America's Gun Violence

HughFreakingDillon

is that legal? the guy who shot him was in no danger, the perp (at least it wasn't mentioned) didn't have a weapon. was lethal force justified? will this guy get a pass because he saved a cop and not a citizen?

in canada that guy would likely be charged with murder.

tbergs

HughFreakingDillon said:

is that legal? the guy who shot him was in no danger, the perp (at least it wasn't mentioned) didn't have a weapon. was lethal force justified? will this guy get a pass because he saved a cop and not a citizen?

in canada that guy would likely be charged with murder.

Are you serious right now? Yes, it's legal. The cop was asking for help and was getting his ass kicked. The suspect had already fired shots at the cop. Was the bystander supposed to run up and try to physically subdue him? If what he did would be charged with murder in Canada then I'm glad I don't live there because the cop would be dead and maybe more. He's not civilly clear though.

mcgruff10

HughFreakingDillon said:

is that legal? the guy who shot him was in no danger, the perp (at least it wasn't mentioned) didn't have a weapon. was lethal force justified? will this guy get a pass because he saved a cop and not a citizen?

in canada that guy would likely be charged with murder.

are you serious? the cop was getting the shit beat out of him after being shot. did you want the bystander to throw rocks at the assailant instead?

HughFreakingDillon

tbergs said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

is that legal? the guy who shot him was in no danger, the perp (at least it wasn't mentioned) didn't have a weapon. was lethal force justified? will this guy get a pass because he saved a cop and not a citizen?

in canada that guy would likely be charged with murder.

Are you serious right now? Yes, it's legal. The cop was asking for help and was getting his ass kicked. The suspect had already fired shots at the cop. Was the bystander supposed to run up and try to physically subdue him? If what he did would be charged with murder in Canada then I'm glad I don't live there because the cop would be dead and maybe more. He's not civilly clear though.

I missed the part of the perp having a gun. I went back and re-read it. jeez. thanks for jumping down my throat folks.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

tbergs said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

is that legal? the guy who shot him was in no danger, the perp (at least it wasn't mentioned) didn't have a weapon. was lethal force justified? will this guy get a pass because he saved a cop and not a citizen?

in canada that guy would likely be charged with murder.

Are you serious right now? Yes, it's legal. The cop was asking for help and was getting his ass kicked. The suspect had already fired shots at the cop. Was the bystander supposed to run up and try to physically subdue him? If what he did would be charged with murder in Canada then I'm glad I don't live there because the cop would be dead and maybe more. He's not civilly clear though.

Although some would be screaming for murder charges... this was self defence (third person variety).

We're as soft as soft can be... but we're not quite that soft.

rgambs

The story sounds a little fishy at this point, alot of moving parts that don't seem to fit. Of course, if the story is true as told, the guy did what he had to do, but the whole thing seems a bit hinky to me.
It wouldn't be the first time something like this was staged by an officer as a plan to get rid of somebody troublesome.

Probably not, but hopefully the investigation will have integrity and the story will be shown to be true.

tbergs

rgambs said:

The story sounds a little fishy at this point, alot of moving parts that don't seem to fit. Of course, if the story is true as told, the guy did what he had to do, but the whole thing seems a bit hinky to me.
It wouldn't be the first time something like this was staged by an officer as a plan to get rid of somebody troublesome.

Probably not, but hopefully the investigation will have integrity and the story will be shown to be true.

I'm really amazed at some of the skepticism about this incident and what some think of all cops. Yeah, there are some shitty cops out there, but I don't default to thinking something is a lie when I have no reason to think in such a way. This would be quite an elaborate undertaking if it was staged. Besides the officer gambling on whether the suspect could fatally shoot him or just wound him before the bystander arrived, with a gun, nonetheless. The majority of cops are good and decent people, so until something indicates otherwise, the conspiracy theories and negative judgment aren't necessary.

rgambs

tbergs said:

rgambs said:

The story sounds a little fishy at this point, alot of moving parts that don't seem to fit. Of course, if the story is true as told, the guy did what he had to do, but the whole thing seems a bit hinky to me.
It wouldn't be the first time something like this was staged by an officer as a plan to get rid of somebody troublesome.

