Final word on GA vs Seating - Mr Neil Young

Princess Bulldozer

Joey Eakins wrote:

I hate getting in line early for PJ only to end up dealing with that group of PJ people who seem to think it is cool to get in line, then create a list of people and their location in line, then leave all fucking day, only to end up coming back hours later and expecting to get in line where they were earlier. That is so stupid. Assigned seats make it to where I don't have to deal with this annoying group of people. If you are one of these people who thinks that is okay, fuck you.

I have had my fair share of experience in lines, including PJ lines. (Ask Dimi, Kathi, Suzie May etc they will vouch for me on that one.)

I have only had to deal with 1 in 100 people who think that what you describe is appropriate behaviour.
People who would put their name on the list to only leave for hours on end, are the same people who would push to the front after they get to the venue late and sit drinking at the bar until 5 mins before the band comes on. Those people are not courteous or respectful people. Those people will spoil your night if you let them regardless.

I like the numbers, as sometime I like to find a quiet shady spot to sit and relax and my number is my "seat" in the line. I have seen lines work really well, as they are started with every single person in mind, from 1 to 400 who line up. I have seen lines work less well, usually as a mentality of all-for-himself(herself) arises at some point in the day. Though, even on those bad line moments, they invariably are calmed by logical and calm discussion and peace is restored. Remind people of common decency and they usually calm down.

Disclaimer: Joey, I am not attacking you personally. I am just using your quote as a springboard for my opinion.

Princess Bulldozer

morello wrote:

CanNotStay wrote:

Joey Eakins wrote:

I hate getting in line early for PJ only to end up dealing with that group of PJ people who seem to think it is cool to get in line, then create a list of people and their location in line, then leave all fucking day, only to end up coming back hours later and expecting to get in line where they were earlier.

This is NOT OK!! I can't believe people think they can instate this rule on everyone who bought a ticket. The longer you wait the better spot you should have. Period.

This happened several times in Europe. PrincessBulldozer saved the day!!

As I wrote above, it is having the thought that "everyone" matters and reminding everyone of that notion.
In the line, people get tired and hot or cold and hungry and uncomfortable and peoples nerves are tested. People get anxious. It helps to have clear communication throughout the whole line, for the whole day, people sharing food, having laughs, talking, making new friends, caring for each and every person.
Sometimes people need to be reminded. That is simple to do.

Pearl Jam Jay

Had GA for a PJ show for the first time in Missoula....it was awesome!! I'll admit, the name/list thing can get out of hand when people abuse it, but I can firmly say that between my buddy and I, we left the line alternately for about an hour total. Went to shower, grab McD's and back into line. That was more than half the fun of it was sticking it out with the crazies!! Trading stories, talking setlists, all that stuff for 13+ hours in line. Trusting and using the system and not abusing it. Meet some people, build some trust/companionship that allows you to take a piss break every few hours. Big deal.

I'm not saying every show has to be GA...but toss it in a few times fellas! GA is exciting, energetic and allows us a true sense of appreciation for our own fan-base. I may not have $500+ for a single ticket, but I have the day off...maybe that's just me. Pros and cons to both, but don't just deny us all the time. Loved it and would do it again in a heartbeat!!!

chaslil

Interesting arguments on this thread. At Red Rocks, traditionally the first 24 rows are GA, then there are about 25 reserved, then GA to the top. I love this, If you want to be in the front, then get in line early! It works well, a great Red Rocks tradition. Alternatively, jam bands usually let the whole place be GA. Unfortunately, Neil Young always has 100% reserved at Red Rocks. The tickets up front last summer were extremely expensive. I wish he would extend his policy to Red Rocks. Why restrict it to indoor shows?

Charles

dimitrispearljam

Pearl Jam Jay wrote:

Had GA for a PJ show for the first time in Missoula....it was awesome!! I'll admit, the name/list thing can get out of hand when people abuse it, but I can firmly say that between my buddy and I, we left the line alternately for about an hour total. Went to shower, grab McD's and back into line. That was more than half the fun of it was sticking it out with the crazies!! Trading stories, talking setlists, all that stuff for 13+ hours in line. Trusting and using the system and not abusing it. Meet some people, build some trust/companionship that allows you to take a piss break every few hours. Big deal.

