I am upset that he is a liar ..I don't like liars .....if this came out during Bush I would be upset also....and I did not agree with Roberts then and I do not agree with him on Obamacare either..
...
Here.. this is exactly what I'm talking about:
...
Come on... i know you know who this person is... I know you watch FOX News.
This is the shit I'm talking about. Only being up in arms because your politician isn't in office.
The arguements would be completely different... there would not be a big deal about Benghazi and this NSA Data Mining thing would be getting defended as 'Keeping America Safe'.
This is the shit i'm talking about.
To bad you refuse to understand that this has nothing to do with Hannity, Fox News (which I rarely watch). I do like 5 at 5 sometimes.
If you just look at the people Obama associated with you would know he hates everything America is about and wants to change it to a socialist paradise. For the ones that stand behind this fake they have to be either ignorant or socialist lovers them selves. I believe he is using this data mill to blackmail congress, judges and anyone that gets in his way. Notice how anyone that could give information about Benghazi are retired, resigned or promoted to positions that would keep them from testifying Why is Obama never knows what is going on until the News reports on it....shouldn't he be doing his job and make it his business on what is going on in his administration? The guy has excuse after excuse and claims to know nothing about anything. We know Rice was sent out to lie question is why? If you have to lie about things then something is not on the up and up.
Now if it is okay to collect peoples DNA (creepy), and keep taps on Americans private lives how about we properly have this guy vetted. Why the hell is his whole life sealed? Where is his family? No one at the Collage he went to ever saw him......isn't this a little creepy to anyone?
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
I'm sure that have some pretty powerful algorithms that look for trends. I would not be surprised if they are running programs that "listen" to calls for certain keywords as well.
Apparently the revelations so far are just the tip of the iceberg. Expect more to come over the coming days.
GCHQ intercepted foreign politicians' communications at G20 summits
Exclusive: phones were monitored and fake internet cafes set up to gather information from allies in London in 2009
Ewen MacAskill, Nick Davies, Nick Hopkins, Julian Borger and James Ball
The Guardian, Sunday 16 June 2013
Foreign politicians and officials who took part in two G20 summit meetings in London in 2009 had their computers monitored and their phone calls intercepted on the instructions of their British government hosts, according to documents seen by the Guardian. Some delegates were tricked into using internet cafes which had been set up by British intelligence agencies to read their email traffic.
The revelation comes as Britain prepares to host another summit on Monday – for the G8 nations, all of whom attended the 2009 meetings which were the object of the systematic spying. It is likely to lead to some tension among visiting delegates who will want the prime minister to explain whether they were targets in 2009 and whether the exercise is to be repeated this week.
The disclosure raises new questions about the boundaries of surveillance by GCHQ and its American sister organisation, the National Security Agency, whose access to phone records and internet data has been defended as necessary in the fight against terrorism and serious crime. The G20 spying appears to have been organised for the more mundane purpose of securing an advantage in meetings. Named targets include long-standing allies such as South Africa and Turkey.
There have often been rumours of this kind of espionage at international conferences, but it is highly unusual for hard evidence to confirm it and spell out the detail. The evidence is contained in documents – classified as top secret – which were uncovered by the NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden and seen by the Guardian. They reveal that during G20 meetings in April and September 2009 GCHQ used what one document calls "ground-breaking intelligence capabilities" to intercept the communications of visiting delegations.
This included:
• Setting up internet cafes where they used an email interception programme and key-logging software to spy on delegates' use of computers;
• Penetrating the security on delegates' BlackBerrys to monitor their email messages and phone calls;
• Supplying 45 analysts with a live round-the-clock summary of who was phoning who at the summit;
• Targeting the Turkish finance minister and possibly 15 others in his party;
• Receiving reports from an NSA attempt to eavesdrop on the Russian leader, Dmitry Medvedev, as his phone calls passed through satellite links to Moscow.
The documents suggest that the operation was sanctioned in principle at a senior level in the government of the then prime minister, Gordon Brown, and that intelligence, including briefings for visiting delegates, was passed to British ministers...
"...it's important to bear in mind I'm being called a traitor by men like former Vice President Dick Cheney. This is a man who gave us the warrantless wiretapping scheme as a kind of atrocity warm-up on the way to deceitfully engineering a conflict that has killed over 4,400 and maimed nearly 32,000 Americans, as well as leaving over 100,000 Iraqis dead. Being called a traitor by Dick Cheney is the highest honor you can give an American, and the more panicked talk we hear from people like him, Feinstein, and King, the better off we all are. If they had taught a class on how to be the kind of citizen Dick Cheney worries about, I would have finished high school." - Edward Snowden
I am upset that he is a liar ..I don't like liars .....if this came out during Bush I would be upset also....and I did not agree with Roberts then and I do not agree with him on Obamacare either..
...
Here.. this is exactly what I'm talking about:
...
Come on... i know you know who this person is... I know you watch FOX News.
This is the shit I'm talking about. Only being up in arms because your politician isn't in office.
The arguements would be completely different... there would not be a big deal about Benghazi and this NSA Data Mining thing would be getting defended as 'Keeping America Safe'.
This is the shit i'm talking about.
To bad you refuse to understand that this has nothing to do with Hannity, Fox News (which I rarely watch). I do like 5 at 5 sometimes.
