Pot and Teens

chadwick

drug induced paranoia is a hoot. i've been so frickin blowed on marijuana, opium, hash, shrooms & acid...some at the same time that i was a wreck in my own head. it was fantastic being so frickin blist & this happened a lot & it was like paradise. dive in it, man, go with the flow. was awesome.

riding passager in a cramped truck. four of us in a two seater. the driver not tripping says to us, 'the cops are following us' holy fucking shit i about had a heart attack & was scared shitless.

there was no cop. it was new years eve about 1 or 2 a.m. & he thought he was funny. also... the best weed to smoke/consume is the strongest stuff they got. why fuck w/ anything less than balls out kill?

if you're gonna be a doper or a little drug addict you want the best/strongest shit around..right? or am i frickin wrong here?

no one wants bunk ass mexican commercial compressed brick ass seedy frickin stemy trash bud do they?

Thirty Bills Unpaid

chadwick wrote:

drug induced paranoia is a hoot. i've been so frickin blowed on marijuana, opium, hash, shrooms & acid...some at the same time that i was a wreck in my own head. it was fantastic being so frickin blist & this happened a lot & it was like paradise. dive in it, man, go with the flow. was awesome.

riding passager in a cramped truck. four of us in a two seater. the driver not tripping says to us, 'the cops are following us' holy fucking shit i about had a heart attack & was scared shitless.

there was no cop. it was new years eve about 1 or 2 a.m. & he thought he was funny. also... the best weed to smoke/consume is the strongest stuff they got. why fuck w/ anything less than balls out kill?

if you're gonna be a doper or a little drug addict you want the best/strongest shit around..right? or am i frickin wrong here?

no one wants bunk ass mexican commercial compressed brick ass seedy frickin stemy trash bud do they?

I'm pretty sure you are looking for our province's 'cash crop'. From what I know, BC is reputed to have some excellent horticulturists.

PJ_Soul

Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:

PJ_Soul wrote:

Yeah, I don't buy that either. It could certainly trigger it for those in which it's latent. But there is Monday to say that it wouldn't have happened anyway, even if they'd never smoked pot. I don't believe for a second that pot actually causes schizophrenia.

I have definitely seen it reduce people's quality of life though, and I've seen it lower people's potential severely (hey, maybe it lowered mine... I'm doing fine, but for all I know, if I'd never smoked dope I would be a rich doctor or something! Who knows! And that statement right there is a good reason to dissuade young people from touching the stuff). I think that how individuals handle pot use is determined by their natural disposition, actually. Some dispositions are just better suited to responsible use than others. Those others tend to burn out hard.

You don't believe in drug induced paranoia?

Yes I do. I knew so.done with drug induced psychosis actually. She eventually started stalking third eye blind and then killed herself. :( I'm just saying that pot doesn't cause schizophrenia. But also, I have personally never heard of anyone who had drug induced psychosis or paranoia just from weed. Other drugs have been involved. Of course, some people do get paranoid while high on weed, so I guess it's got to a permanent state.for someone somewhere. Couldn't be common though. So uncommon that it's barely worthworrying aabout IMO. I think the concern should be in that weed very commonly lowers motivation to the point where it ruins lives.

PJ_Soul

Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:

chadwick wrote:

drug induced paranoia is a hoot. i've been so frickin blowed on marijuana, opium, hash, shrooms & acid...some at the same time that i was a wreck in my own head. it was fantastic being so frickin blist & this happened a lot & it was like paradise. dive in it, man, go with the flow. was awesome.

riding passager in a cramped truck. four of us in a two seater. the driver not tripping says to us, 'the cops are following us' holy fucking shit i about had a heart attack & was scared shitless.

there was no cop. it was new years eve about 1 or 2 a.m. & he thought he was funny. also... the best weed to smoke/consume is the strongest stuff they got. why fuck w/ anything less than balls out kill?

if you're gonna be a doper or a little drug addict you want the best/strongest shit around..right? or am i frickin wrong here?

no one wants bunk ass mexican commercial compressed brick ass seedy frickin stemy trash bud do they?