I'm not saying every show has to be GA...but toss it in a few times fellas! GA is exciting, energetic and allows us a true sense of appreciation for our own fan-base. I may not have $500+ for a single ticket, but I have the day off...maybe that's just me. Pros and cons to both, but don't just deny us all the time. Loved it and would do it again in a heartbeat!!!

This is fuckin ROCK N ROLL.....You understand 100 % what GA means,isnt a seat ONLY the difference...
beers on me if we are at the same show next time...

dimitrispearljam

Princess Bulldozer wrote:

Joey Eakins wrote:

I hate getting in line early for PJ only to end up dealing with that group of PJ people who seem to think it is cool to get in line, then create a list of people and their location in line, then leave all fucking day, only to end up coming back hours later and expecting to get in line where they were earlier. That is so stupid. Assigned seats make it to where I don't have to deal with this annoying group of people. If you are one of these people who thinks that is okay, fuck you.

I have had my fair share of experience in lines, including PJ lines. (Ask Dimi, Kathi, Suzie May etc they will vouch for me on that one.)

I have only had to deal with 1 in 100 people who think that what you describe is appropriate behaviour.
People who would put their name on the list to only leave for hours on end, are the same people who would push to the front after they get to the venue late and sit drinking at the bar until 5 mins before the band comes on. Those people are not courteous or respectful people. Those people will spoil your night if you let them regardless.

I like the numbers, as sometime I like to find a quiet shady spot to sit and relax and my number is my "seat" in the line. I have seen lines work really well, as they are started with every single person in mind, from 1 to 400 who line up. I have seen lines work less well, usually as a mentality of all-for-himself(herself) arises at some point in the day. Though, even on those bad line moments, they invariably are calmed by logical and calm discussion and peace is restored. Remind people of common decency and they usually calm down.

Disclaimer: Joey, I am not attacking you personally. I am just using your quote as a springboard for my opinion.

Jodie..you know im not line up..i come early to the venue,but i chat with friends,get some drink,go back to hotel,town,a bar,back in the venue,but dont get in early..i just care to be inside before the public tix,cos isntr easy to find friends after that...
my experience says that most of the times list works well cos especially in Europe we are the same fuckers at every show and we all know each others very well..but always there are assholes to rule things..but they are ALWAYS less than the good people that respect eachother...


p.s...im in good mood and ill not say anything for those frikkin Italians.. :wave:

Spiritual_Chaos

Been to 9 GA shows and 1 "seated" (Verona 2006).

I enjoyed the system of Verona the most - even though no one sat ofc and I were at a "worse" place.

And GA and the "front" doesn't equal great fans.
At Stockholm in the first row ( I was in the second or something) was a group of girls who talked up untill the show about alllllll the million of pearl jam shows they been to and how big fans they were. But as soon as the show started they just stood there taking pictures of Eddie or browsing through their pictures of Eddie and talking to eachother about the pictures of Eddie. And they just stood there with their backpacks on (rude GA behavoir to have backpacks on IMO) and eyes fixed on their cameras.

Only time they "cared" about the show was when PJ played something "rare" like All those yesterdays. Or when Eddie came over to our side - then they acted like they care to give the impression to him that they did.

And the funny thing was - just before the show started and their cameras was used nonstop - THEY TALKED ABOUT HOW SOME PEOPLE DON'T GET INTO THE SHOWS AND JUST TAKE PICS! What the fuck.

Kathi

dimitrispearljam wrote:

Princess Bulldozer wrote:

Joey Eakins wrote:

I hate getting in line early for PJ only to end up dealing with that group of PJ people who seem to think it is cool to get in line, then create a list of people and their location in line, then leave all fucking day, only to end up coming back hours later and expecting to get in line where they were earlier. That is so stupid. Assigned seats make it to where I don't have to deal with this annoying group of people. If you are one of these people who thinks that is okay, fuck you.

I have had my fair share of experience in lines, including PJ lines. (Ask Dimi, Kathi, Suzie May etc they will vouch for me on that one.)

I have only had to deal with 1 in 100 people who think that what you describe is appropriate behaviour.
People who would put their name on the list to only leave for hours on end, are the same people who would push to the front after they get to the venue late and sit drinking at the bar until 5 mins before the band comes on. Those people are not courteous or respectful people. Those people will spoil your night if you let them regardless.

