Please explain the WHOLE Fiscal Cliff being addressed.
What will take place the next few days/weeks?
On Sunday night, the increased taxes on folks making $1 million or more will be passed, everything else will be put off for the new session, and we will see the battle begin anew in February as we approach the debt ceiling again (though I can also see the concession that this round of debt ceiling raising gets through, so Obama can claim somewhat victory, and the can can be kicked until next December).
And, while everyone will claim victory, they are all the cause of this. It's a big game of chicken, and unfortunately, we are the ultimate losers. I won't cut spending. I won't raise taxes. Let's stare each other in the eye and do the minimal to effect each of our constituencies, so we can all get re-elected and continue with our own largese.
As I'm sure is no surprise to anyone that reads my post - we need to cut spending, or you can raise taxes all you want and we're still in deep doo-doo. The Republicans are more (not totally by any stretch) in the right here. It can't just be reductions in future spending which can easily be undone by tack ons to future bills. It has to be immediate cuts that reduced spending across the board. Without that, I agree with them - why spit in the ocean? Thus, going over the cliff is the right thing to do. Every expense reviewed. Every tax reviewed. Every person effected. Not pick and choose which pimple to pop.
Sorry. The world doesn't work the way you tell it to.
what im most impressed with is how mobilized we americans are...i mean whats worse than going over a cliff. this will have long lasting effects on us all, black white, brown, green yellow, rich, poor, freeloader, etc. so many are taking to the streets as one, so many are gathering to discuss resolutions as one, the entire country has united to stop the car from going over the cliff. we truly believe that this is real and we truly believe that it will be even worse than it already is so much so that we are moved to act. its great to be an american, its times like these that make me be proud to be american.
what im most impressed with is how mobilized we americans are...i mean whats worse than going over a cliff. this will have long lasting effects on us all, black white, brown, green yellow, rich, poor, freeloader, etc. so many are taking to the streets as one, so many are gathering to discuss resolutions as one, the entire country has united to stop the car from going over the cliff. we truly believe that this is real and we truly believe that it will be even worse than it already is so much so that we are moved to act. its great to be an american, its times like these that make me be proud to be american.
Sarcasm duly noted. Though, you have proved the genius of the framers once again. And one of our great faults in trying to create other democracies around they world. The difference b/w them and us is that they don't have any Jeffersons, Franklins, et. al. like we were lucky enough to have.
Sorry. The world doesn't work the way you tell it to.
Gimme, I can't walk out of a Ferrari dealership without a car and claim I saved $300k. Same logic applies here.
what about cutting the pentagon budget equates to saving money by not increasing spending, when the pentagon and military budgets are going back to less than what they are now?
it is simple math.
i don't think we are counting the money the gop wants to give the military that is over and above what the military is asking for as savings.... :fp:
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
i dont understand why the US government is having such an issue with pulling back from this supposed cliff. decide what needs to be done and do it.
It's not up to the "U.S. Government"
its the U.S. House of Representatives that are holding things up
actually to be more specific its the teabaggers in the house that are holding things up
it will get done
just not as timely or as easily as we average Americans would like
i dont understand why the US government is having such an issue with pulling back from this supposed cliff. decide what needs to be done and do it.
It's not up to the "U.S. Government"
its the U.S. House of Representatives that are holding things up
actually to be more specific its the teabaggers in the house that are holding things up
it will get done
just not as timely or as easily as we average Americans would like
so the house of reps arent a part of the govt? interesting.. they are here.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
i dont understand why the US government is having such an issue with pulling back from this supposed cliff. decide what needs to be done and do it.
It's not up to the "U.S. Government"
its the U.S. House of Representatives that are holding things up
actually to be more specific its the teabaggers in the house that are holding things up
it will get done
just not as timely or as easily as we average Americans would like
so the house of reps arent a part of the govt? interesting.. they are here.
Lately you would think they were their own country the way the teabaggers have been behaving
its the U.S. House of Representatives that are holding things up
actually to be more specific its the teabaggers in the house that are holding things up
it will get done
just not as timely or as easily as we average Americans would like
so the house of reps arent a part of the govt? interesting.. they are here.