If you just look at the people Obama associated with you would know he hates everything America is about and wants to change it to a socialist paradise. For the ones that stand behind this fake they have to be either ignorant or socialist lovers them selves. I believe he is using this data mill to blackmail congress, judges and anyone that gets in his way. Notice how anyone that could give information about Benghazi are retired, resigned or promoted to positions that would keep them from testifying Why is Obama never knows what is going on until the News reports on it....shouldn't he be doing his job and make it his business on what is going on in his administration? The guy has excuse after excuse and claims to know nothing about anything. We know Rice was sent out to lie question is why? If you have to lie about things then something is not on the up and up.
Now if it is okay to collect peoples DNA (creepy), and keep taps on Americans private lives how about we properly have this guy vetted. Why the hell is his whole life sealed? Where is his family? No one at the Collage he went to ever saw him......isn't this a little creepy to anyone?
To bad you refuse to understand that this has nothing to do with Hannity, Fox News (which I rarely watch). I do like 5 at 5 sometimes.
If you just look at the people Obama associated with you would know he hates everything America is about and wants to change it to a socialist paradise. For the ones that stand behind this fake they have to be either ignorant or socialist lovers them selves. I believe he is using this data mill to blackmail congress, judges and anyone that gets in his way. Notice how anyone that could give information about Benghazi are retired, resigned or promoted to positions that would keep them from testifying Why is Obama never knows what is going on until the News reports on it....shouldn't he be doing his job and make it his business on what is going on in his administration? The guy has excuse after excuse and claims to know nothing about anything. We know Rice was sent out to lie question is why? If you have to lie about things then something is not on the up and up.
Now if it is okay to collect peoples DNA (creepy), and keep taps on Americans private lives how about we properly have this guy vetted. Why the hell is his whole life sealed? Where is his family? No one at the Collage he went to ever saw him......isn't this a little creepy to anyone?
...
Aerial...
The point I'm making is this...
WHY was it okay for the SAME data gathering operations to go on in 2006?
...
Also, all of your talking points above... they could all be taken right off of the script of one of Sean Hannity's television shows.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
It sickens me to read that people don't care if their government does this to them.
I could care less if the government does this. I have nothing to hide, if they want to snoop at my dirty text messages to my wife or my calls to mom and pop across the country so be it. Sure the tax dollars could be better spent on my kids schools and the streets in my city, but really I have more important things to worry about during my day.......its called life.
The problem with this is that the government ostensibly is using this to track suspected terrorists, but there is nothing to prevent them from using it against the political oppostion. Hopefully we have learned from the IRS scandal that the government cannot be expected to use its authority in a nonpartisan way, and that those in power can be expected sometimes to abuse that power against their foes.
This is not a partisan issue. this is government overreach and it started with the Bush administration. I am disturbed by the apathy of so many towards this
Snowden spy row grows as US is accused of hacking China
Whistleblower charged with espionage reportedly claims US authorities accessed millions of private text messages in China
Toby Helm, Daniel Boffey and Nick Hopkins
The Observer, Saturday 22 June 2013
'...The 30-year-old intelligence analyst has over the past three weeks leaked a series of documents to the Guardian revealing how US and UK secret services gain access to huge amounts of phone and internet data, raising serious questions about privacy in the internet age.
On Friday, based on documents from Snowden, the Guardian reported that Britain's spy agency GCHQ has secretly gained access to the network of cables carrying the world's phone calls and internet traffic, without the authorities having made this known to the public. It was also reported that GCHQ is processing vast streams of sensitive information which it is sharing with its US partner, the National Security Agency.
On Saturday the former British foreign secretary Sir Malcolm Rifkind, who now chairs the intelligence and security committee, said the committee would launch an investigation into the latest revelations. The committee will receive an official report from GCHQ about the story within days and will then decide whether to call witnesses to give oral evidence. If it is then thought necessary, the committee can require GCHQ to submit relevant data.
Within hours of news breaking that the US had filed charges against Snowden, the South China Morning Post reported that the whistleblower had handed over a series of documents to the paper detailing how the US had targeted Chinese phone companies as part of a widespread attempt to get its hands on a mass of data.
Text messaging is the most popular form of communication in mainland China where more than 900bn SMS messages were exchanged in 2012.Snowden reportedly told the paper: "The NSA does all kinds of things like hack Chinese cellphone companies to steal all of your SMS data."
The paper said Snowden had also passed on information detailing NSA attacks on China's prestigious Tsinghua University, the hub of a major digital network from which data on millions of Chinese citizens could be harvested.
As Snowden made his latest disclosures, the US issued an extradition request to Hong Kong and piled pressure on the territory to respond swiftly. "If Hong Kong doesn't act soon, it will complicate our bilateral relations and raise questions about Hong Kong's commitment to the rule of law," a senior Obama administration official said.
Snowden appeared to be gaining support from politicians in Hong Kong who said China should support him against any extradition application from the US, which on Friday charged him under its Espionage Act. One legislator, Leung Kwok-hung, said Beijing should issue instructions to protect Snowden from extradition before his case was dragged through the courts. Leung urged the Hong Kong people to "take to the streets to protect Snowden". Another politician, Cyd Ho, vice-chairwoman of the pro-democracy Labour party, said China "should now make its stance clear to the Hong Kong SAR [Special Administrative Region] government" before the case goes before a court...'
