The Detroit Free Press Building!!!

deadhead365

I flew into Detroit from Boston Thursday for the show. I was a trill to see PJ at the Joe. I had a great time and found some great spots in the city. During my stay I checked into the DoubleTree hotel on W. Lafayette Blvd. I have no complaints with the hotel, but the view from my room flipped my switch. The view from room 815 overlooked a parking lot adjacent to the Detroit Free Press building. I could see where they were setting up the starting line for the weekend's marathon. What was disturbing to me was the condition of the two American flags on top of opposite ends of the Detroit Free Press building. One of the flag pictures is now my profile pic if you want to see. That flag was the better condition of the two.

Now this was my first visit to Detroit. I have heard all about the economic struggle that defines this city. After staying several days and exploring the city I saw the abandonment and neglect. But there is no excuse for the tattered ribbon flags flanking that building. If you can't afford new flags, that's fine. But take those down. It is disrespectful on many levels and a symbol to the failure of leadership in that community.

I myself tried to enter the building and get an explanation. An ushering out by the security is all that I found.

UnthoughtName

Act One, Scene One:

Jason McCoy, the security guard at the Detroit Free Press is a mid-20's college drop out. He lives at home with his single mother and takes the 17a public bus to work every day. On Friday morning while he was sitting at his desk eating his turkey sandwich he was interrupted by a disheveled man at the buildings entrance.

Man approaches the desk Jason is sitting at
Jason: Good morning, sir. How may I help you.
Man: Well you could start by explaining how you can let those tattered flags fly.
Jason: Excuse me?
Man: This is my first visit to Detroit. I have heard all about the economic struggle that defines this city. After staying several days and exploring the city I've seen the abandonment and neglect. But there is no excuse for the tattered ribbon flags flanking this building. If you can't afford new flags, that's fine. But take those down. It is disrespectful on many levels and a symbol to the failure of leadership in that community.
Jason swallows the rest of the turkey sandwich bite he had in his mout and stands up.
Jason: Sir...
Man: Yes?
Jason: Get the fuck out.

End Scene

hedonist

As a symbol, it's sadly ironic that the state of those flags reflects the sad state of that area.

I get some don't respect it (not sure if only the American flag or flags in general, but whatever) - I do. Maybe it's weather or time-related? But agreed, either replace or remove them. Are they that expensive?

hedonist

UnthoughtName said:

Act One, Scene One:

Jason McCoy, the security guard at the Detroit Free Press is a mid-20's college drop out. He lives at home with his single mother and takes the 17a public bus to work every day. On Friday morning while he was sitting at his desk eating his turkey sandwich he was interrupted by a disheveled man at the buildings entrance.

Man approaches the desk Jason is sitting at
Jason: Good morning, sir. How may I help you.
Man: Well you could start by explaining how you can let those tattered flags fly.
Jason: Excuse me?
Man: This is my first visit to Detroit. I have heard all about the economic struggle that defines this city. After staying several days and exploring the city I've seen the abandonment and neglect. But there is no excuse for the tattered ribbon flags flanking this building. If you can't afford new flags, that's fine. But take those down. It is disrespectful on many levels and a symbol to the failure of leadership in that community.
Jason swallows the rest of the turkey sandwich bite he had in his mout and stands up.
Jason: Sir...
Man: Yes?
Jason: Get the fuck out.

End Scene

Not sure the point of this scene...? I can't tell if it's trying to illustrate that no one gives a fuck, or no one should give a fuck.

RunIntoTheRain

I care and completely agree they need to be replaced

Big Bank Hank

UnthoughtName said:

Act One, Scene One:

Jason McCoy, the security guard at the Detroit Free Press is a mid-20's college drop out. He lives at home with his single mother and takes the 17a public bus to work every day. On Friday morning while he was sitting at his desk eating his turkey sandwich he was interrupted by a disheveled man at the buildings entrance.

Man approaches the desk Jason is sitting at
Jason: Good morning, sir. How may I help you.
Man: Well you could start by explaining how you can let those tattered flags fly.
Jason: Excuse me?
Man: This is my first visit to Detroit. I have heard all about the economic struggle that defines this city. After staying several days and exploring the city I've seen the abandonment and neglect. But there is no excuse for the tattered ribbon flags flanking this building. If you can't afford new flags, that's fine. But take those down. It is disrespectful on many levels and a symbol to the failure of leadership in that community.
Jason swallows the rest of the turkey sandwich bite he had in his mout and stands up.
Jason: Sir...
Man: Yes?
Jason: Get the fuck out.

