Something Interesting To Ponder

hedonist

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

Horos wrote:

On the cars vs. guns analogy.

I certainly see a lot of irresponsible drivers on the road everyday. Even with the laws and regulations in place people risk injuring others everyday by ignoring said laws.

Personally, I believe 20-30% of the people on Americas highways, should have their drivers license revoked.

I'd bump up that percentage, actually. It seems more and more - and it's not just me experiencing this - there are so many close calls with drivers who are distracted, unaware, or just don't give a shit that they're in control of a machine THAT CAN KILL.

And now we're in the season of adding drunk driving to the mix - woohoo!

vant0037

DS1119 wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

So that's a "yes" I assume? You're OK with anyone buying a gun at a gun show or over the internet.
Got it.

Until legally sold weapons becomes a major problem in the US than I guess my answer is yes.

What percentage of shootings in America are done with illegally obtained weapons?

DS1119

vant0037 wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

So that's a "yes" I assume? You're OK with anyone buying a gun at a gun show or over the internet.
Got it.

Until legally sold weapons becomes a major problem in the US than I guess my answer is yes.

What percentage of shootings in America are done with illegally obtained weapons?

I will try and find that number. My gut tells me it's very high but I'l try and dig up the number.

DS1119

vant0037 wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

So that's a "yes" I assume? You're OK with anyone buying a gun at a gun show or over the internet.
Got it.

Until legally sold weapons becomes a major problem in the US than I guess my answer is yes.

What percentage of shootings in America are done with illegally obtained weapons?

Really hard to find the answer to your question since the numbers are skewed from unsolved homicides so in those cases no one knows until the crime is solved. I am still searching though. I've seen numbers as low as 94% and has high as 98% so far.

DS1119

Something I pondered tonight. If citizens who think that reducing the number of legally sold and possessed guns will reduce the gun problem that's in the country couldn't the same logic be applied to the drug issue? Is legalized marijuana really a good thing? I mean more drugs more drug problems right? Shouldn't we as a nation be looking to reduce drug use instead of encouraging or legalizing it?

Bentleyspop

DS1119 wrote:

Something I pondered tonight. If citizens who think that reducing the number of legally sold and possessed guns will reduce the gun problem that's in the country couldn't the same logic be applied to the drug issue? Is legalized marijuana really a good thing? I mean more drugs more drug problems right? Shouldn't we as a nation be looking to reduce drug use instead of encouraging or legalizing it?

Guess you won't be visiting Colorado any time soon.
Legal possession of marijuana and concealed carry permits
:shock:

covered in bliss

vant0037 wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

So that's a "yes" I assume? You're OK with anyone buying a gun at a gun show or over the internet.
Got it.

Until legally sold weapons becomes a major problem in the US than I guess my answer is yes.

What percentage of shootings in America are done with illegally obtained weapons?

Here's a very interesting article: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... /guns.html

Further proof that guns themselves aren't the problem, it's the morally corrupt fuck heads in this world.

DS1119

covered in bliss wrote:

Here's a very interesting article: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... /guns.html

Further proof that guns themselves aren't the problem, it's the morally corrupt fuck heads in this world.

This happens all the time with anything too. Homes...cars.

Drowned Out

covered in bliss wrote:

vant0037 wrote:

What percentage of shootings in America are done with illegally obtained weapons?

Here's a very interesting article: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... /guns.html

Further proof that guns themselves aren't the problem, it's the morally corrupt fuck heads in this world.

....says the person with an OJ Simpson avatar.....

covered in bliss

Drowned Out wrote:

covered in bliss wrote:

vant0037 wrote:

What percentage of shootings in America are done with illegally obtained weapons?

Here's a very interesting article: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... /guns.html

Further proof that guns themselves aren't the problem, it's the morally corrupt fuck heads in this world.

....says the person with an OJ Simpson avatar.....

haha-yep! 2 morally corrupt fuck heads! edit to add: one used a machete and the other duct tape and chloroform. no guns!

pandora

Horos wrote:

pandora wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

There are many that would disagree with you on that.


BTW, I am prochoice.

Yes many including me.

This the key for me choice.