On the Espionage Act charges against Edward Snowden
Who is actually bringing 'injury to America': those who are secretly building a massive surveillance system or those who inform citizens that it's being done?
Glenn Greenwald
guardian.co.uk, Saturday 22 June 2013
'...Prior to Barack Obama's inauguration, there were a grand total of three prosecutions of leakers under the Espionage Act (including the prosecution of Dan Ellsberg by the Nixon DOJ). That's because the statute is so broad that even the US government has largely refrained from using it. But during the Obama presidency, there are now seven such prosecutions: more than double the number under all prior US presidents combined. How can anyone justify that?
For a politician who tried to convince Americans to elect him based on repeated pledges of unprecedented transparency and specific vows to protect "noble" and "patriotic" whistleblowers, is this unparalleled assault on those who enable investigative journalism remotely defensible? Recall that the New Yorker's Jane Mayer said recently that this oppressive climate created by the Obama presidency has brought investigative journalism to a "standstill", while James Goodale, the General Counsel for the New York Times during its battles with the Nixon administration, wrote last month in that paper that "President Obama will surely pass President Richard Nixon as the worst president ever on issues of national security and press freedom." Read what Mayer and Goodale wrote and ask yourself: is the Obama administration's threat to the news-gathering process not a serious crisis at this point?
...He [Edward Snowden] could have - but chose not - sold the information he had to a foreign intelligence service for vast sums of money, or covertly passed it to one of America's enemies, or worked at the direction of a foreign government. That is espionage. He did none of those things.
What he did instead was give up his life of career stability and economic prosperity, living with his long-time girlfriend in Hawaii, in order to inform his fellow citizens (both in America and around the world) of what the US government and its allies are doing to them and their privacy. He did that by very carefully selecting which documents he thought should be disclosed and concealed, then gave them to a newspaper with a team of editors and journalists and repeatedly insisted that journalistic judgments be exercised about which of those documents should be published in the public interest and which should be withheld.
That's what every single whistleblower and source for investigative journalism, in every case, does - by definition. In what conceivable sense does that merit felony charges under the Espionage Act?
The essence of that extremely broad, century-old law is that one is guilty if one discloses classified information "with intent or reason to believe that the information is to be used to the injury of the United States, or to the advantage of any foreign nation". Please read this rather good summary in this morning's New York Times of the worldwide debate Snowden has enabled - how these disclosures have "set off a national debate over the proper limits of government surveillance" and "opened an unprecedented window on the details of surveillance by the NSA, including its compilation of logs of virtually all telephone calls in the United States and its collection of e-mails of foreigners from the major American Internet companies, including Google, Yahoo, Microsoft, Apple and Skype" - and ask yourself: has Snowden actually does anything to bring "injury to the United States", or has he performed an immense public service?
The irony is obvious: the same people who are building a ubiquitous surveillance system to spy on everyone in the world, including their own citizens, are now accusing the person who exposed it of "espionage". It seems clear that the people who are actually bringing "injury to the United States" are those who are waging war on basic tenets of transparency and secretly constructing a mass and often illegal and unconstitutional surveillance apparatus aimed at American citizens - and those who are lying to the American people and its Congress about what they're doing - rather than those who are devoted to informing the American people that this is being done.
The Obama administration leaks classified information continuously. They do it to glorify the President, or manipulate public opinion, or even to help produce a pre-election propaganda film about the Osama bin Laden raid. The Obama administration does not hate unauthorized leaks of classified information. They are more responsible for such leaks than anyone.
What they hate are leaks that embarrass them or expose their wrongdoing. Those are the only kinds of leaks that are prosecuted. It's a completely one-sided and manipulative abuse of secrecy laws. It's all designed to ensure that the only information we as citizens can learn is what they want us to learn because it makes them look good. The only leaks they're interested in severely punishing are those that undermine them politically. The "enemy" they're seeking to keep ignorant with selective and excessive leak prosecutions are not The Terrorists or The Chinese Communists. It's the American people.
The Terrorists already knew, and have long known, that the US government is doing everything possible to surveil their telephonic and internet communications. The Chinese have long known, and have repeatedly said, that the US is hacking into both their governmental and civilian systems (just as the Chinese are doing to the US). The Russians have long known that the US and UK try to intercept the conversations of their leaders just as the Russians do to the US and the UK.
They haven't learned anything from these disclosures that they didn't already well know. The people who have learned things they didn't already know are American citizens who have no connection to terrorism or foreign intelligence, as well as hundreds of millions of citizens around the world about whom the same is true. What they have learned is that the vast bulk of this surveillance apparatus is directed not at the Chinese or Russian governments or the Terrorists, but at them.
And that is precisely why the US government is so furious and will bring its full weight to bear against these disclosures. What has been "harmed" is not the national security of the US but the ability of its political leaders to work against their own citizens and citizens around the world in the dark, with zero transparency or real accountability. If anything is a crime, it's that secret, unaccountable and deceitful behavior: not the shining of light on it.
To bad you refuse to understand that this has nothing to do with Hannity, Fox News (which I rarely watch). I do like 5 at 5 sometimes.