I like the numbers, as sometime I like to find a quiet shady spot to sit and relax and my number is my "seat" in the line. I have seen lines work really well, as they are started with every single person in mind, from 1 to 400 who line up. I have seen lines work less well, usually as a mentality of all-for-himself(herself) arises at some point in the day. Though, even on those bad line moments, they invariably are calmed by logical and calm discussion and peace is restored. Remind people of common decency and they usually calm down.

Disclaimer: Joey, I am not attacking you personally. I am just using your quote as a springboard for my opinion.

Jodie..you know im not line up..i come early to the venue,but i chat with friends,get some drink,go back to hotel,town,a bar,back in the venue,but dont get in early..i just care to be inside before the public tix,cos isntr easy to find friends after that...
my experience says that most of the times list works well cos especially in Europe we are the same fuckers at every show and we all know each others very well..but always there are assholes to rule things..but they are ALWAYS less than the good people that respect eachother...


p.s...im in good mood and ill not say anything for those frikkin Italians.. :wave:

Italians shouldn't run anything. Especially not queues. But besides the bad experience of Berlin 2 (or the Italian fuckup ), the system worked for all the Euro shows I attended.

I actually really like queueing, hanging out with fellow fans, sharing stories, spending the day together...lots of bonding over music really. However, even if you don't want to line up for ages, 10C early entry wristbands make for everyone to have a pretty good spot still (sometimes even rail at the sides, otherwise 3rd, 4th, 5th row). You are free to choose whatever suits you best, and what is more important, you can freely choose your company.

Europe doesn't have seating for rock shows (except the normal seats in the arenas of course), and I'm glad it's that way. Especially with how 10c entrance was run, you had no-one jumping over you or trying to knock you out of their way, it was all calm and civilized, and most people looked out for each other in the pit as well.
I've seen Smashing Pumpkins and the Chili Peppers seated, both times because all floor tickets were gone, and I really disliked it. I understand that there may be shows that require seating (like Ed's solo gigs, or the tour Conor Oberst is doing next year), but for your general loud full band rock show, I really wouldn't want to be seated.

And I really need to read that Neil Young book...maybe when I'm going to Florida, I don't see any free time coming before that.

edited to add: Oh, and annoying talking girls with BACKPACKS at shows? that sounds like Italians as well especially the backpack part. I have not seen anyone else doing that, ever. It might have been the two that were next to me for Berlin 1, they had backpacks as well, and basically spent the whole show taking pics and trying not to faint cause "he's sooooo hot"

TigaSefi

I can see the arguments for both seating and standing and I am 100% standing all the way. The jerks is just a by product. If you want good shows, I believe the group would prefer screaming fans at the front jumping in unison and so on rather than just standing in front of your seat clapping away. Standing so close to Mike in Stockholm was electric! It just would not happen if I sat down near the front!

EDIT: Backpack should be banned 100% too.... fucking annoying.

LostRebel

Spiritual_Chaos wrote:

At Stockholm in the first row ( I was in the second or something) was a group of girls who talked up untill the show about alllllll the million of pearl jam shows they been to and how big fans they were. But as soon as the show started they just stood there taking pictures of Eddie or browsing through their pictures of Eddie and talking to eachother about the pictures of Eddie. And they just stood there with their backpacks on (rude GA behavoir to have backpacks on IMO) and eyes fixed on their cameras.

Only time they "cared" about the show was when PJ played something "rare" like All those yesterdays. Or when Eddie came over to our side - then they acted like they care to give the impression to him that they did.

And the funny thing was - just before the show started and their cameras was used nonstop - THEY TALKED ABOUT HOW SOME PEOPLE DON'T GET INTO THE SHOWS AND JUST TAKE PICS! What the fuck.

+1
Still remember those girls... and I know they read this cause they visit the forum really often...
Hope they'll do us a "favour" and go seated next time.

Spiritual_Chaos

LostRebel wrote:

Still remember those girls... and I know they read this cause they visit the forum really often...
Hope they'll do us a "favour" and go seated next time.

Yeah I've seen them at a bunch of shows. But still, talking for 30 min before the show about all the shows they been to and all the years they have followed PJ and how disturbing all the people taking pictures are and then just stand there like photo-snapping-zombies only caring when Eddie comes over or they play All those yesterdays. I mean...fuck. And the fucking backpacks. Those...backpacks - put them on the floor!