Probably not, but hopefully the investigation will have integrity and the story will be shown to be true.

I'm really amazed at some of the skepticism about this incident and what some think of all cops. Yeah, there are some shitty cops out there, but I don't default to thinking something is a lie when I have no reason to think in such a way. This would be quite an elaborate undertaking if it was staged. Besides the officer gambling on whether the suspect could fatally shoot him or just wound him before the bystander arrived, with a gun, nonetheless. The majority of cops are good and decent people, so until something indicates otherwise, the conspiracy theories and negative judgment aren't necessary.

Some cops are really shitty, so until evidence supports their story the abject acceptance and devotion aren't necessary.
Apparently you haven't heard of Charles Joseph Gliniewicz?

Despite what some of you think, my opinion on police isn't that they are all bad or evil, it is that they are all people with flaws like you and I, and just like politicians, when you give flawed people absolute power, they will abuse it.

I don't choose to believe anybody at face value just because of the clothes they wear to work, if that makes me a cop hater, so be it.

mcgruff10

rgambs said:

The story sounds a little fishy at this point, alot of moving parts that don't seem to fit. Of course, if the story is true as told, the guy did what he had to do, but the whole thing seems a bit hinky to me.
It wouldn't be the first time something like this was staged by an officer as a plan to get rid of somebody troublesome.

Probably not, but hopefully the investigation will have integrity and the story will be shown to be true.

omg....seriously?

mcgruff10

good guy with gun wins (and there's video to prove it)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/12/georgia-gun-store-owner-shoots-kills-armed-robbery-suspect.html?hl=1&noRedirect=1
MABLETON, Ga. – A Georgia gun store owner's quick reflexes may have saved his life when armed robbers came calling.

Surveillance video shows Jimmy Groover, owner of Dixie Gun and Pawn, with his back to the front of the store when the suspects entered on Dec. 26. The video shows him turning quickly and shooting, and one of the glass cabinets shatters. One of armed suspects is hit and falls to the ground. The other flees.

Cobb County police say 30-year-old Donovan Chopin died at the scene. The investigation is ongoing and the second suspect had not been caught by Thursday.

Cobb County police Officer Alicia Chilton said Groover doesn't face any charges.

The store is located in Mableton, about 15 miles northwest of Atlanta.

PJPOWER

mcgruff10 said:

good guy with gun wins (and there's video to prove it)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/12/georgia-gun-store-owner-shoots-kills-armed-robbery-suspect.html?hl=1&noRedirect=1
MABLETON, Ga. – A Georgia gun store owner's quick reflexes may have saved his life when armed robbers came calling.

Surveillance video shows Jimmy Groover, owner of Dixie Gun and Pawn, with his back to the front of the store when the suspects entered on Dec. 26. The video shows him turning quickly and shooting, and one of the glass cabinets shatters. One of armed suspects is hit and falls to the ground. The other flees.

Cobb County police say 30-year-old Donovan Chopin died at the scene. The investigation is ongoing and the second suspect had not been caught by Thursday.

Cobb County police Officer Alicia Chilton said Groover doesn't face any charges.

The store is located in Mableton, about 15 miles northwest of Atlanta.

Wonder how different this story would have been had the owner not been allowed legally to be armed...and the previous story with the bystander saving the officer...

Go Beavers

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I have hearing loss in my right ear from shooting rifles (the kind used to kill animals- not school children).

Not in a million years would I advocate for silencers, nor would any other current or ex hunter I know.

You evidently don't get out much these days. Almost all hunters I know (and I know a lot) advocate for suppressors. Don't lie, you have never hunted in your life.

F**k off.

I don't get out at all any more and I've said this several times. But I grew up hunting with my father in the interior of British Columbia.

We've got actual forests in BC. Lots of rivers and remote lakes for fishing too. It's not some dust bed like Texas where you pay a rich rancher for some canned hunt like you and your chums likely partake in- fresh off the gun range with your at-15s 'feeling awesome' and rather large.

But yah... back to the point... f**k off. Don't call bullshit on me. You don't even know me.