If you just look at the people Obama associated with you would know he hates everything America is about and wants to change it to a socialist paradise. For the ones that stand behind this fake they have to be either ignorant or socialist lovers them selves. I believe he is using this data mill to blackmail congress, judges and anyone that gets in his way. Notice how anyone that could give information about Benghazi are retired, resigned or promoted to positions that would keep them from testifying Why is Obama never knows what is going on until the News reports on it....shouldn't he be doing his job and make it his business on what is going on in his administration? The guy has excuse after excuse and claims to know nothing about anything. We know Rice was sent out to lie question is why? If you have to lie about things then something is not on the up and up.
Now if it is okay to collect peoples DNA (creepy), and keep taps on Americans private lives how about we properly have this guy vetted. Why the hell is his whole life sealed? Where is his family? No one at the Collage he went to ever saw him......isn't this a little creepy to anyone?
I think someone has their foil cap on too tight...
I think you make some valid points, but I agree with the person who said that if this was happening under Bush, it would not be getting as much backlash.
Here is how I see it:
I'm pissed this was happening, although I pretty much already knew something like this was happening cuz of the Patriot Act.
However, to fight modern terrorism, you need tactics like this, because they use a wide variety of technology. To fight technology you need technology. Their tapping and trying to listen to something that involves terrorism is valid, but it sucks it violates our civil liberties.
But now that terrorists definitely know all of how the gov't was listening to them, they now know not to use phones or do anything technological anymore. It may slow them down, but they will be hard to catch.
~Carter~
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense
...
Here.. this is exactly what I'm talking about:
...
Come on... i know you know who this person is... I know you watch FOX News.
This is the shit I'm talking about. Only being up in arms because your politician isn't in office.
The arguements would be completely different... there would not be a big deal about Benghazi and this NSA Data Mining thing would be getting defended as 'Keeping America Safe'.
This is the shit i'm talking about.
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense
Amid the furor in Washington over government leaks and media exposés, a little-known executive order signed by President Obama in October of 2011 could fuel the paranoia.
Amid the furor in Washington over government leaks and media exposés, a little-known executive order signed by President Obama in October of 2011 could fuel the paranoia.
'As an example of the order's broad sweep, a Department of Education security systems webinar describes how, "certain life experiences can alter a person's normal behavior and cause them to act illegally or irresponsibly."
It points to "stress, divorce, untreated mental illness, financial problems, frustrations with co-workers or the organization" as warning signs that must be reported.'
So now having a conscience, and acting on it, is synonymous with mental illness?
Amid the furor in Washington over government leaks and media exposés, a little-known executive order signed by President Obama in October of 2011 could fuel the paranoia.
'As an example of the order's broad sweep, a Department of Education security systems webinar describes how, "certain life experiences can alter a person's normal behavior and cause them to act illegally or irresponsibly."
It points to "stress, divorce, untreated mental illness, financial problems, frustrations with co-workers or the organization" as warning signs that must be reported.'
So now having a conscience, and acting on it, is synonymous with mental illness?
I was thinking that all those "disorders" affect about 99.9% of the worlds population at some point and time
so now it's a executive order to keep an eye on your co-worker and rat them out for personal problems ?
To bad you refuse to understand that this has nothing to do with Hannity, Fox News (which I rarely watch). I do like 5 at 5 sometimes.
If you just look at the people Obama associated with you would know he hates everything America is about and wants to change it to a socialist paradise. For the ones that stand behind this fake they have to be either ignorant or socialist lovers them selves. I believe he is using this data mill to blackmail congress, judges and anyone that gets in his way. Notice how anyone that could give information about Benghazi are retired, resigned or promoted to positions that would keep them from testifying Why is Obama never knows what is going on until the News reports on it....shouldn't he be doing his job and make it his business on what is going on in his administration? The guy has excuse after excuse and claims to know nothing about anything. We know Rice was sent out to lie question is why? If you have to lie about things then something is not on the up and up.
Now if it is okay to collect peoples DNA (creepy), and keep taps on Americans private lives how about we properly have this guy vetted. Why the hell is his whole life sealed? Where is his family? No one at the Collage he went to ever saw him......isn't this a little creepy to anyone?
I think someone has their foil cap on too tight...
I think you make some valid points, but I agree with the person who said that if this was happening under Bush, it would not be getting as much backlash.
Here is how I see it:
I'm pissed this was happening, although I pretty much already knew something like this was happening cuz of the Patriot Act.
However, to fight modern terrorism, you need tactics like this, because they use a wide variety of technology. To fight technology you need technology. Their tapping and trying to listen to something that involves terrorism is valid, but it sucks it violates our civil liberties.
But now that terrorists definitely know all of how the gov't was listening to them, they now know not to use phones or do anything technological anymore. It may slow them down, but they will be hard to catch.
I imagine most Americans thought the Government was listening to SUSPICIOUS people the could be terrorist...Not every American in the country.....on the other hand if Americans did know it than the Terrorist already knew it also....Then government does not need to keep records of everyone in this country.....
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
Amid the furor in Washington over government leaks and media exposés, a little-known executive order signed by President Obama in October of 2011 could fuel the paranoia.