I mean, I sing false and I look like a jerk. But wtf... someone standing and browsing through their camera all through Given to fly, Do The evolution and 20 other songs? Why even bother queing up? Are they just there to "cross off" the songs they haveb't yet head? Then do that from the seats. Or are they just waiting for Eddie to be fooled and throw them a tambourine or have sex with them backstage?

Better Dan

I definitely support GA floors for arena shows. This is a rock concert! Plus, it allows people to enjoy the show with their friends. There are always seats away from the floor for those who don't want to do GA.

keeponrockin

My rule for GA is I'll walk up to as close as I can until I actually have to start moving people. Hate people that sneak to the front pushing their way through, but t'is life.

ladydocNYC

demetrios wrote:

I don't agree what Neil just said. Does Neil Young even offer "fanclub" reserved seats? I don't think so. Yes his site offer's presale tickets but anybody who is anybody can buy tickets from his site. There is no seniority. This is different to Pearl Jam's 10club ticketing system were row's 1, 2, 9 & 10 are "lottery seats." Big fan or not a big fan of the band get a chance to score those sweet seats. They are not expensive, rich class tickets for a Pearl Jam show, unlike what Neil Young offers. It's fair all around. And pretty much reserved numerical in order from 10club member #1 - it's ending number. You can't just go on to Ticketmaster & buy these, unlike Neil Young for his past few tours he has sections of his lower bowl & floor seats that are very expensive which pretty much "he" offers. There is no seniority. Plus anybody can score those front row seats months before the show & flip them to the rich who will buy those tickets and sit up front. If Neil doesn't like that, then he needs to change his ticket system. Last few show's here in the USA/CDN he charged $250 for sections of the lower bowl that were closer to the stage. Can't remember how much he offered for floor seats but it wasn't fanclub ticketing.

I for one support reserved seating for Pearl Jam's USA/CDN indoor show's. And what 10club has been doing is a fantastic job distributing tickets to our show's. I believe Neil Young needs to talk to 10club management; if he's having a hard time with his "indoor" experiences.

THIS

Zoso

mr young is a badass and is completely right with this.. I love a seat like most people but this does create a muted atmosphere at certain shows..

ACCBootlegGoddess

I see Neil's point of view and yes I HATE the rick folks in the front that sit, and text or talk on their phones during the performance...or are constantly leaving during the performance.
I see how that can be distracting for the artists too. That said...

I like festival seating for crowds who are mature enough to handle it. Bruce Springsteen crowds for example. His GA pit is so safe that Kids hang in there with no fear of being trampled or squeezed out.
Foo Fighters crowds have become a lot more like Bruce's crowds too. I've always done floors for them, been up close and never had a crowd surge. (It wasn't always like that with the Foo's).
U2 Pit...same thing, lots of room, people are (for the most part) considerate of each other and look out for each other. Great environment.

Pearl Jam crowds, however, are hit and miss. Manchester shows seemed pretty relaxed and fun on the floor, whereas Berlin had to be told to take 3 steps back by the band, and I've heard it got a little rough.
I'm 5'5 and In the US I've done GA for Pearl Jam several times. I was at the Showbox in 2002. I was also at all three San Francisco shows in 2006 (Did 2 of those shows on the front rail), Henry Fonda Theatre in 2006, The Vic Theatre and Lollapalooza 2007 and MIA this year.
The theatre shows aren't the best examples as the venue's are much smaller. Showbox I found it was a tight squeeze and very stuffy. I almost had to be pulled out on more than one occasion but I stuck it out. (It also didn't help that the guys on the rail in front of me were assholes - didn't want their spot, just one hand on the rail to break my fall and they kept punching my hand off until I told them off) The Vic was completely different..I had LOTS of room, great people around me and it made the show for me.
Henry Fonda doesn't count because there were a lot of industry people there so there was a ton of space for that.
San Francisco night 1 we had amazing people behind us who protected all of us (mostly women) on the rail. Ed even commented about it being mostly females on the rail and how impressed he was with the people behind us watching out for us BUT night 3 was a different story. I was crushed HARD against the guard rail many times that night. Stone of all people got on the Mic and made everybody step back. It was much better after that, but still pretty tight.
Lollapalooza was crazy and I couldn't even get close...didn't want to because it was very clausterphobic and HOT. Finally MIA was great...most people had left because it was a hip hop festivaland the weather was kinda shitty so it was just us PJ fans and remnants of the hip hop fans. It was very safe and I had a great time. Heck my friend stood on the rail beside me with her 6 year old Son and they had a great time too.