You make it easy to call bullshit with your evident lack of knowledge of the basic geography and people of Texas, lol. You get all triggered when someone makes a general statement about you and you go on to make a generalized comment about me and my "chums". You know nothing about hunting or hunters or Texas and make that evident post after post. As you said "you don't even know me".
On the lighter hand, I've been fortunate enough to have plenty of family owned land and have never participated in one of your stated "canned hunts". Those are usually payed for by the city folk that never get to see outside of the confines of their steel structures otherwise. People are capitalizing on them because they are willing to pay ridiculous $ to put a deer head on their wall...which I do not fully understand. Different strokes for different folks I suppose. I love hunting and being outdoors, but "trophies" are a little strange to me and must require a different mentality than I possess.

You use a gun to hunt and

PJPOWER said:

mcgruff10 said:

good guy with gun wins (and there's video to prove it)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/12/georgia-gun-store-owner-shoots-kills-armed-robbery-suspect.html?hl=1&noRedirect=1
MABLETON, Ga. – A Georgia gun store owner's quick reflexes may have saved his life when armed robbers came calling.

Surveillance video shows Jimmy Groover, owner of Dixie Gun and Pawn, with his back to the front of the store when the suspects entered on Dec. 26. The video shows him turning quickly and shooting, and one of the glass cabinets shatters. One of armed suspects is hit and falls to the ground. The other flees.

Cobb County police say 30-year-old Donovan Chopin died at the scene. The investigation is ongoing and the second suspect had not been caught by Thursday.

Cobb County police Officer Alicia Chilton said Groover doesn't face any charges.

The store is located in Mableton, about 15 miles northwest of Atlanta.

Wonder how different this story would have been had the owner not been allowed legally to be armed...and the previous story with the bystander saving the officer...

I wonder how different it would be if there's no gun stores.

jeffbr

mcgruff10 said:

good guy with gun wins (and there's video to prove it)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/12/georgia-gun-store-owner-shoots-kills-armed-robbery-suspect.html?hl=1&noRedirect=1
MABLETON, Ga. – A Georgia gun store owner's quick reflexes may have saved his life when armed robbers came calling.

Surveillance video shows Jimmy Groover, owner of Dixie Gun and Pawn, with his back to the front of the store when the suspects entered on Dec. 26. The video shows him turning quickly and shooting, and one of the glass cabinets shatters. One of armed suspects is hit and falls to the ground. The other flees.

Cobb County police say 30-year-old Donovan Chopin died at the scene. The investigation is ongoing and the second suspect had not been caught by Thursday.

Cobb County police Officer Alicia Chilton said Groover doesn't face any charges.

The store is located in Mableton, about 15 miles northwest of Atlanta.

That was pretty smooth. Jimmy Groover is not to be fucked with! He dropped that asshole where he stood. You'd have to be a real fucking moron to try to rob a gun store (or pawn shop). Those guys are always armed. At least the real fucking moron in this story won't be committing violent crimes anymore. Good riddance to bad rubbish.

PJPOWER

Go Beavers said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I have hearing loss in my right ear from shooting rifles (the kind used to kill animals- not school children).

Not in a million years would I advocate for silencers, nor would any other current or ex hunter I know.

You evidently don't get out much these days. Almost all hunters I know (and I know a lot) advocate for suppressors. Don't lie, you have never hunted in your life.

F**k off.

I don't get out at all any more and I've said this several times. But I grew up hunting with my father in the interior of British Columbia.

We've got actual forests in BC. Lots of rivers and remote lakes for fishing too. It's not some dust bed like Texas where you pay a rich rancher for some canned hunt like you and your chums likely partake in- fresh off the gun range with your at-15s 'feeling awesome' and rather large.

But yah... back to the point... f**k off. Don't call bullshit on me. You don't even know me.