'As an example of the order's broad sweep, a Department of Education security systems webinar describes how, "certain life experiences can alter a person's normal behavior and cause them to act illegally or irresponsibly."
It points to "stress, divorce, untreated mental illness, financial problems, frustrations with co-workers or the organization" as warning signs that must be reported.'
So now having a conscience, and acting on it, is synonymous with mental illness?
I was thinking that all those "disorders" affect about 99.9% of the worlds population at some point and time
so now it's a executive order to keep an eye on your co-worker and rat them out for personal problems ?
Godfather.
I just want to say that Fox News isn't the best thing to source.
But it kind of makes sense. Say someone in charge of missiles has just lost this whole family in some accident and sees no hope of living. He does not care what happens to him. So he just decides to launch missiles at the building he works in.
Don't be like, "Look at this guy trying to "defend" his government again."
I am not defending anyone, I am just saying it makes sense to let higher officials know that someone is really depressed/angry/sad, etc, and it may effect their job. I bet some may "rat" on others, but they wouldn't do anything unless they knew for sure they wouldn't be able to do their job.
~Carter~
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense
Citizens should never give up liberties. We have the Constitution for a reason.
Many people do not even know what is in our constitution, they are uninformed, therefore, these liberties are being taken away and people are complacent because it does not immediately affect their daily lives.
Citizens should never give up liberties. We have the Constitution for a reason.
Many people do not even know what is in our constitution, they are uninformed, therefore, these liberties are being taken away and people are complacent because it does not immediately affect their daily lives.
I imagine most Americans thought the Government was listening to SUSPICIOUS people the could be terrorist...Not every American in the country.....on the other hand if Americans did know it than the Terrorist already knew it also....Then government does not need to keep records of everyone in this country.....
...
See... that's just it... you imagined.
in this case, your imagination betrayed you and kept you from the facts. Those facts being, the data mining was going on prior to 2006 and the NSA was gathering phone record data on all of us... same as they are today.
The biggest difference being, in 2006, FOX News was broadcasting out how this type of operation was good for us because it also captured the 'terrorists' in its massive dragnet.
...
I beg of you... when considering political matters and those things that deal with our rights, the Constitution and law enforcement... use the facts to form your opinions, not your imagination on what you want to believe to be the facts.
Trusts me... facts beat imagined fear every time.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Google Pressure Cookers and Backpacks, Get a Visit from the Feds
Michele Catalano was looking for information online about pressure cookers. Her husband, in the same time frame, was Googling backpacks. Wednesday morning, six men from a joint terrorism task force showed up at their house to see if they were terrorists. Which begs the question: How'd the government know what they were Googling?
First, this would mean that the US Government has actually built something that works. Second, there is no way they are doing this 100 times a week and this is the first we have heard of it. Not in iAmerica.
And lastly, the way she describes their behaivior ... nice, cordial, and being put on a verbal defensive a few times ... that's not typical of someone who is on a joint terrorism task force. They would be forceful, direct, and would not give back any answers or information.
First, this would mean that the US Government has actually built something that works. Second, there is no way they are doing this 100 times a week and this is the first we have heard of it. Not in iAmerica.
And lastly, the way she describes their behaivior ... nice, cordial, and being put on a verbal defensive a few times ... that's not typical of someone who is on a joint terrorism task force. They would be forceful, direct, and would not give back any answers or information.
Well if they are doing it 100 times a week and 99 times out of the 100 are a waste of time, Maybe that's why they seem the way they do (the joint task force)
I need to know if she is any relation to Manti Te'o.
one other thing ... the photo next to the story is clearly not of the incident per the way she described the force to be in plain clothes. wtf, yahoo and atlantic wire? do you still have to earn a degree in journalism or can you win one in a cracker jack box these days?
First, this would mean that the US Government has actually built something that works. Second, there is no way they are doing this 100 times a week and this is the first we have heard of it. Not in iAmerica.
And lastly, the way she describes their behaivior ... nice, cordial, and being put on a verbal defensive a few times ... that's not typical of someone who is on a joint terrorism task force. They would be forceful, direct, and would not give back any answers or information.
I agree.
Reading it I pictured in my head them sitting around a table drinking tea and politely asking them questions.
~Carter~
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense
Comments
To bad you refuse to understand that this has nothing to do with Hannity, Fox News (which I rarely watch). I do like 5 at 5 sometimes.
If you just look at the people Obama associated with you would know he hates everything America is about and wants to change it to a socialist paradise. For the ones that stand behind this fake they have to be either ignorant or socialist lovers them selves. I believe he is using this data mill to blackmail congress, judges and anyone that gets in his way. Notice how anyone that could give information about Benghazi are retired, resigned or promoted to positions that would keep them from testifying Why is Obama never knows what is going on until the News reports on it....shouldn't he be doing his job and make it his business on what is going on in his administration? The guy has excuse after excuse and claims to know nothing about anything. We know Rice was sent out to lie question is why? If you have to lie about things then something is not on the up and up.
Now if it is okay to collect peoples DNA (creepy), and keep taps on Americans private lives how about we properly have this guy vetted. Why the hell is his whole life sealed? Where is his family? No one at the Collage he went to ever saw him......isn't this a little creepy to anyone?