Lately you would think they were their own country the way the teabaggers have been behaving
it is quite interesting that certain politicans thwart moves to improve things and then blame the leader for not improving things.. as if he made the decision. politics is horseshit. it would appear to some it is a game where the only losers are the people... and yet we seem to be okay with it.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
This is what happens when people elect a President that can not lead or is not interested in leading.
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
This is what happens when people elect a President that can not lead or is not interested in leading.
respectfully, where the hell are you getting your information from? what evidence do you have that obama is not leading and is not interested in leading???
obama's positions regarding the fiscal cliff and deficits are the same as they were during the campaign.
the american people overwhelmingly supported those positions by voting for him in a landslide victory over romney.
based on every poll out there now, the american people want a compromise. obama has put entitlement reform on the table. something that the american people and the democrats vehemently oppose. he has tried to compromise. boehner, mcconnell, and the tea party have not compromised at all. boehner could not even get his "plan b" brought to a vote because his own party did not support it. who is the failed leader now??
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
This is what happens when people elect a President that can not lead or is not interested in leading.
respectfully, where the hell are you getting your information from? what evidence do you have that obama is not leading and is not interested in leading???
obama's positions regarding the fiscal cliff and deficits are the same as they were during the campaign.
the american people overwhelmingly supported those positions by voting for him in a landslide victory over romney.
based on every poll out there now, the american people want a compromise. obama has put entitlement reform on the table. something that the american people and the democrats vehemently oppose. he has tried to compromise. boehner, mcconnell, and the tea party have not compromised at all. boehner could not even get his "plan b" brought to a vote because his own party did not support it. who is the failed leader now??
Polls mean nothing....can you tell me where he is leading this country.....besides into more debt and division......since when does the President give raises......
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
Polls mean nothing....can you tell me where he is leading this country.....besides into more debt and division......since when does the President give raises......
polls do mean something. polls are representative of what the majority of americans are thinking on certain issues.
it is typical of a republican to oppose everything and then blame the president for not compromising. you have bought into the fox news mentality hook, line, and sinker. the american people are not falling for that crap anymore.
the republicans are going to take the blame for this, and they are going to lose the house in 2014. mark my words.
i can not wait to hear obama admonish them on live tv in the state of the union. hell, maybe even in his inaugural address...
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
Polls mean nothing....can you tell me where he is leading this country.....besides into more debt and division......since when does the President give raises......
polls do mean something. polls are representative of what the majority of americans are thinking on certain issues.
it is typical of a republican to oppose everything and then blame the president for not compromising. you have bought into the fox news mentality hook, line, and sinker. the american people are not falling for that crap anymore.
the republicans are going to take the blame for this, and they are going to lose the house in 2014. mark my words.
i can not wait to hear obama admonish them on live tv in the state of the union. hell, maybe even in his inaugural address...
polls are a joke dude. those poll numbers are manipulated by whatever outlet releases them
obama's legacy will be a failure of catastrophic proportions. what has he done to define his presidency??? gay marriage rights? awesome...congrats. that affects something like 2% of the population
and hold the excuses. I know obama supporters are quick to say it's everyone's fault but his. what has he accomplished???????????????? other than record deficits
Polls mean nothing....can you tell me where he is leading this country.....besides into more debt and division......since when does the President give raises......
polls do mean something. polls are representative of what the majority of americans are thinking on certain issues.
it is typical of a republican to oppose everything and then blame the president for not compromising. you have bought into the fox news mentality hook, line, and sinker. the american people are not falling for that crap anymore.
the republicans are going to take the blame for this, and they are going to lose the house in 2014. mark my words.
i can not wait to hear obama admonish them on live tv in the state of the union. hell, maybe even in his inaugural address...
You mean the polls that say tax SOMEBODY ELSE?
I also love that your favorite part of this is him admonishing folks. Too funny. That's not what leaders do. (Though you are exactly right. That is what he will do.).
Sorry. The world doesn't work the way you tell it to.
and the democratic/republican masturbation continues....