I'm pretty sure you are looking for our province's 'cash crop'. From what I know, BC is reputed to have some excellent horticulturists.

Yup!

Thirty Bills Unpaid

PJ_Soul wrote:

Yes I do. I knew so.done with drug induced psychosis actually. She eventually started stalking third eye blind and then killed herself. :( I'm just saying that pot doesn't cause schizophrenia. But also, I have personally never heard of anyone who had drug induced psychosis or paranoia just from weed. Other drugs have been involved. Of course, some people do get paranoid while high on weed, so I guess it's got to a permanent state.for someone somewhere. Couldn't be common though. So uncommon that it's barely worthworrying aabout IMO. I think the concern should be in that weed very commonly lowers motivation to the point where it ruins lives.

But it's part in parcel. As small any risk might be, our youth needs to be aware of all of the risks associated with anything so they might make informed decisions.

I'm not necessarily hearing a condemnation for teens smoking pot. Do we want our youth smoking dope?

PJ_Soul

Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:

PJ_Soul wrote:

Yes I do. I knew so.done with drug induced psychosis actually. She eventually started stalking third eye blind and then killed herself. :( I'm just saying that pot doesn't cause schizophrenia. But also, I have personally never heard of anyone who had drug induced psychosis or paranoia just from weed. Other drugs have been involved. Of course, some people do get paranoid while high on weed, so I guess it's got to a permanent state.for someone somewhere. Couldn't be common though. So uncommon that it's barely worthworrying aabout IMO. I think the concern should be in that weed very commonly lowers motivation to the point where it ruins lives.

But it's part in parcel. As small any risk might be, our youth needs to be aware of all of the risks associated with anything so they might make informed decisions.

I'm not necessarily hearing a condemnation for teens smoking pot. Do we want our youth smoking dope?

You're not? I thought that I've been pretty clear in saying that kids should be discouraged from smoking it because of the possible negative consequences. And it's certainly never going to be legal anywhere for youths to smoke it. But I also know that that isn't going to stop them so I think that, after condemnation is made clear, encouraging moderation and thoughtful use by those who are using it is also an important part of the message.

chadwick

grass makes me hyperactive. cleaning house stoned rocks. puff puff pass = zoom zoom zoom. then again i swim good & long while when eating methadone & percocets. function, people, function. for cryin out loud it's just a frickin joint & a few bong hits & a few pills & a few chewed up buds to swallow.

now go do your algebra and report back to me

Thirty Bills Unpaid

chadwick wrote:

grass makes me hyperactive. cleaning house stoned rocks. puff puff pass = zoom zoom zoom. then again i swim good & long while eating methadone & percocets. function, people, function. for cryin out loud it's just a frickin joint & a few bong hits & a few pills & a few chewed up buds to swallow.

now go do your algebra and report back to me

In this particular case, I would suggest to carry on. For some such as yourselves... no harm no foul and this is why I will not judge those that choose to use.

But let's be honest... not everyone gets the same positive experience after getting high. I know of people who struggle greatly once high: they feel a dramatic rush of anxiety, they cannot relax, they wrestle with their greatest insecurities, they misread people's intentions (paranoia), and they become introverted and tense. This experience is in contrast to those experiences they met in their early stages of drug use. These new experiences have been developed over time and very accurately represent some of the negative side effects that have been promoted by experts.

chadwick

then those people should be beat with a 4 foot long iron bar, set on fire & ran over with four large semi automatic tanks, thrown into a raging river then hung up by their ear lobes until dry then tossed onto a fire ant hill as they are then lathered in honey, syrup & coyote urine as the buzzards are brought in for entertainment purposes

rollings

chadwick wrote:

then those people should be beat with a 4 foot long iron bar, set on fire & ran over with four large semi automatic tanks, thrown into a raging river then hung up by their ear lobes until dry then tossed onto a fire ant hill as they are then lathered in honey, syrup & coyote urine as the buzzards are brought in for entertainment purposes

or, they shouldn't smoke pot

Thirty Bills Unpaid

rollings wrote:

chadwick wrote:

then those people should be beat with a 4 foot long iron bar, set on fire & ran over with four large semi automatic tanks, thrown into a raging river then hung up by their ear lobes until dry then tossed onto a fire ant hill as they are then lathered in honey, syrup & coyote urine as the buzzards are brought in for entertainment purposes

or, they shouldn't smoke pot

One of the two for sure though!