Apparently the revelations so far are just the tip of the iceberg. Expect more to come over the coming days.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... anda-prism
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/1 ... 20-summits
GCHQ intercepted foreign politicians' communications at G20 summits
Exclusive: phones were monitored and fake internet cafes set up to gather information from allies in London in 2009
Ewen MacAskill, Nick Davies, Nick Hopkins, Julian Borger and James Ball
The Guardian, Sunday 16 June 2013
Foreign politicians and officials who took part in two G20 summit meetings in London in 2009 had their computers monitored and their phone calls intercepted on the instructions of their British government hosts, according to documents seen by the Guardian. Some delegates were tricked into using internet cafes which had been set up by British intelligence agencies to read their email traffic.
The revelation comes as Britain prepares to host another summit on Monday – for the G8 nations, all of whom attended the 2009 meetings which were the object of the systematic spying. It is likely to lead to some tension among visiting delegates who will want the prime minister to explain whether they were targets in 2009 and whether the exercise is to be repeated this week.
The disclosure raises new questions about the boundaries of surveillance by GCHQ and its American sister organisation, the National Security Agency, whose access to phone records and internet data has been defended as necessary in the fight against terrorism and serious crime. The G20 spying appears to have been organised for the more mundane purpose of securing an advantage in meetings. Named targets include long-standing allies such as South Africa and Turkey.
There have often been rumours of this kind of espionage at international conferences, but it is highly unusual for hard evidence to confirm it and spell out the detail. The evidence is contained in documents – classified as top secret – which were uncovered by the NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden and seen by the Guardian. They reveal that during G20 meetings in April and September 2009 GCHQ used what one document calls "ground-breaking intelligence capabilities" to intercept the communications of visiting delegations.
This included:
• Setting up internet cafes where they used an email interception programme and key-logging software to spy on delegates' use of computers;
• Penetrating the security on delegates' BlackBerrys to monitor their email messages and phone calls;
• Supplying 45 analysts with a live round-the-clock summary of who was phoning who at the summit;
• Targeting the Turkish finance minister and possibly 15 others in his party;
• Receiving reports from an NSA attempt to eavesdrop on the Russian leader, Dmitry Medvedev, as his phone calls passed through satellite links to Moscow.
The documents suggest that the operation was sanctioned in principle at a senior level in the government of the then prime minister, Gordon Brown, and that intelligence, including briefings for visiting delegates, was passed to British ministers...
It's the oldest question of all, George. Who can spy on the spies?
that said...
just fuckin tell us you are doing this shit. stop being so secretive about every little thing.
"...it's important to bear in mind I'm being called a traitor by men like former Vice President Dick Cheney. This is a man who gave us the warrantless wiretapping scheme as a kind of atrocity warm-up on the way to deceitfully engineering a conflict that has killed over 4,400 and maimed nearly 32,000 Americans, as well as leaving over 100,000 Iraqis dead. Being called a traitor by Dick Cheney is the highest honor you can give an American, and the more panicked talk we hear from people like him, Feinstein, and King, the better off we all are. If they had taught a class on how to be the kind of citizen Dick Cheney worries about, I would have finished high school."
- Edward Snowden
[
Aerial...
The point I'm making is this...
WHY was it okay for the SAME data gathering operations to go on in 2006?
...
Also, all of your talking points above... they could all be taken right off of the script of one of Sean Hannity's television shows.
Hail, Hail!!!
The problem with this is that the government ostensibly is using this to track suspected terrorists, but there is nothing to prevent them from using it against the political oppostion. Hopefully we have learned from the IRS scandal that the government cannot be expected to use its authority in a nonpartisan way, and that those in power can be expected sometimes to abuse that power against their foes.
This is not a partisan issue. this is government overreach and it started with the Bush administration. I am disturbed by the apathy of so many towards this
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/ju ... n-us-china
Snowden spy row grows as US is accused of hacking China
Whistleblower charged with espionage reportedly claims US authorities accessed millions of private text messages in China
Toby Helm, Daniel Boffey and Nick Hopkins
The Observer, Saturday 22 June 2013
'...The 30-year-old intelligence analyst has over the past three weeks leaked a series of documents to the Guardian revealing how US and UK secret services gain access to huge amounts of phone and internet data, raising serious questions about privacy in the internet age.
On Friday, based on documents from Snowden, the Guardian reported that Britain's spy agency GCHQ has secretly gained access to the network of cables carrying the world's phone calls and internet traffic, without the authorities having made this known to the public. It was also reported that GCHQ is processing vast streams of sensitive information which it is sharing with its US partner, the National Security Agency.
On Saturday the former British foreign secretary Sir Malcolm Rifkind, who now chairs the intelligence and security committee, said the committee would launch an investigation into the latest revelations. The committee will receive an official report from GCHQ about the story within days and will then decide whether to call witnesses to give oral evidence. If it is then thought necessary, the committee can require GCHQ to submit relevant data.
Within hours of news breaking that the US had filed charges against Snowden, the South China Morning Post reported that the whistleblower had handed over a series of documents to the paper detailing how the US had targeted Chinese phone companies as part of a widespread attempt to get its hands on a mass of data.