You make it easy to call bullshit with your evident lack of knowledge of the basic geography and people of Texas, lol. You get all triggered when someone makes a general statement about you and you go on to make a generalized comment about me and my "chums". You know nothing about hunting or hunters or Texas and make that evident post after post. As you said "you don't even know me".
On the lighter hand, I've been fortunate enough to have plenty of family owned land and have never participated in one of your stated "canned hunts". Those are usually payed for by the city folk that never get to see outside of the confines of their steel structures otherwise. People are capitalizing on them because they are willing to pay ridiculous $ to put a deer head on their wall...which I do not fully understand. Different strokes for different folks I suppose. I love hunting and being outdoors, but "trophies" are a little strange to me and must require a different mentality than I possess.

You use a gun to hunt and

PJPOWER said:

mcgruff10 said:

good guy with gun wins (and there's video to prove it)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/12/georgia-gun-store-owner-shoots-kills-armed-robbery-suspect.html?hl=1&noRedirect=1
MABLETON, Ga. – A Georgia gun store owner's quick reflexes may have saved his life when armed robbers came calling.

Surveillance video shows Jimmy Groover, owner of Dixie Gun and Pawn, with his back to the front of the store when the suspects entered on Dec. 26. The video shows him turning quickly and shooting, and one of the glass cabinets shatters. One of armed suspects is hit and falls to the ground. The other flees.

Cobb County police say 30-year-old Donovan Chopin died at the scene. The investigation is ongoing and the second suspect had not been caught by Thursday.

Cobb County police Officer Alicia Chilton said Groover doesn't face any charges.

The store is located in Mableton, about 15 miles northwest of Atlanta.

Wonder how different this story would have been had the owner not been allowed legally to be armed...and the previous story with the bystander saving the officer...

I wonder how different it would be if there's no gun stores.

I wonder who wrote the book of love?

tbergs

It would be great if guns didn't exist here or anywhere, but they do. I'm not a gun advocate by any means and would prefer we go the route of Australia, but until things change, the focus should first be on stricter controls and policies because based on our current laws, people with guns do save lives as well. You can't argue that. You also can't argue that guns takes lots of lives and always will because no policy/law can predict whether someone will use a gun with good intentions.

tbergs

rgambs said:

tbergs said:

rgambs said:

The story sounds a little fishy at this point, alot of moving parts that don't seem to fit. Of course, if the story is true as told, the guy did what he had to do, but the whole thing seems a bit hinky to me.
It wouldn't be the first time something like this was staged by an officer as a plan to get rid of somebody troublesome.

Probably not, but hopefully the investigation will have integrity and the story will be shown to be true.

I'm really amazed at some of the skepticism about this incident and what some think of all cops. Yeah, there are some shitty cops out there, but I don't default to thinking something is a lie when I have no reason to think in such a way. This would be quite an elaborate undertaking if it was staged. Besides the officer gambling on whether the suspect could fatally shoot him or just wound him before the bystander arrived, with a gun, nonetheless. The majority of cops are good and decent people, so until something indicates otherwise, the conspiracy theories and negative judgment aren't necessary.

Some cops are really shitty, so until evidence supports their story the abject acceptance and devotion aren't necessary.
Apparently you haven't heard of Charles Joseph Gliniewicz?

Despite what some of you think, my opinion on police isn't that they are all bad or evil, it is that they are all people with flaws like you and I, and just like politicians, when you give flawed people absolute power, they will abuse it.

I don't choose to believe anybody at face value just because of the clothes they wear to work, if that makes me a cop hater, so be it.

I have, but I'm not going to apply that line of thinking to every cop or person no matter what their profession.

I tend to believe people are inherently good.

rgambs

tbergs said:

rgambs said:

tbergs said:

rgambs said:

The story sounds a little fishy at this point, alot of moving parts that don't seem to fit. Of course, if the story is true as told, the guy did what he had to do, but the whole thing seems a bit hinky to me.
It wouldn't be the first time something like this was staged by an officer as a plan to get rid of somebody troublesome.

Probably not, but hopefully the investigation will have integrity and the story will be shown to be true.

I'm really amazed at some of the skepticism about this incident and what some think of all cops. Yeah, there are some shitty cops out there, but I don't default to thinking something is a lie when I have no reason to think in such a way. This would be quite an elaborate undertaking if it was staged. Besides the officer gambling on whether the suspect could fatally shoot him or just wound him before the bystander arrived, with a gun, nonetheless. The majority of cops are good and decent people, so until something indicates otherwise, the conspiracy theories and negative judgment aren't necessary.