BinauralJam

Good for her, it's nobody else's business.

Drowned Out

Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:

I'm not going to judge anyone smoking pot, but some items have not been presented yet that should at least give someone pause for thought before accepting pot usage among teens.

Mental illness, paranoia, psychosis, and schizophrenia have all been linked to marijuana use. Not everyone exhibits these diagnoses, but some do. Pot use quadruples teens chances for developing schizophrenia. A fairly high price for a recreational high.

Pot is not harmless. The dope kids get today is way more potent than the dope we smoked as teens.

http://www.cbc.ca/player/Shows/Shows/Th ... 398511775/

What is the answer? Not sure. Educating the kid about the 'downside of high' would be a good idea.

Leave it to a pot thread to drag me back to the pit


The Nature of Things episode you linked - I watched it a while back and don't remember much of what's covered...but I watched the intro, and it seems the cause they are using to show a link to schizophrenia is an increase in dopamine. What appears to me to be an identical study shows an opposite result (?)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1953 ... d_RVDocSum
Dr Suzuki also interviews the author of a meta-analysis (review of a bunch of previous studies) released in 2005, named "The environment and schizophrenia: the role of cannabis use"...it's available online, I will be checking it out later...but the claims this van Os character claims seem mostly contradicted in this 2007 meta-analysis...
http://apt.rcpsych.org/content/13/6/400.full#sec-16
So who is right?
The 2007 article points out a ton of issues in determining a link between schizophrenia and psychosis and pot use. It does not completely rule it out, and calls for further research into whether psychosis can be prevented by preventing pot use....But just looking at the number of variables and issues with methodology, confounding, reverse causality, interpretation of results, etc....We have to realize that epidemiology has limitations and loooong learning curve when it comes to this shit...You throw in political bias and control over research funding, particularly when looking at a difficult to regulate substance (plant), which could harm the bottom line for several influential, established industries if legalized....knowing there is a large lobby working to maintain the status quo, we have to give a little extra scrutiny to scientific claims used to support the prohibitionists.

in relation to the OP - it seems a bit reckless to make a statement like "pot use quadruples teens chances for developing schizophrenia. a fairly high price for a recreational high"....because making a virtually unprovable statement like that as a way to deter pot use can be viewed as drug war propaganda or cherry-picked science, and turned around on you by a clever teen curious about getting a buzz These points are highly debatable and you're presenting them as fact....which could come off as a scare tactic (it does to me, anyway).

peacefrompaul

I started smoking pot and drinking at 15... I've done acid 3 times, mushrooms twice, popped all kinds of pills... I smoke half a pack a day....

On track to graduate in 4 years.

Drowned Out

whgarrett wrote:

Pot is an extremely potent drug, and there seems to be no end to the users craving for stronger bud. I don't think people under the age of 21 should smoke. It shouldn't be demonized, but it shouldn't be accepted either. In WA state I have been hearing of some recent freakouts due to smoking weed. These are veterans too. There are some powerful shit floating around. Also, everyones seems to be making hash oil lately. BHO.

It shouldn't be demonized...but there have been 'some recent freakouts due to smoking weed' ? Veterans, no less!
Source?
"powerful shit" does not affect you any differently than "not-so-powerful-shit" if you smoke enough of it. More potent pot is likely better for a user who chooses to ingest by smoking, as they have to use less to get the same effect.
http://www.alternet.org/story/19416/the ... ot%27_myth

Drowned Out

peacefrompaul wrote:

I started smoking pot and drinking at 15... I've done acid 3 times, mushrooms twice, popped all kinds of pills...

On track to graduate in 4 years.