I truly wonder if the Average American realizes just what is in store for them. From what I can gather, the average American will pay an additional $1700 or so a year in taxes. That means everyones payroll check will be $30-$35 a week less? $120-$140 less a month? Thats a TON of money to Mr. and Mrs. Average American. PLUS having the child dependent claim sliced in half? Not being able to claim the interest on your home?
Its a HUGE kick in the ass to Mr. and Mrs. Average American.
Take me piece by piece..... Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
and the democratic/republican masturbation continues....
I truly wonder if the Average American realizes just what is in store for them. From what I can gather, the average American will pay an additional $1700 or so a year in taxes. That means everyones payroll check will be $30-$35 a week less? $120-$140 less a month? Thats a TON of money to Mr. and Mrs. Average American. PLUS having the child dependent claim sliced in half? Not being able to claim the interest on your home?
Its a HUGE kick in the ass to Mr. and Mrs. Average American.
wont happen! like i said in a previous post, once the circle jerk ends there will be a agreement and a "tax deal". all that remains is which "side" comes first.
its like the girl in the scary movie that looks for the noise in the basement, you know she will be killed by the monster, you just dont know exactly when and how.
wont happen! like i said in a previous post, once the circle jerk ends there will be a agreement and a "tax deal". all that remains is which "side" comes first.
its like the girl in the scary movie that looks for the noise in the basement, you know she will be killed by the monster, you just dont know exactly when and how.
I wouldn't be so sure. Like these forums, your government is so partisan that it seems entirely possible that nothing will be accomplished. In the past it seems that the Democrats have been more inclined to cave to Republican demands, however I get the feeling a line has been drawn here.
Just a hunch, but I imagine that 2013 will be about pointing fingers and campaigning for 2014 instead of finding common ground.
wont happen! like i said in a previous post, once the circle jerk ends there will be a agreement and a "tax deal". all that remains is which "side" comes first.
its like the girl in the scary movie that looks for the noise in the basement, you know she will be killed by the monster, you just dont know exactly when and how.
I wouldn't be so sure. Like these forums, your government is so partisan that it seems entirely possible that nothing will be accomplished. In the past it seems that the Democrats have been more inclined to cave to Republican demands, however I get the feeling a line has been drawn here.
Just a hunch, but I imagine that 2013 will be about pointing fingers and campaigning for 2014 instead of finding common ground.
Is it possible both sides see the forced reduced spending and forced higher taxes is the proper medicine we need to correct the crushing deficit/debt that needs to be addressed? They both "lose." They both "win." They both are able to save face while pointing fingers.
And while it will cause short term pain, it might actually be what we need to correct the long term problem.
The funny thing that's being ignored is that this "predicament" is actually caused by the Democrats' insistence on putting a term on the Bush tax cuts. Bush and the Republicans didn't want an expiration. Their thought was - if we want to change the tax rates in the future, it should be because we decide to, and not because of some imaginary termination date. So, I don't see how these tax increases are not solidly at the feet of the Democrats.
Now that being said, like I stated, if letting them expire and lowering expenses is the ultimate fix to the problem we are having, then they should get the credit if/when it works.
I'm on the side that some semblence of the Boehner plan (tax increases only for those making $1 million or more) with some Social Security cuts with an added raising of the debt ceiling will get passed in the next couple days (if it were to pass on the 2nd or 3rd, not much would have been effected). This way, they all get to kick the can down the road past the February debt ceiling crunch.
Sorry. The world doesn't work the way you tell it to.
At the end of the day democrats can blame the republicans but as the leader of this country the whole fiscal cliff is all on Obama. If he had any leadership skills whatsoever this would've been resolved already.
With less than a week to go he showed there is no urgency on his part to come up with a solution. He should have never taken a vacation for Christmas instead he should've remained in Washington and worked to resolve this issue.
He spent the first term blaming Bush for the 2008 financial crisis even though it was policies implemented by clinton that ultimately caused the collapse of the financial sector which caused the crisis. Now it looks like he's going to do the same for his second, blame others instead of working to find solutions.
He has shown zero accountability throughout his first term. He is truly a amateur who is shown time and time again that he is unqualified for this job.
At the end of the day democrats can blame the republicans but as the leader of this country the whole fiscal cliff is all on Obama. If he had any leadership skills whatsoever this would've been resolved already.