Some cops are really shitty, so until evidence supports their story the abject acceptance and devotion aren't necessary.
Apparently you haven't heard of Charles Joseph Gliniewicz?

Despite what some of you think, my opinion on police isn't that they are all bad or evil, it is that they are all people with flaws like you and I, and just like politicians, when you give flawed people absolute power, they will abuse it.

I don't choose to believe anybody at face value just because of the clothes they wear to work, if that makes me a cop hater, so be it.

I have, but I'm not going to apply that line of thinking to every cop or person no matter what their profession.

I tend to believe people are inherently good.

Seriously?
Kudos for that, but it seems naive to me.
War, greed, murder, rape, opression, racism...the list goes on and on and this shit happens every single minute.

Go Beavers

PJPOWER said:

Go Beavers said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I have hearing loss in my right ear from shooting rifles (the kind used to kill animals- not school children).

Not in a million years would I advocate for silencers, nor would any other current or ex hunter I know.

You evidently don't get out much these days. Almost all hunters I know (and I know a lot) advocate for suppressors. Don't lie, you have never hunted in your life.

F**k off.

I don't get out at all any more and I've said this several times. But I grew up hunting with my father in the interior of British Columbia.

We've got actual forests in BC. Lots of rivers and remote lakes for fishing too. It's not some dust bed like Texas where you pay a rich rancher for some canned hunt like you and your chums likely partake in- fresh off the gun range with your at-15s 'feeling awesome' and rather large.

But yah... back to the point... f**k off. Don't call bullshit on me. You don't even know me.

You make it easy to call bullshit with your evident lack of knowledge of the basic geography and people of Texas, lol. You get all triggered when someone makes a general statement about you and you go on to make a generalized comment about me and my "chums". You know nothing about hunting or hunters or Texas and make that evident post after post. As you said "you don't even know me".
On the lighter hand, I've been fortunate enough to have plenty of family owned land and have never participated in one of your stated "canned hunts". Those are usually payed for by the city folk that never get to see outside of the confines of their steel structures otherwise. People are capitalizing on them because they are willing to pay ridiculous $ to put a deer head on their wall...which I do not fully understand. Different strokes for different folks I suppose. I love hunting and being outdoors, but "trophies" are a little strange to me and must require a different mentality than I possess.

You use a gun to hunt and

PJPOWER said:

mcgruff10 said:

good guy with gun wins (and there's video to prove it)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/12/georgia-gun-store-owner-shoots-kills-armed-robbery-suspect.html?hl=1&noRedirect=1
MABLETON, Ga. – A Georgia gun store owner's quick reflexes may have saved his life when armed robbers came calling.

Surveillance video shows Jimmy Groover, owner of Dixie Gun and Pawn, with his back to the front of the store when the suspects entered on Dec. 26. The video shows him turning quickly and shooting, and one of the glass cabinets shatters. One of armed suspects is hit and falls to the ground. The other flees.

Cobb County police say 30-year-old Donovan Chopin died at the scene. The investigation is ongoing and the second suspect had not been caught by Thursday.

Cobb County police Officer Alicia Chilton said Groover doesn't face any charges.

The store is located in Mableton, about 15 miles northwest of Atlanta.

Wonder how different this story would have been had the owner not been allowed legally to be armed...and the previous story with the bystander saving the officer...

I wonder how different it would be if there's no gun stores.

I wonder who wrote the book of love?

Charlton Heston. Little known fact.

PJPOWER

Go Beavers said:

PJPOWER said:

Go Beavers said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I have hearing loss in my right ear from shooting rifles (the kind used to kill animals- not school children).

Not in a million years would I advocate for silencers, nor would any other current or ex hunter I know.

You evidently don't get out much these days. Almost all hunters I know (and I know a lot) advocate for suppressors. Don't lie, you have never hunted in your life.

F**k off.

I don't get out at all any more and I've said this several times. But I grew up hunting with my father in the interior of British Columbia.

