapinoe talks equal pay and Donald Trump | Pod Save America



    chinese-happy.jpg
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 16,319
    Swedish GOAT soccer player Zlatan on US soccer:



    MLS is not the level of Europe, to be honest. Before, I played with players either on my level or close to it. Which makes the game connect easier. ...

    Here, I am like a Ferrari among Fiats. And it can happen that the Ferrari can become the Fiat, or the Fiat can become the Ferrari.

    I had the same issue with the national [Swedish] team, though not as much. I said, ‘I don’t accept it. I don’t accept when the ball doesn’t arrive, or arrives too late. I want them to come up to my level.’

    All of this makes me slow down a bit. The game here [in America] could be so much faster, so much more tactical, so much more rhythmic.

    ***

    When I asked Zlatan what it will take for MLS to achieve parity with Europe and South America, he responds with a question.

    “Do they want to make it?”

    “Who is ‘they’?”

    “They that control it. The owners. Do they want it to be big?”

    “Yeah. Of course.”

    “You think?”

    “You don’t?”

    “I don’t.”

    “Why?”

    “Because you don’t make money in soccer,” he tells me. “In Europe, I can pick two clubs that make money. The rest don’t; they do it out of passion. Here, with the sports, you make money. That’s it. And I think with all the rules you have here, you are not boosting up the soccer.”

    What rules?

    “The budget things. The salary cap. You cannot bring in players you want. They have more rules here than I have in my home.”





    The man they call my enemy. I've seen his eyes, he looks just like me - A mirror...
  • eddieceddiec Posts: 3,032
    And that's why there is zero parity in Europe. It's the same few clubs in each league battling for first...year, after year, after year, after year.


  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 14,012
    eddiec said:
    And that's why there is zero parity in Europe. It's the same few clubs in each league battling for first...year, after year, after year, after year.


    Salary caps are great for leagues.  Even baseball's modified one has closed the gap and allows the middle markets to compete for windows of time.  Baltimore is the exception.  I think Angelos is still just pouting about the Nationals and refusing to invest. 
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 29,272
    They are a fucking disgrace 
  • Indifference71Indifference71 ChicagoPosts: 13,278
    They are a fucking disgrace 

    Yep.  Berhalter doesn't have a clue.  But hey, at least his brother is the current COO and likely next CEO of US Soccer.  No conflict of interest for anybody there!  What a joke.
    6/18/03, 5/17/06, 6/30/06, 8/5/07, 6/22/08, 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 5/7/10, 9/3/11, 9/4/11, 7/19/13, 11/21/13, 11/23/13, 11/24/13, 10/17/14, 10/20/14, 4/18/16, 4/20/16, 5/2/16, 5/3/16, 8/20/16, 8/22/16
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 29,272
    Holy Jesus 
  • Indifference71Indifference71 ChicagoPosts: 13,278
    What an embarrassment.  Berhalter needs to go.  It's plain and simple at this point.  He clearly isn't the guy for the job and they need to get someone in there who knows what the fuck they're doing before WC qualifying starts up next year.  Will US Soccer actually do something about it?  Absolutely not.  The guy's brother is about to be the next CEO!!!!  What a joke.
    6/18/03, 5/17/06, 6/30/06, 8/5/07, 6/22/08, 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 5/7/10, 9/3/11, 9/4/11, 7/19/13, 11/21/13, 11/23/13, 11/24/13, 10/17/14, 10/20/14, 4/18/16, 4/20/16, 5/2/16, 5/3/16, 8/20/16, 8/22/16
  • jeffbrjeffbr SeattlePosts: 6,674
    Embarrassment is correct. The last WC qualifying weened me off of supporting the USMNT for the foreseeable future. I know in July in this thread I said I'd try to withhold judgement for a while, but I'm unable to. I'm judging the USMNT as unworthy of even a little bit of my support. They are a joke. USSF is a joke.  Our nation's best are bench warmers in Europe if they're lucky. We can't beat T&T when it counts. We can't beat Canada when it counts. We're like checkers players trying to compete in a chess tournament. Completely outclassed.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 29,272
    I watched most of the game off and on yesterday. It was bad. Pulisic especially looked bad. His worst game for the national team. The rest of the team was equally bad. They’re not qualifying for the next one either 
  • Indifference71Indifference71 ChicagoPosts: 13,278
    Tough game for Pulisic.  But he's the only playmaker they have and Berhalter subs him out in the 60th minute?!?!?  Once he went out the chances of anyone creating a scoring chance on their own went down big time.  

    And I really don't think the talent pool is that bad.  A lot of young players like Pulisic, McKennie, Adams, Sargent, etc.. that have bright futures.  But this system that Berhalter insists on playing just isn't working.  Unless something big changes it's hard to see them qualifying for 2022.


    6/18/03, 5/17/06, 6/30/06, 8/5/07, 6/22/08, 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 5/7/10, 9/3/11, 9/4/11, 7/19/13, 11/21/13, 11/23/13, 11/24/13, 10/17/14, 10/20/14, 4/18/16, 4/20/16, 5/2/16, 5/3/16, 8/20/16, 8/22/16
  • jeffbrjeffbr SeattlePosts: 6,674
    Tough game for Pulisic.  But he's the only playmaker they have and Berhalter subs him out in the 60th minute?!?!?  Once he went out the chances of anyone creating a scoring chance on their own went down big time.  

    And I really don't think the talent pool is that bad.  A lot of young players like Pulisic, McKennie, Adams, Sargent, etc.. that have bright futures.  But this system that Berhalter insists on playing just isn't working.  Unless something big changes it's hard to see them qualifying for 2022.


    You are right that Berhalter's system isn't working. It could work in a club setting where he sees and works with his players every day. It can't work in the national team structure where he gets a few weeks a year to work with them. He needs to change his system to fit the players he has rather than try to shoehorn the players into a new system they don't know. And as Grant Wahl pointed out, USSF is a seriously screwed up organization, and Berhalter should have been given the extra year in 2018 to start the new system, rather than whatever the hell they were doing for a full year before giving Berhalter the reins in 2019. But Earnie Stewart isn't going to fire his future boss's brother, so here we are. We'll likely not qualify for 2022. Not sure if we'll get an automatic berth in 2026, but that seems to be the only way this team would be able to play in that competition at this point. Getting beaten by Mexico in the Gold Cup, owned by Mexico in a subsequent friendly, and being beaten by Canada is a great start to Berhalter's legacy. lol.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • WobbieWobbie Posts: 25,381
    you guys know way more about soccer that I but it seems like, where I live, the stud high school athletes are playing the “big 3” sports and  the leftovers are choosing soccer. it’s obviously not this way in europe or south america.
    If I had known then what I know now...

    Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
    VIC 07
    EV LA1 08
    Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
    Columbus 10
    EV LA 11
    Vancouver 11
    Missoula 12
    Portland 13, Spokane 13
    St. Paul 14, Denver 14
    Philly I & II, 16
Sign In or Register to comment.