With less than a week to go he showed there is no urgency on his part to come up with a solution. He should have never taken a vacation for Christmas instead he should've remained in Washington and worked to resolve this issue.
He spent the first term blaming Bush for the 2008 financial crisis even though it was policies implemented by clinton that ultimately caused the collapse of the financial sector which caused the crisis. Now it looks like he's going to do the same for his second, blame others instead of working to find solutions.
He has shown zero accountability throughout his first term. He is truly a amateur who is shown time and time again that he is unqualified for this job.
and yet more democratic and republican masturbation...
I am sure that it will happen, politicians care about one thing and one thing only RETAINING POWER/CONTROL.
during the 11th hour democratic and republican circle jerk, a simple but temporary tax law will be enacted that restores some of the set to expire tax increases, the who and what specifics will be masturbated over whereby "both" sides will be able to claim "victories"...as a side show personal "entiltements" will be cut...there will be no mention or action taken against corporate "entitlements" or "war" spending
Fiscal Cliff the movie
...the terrified women wrapped only in a bath towel grabs a knife and is slowly walking down the basement stairs.....
This little tidbit, might effect a few people here.
Child Tax Credit: Families that had been able to claim a $1,000-per-child credit on their taxes will see this fall to $500 per child if the cliff happens. So a family with three children, for example, will get a $1,500 credit rather than a $3,000 credit. The Child Tax Credit is available to taxpayers with dependent children age 16 or younger and begins phasing out at modified adjusted gross incomes of for joint filers and $75,000 for single filers. Also, families who owe less in taxes than the credit is worth will no longer be eligible to have the excess credit refunded to them in most cases.
and this will have an effect on the middle and lower classes.
but the people in congress do not fall into those categories so they don't give a shit.
that will suck, but those that owed less ,they shouldn't have been given the difference!!! THERES an example of wasteful spending.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Comments
and again.
how is it big government when sequestration is going to cut a lot of spending? especially on "entitlements"..
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
On Sunday night, the increased taxes on folks making $1 million or more will be passed, everything else will be put off for the new session, and we will see the battle begin anew in February as we approach the debt ceiling again (though I can also see the concession that this round of debt ceiling raising gets through, so Obama can claim somewhat victory, and the can can be kicked until next December).
And, while everyone will claim victory, they are all the cause of this. It's a big game of chicken, and unfortunately, we are the ultimate losers. I won't cut spending. I won't raise taxes. Let's stare each other in the eye and do the minimal to effect each of our constituencies, so we can all get re-elected and continue with our own largese.
As I'm sure is no surprise to anyone that reads my post - we need to cut spending, or you can raise taxes all you want and we're still in deep doo-doo. The Republicans are more (not totally by any stretch) in the right here. It can't just be reductions in future spending which can easily be undone by tack ons to future bills. It has to be immediate cuts that reduced spending across the board. Without that, I agree with them - why spit in the ocean? Thus, going over the cliff is the right thing to do. Every expense reviewed. Every tax reviewed. Every person effected. Not pick and choose which pimple to pop.
Sarcasm duly noted. Though, you have proved the genius of the framers once again. And one of our great faults in trying to create other democracies around they world. The difference b/w them and us is that they don't have any Jeffersons, Franklins, et. al. like we were lucky enough to have.
it is simple math.
i don't think we are counting the money the gop wants to give the military that is over and above what the military is asking for as savings.... :fp:
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
A man that stands for nothing....will fall for anything!
All people need to do more on every level!
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
It's not up to the "U.S. Government"
its the U.S. House of Representatives that are holding things up
actually to be more specific its the teabaggers in the house that are holding things up
it will get done
just not as timely or as easily as we average Americans would like
so the house of reps arent a part of the govt? interesting.. they are here.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Lately you would think they were their own country the way the teabaggers have been behaving
it is quite interesting that certain politicans thwart moves to improve things and then blame the leader for not improving things.. as if he made the decision. politics is horseshit. it would appear to some it is a game where the only losers are the people... and yet we seem to be okay with it.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q= ... 4169,d.aWM
Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
This is what happens when people elect a President that can not lead or is not interested in leading.
seriously. why would any middle class person volunteer for higher taxes?
um, handouts. let's run up that debt!!
fucking liberals
obama's positions regarding the fiscal cliff and deficits are the same as they were during the campaign.
the american people overwhelmingly supported those positions by voting for him in a landslide victory over romney.
based on every poll out there now, the american people want a compromise. obama has put entitlement reform on the table. something that the american people and the democrats vehemently oppose. he has tried to compromise. boehner, mcconnell, and the tea party have not compromised at all. boehner could not even get his "plan b" brought to a vote because his own party did not support it. who is the failed leader now??