End Scene

)

Big Bank Hank

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion, too

a stupid flag won't mean shit when we are all dead someday

like Eddie said in Severed Hand and why there is no point in worrying about BS

If I don't lose control
Explore and not explode
A preternatural other plane
With the power to maintain.

Like a tear in all we know
Once dissolved, we are free to grow
"What is human?,... What is more?"
I'll answer this

When I get home.

this shit is only temporary and never forget that shit, and how is this Pearl Jam related anyway?

hedonist

Big Bank Hank said:

this shit is only temporary and never forget that shit, and how is this Pearl Jam related anyway?

See first lines of the original post.

As said above, I understand that some don't respect the (any) flags. No worries, I get it, respect that view.

But to intentionally disrespect it? That I don't get.

Big Bank Hank

hedonist said:

Big Bank Hank said:

this shit is only temporary and never forget that shit, and how is this Pearl Jam related anyway?

See first lines of the original post.

As said above, I understand that some don't respect the (any) flags. No worries, I get it, respect that view.

But to intentionally disrespect it? That I don't get.

maybe when they are provided the basic necessities we take for granted, maybe they can put up some proper flags to keep some middle class tourists happy, I mean seriously when you live in a ghetto and you ain't got shit, do you really give a fuck? should you give a fuck? here's an idea go live in inner city Detroit for 3 months and see how much you give about the condition of a flag, they are just worried about survival

hedonist

Well you certainly told me!

I don't know whether anyone "should" give a fuck about anything - it's not my place to say - but it's not beyond the realm of possibility to be able to give a fuck.

To just be decent...civil? Might be too much to ask, I never know these days.

I appreciate that this spurred the OP to say something they feel is important...same like most of us here do.

(and I'm sure that philosophy has many PJ-related roots, if that helps at all )

Big Bank Hank

hedonist said:

Well you certainly told me!

I don't know whether anyone "should" give a fuck about anything - it's not my place to say - but it's not beyond the realm of possibility to be able to give a fuck.

To just be decent...civil? Might be too much to ask, I never know these days.

I appreciate that this spurred the OP to say something they feel is important...same like most of us here do.

(and I'm sure that philosophy has many PJ-related roots, if that helps at all )

yeah I am not trying to be mean but as someone who spent 5 years of my life on the south side of Chicago, I know first hand that the realities of life where the reality of "each day could be your last" rings true, but at the same time, many are trying and fighting with everything they have to to work their way out so they can move to the suburbs and don't have to look over their shoulder whenever they leave their house

Nami

UnthoughtName said:

Act One, Scene One:

Jason McCoy, the security guard at the Detroit Free Press is a mid-20's college drop out. He lives at home with his single mother and takes the 17a public bus to work every day. On Friday morning while he was sitting at his desk eating his turkey sandwich he was interrupted by a disheveled man at the buildings entrance.

Man approaches the desk Jason is sitting at
Jason: Good morning, sir. How may I help you.
Man: Well you could start by explaining how you can let those tattered flags fly.
Jason: Excuse me?
Man: This is my first visit to Detroit. I have heard all about the economic struggle that defines this city. After staying several days and exploring the city I've seen the abandonment and neglect. But there is no excuse for the tattered ribbon flags flanking this building. If you can't afford new flags, that's fine. But take those down. It is disrespectful on many levels and a symbol to the failure of leadership in that community.
Jason swallows the rest of the turkey sandwich bite he had in his mout and stands up.
Jason: Sir...
Man: Yes?
Jason: Get the fuck out.

End Scene

LOL

hedonist

Well sure, everything's relative. But that doesn't equate to tossing decency aside. Caring about shit.

Just not a fan of shitting on something for the sake of it or because of circumstance. There's always room for not being an asshole and trying to make a positive difference.

BizzzyBozzzy

Flags? We talkin' 'bout flags?!?! - Allen Iverson

Big Bank Hank

hedonist said:

Well sure, everything's relative. But that doesn't equate to tossing decency aside. Caring about shit.

Just not a fan of shitting on something for the sake of it or because of circumstance. There's always room for not being an asshole and trying to make a positive difference.

sorry I can be abrasive but I am a nice guy, sorry if you feel shat upon

PJfanwillneverleave1

deadhead365 said:

I flew into Detroit from Boston Thursday for the show. I was a trill to see PJ at the Joe. I had a great time and found some great spots in the city. During my stay I checked into the DoubleTree hotel on W. Lafayette Blvd. I have no complaints with the hotel, but the view from my room flipped my switch. The view from room 815 overlooked a parking lot adjacent to the Detroit Free Press building. I could see where they were setting up the starting line for the weekend's marathon. What was disturbing to me was the condition of the two American flags on top of opposite ends of the Detroit Free Press building. One of the flag pictures is now my profile pic if you want to see. That flag was the better condition of the two.

