America's Gun Violence

mcgruff10

Ledbetterman10 said:

rgambs said:

Renfield said:

On CNN now, Dayton shooter had a troubled past, was taken out of high school because he had a Kill list and a Rape list.  Red flags that were most likely overlooked.

Red flags that can't be acted upon because of Constitutional rights, unfortunately.

I think they can. If the high school suspended him for compling those lists, they could have forced into some sort of mental health evaluation. Maybe they'd have to get their county's juvenile probation department involved to make it happen, but it could happen. If you have a kill and rape list, that can probably be construed as plotting a crime. 

I ll have to look it up but around 14 states have red flag legislation; I know that New Jersey is one of them.  It is a slippery slope because of due process but overall I like the idea of it.  

Ledbetterman10

mcgruff10 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

rgambs said:

Renfield said:

On CNN now, Dayton shooter had a troubled past, was taken out of high school because he had a Kill list and a Rape list.  Red flags that were most likely overlooked.

Red flags that can't be acted upon because of Constitutional rights, unfortunately.

I think they can. If the high school suspended him for compling those lists, they could have forced into some sort of mental health evaluation. Maybe they'd have to get their county's juvenile probation department involved to make it happen, but it could happen. If you have a kill and rape list, that can probably be construed as plotting a crime. 

I ll have to look it up but around 14 states have red flag legislation; I know that New Jersey is one of them.  It is a slippery slope because of due process but overall I like the idea of it.  

Yeah it's definitely a slippery slope. Especially with things like drawings or posting song lyrics that can be open to various interpretations. But a flat-out rape/kill list isn't a red flag that someone might be crazy. It's evidence that they are crazy. 

rgambs

Ledbetterman10 said:

rgambs said:

Renfield said:

On CNN now, Dayton shooter had a troubled past, was taken out of high school because he had a Kill list and a Rape list.  Red flags that were most likely overlooked.

Red flags that can't be acted upon because of Constitutional rights, unfortunately.

I think they can. If the high school suspended him for compling those lists, they could have forced into some sort of mental health evaluation. Maybe they'd have to get their county's juvenile probation department involved to make it happen, but it could happen. If you have a kill and rape list, that can probably be construed as plotting a crime. 

Yeah, as McGruff stated, that's a very touchy subject, and right now there is no more political will to take guns away on a "see something, say something" basis than there is a will for any other sensible gun control measures.

mrussel1

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

I think you'd be surprised.  Trump is a patsy to money, at the end of the day.  After Vegas, I believe, he came out in support on much stronger controls than just bump stock bans, but after several days, he walked that back.  His "base" of deplorables is completely unmoved by these tragedies.  

Spiritual_Chaos

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

Saying you want background checks in a tweet when there has just been two mass-shooting and he has been under attack because of them, is not the same as him really caring or a wave building.

is my guess.

Halifax2TheMax

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

$30 million and so far outside their norm that Putin on the ritz is being looked at as a funding source. Remember the recorded nervous laughter by repub leadership on who pays Team Trump Treason? Moscow Mitchy Baby is a complicit traitor.
 

mrussel1

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

And of course he cynically ties the background check legislation to immigration reform.  

mcgruff10

mrussel1 said:

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

And of course he cynically ties the background check legislation to immigration reform.  

It s pretty damn smart imo

OnWis97

mrussel1 said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

I think you'd be surprised.  Trump is a patsy to money, at the end of the day.  After Vegas, I believe, he came out in support on much stronger controls than just bump stock bans, but after several days, he walked that back.  His "base" of deplorables is completely unmoved by these tragedies.  

That’s why I said “if Trump wants it.”  I would not be surprised if that kinda fades away.  

Funny, though; based on gut reactions,  he seems to be for a bit of gun control.  A principle that is for sale.

mrussel1

OnWis97 said:

mrussel1 said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

I think you'd be surprised.  Trump is a patsy to money, at the end of the day.  After Vegas, I believe, he came out in support on much stronger controls than just bump stock bans, but after several days, he walked that back.  His "base" of deplorables is completely unmoved by these tragedies.  

That’s why I said “if Trump wants it.”  I would not be surprised if that kinda fades away.  

Funny, though; based on gut reactions,  he seems to be for a bit of gun control.  A principle that is for sale.

That's the beauty of his principles, there's always a price tag on them.  

Spiritual_Chaos

mcgruff10 said:

mrussel1 said:

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

And of course he cynically ties the background check legislation to immigration reform.  

It s pretty damn smart imo

Quoting this for history.

bootlegger10

Went to Burger King yesterday. Some guy had on a gun/2nd amendment shirt on.  At least give it a couple days before you start pushing the gun b.s. again.   I would have thought he would have been hunting instead of buying food at Burger King.  

Yes, I eat at Burger King and love it.  I dip the fries in ketchup.  I dip the burgers in ketchup.  I love ketchup.  Sure I’ll die at my desk at 43 but I love ketchup.

mrussel1

mcgruff10 said:

mrussel1 said:

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

And of course he cynically ties the background check legislation to immigration reform.  

It s pretty damn smart imo

It's a poison pill.  It shows he doesn't really care about it.  There's little nexus between the two issues.  