I am all about choice, the choice to own a gun responsibly, the choice to have an abortion,
the choice to marry whom we want, the choice to die when we are ready.
The choice to believe. The choice to speak freely.
All of these effect other people.
How we choose is the basis of our journey and those we effect on their journey too.
We all have choices and no one can control what another chooses to do.

This sounds selfish and sounds like there is no solution to the problem because no one can control what one chooses.

Selfish is as selfish does... people's choices reflect selfishness.
When someone owns a gun to protect their family or themselves it is a response to the selfish acts of others.
People who are selfish that rob, murder, rape, remove security, dignity, hope and faith
from our lives, those are selfish choices of selfish people who do not value human life.
The selfish one is the predator. Not the person trying to protect the innocent.

And really the basis is we can not control other people. We can set examples, punish,
expect, but people will live their lives and make their choices.

Who Princess

DS1119 wrote:

Something I pondered tonight. If citizens who think that reducing the number of legally sold and possessed guns will reduce the gun problem that's in the country couldn't the same logic be applied to the drug issue? Is legalized marijuana really a good thing? I mean more drugs more drug problems right? Shouldn't we as a nation be looking to reduce drug use instead of encouraging or legalizing it?

We've had a drug that's legal and affordable--alcohol--for many centuries and it's by far the most abused substance in this country. I don't see anyone recommending we go back to prohibition, just as I don't see anyone here advocating banning gun sales or ownership. The limitations many people are discussing wouldn't threaten responsible gun owners, i.e., prohibiting sales of assault weapons, more consistent background checks, closing the gun show loophole, lengthier waiting periods, limiting the amounts of ammunition a person may buy.

DS1119

Who Princess wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

Something I pondered tonight. If citizens who think that reducing the number of legally sold and possessed guns will reduce the gun problem that's in the country couldn't the same logic be applied to the drug issue? Is legalized marijuana really a good thing? I mean more drugs more drug problems right? Shouldn't we as a nation be looking to reduce drug use instead of encouraging or legalizing it?

We've had a drug that's legal and affordable--alcohol--for many centuries and it's by far the most abused substance in this country. I don't see anyone recommending we go back to prohibition, just as I don't see anyone here advocating banning gun sales or ownership. The limitations many people are discussing wouldn't threaten responsible gun owners, i.e., prohibiting sales of assault weapons, more consistent background checks, closing the gun show loophole, lengthier waiting periods, limiting the amounts of ammunition a person may buy.

When was the last time the amount of alcohol you could purchase limited? Is there a waiting period to buy some beer?

Horos

DS1119 wrote:

Who Princess wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

Something I pondered tonight. If citizens who think that reducing the number of legally sold and possessed guns will reduce the gun problem that's in the country couldn't the same logic be applied to the drug issue? Is legalized marijuana really a good thing? I mean more drugs more drug problems right? Shouldn't we as a nation be looking to reduce drug use instead of encouraging or legalizing it?

We've had a drug that's legal and affordable--alcohol--for many centuries and it's by far the most abused substance in this country. I don't see anyone recommending we go back to prohibition, just as I don't see anyone here advocating banning gun sales or ownership. The limitations many people are discussing wouldn't threaten responsible gun owners, i.e., prohibiting sales of assault weapons, more consistent background checks, closing the gun show loophole, lengthier waiting periods, limiting the amounts of ammunition a person may buy.

When was the last time the amount of alcohol you could purchase limited? Is there a waiting period to buy some beer?

I've seen many a person denied the sale of beer because they were already intoxicated. You've never been cut-off anywhere?

DS1119

Horos wrote:

I've seen many a person denied the sale of beer because they were already intoxicated. You've never been cut-off anywhere?

Pretty sure you can't purchase a gun legally either while visibly intoxicated. Can't drive a car, can't board a plane, etc. I'm asking if you walked into a store perfectly sober what store wouldn't sell you all the booze they have in one shot if you had the money?

JonnyPistachio

DS1119 wrote:

Who Princess wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

Something I pondered tonight. If citizens who think that reducing the number of legally sold and possessed guns will reduce the gun problem that's in the country couldn't the same logic be applied to the drug issue? Is legalized marijuana really a good thing? I mean more drugs more drug problems right? Shouldn't we as a nation be looking to reduce drug use instead of encouraging or legalizing it?