Now this was my first visit to Detroit. I have heard all about the economic struggle that defines this city. After staying several days and exploring the city I saw the abandonment and neglect. But there is no excuse for the tattered ribbon flags flanking that building. If you can't afford new flags, that's fine. But take those down. It is disrespectful on many levels and a symbol to the failure of leadership in that community.

I myself tried to enter the building and get an explanation. An ushering out by the security is all that I found.

I'm not American but I do think that flag should be replaced by a new one.

on2legs

Hey... Great post. I think it's awesome that you actually followed up and tried to get the matter rectified instead of just posting a complaint.

hedonist

Big Bank Hank said:

hedonist said:

Well sure, everything's relative. But that doesn't equate to tossing decency aside. Caring about shit.

Just not a fan of shitting on something for the sake of it or because of circumstance. There's always room for not being an asshole and trying to make a positive difference.

sorry I can be abrasive but I am a nice guy, sorry if you feel shat upon

Myself shat upon? I said shitting on something, not someone. That was my point.

My skin is thicker than that, so no offense taken here - no need for it.

Empty Glass

Big Bank Hank said:

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion, too

a stupid flag won't mean shit when we are all dead someday

like Eddie said in Severed Hand and why there is no point in worrying about BS

If I don't lose control
Explore and not explode
A preternatural other plane
With the power to maintain.

Like a tear in all we know
Once dissolved, we are free to grow
"What is human?,... What is more?"
I'll answer this

When I get home.

this shit is only temporary and never forget that shit, and how is this Pearl Jam related anyway?

"A stupid flag won't mean shit...." As an Army Vet, go start another stupid fucking poll on a rock band site. We all know how important: poll your favorite song 3 is, will be when we're dead.

hedonist

Empty Glass, I've read many of your posts here but don't think I knew you are a vet (thank you). My dad was as well, in WWII. As a German-born man who became an American citizen before entering battle, he held the US flag close to him. What it meant. The one he had in his possession when the war was over was the same one we hung every Memorial Day, Veterans Day, even on some of the Jewish holidays.

I always helped him fold it and learned early on the solemnity both the item and the ritual merited.

To not appreciate its value is one thing, but to mock or minimize its importance to others is completely different.

PJfanwillneverleave1

Big Bank Hank said:

a stupid flag won't mean shit when we are all dead someday

like Eddie said in Severed Hand and why there is no point in worrying about BS



Big Bank

I think after making comments like this it's time for you to depart from this thread.
There is nothing that you can say, do, post your way out of it.
Please do not continue in this thread.

Empty Glass

hedonist said:

Empty Glass, I've read many of your posts here but don't think I knew you are a vet (thank you). My dad was as well, in WWII. As a German-born man who became an American citizen before entering battle, he held the US flag close to him. What it meant. The one he had in his possession when the war was over was the same one we hung every Memorial Day, Veterans Day, even on some of the Jewish holidays.

I always helped him fold it and learned early on the solemnity both the item and the ritual merited.

To not appreciate its value is one thing, but to mock or minimize its importance to others is completely different.

Hats off to anyone who served in WWII. America's greatest generation for sure. I can certainly raise a toast to your father this evening.

hedonist

Thank you, sir. I'll do the same to you on my and my father's behalf.

Big Bank Hank

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Big Bank Hank said:

a stupid flag won't mean shit when we are all dead someday

like Eddie said in Severed Hand and why there is no point in worrying about BS



Big Bank

I think after making comments like this it's time for you to depart from this thread.
There is nothing that you can say, do, post your way out of it.
Please do not continue in this thread.

I stand behind everything I said, no need to try to back out of it, I believe in the human spirit far more than symbolism, and obviously some people hold symbolism in higher regard, more power to you, see where that gets you when your life is said and done, because your spiritual growth is all you are taking with you, I have lived a lot of life to get to this point, I evolved beyond that stuff a long time ago, country will never be greater than love, but I will let you all pine for new flags in the ghetto so they can be reminded how the US government doesn't give a shit about them, that is reality, whether you choose to see it or not, so I will let you have this thread because it is starting to sound far too much like Fox News for me

Empty Glass

Big Bank Hank said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Big Bank Hank said:

a stupid flag won't mean shit when we are all dead someday

like Eddie said in Severed Hand and why there is no point in worrying about BS



Big Bank

I think after making comments like this it's time for you to depart from this thread.
There is nothing that you can say, do, post your way out of it.
Please do not continue in this thread.