If all of the PJ shows Pits can be like the good one's I've been in, I'd be all for GA...sadly PJ crowds haven't quite evolved that far as of yet. (not talking about every fan...just the douchers that ruin stuff for us all).
I'd love to see PJ crowds go like the Springsteen crowds in terms of behavior and until that happens I'd prefer seats to level the playing field a bit for us shorter, weaker people lol.

amethgr8

GA show down in New Orleans in 1995 (I was younger and in better shape), the crowd was just bearable during the Ramones, I made it a half hour through intermission, the crowd seemed to compressed every 15 mins, my glasses steamed, there was no way I could physically make it through 2 hours of PJ. I got out and moved about 100 ft back.

Soundgarden recently in Chicago, we had a chance for GA, also STP in our area, we just can't do GA anymore.

too many pushy people make it unpleasant.

Spiritual_Chaos

amethgr8 wrote:

GA show down in New Orleans in 1995 (I was younger and in better shape), the crowd was just bearable during the Ramones, I made it a half hour through intermission, the crowd seemed to compressed every 15 mins, my glasses steamed, there was no way I could physically make it through 2 hours of PJ. I got out and moved about 100 ft back.

Soundgarden recently in Chicago, we had a chance for GA, also STP in our area, we just can't do GA anymore.

too many pushy people make it unpleasant.

Isn't that on a show to show bases?
i had a terrible time with PJ in Milan 2006 and Berlin 2009.
But Stockholm 2010 was just fine and no pushing. Went to GA show with the Foo Fighter and no pushing there either.

DiRtYyELLoWoCeAn

dimitrispearljam wrote:

...this is Rock N Roll.......

Couldn't have said it better D!

dimitrispearljam

Kathi wrote:

dimitrispearljam wrote:

Jodie..you know im not line up..i come early to the venue,but i chat with friends,get some drink,go back to hotel,town,a bar,back in the venue,but dont get in early..i just care to be inside before the public tix,cos isntr easy to find friends after that...
my experience says that most of the times list works well cos especially in Europe we are the same fuckers at every show and we all know each others very well..but always there are assholes to rule things..but they are ALWAYS less than the good people that respect eachother...


p.s...im in good mood and ill not say anything for those frikkin Italians.. :wave:

Italians shouldn't run anything. Especially not queues. But besides the bad experience of Berlin 2 (or the Italian fuckup ), the system worked for all the Euro shows I attended.

I actually really like queueing, hanging out with fellow fans, sharing stories, spending the day together...lots of bonding over music really. However, even if you don't want to line up for ages, 10C early entry wristbands make for everyone to have a pretty good spot still (sometimes even rail at the sides, otherwise 3rd, 4th, 5th row). You are free to choose whatever suits you best, and what is more important, you can freely choose your company.

Europe doesn't have seating for rock shows (except the normal seats in the arenas of course), and I'm glad it's that way. Especially with how 10c entrance was run, you had no-one jumping over you or trying to knock you out of their way, it was all calm and civilized, and most people looked out for each other in the pit as well.
I've seen Smashing Pumpkins and the Chili Peppers seated, both times because all floor tickets were gone, and I really disliked it. I understand that there may be shows that require seating (like Ed's solo gigs, or the tour Conor Oberst is doing next year), but for your general loud full band rock show, I really wouldn't want to be seated.

And I really need to read that Neil Young book...maybe when I'm going to Florida, I don't see any free time coming before that.

edited to add: Oh, and annoying talking girls with BACKPACKS at shows? that sounds like Italians as well especially the backpack part. I have not seen anyone else doing that, ever. It might have been the two that were next to me for Berlin 1, they had backpacks as well, and basically spent the whole show taking pics and trying not to faint cause "he's sooooo hot"

as i said..im in the good mood..im not saying anything for Italians ...today..ahahahahahhah
as for fotos..no way to take fotos at the show...and of "hot eddie...
but.cant escape that....they will tag me at 200 photos of sweaty eddie at facebook...