We've had a drug that's legal and affordable--alcohol--for many centuries and it's by far the most abused substance in this country. I don't see anyone recommending we go back to prohibition, just as I don't see anyone here advocating banning gun sales or ownership. The limitations many people are discussing wouldn't threaten responsible gun owners, i.e., prohibiting sales of assault weapons, more consistent background checks, closing the gun show loophole, lengthier waiting periods, limiting the amounts of ammunition a person may buy.

When was the last time the amount of alcohol you could purchase limited? Is there a waiting period to buy some beer?

I was denied purchasing alcohol at 2:01am, also there are tons of counties that can't sell it on Sunday. :?
I also can't drink in public, at work, or at the sunrise park by my house at any time. I'm also not allowed to drink near or on the beach, though I'd really love to!

DS1119

JonnyPistachio wrote:

I was denied purchasing alcohol at 2:01am, also there are tons of counties that can't sell it on Sunday. :?
I also can't drink in public, at work, or at the sunrise park by my house at any time. I'm also not allowed to drink near or on the beach, though I'd really love to!

...and when you think about it. Makes perfect sense doesn't it? :? Those restrictions really do a lot...a lot of nothing. :fp:

JonnyPistachio

DS1119 wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

I was denied purchasing alcohol at 2:01am, also there are tons of counties that can't sell it on Sunday. :?
I also can't drink in public, at work, or at the sunrise park by my house at any time. I'm also not allowed to drink near or on the beach, though I'd really love to!

...and when you think about it. Makes perfect sense doesn't it? :? Those restrictions really do a lot...a lot of nothing. :fp:

They kept me from getting drunk in the early am, but yes those restrictions are silly. But how that has to do with anything aside from drunk people in the wee hours of the night? Oh another senseless analogy :roll:

DS1119

JonnyPistachio wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

I was denied purchasing alcohol at 2:01am, also there are tons of counties that can't sell it on Sunday. :?
I also can't drink in public, at work, or at the sunrise park by my house at any time. I'm also not allowed to drink near or on the beach, though I'd really love to!

...and when you think about it. Makes perfect sense doesn't it? :? Those restrictions really do a lot...a lot of nothing. :fp:

They kept me from getting drunk in the early am, but yes those restrictions are silly. But how that has to do with anything aside from drunk people in the wee hours of the night? Oh another senseless analogy :roll:

Nope. Not another senseless analogy. It all comes down to individual rights and actually targeting a problem with a real solution. This country is much too quick to try to enact legislation on the legal to try and solve the problems caused by the illegal.

vant0037

Let's just let everyone do whatever the fuck they want whenever with no regulations on anything ever. Is that what you're proposing? You keep going back to how alcohol is regulated differently, as if that points us toward some illuminating epiphany about the nature of regulating guns. I could make an argument about how fast food and high cholesterol kills people at a far higher rate than land mines...but...I don't. Because they're not the same thing. And disparate regulations between the two don't prove that one should be regulated more or less. Stop doing it with alcohol and guns.

http://www.startribune.com/nation/184673491.html

The sad thing is, this guy could've done this just as easily with a big hole and some leaves over it and a perfectly timed surprise baseball bat attack. And plenty of time to swing away. And a few minutes where no one was looking and he had one of them isolated. And maybe a really solid, level swing. Guns and access to guns remove most of the variables needed to execute the same violence with an alternative weapon. Legal or not, responsible gun owner or not, guns are being used to commit violence far more than other weapons. But because people are not shot as frequently as say, people are killed by drunk drivers or alcoholism, doesn't mean we should not look to our legislators to do something. It also doesn't mean we shouldn't take a comprehensive approach toward the problem (yes, it's a problem) either: regulation + increased mental health services + anti-bullying etc etc etc. Take a look at all of it. But stop trying to convince us that gun violence isn't a problem.

You're entitled to your opinion, but you continue to compare things in a misleading way, use wrong numbers or apply them incorrectly, and continue to start threads that are clearly meant to start arguments. You're better than this and I'm not sure why you continue to beat this drum in such a loud way.

Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays. Enough of this nonsense already. We get it.