Ledbetterman10

rgambs said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

rgambs said:

Renfield said:

On CNN now, Dayton shooter had a troubled past, was taken out of high school because he had a Kill list and a Rape list.  Red flags that were most likely overlooked.

Red flags that can't be acted upon because of Constitutional rights, unfortunately.

I think they can. If the high school suspended him for compling those lists, they could have forced into some sort of mental health evaluation. Maybe they'd have to get their county's juvenile probation department involved to make it happen, but it could happen. If you have a kill and rape list, that can probably be construed as plotting a crime. 

Yeah, as McGruff stated, that's a very touchy subject, and right now there is no more political will to take guns away on a "see something, say something" basis than there is a will for any other sensible gun control measures.

I see what both of you guys are saying but a written kill list seems so extreme that even the NRA would say "Yeah that guy shouldn't own a gun."

Unfortunately they'd probably never say it publicly. 

Spiritual_Chaos

bootlegger10 said:

Went to Burger King yesterday. Some guy had on a gun/2nd amendment shirt on.  At least give it a couple days before you start pushing the gun b.s. again.   I would have thought he would have been hunting instead of buying food at Burger King.  

Yes, I eat at Burger King and love it.  I dip the fries in ketchup.  I dip the burgers in ketchup.  I love ketchup.  Sure I’ll die at my desk at 43 but I love ketchup.

Have you tried their impossible burger?

Spiritual_Chaos

mcgruff10 said:

mrussel1 said:

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

And of course he cynically ties the background check legislation to immigration reform.  

It s pretty damn smart imo

https://twitter.com/LOLGOP/status/1158348090711138304

mcgruff10

mrussel1 said:

mcgruff10 said:

mrussel1 said:

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

And of course he cynically ties the background check legislation to immigration reform.  

It s pretty damn smart imo

It's a poison pill.  It shows he doesn't really care about it.  There's little nexus between the two issues.  

100% agree. But like I said, it s pretty smart of him to tie both of these issues together.  We appease some people on the left and right.  

Spiritual_Chaos

mcgruff10 said:

mrussel1 said:

mcgruff10 said:

mrussel1 said:

josevolution said:

OnWis97 said:

mcgruff10 said:

bootlegger10 said:

cincybearcat said:

bootlegger10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

bootlegger10 said:

There are some questions about what is wrong with America.  America is a child compared to how old other countries are in the world.  We have just about every ethnic group living here.  We have just about every religion here.   We are a country founded on personal freedom and opportunity.  

This is what happens with a melting pot.  Still very much an experiment.  We should not be surprised by this even in 2019.  It is much harder to find unification in a melting pot than in countries that have few immigrants.  We still are not  remotely close to getting rid of the negative effects of slavery.

This is not an excuse for poor behavior.  But an observation when people ask why the US is so screwed up.  America’s greatest attribute/strength comes with difficulty.

Nice ending segment to a Chris Cuomo CNN show.

But I dont see how being this greatest-experiment-on-earth-melting-pot gives a reason for americas insane Gun laws or other insane things.

Because guns don’t pull the trigger.  Because guns aren’t racist.  Because guns can’t vote.  Because guns don’t take bribes.  People do all these things for any number of reasons.  Get rid of the guns yes, but just saying we should not be surprised at all based on the history of the world that there are issues with co-existing in America.

Yes I understand. You are trying to go beyond what you think is the starting point (gun control) and working on some of the root causes that get people to reach for the gun. Makes sense.  I agree.

Take immediate action for today - gun control.
 But the long term play has to include more.  I think the only way to stop this is to remove the outrage and hate for “the other side”. Get back to compromise and solving problems. I’m unclear how to do that exactly. But I think it can be done. Though if we can’t unite as a country against Russia attacking our elections...I’m concerned 

Agree.  Gun control now. 

Moscow Mitch.  He will go down in history as one evil man.

They definitely have to do something. I just read that trump wants stronger background checks, that s a good start.  I hope just one republican agreed with him and starts some sort of small wave in the senate.  

If Trump wants it, they’ll probably all be on board.  The NRA will stick their nose in but Trump is the one thing that trumps the NRA for the GOP.
 

NRA contributed 20 Million for his election in 2016 ...

And of course he cynically ties the background check legislation to immigration reform.  

It s pretty damn smart imo

It's a poison pill.  It shows he doesn't really care about it.  There's little nexus between the two issues.  

100% agree. But like I said, it s pretty smart of him to tie both of these issues together.  We appease some people on the left and right.  

https://twitter.com/LOLGOP/status/1158348090711138304

rgambs

Speaking of "see something, say something" I would love to see an internet movement to start flooding authorities with warnings about conservative white young men.
Confederate flag?
Saw something, say something.
Posting about guns and Trump?
Saw something, say something.
Anti-immigrant rhetoric?
Saw something, say something.

mcgruff10

rgambs said:

Speaking of "see something, say something" I would love to see an internet movement to start flooding authorities with warnings about conservative white young men.
Confederate flag?
Saw something, say something.
Posting about guns and Trump?
Saw something, say something.
Anti-immigrant rhetoric?
Saw something, say something.

I like it. Just read an article about a grandmother in Lubbock, Texas who called the cops in her grandson because she was scared he was planning something big. Turns out she was right .  Give me a minute to find the article.