:thumbup: As has been stated here - priorities. Sounds like you have your shit together and understand the concept..
Once people understand that concept, it becomes a matter of personal choice and cost/benefit, imo. With costs being financial, legal, and health-related, with a lot of subjective (and also difficult to prove) benefits. For some people the benefits do not outweigh the costs, for others they do.

CH156378

:corn:

jbarbian

When we talk about people freaking out and stuff from weed, other than ones own brain chemistry, we are talking about THC levels and indica vs sativa. IMO research and growing techniques will strengthen as we legalize/decriminalize and the consumer will know what works best for them AND be able to obtain it. ie: you may want a low-medium THC indica to help with body aches at the end of the work day or to help with sleep, or a high THC sativa to take to Wrigley for a trippy good time.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Drowned Out wrote:

Leave it to a pot thread to drag me back to the pit


The Nature of Things episode you linked - I watched it a while back and don't remember much of what's covered...but I watched the intro, and it seems the cause they are using to show a link to schizophrenia is an increase in dopamine. What appears to me to be an identical study shows an opposite result (?)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1953 ... d_RVDocSum
Dr Suzuki also interviews the author of a meta-analysis (review of a bunch of previous studies) released in 2005, named "The environment and schizophrenia: the role of cannabis use"...it's available online, I will be checking it out later...but the claims this van Os character claims seem mostly contradicted in this 2007 meta-analysis...
http://apt.rcpsych.org/content/13/6/400.full#sec-16
So who is right?
The 2007 article points out a ton of issues in determining a link between schizophrenia and psychosis and pot use. It does not completely rule it out, and calls for further research into whether psychosis can be prevented by preventing pot use....But just looking at the number of variables and issues with methodology, confounding, reverse causality, interpretation of results, etc....We have to realize that epidemiology has limitations and loooong learning curve when it comes to this shit...You throw in political bias and control over research funding, particularly when looking at a difficult to regulate substance (plant), which could harm the bottom line for several influential, established industries if legalized....knowing there is a large lobby working to maintain the status quo, we have to give a little extra scrutiny to scientific claims used to support the prohibitionists.

in relation to the OP - it seems a bit reckless to make a statement like "pot use quadruples teens chances for developing schizophrenia. a fairly high price for a recreational high"....because making a virtually unprovable statement like that as a way to deter pot use can be viewed as drug war propaganda or cherry-picked science, and turned around on you by a clever teen curious about getting a buzz These points are highly debatable and you're presenting them as fact....which could come off as a scare tactic (it does to me, anyway).

I'm not trying to scare anyone. As I expressed before, I am not trying to be the thread 'square'. I know full well how people can smoke marijuana and still have productive and happy lives. But it would be naive to suggest to anyone that pot is perfect and doesn't have its pitfalls. Suzuki is a well-respected researcher. His film isn't propoganda: he presents his findings which seem to support what experts have been saying for decades. To me, they are at a very minimum worth noting. I'm not so sure that qualifies as reckless and I'm also not sure that you can dismiss them so easily.

Troubling again though, is it seems as if people are advocating for the use of marijuana among our youth sector. While the negative side effects are debatable... people cannot be serious when they suggest that pot is harmless and that teens should pursue getting high because there is no problem with doing so.

Regardless, I understand the 'draw' and I'm not so naive to think that kids- or adults for that matter- will abstain after hearing the negative side effects of marijuana use. All I'm saying we need to provide our youth with information and have them make informed choices without promoting the drug. Is there a problem with this?

hedonist

Drowned Out wrote:

peacefrompaul wrote:

I started smoking pot and drinking at 15... I've done acid 3 times, mushrooms twice, popped all kinds of pills...

On track to graduate in 4 years.

:thumbup: As has been stated here - priorities. Sounds like you have your shit together and understand the concept..
Once people understand that concept, it becomes a matter of personal choice and cost/benefit, imo. With costs being financial, legal, and health-related, with a lot of subjective (and also difficult to prove) benefits. For some people the benefits do not outweigh the costs, for others they do.

Another thumbs-up from here.

(we sorely need more people with their overall shit together like young PFP )

Glad you dipped your toe in again here, Drowned Out!