We've got actual forests in BC. Lots of rivers and remote lakes for fishing too. It's not some dust bed like Texas where you pay a rich rancher for some canned hunt like you and your chums likely partake in- fresh off the gun range with your at-15s 'feeling awesome' and rather large.

But yah... back to the point... f**k off. Don't call bullshit on me. You don't even know me.

You make it easy to call bullshit with your evident lack of knowledge of the basic geography and people of Texas, lol. You get all triggered when someone makes a general statement about you and you go on to make a generalized comment about me and my "chums". You know nothing about hunting or hunters or Texas and make that evident post after post. As you said "you don't even know me".
On the lighter hand, I've been fortunate enough to have plenty of family owned land and have never participated in one of your stated "canned hunts". Those are usually payed for by the city folk that never get to see outside of the confines of their steel structures otherwise. People are capitalizing on them because they are willing to pay ridiculous $ to put a deer head on their wall...which I do not fully understand. Different strokes for different folks I suppose. I love hunting and being outdoors, but "trophies" are a little strange to me and must require a different mentality than I possess.

You use a gun to hunt and

PJPOWER said:

mcgruff10 said:

good guy with gun wins (and there's video to prove it)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/12/georgia-gun-store-owner-shoots-kills-armed-robbery-suspect.html?hl=1&noRedirect=1
MABLETON, Ga. – A Georgia gun store owner's quick reflexes may have saved his life when armed robbers came calling.

Surveillance video shows Jimmy Groover, owner of Dixie Gun and Pawn, with his back to the front of the store when the suspects entered on Dec. 26. The video shows him turning quickly and shooting, and one of the glass cabinets shatters. One of armed suspects is hit and falls to the ground. The other flees.

Cobb County police say 30-year-old Donovan Chopin died at the scene. The investigation is ongoing and the second suspect had not been caught by Thursday.

Cobb County police Officer Alicia Chilton said Groover doesn't face any charges.

The store is located in Mableton, about 15 miles northwest of Atlanta.

Wonder how different this story would have been had the owner not been allowed legally to be armed...and the previous story with the bystander saving the officer...

I wonder how different it would be if there's no gun stores.

I wonder who wrote the book of love?

Charlton Heston. Little known fact.

One less thing to wonder about

tbergs

rgambs said:

tbergs said:

rgambs said:

tbergs said:

rgambs said:

The story sounds a little fishy at this point, alot of moving parts that don't seem to fit. Of course, if the story is true as told, the guy did what he had to do, but the whole thing seems a bit hinky to me.
It wouldn't be the first time something like this was staged by an officer as a plan to get rid of somebody troublesome.

Probably not, but hopefully the investigation will have integrity and the story will be shown to be true.

I'm really amazed at some of the skepticism about this incident and what some think of all cops. Yeah, there are some shitty cops out there, but I don't default to thinking something is a lie when I have no reason to think in such a way. This would be quite an elaborate undertaking if it was staged. Besides the officer gambling on whether the suspect could fatally shoot him or just wound him before the bystander arrived, with a gun, nonetheless. The majority of cops are good and decent people, so until something indicates otherwise, the conspiracy theories and negative judgment aren't necessary.

Some cops are really shitty, so until evidence supports their story the abject acceptance and devotion aren't necessary.
Apparently you haven't heard of Charles Joseph Gliniewicz?

Despite what some of you think, my opinion on police isn't that they are all bad or evil, it is that they are all people with flaws like you and I, and just like politicians, when you give flawed people absolute power, they will abuse it.

I don't choose to believe anybody at face value just because of the clothes they wear to work, if that makes me a cop hater, so be it.

I have, but I'm not going to apply that line of thinking to every cop or person no matter what their profession.

I tend to believe people are inherently good.

Seriously?
Kudos for that, but it seems naive to me.
War, greed, murder, rape, opression, racism...the list goes on and on and this shit happens every single minute.

Yeah, seriously. I wasn't always this way, but my way of thinking changed when I quit focusing on and being exposed to all the negatives in this world. There's a lot of good being done by a lot of great people. Unfortunately, the focus is about the negative 90% of the time.