Text messaging is the most popular form of communication in mainland China where more than 900bn SMS messages were exchanged in 2012.Snowden reportedly told the paper: "The NSA does all kinds of things like hack Chinese cellphone companies to steal all of your SMS data."
The paper said Snowden had also passed on information detailing NSA attacks on China's prestigious Tsinghua University, the hub of a major digital network from which data on millions of Chinese citizens could be harvested.
As Snowden made his latest disclosures, the US issued an extradition request to Hong Kong and piled pressure on the territory to respond swiftly. "If Hong Kong doesn't act soon, it will complicate our bilateral relations and raise questions about Hong Kong's commitment to the rule of law," a senior Obama administration official said.
Snowden appeared to be gaining support from politicians in Hong Kong who said China should support him against any extradition application from the US, which on Friday charged him under its Espionage Act. One legislator, Leung Kwok-hung, said Beijing should issue instructions to protect Snowden from extradition before his case was dragged through the courts. Leung urged the Hong Kong people to "take to the streets to protect Snowden". Another politician, Cyd Ho, vice-chairwoman of the pro-democracy Labour party, said China "should now make its stance clear to the Hong Kong SAR [Special Administrative Region] government" before the case goes before a court...'
On the Espionage Act charges against Edward Snowden
Who is actually bringing 'injury to America': those who are secretly building a massive surveillance system or those who inform citizens that it's being done?
Glenn Greenwald
guardian.co.uk, Saturday 22 June 2013
'...Prior to Barack Obama's inauguration, there were a grand total of three prosecutions of leakers under the Espionage Act (including the prosecution of Dan Ellsberg by the Nixon DOJ). That's because the statute is so broad that even the US government has largely refrained from using it. But during the Obama presidency, there are now seven such prosecutions: more than double the number under all prior US presidents combined. How can anyone justify that?
For a politician who tried to convince Americans to elect him based on repeated pledges of unprecedented transparency and specific vows to protect "noble" and "patriotic" whistleblowers, is this unparalleled assault on those who enable investigative journalism remotely defensible? Recall that the New Yorker's Jane Mayer said recently that this oppressive climate created by the Obama presidency has brought investigative journalism to a "standstill", while James Goodale, the General Counsel for the New York Times during its battles with the Nixon administration, wrote last month in that paper that "President Obama will surely pass President Richard Nixon as the worst president ever on issues of national security and press freedom." Read what Mayer and Goodale wrote and ask yourself: is the Obama administration's threat to the news-gathering process not a serious crisis at this point?
...He [Edward Snowden] could have - but chose not - sold the information he had to a foreign intelligence service for vast sums of money, or covertly passed it to one of America's enemies, or worked at the direction of a foreign government. That is espionage. He did none of those things.
What he did instead was give up his life of career stability and economic prosperity, living with his long-time girlfriend in Hawaii, in order to inform his fellow citizens (both in America and around the world) of what the US government and its allies are doing to them and their privacy. He did that by very carefully selecting which documents he thought should be disclosed and concealed, then gave them to a newspaper with a team of editors and journalists and repeatedly insisted that journalistic judgments be exercised about which of those documents should be published in the public interest and which should be withheld.
That's what every single whistleblower and source for investigative journalism, in every case, does - by definition. In what conceivable sense does that merit felony charges under the Espionage Act?
The essence of that extremely broad, century-old law is that one is guilty if one discloses classified information "with intent or reason to believe that the information is to be used to the injury of the United States, or to the advantage of any foreign nation". Please read this rather good summary in this morning's New York Times of the worldwide debate Snowden has enabled - how these disclosures have "set off a national debate over the proper limits of government surveillance" and "opened an unprecedented window on the details of surveillance by the NSA, including its compilation of logs of virtually all telephone calls in the United States and its collection of e-mails of foreigners from the major American Internet companies, including Google, Yahoo, Microsoft, Apple and Skype" - and ask yourself: has Snowden actually does anything to bring "injury to the United States", or has he performed an immense public service?
The irony is obvious: the same people who are building a ubiquitous surveillance system to spy on everyone in the world, including their own citizens, are now accusing the person who exposed it of "espionage". It seems clear that the people who are actually bringing "injury to the United States" are those who are waging war on basic tenets of transparency and secretly constructing a mass and often illegal and unconstitutional surveillance apparatus aimed at American citizens - and those who are lying to the American people and its Congress about what they're doing - rather than those who are devoted to informing the American people that this is being done.
The Obama administration leaks classified information continuously. They do it to glorify the President, or manipulate public opinion, or even to help produce a pre-election propaganda film about the Osama bin Laden raid. The Obama administration does not hate unauthorized leaks of classified information. They are more responsible for such leaks than anyone.
What they hate are leaks that embarrass them or expose their wrongdoing. Those are the only kinds of leaks that are prosecuted. It's a completely one-sided and manipulative abuse of secrecy laws. It's all designed to ensure that the only information we as citizens can learn is what they want us to learn because it makes them look good. The only leaks they're interested in severely punishing are those that undermine them politically. The "enemy" they're seeking to keep ignorant with selective and excessive leak prosecutions are not The Terrorists or The Chinese Communists. It's the American people.