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Polls mean nothing....can you tell me where he is leading this country.....besides into more debt and division......since when does the President give raises......
it is typical of a republican to oppose everything and then blame the president for not compromising. you have bought into the fox news mentality hook, line, and sinker. the american people are not falling for that crap anymore.
the republicans are going to take the blame for this, and they are going to lose the house in 2014. mark my words.
i can not wait to hear obama admonish them on live tv in the state of the union. hell, maybe even in his inaugural address...
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
polls are a joke dude. those poll numbers are manipulated by whatever outlet releases them
obama's legacy will be a failure of catastrophic proportions. what has he done to define his presidency??? gay marriage rights? awesome...congrats. that affects something like 2% of the population
and hold the excuses. I know obama supporters are quick to say it's everyone's fault but his. what has he accomplished???????????????? other than record deficits
You mean the polls that say tax SOMEBODY ELSE?
I also love that your favorite part of this is him admonishing folks. Too funny.
and the democratic/republican masturbation continues....
Its a HUGE kick in the ass to Mr. and Mrs. Average American.
Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
wont happen! like i said in a previous post, once the circle jerk ends there will be a agreement and a "tax deal". all that remains is which "side" comes first.
its like the girl in the scary movie that looks for the noise in the basement, you know she will be killed by the monster, you just dont know exactly when and how.
I wouldn't be so sure. Like these forums, your government is so partisan that it seems entirely possible that nothing will be accomplished. In the past it seems that the Democrats have been more inclined to cave to Republican demands, however I get the feeling a line has been drawn here.
Just a hunch, but I imagine that 2013 will be about pointing fingers and campaigning for 2014 instead of finding common ground.
Is it possible both sides see the forced reduced spending and forced higher taxes is the proper medicine we need to correct the crushing deficit/debt that needs to be addressed? They both "lose." They both "win." They both are able to save face while pointing fingers.
And while it will cause short term pain, it might actually be what we need to correct the long term problem.
The funny thing that's being ignored is that this "predicament" is actually caused by the Democrats' insistence on putting a term on the Bush tax cuts. Bush and the Republicans didn't want an expiration. Their thought was - if we want to change the tax rates in the future, it should be because we decide to, and not because of some imaginary termination date. So, I don't see how these tax increases are not solidly at the feet of the Democrats.
Now that being said, like I stated, if letting them expire and lowering expenses is the ultimate fix to the problem we are having, then they should get the credit if/when it works.
I'm on the side that some semblence of the Boehner plan (tax increases only for those making $1 million or more) with some Social Security cuts with an added raising of the debt ceiling will get passed in the next couple days (if it were to pass on the 2nd or 3rd, not much would have been effected). This way, they all get to kick the can down the road past the February debt ceiling crunch.
With less than a week to go he showed there is no urgency on his part to come up with a solution. He should have never taken a vacation for Christmas instead he should've remained in Washington and worked to resolve this issue.
He spent the first term blaming Bush for the 2008 financial crisis even though it was policies implemented by clinton that ultimately caused the collapse of the financial sector which caused the crisis. Now it looks like he's going to do the same for his second, blame others instead of working to find solutions.
He has shown zero accountability throughout his first term. He is truly a amateur who is shown time and time again that he is unqualified for this job.
and yet more democratic and republican masturbation...
I am sure that it will happen, politicians care about one thing and one thing only RETAINING POWER/CONTROL.
Fiscal Cliff the movie
...the terrified women wrapped only in a bath towel grabs a knife and is slowly walking down the basement stairs.....
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14