I stand behind everything I said, no need to try to back out of it, I believe in the human spirit far more than symbolism, and obviously some people hold symbolism in higher regard, more power to you, see where that gets you when your life is said and done, because your spiritual growth is all you are taking with you, I have lived a lot of life to get to this point, I evolved beyond that stuff a long time ago, country will never be greater than love, but I will let you all pine for new flags in the ghetto so they can be reminded how the US government doesn't give a shit about them, that is reality, whether you choose to see it or not, so I will let you have this thread because it is starting to sound far too much like Fox News for me

I also believe in telling people to "go fuck themselves".

I'm also 100% against Fox News. Feel free to report me, it's your right.

hedonist

Big Bank Hank said:

I stand behind everything I said, no need to try to back out of it, I believe in the human spirit far more than symbolism, and obviously some people hold symbolism in higher regard, more power to you, see where that gets you when your life is said and done, because your spiritual growth is all you are taking with you, I have lived a lot of life to get to this point, I evolved beyond that stuff a long time ago, country will never be greater than love, but I will let you all pine for new flags in the ghetto so they can be reminded how the US government doesn't give a shit about them, that is reality, whether you choose to see it or not, so I will let you have this thread because it is starting to sound far too much like Fox News for me

See...it's the taking digs bullshit. I'm open to get where other people are coming from, but nuggets such as "see where it gets you"..."pine for new flags"...and of course the big guns - "Fox News"...just doesn't foster actual discussion (assuming that's the goal).

My/our points went above your head or maybe you choose not to shift your gaze a bit?

Anyway, have a great evening, and good wishes on your (hopefully continued?) evolving.

Big Bank Hank

and if you think that troops which I do support, are sent over to the middle east for peace, that is not true, it is to make corporate interests who get the government contracts more money, same reason that the EPA allows water fluoridation even though Fluoride is more toxic than lead, the same reason that the government allows our food to have toxic stuff in it that the rest of the world won't even eat, without proper testing, America is owned by the corporations they own the RNC, the DNC all the oversight committees and the Television networks, the American flag is just basically like a corporate logo now, and worst thing of all when these troops come back all fucked up they don't want to provide proper medical treatment and try whatever they can to not pay them their full benefits, that is the America we live in. I support the troops, but really that is one of the few things left in America and all that flag represents that I do support, the government has used the troops as a PR move and getting people whipped up into all this patriotic fervor while their evil and deception goes on behind the scenes. Here is the topper of all, this wasn't even our country we stole it and committed atrocities against it inhabitants and the environment which they managed to keep pristine for thousands of years, so I ask again what does the flag really mean? half the people here don't even bother to vote, that should tell you all you need to know

on2legs

Hank... why are you deliberately antagonizing people?

Your posts are rude and insulting and have no place here.

If you want a political debate follow the forum rules and take it to the moving train board. This is not the right forum.

deadhead365

Thanks for the support guys. I think it should be stressed too that this is not a poor persons dwelling. This is the Detroit Free Press building that happens to be at the foot of the starting line for the weekend's big marathon being covered by the local news. It's certainly very easy to diminish it's significance and say there's a lot of other important things to worry about. Or simply laugh it off and just say who the fuck cares? That is certainly an attitude reflected by many in this city. But I see it as a great opportunity for a proud American, a proud Detroiter to stand strong and make a change for the better. To say we deserve better and I will do something about it. It could be a small victory that inspires others.

Besides, what's wrong with having respect and honor for one's country and city?

shortstack

it's just really windy downtown and the flags get all torn up and stuff.

Big Bank Hank

on2legs said:

Hank... why are you deliberately antagonizing people?

Your posts are rude and insulting and have no place here.

If you want a political debate follow the forum rules and take it to the moving train board. This is not the right forum.

rude and insulting hardly, only if you allow yourself to be insulted, what are we 4 years old "sticks and stones will break my bones and names will never hurt me" apparently someone missed the memo, as free thinkers which I hope we all are, you should be able to rise above it because there is far more important stuff going on in life than worrying about someone's OPINION, yes it is just my opinion (which I am entitled to, thank you) on an internet message board, but thanks so much for your concern