The Terrorists already knew, and have long known, that the US government is doing everything possible to surveil their telephonic and internet communications. The Chinese have long known, and have repeatedly said, that the US is hacking into both their governmental and civilian systems (just as the Chinese are doing to the US). The Russians have long known that the US and UK try to intercept the conversations of their leaders just as the Russians do to the US and the UK.
They haven't learned anything from these disclosures that they didn't already well know. The people who have learned things they didn't already know are American citizens who have no connection to terrorism or foreign intelligence, as well as hundreds of millions of citizens around the world about whom the same is true. What they have learned is that the vast bulk of this surveillance apparatus is directed not at the Chinese or Russian governments or the Terrorists, but at them.
And that is precisely why the US government is so furious and will bring its full weight to bear against these disclosures. What has been "harmed" is not the national security of the US but the ability of its political leaders to work against their own citizens and citizens around the world in the dark, with zero transparency or real accountability. If anything is a crime, it's that secret, unaccountable and deceitful behavior: not the shining of light on it.
I think someone has their foil cap on too tight...
I think you make some valid points, but I agree with the person who said that if this was happening under Bush, it would not be getting as much backlash.
Here is how I see it:
I'm pissed this was happening, although I pretty much already knew something like this was happening cuz of the Patriot Act.
However, to fight modern terrorism, you need tactics like this, because they use a wide variety of technology. To fight technology you need technology. Their tapping and trying to listen to something that involves terrorism is valid, but it sucks it violates our civil liberties.
But now that terrorists definitely know all of how the gov't was listening to them, they now know not to use phones or do anything technological anymore. It may slow them down, but they will be hard to catch.
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense
Here is a video of that:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t27ie4qFlXM
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/06 ... z2XEZOQ3gO
Godfather.
'As an example of the order's broad sweep, a Department of Education security systems webinar describes how, "certain life experiences can alter a person's normal behavior and cause them to act illegally or irresponsibly."
It points to "stress, divorce, untreated mental illness, financial problems, frustrations with co-workers or the organization" as warning signs that must be reported.'
So now having a conscience, and acting on it, is synonymous with mental illness?
I was thinking that all those "disorders" affect about 99.9% of the worlds population at some point and time
so now it's a executive order to keep an eye on your co-worker and rat them out for personal problems ?
Godfather.
"I don't think President Obama is here tonight... But I'm sure he's listening in," Jagger reportedly joked.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/20 ... z2XFEIH5gn
Godfather.
I imagine most Americans thought the Government was listening to SUSPICIOUS people the could be terrorist...Not every American in the country.....on the other hand if Americans did know it than the Terrorist already knew it also....Then government does not need to keep records of everyone in this country.....
I just want to say that Fox News isn't the best thing to source.
But it kind of makes sense. Say someone in charge of missiles has just lost this whole family in some accident and sees no hope of living. He does not care what happens to him. So he just decides to launch missiles at the building he works in.
Don't be like, "Look at this guy trying to "defend" his government again."
I am not defending anyone, I am just saying it makes sense to let higher officials know that someone is really depressed/angry/sad, etc, and it may effect their job. I bet some may "rat" on others, but they wouldn't do anything unless they knew for sure they wouldn't be able to do their job.
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense
Many people do not even know what is in our constitution, they are uninformed, therefore, these liberties are being taken away and people are complacent because it does not immediately affect their daily lives.
:thumbup:
Godfather.
See... that's just it... you imagined.
in this case, your imagination betrayed you and kept you from the facts. Those facts being, the data mining was going on prior to 2006 and the NSA was gathering phone record data on all of us... same as they are today.
The biggest difference being, in 2006, FOX News was broadcasting out how this type of operation was good for us because it also captured the 'terrorists' in its massive dragnet.
...
I beg of you... when considering political matters and those things that deal with our rights, the Constitution and law enforcement... use the facts to form your opinions, not your imagination on what you want to believe to be the facts.
Trusts me... facts beat imagined fear every time.
Hail, Hail!!!
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Michele Catalano was looking for information online about pressure cookers. Her husband, in the same time frame, was Googling backpacks. Wednesday morning, six men from a joint terrorism task force showed up at their house to see if they were terrorists. Which begs the question: How'd the government know what they were Googling?
http://news.yahoo.com/google-pressure-cookers-backpacks-visit-feds-140900667.html
(My bad if this has already been posted on the Train, not even sure if it belongs in this thread)
First, this would mean that the US Government has actually built something that works. Second, there is no way they are doing this 100 times a week and this is the first we have heard of it. Not in iAmerica.
And lastly, the way she describes their behaivior ... nice, cordial, and being put on a verbal defensive a few times ... that's not typical of someone who is on a joint terrorism task force. They would be forceful, direct, and would not give back any answers or information.
Well if they are doing it 100 times a week and 99 times out of the 100 are a waste of time, Maybe that's why they seem the way they do (the joint task force)
I dunno,
one other thing ... the photo next to the story is clearly not of the incident per the way she described the force to be in plain clothes. wtf, yahoo and atlantic wire? do you still have to earn a degree in journalism or can you win one in a cracker jack box these days?
I agree.
Reading it I pictured in my head them sitting around a table drinking tea and politely asking them questions.
You can spend your time alone, redigesting past regrets, oh
or you can come to terms and realize
you're the only one who can't forgive yourself, oh
makes much more sense to live in the present tense - Present Tense