Jumping ship.

brianlux

Or should I say, I'm getting off the train. Of course, some of you might like that!

No, seriously, I'm doing this for a couple of reasons. Mainly I sincerely am worried about the condition of this rock we live on, not so much for my sake- I'm older than most of ya'll and have been down that long and winding road- but more so for the kids in my life- I don't have any of my own, but I have plenty of extended family kids and frankly, I'm worried for their future. When I write about global warming and environmental collapse, I don't do so to win points, say I'm right not you, or try to antagonize any of you. I've studied the hell out of these subjects and it's like watching a tidal wave come in and I just want to get my kids- and yours- off the beach before it's too late. But mostly I seem to have either preached to the choir, agrivated those who see things differently (a right I would never deny anyone)... or maybe I'm just howling at the moon, I don't know.

Another reason is I get so caught up in all of this that I just get fucking depressed and even though we all use this place (understandably) to vent, it shouldn't be battle zone and it all too often feels like that and I'm as guilty as anyone for that. I feel like I'm beating my head against a wall and that's no one's problem or fault but my own.

The other thing is... and honestly, I mean no offense, but what are we doing here? Is anything changing? Are any of us changing? I think I've learned something from all of you and I appreciate that but sometimes it feels like we all keep saying the same thing. Call me on that if I'm wrong- please!


Well, at least we're all Pearl Jam fans, right!

Take care everyone... and take care of someone else. And forgive me if this all seems too self-indulgent. I don't mean it that way.

Byrnzie

I've been howling at the moon on here for five years.

It's a good place to vent, but it's also a good place to pick up links to articles and movies e.t.c. that I wouldn't find otherwise.


I know what you mean about banging your head against a wall though. You can bombard people with the facts all day long, but tomorrow they'll return spouting the same bullshit they picked up from the t.v, or they'll just throw insults at you instead.

Basically, people will just believe what they want to believe (what it's convenient for them to believe), or whatever Fox News tells them to believe. Seems to be that opinions are regarded as more important than the facts.

quimby20

Byrnzie wrote:

I've been howling at the moon on here for five years.

It's a good place to vent, but it's also a good place to pick up links to articles and movies e.t.c. that I wouldn't find otherwise.


I know what you mean about banging your head against a wall though. You can bombard people with the facts all day long, but tomorrow they'll return spouting the same bullshit they picked up from the t.v, or they'll just throw insults at you instead.

Basically, people will just believe what they want to believe (what it's convenient for them to believe), or whatever Fox News tells them to believe. Seems to be that opinions are regarded as more important than the facts.

???????? you don't stop do you??????

RW81233

Byrnzie wrote:

I've been howling at the moon on here for five years.

It's a good place to vent, but it's also a good place to pick up links to articles and movies e.t.c. that I wouldn't find otherwise.


I know what you mean about banging your head against a wall though. You can bombard people with the facts all day long, but tomorrow they'll return spouting the same bullshit they picked up from the t.v, or they'll just throw insults at you instead.

Basically, people will just believe what they want to believe (what it's convenient for them to believe), or whatever Fox News tells them to believe. Seems to be that opinions are regarded as more important than the facts.

i haven't been posting in here as often as i used to, but this spot was and is literally how I get my cool news pieces from the left and right for as long as I remember posting here.

mikepegg44

Byrnzie wrote:

Basically, people will just believe what they want to believe (what it's convenient for them to believe), or whatever Fox News tells them to believe. Seems to be that opinions are regarded as more important than the facts.

so if someone were to agree with you on everything they are ok, but if someone disagrees with you it is because it is simply convenient or whatever fox tells them?


just f'n with you.

Too bad you are leaving. I was just about to comment on one of your threads that is nice to have someone as actively posting things as you are.

good luck

and this place for me isn't necessarily about changing anyone's mind, it is more about challenging my own beliefs. Discussing topics I normally don't get a chance to because too many people either don't know, don't show, or don't care what is going on in the world...

You can look at it as banging heads into the wall or whatever, but ultimately you need to ignore those that aren't involved in an actual discussion (i.e trolls)...I think it is pretty simple to see who those people are

JonnyPistachio

brianlux wrote:

Or should I say, I'm getting off the train. Of course, some of you might like that!

No, seriously, I'm doing this for a couple of reasons. Mainly I sincerely am worried about the condition of this rock we live on, not so much for my sake- I'm older than most of ya'll and have been down that long and winding road- but more so for the kids in my life- I don't have any of my own, but I have plenty of extended family kids and frankly, I'm worried for their future. When I write about global warming and environmental collapse, I don't do so to win points, say I'm right not you, or try to antagonize any of you. I've studied the hell out of these subjects and it's like watching a tidal wave come in and I just want to get my kids- and yours- off the beach before it's too late. But mostly I seem to have either preached to the choir, agrivated those who see things differently (a right I would never deny anyone)... or maybe I'm just howling at the moon, I don't know.

Another reason is I get so caught up in all of this that I just get fucking depressed and even though we all use this place (understandably) to vent, it shouldn't be battle zone and it all too often feels like that and I'm as guilty as anyone for that. I feel like I'm beating my head against a wall and that's no one's problem or fault but my own.

The other thing is... and honestly, I mean no offense, but what are we doing here? Is anything changing? Are any of us changing? I think I've learned something from all of you and I appreciate that but sometimes it feels like we all keep saying the same thing. Call me on that if I'm wrong- please!


Well, at least we're all Pearl Jam fans, right!

Take care everyone... and take care of someone else. And forgive me if this all seems too self-indulgent. I don't mean it that way.

I, for one, really enjoy your point of view on things.
I know what you mean about the felling of (of lack thereof) 'puspose' of being in here...
But I have found that it has made me look deeper into many things that I wouldnt otherwise understand. And seeing people discuss things from opposite ends is really educational sometimes (because i'm often on the fence.)

btw, I ordered from amazon that book you posted yesterday.

See you on the flipside..

polaris_x

firstly ... with time comes perspective ... as frustrating as it may seem to you to read the things and opinions on here - just remember two things: 1. there is someone with likely opposite beliefs equally frustrated and 2. somewhere out there is a lurker or a poster with some critical thinking skills who is digesting all that information ... don't discount the power of written words ... if we get one person to reconsider their viewpoints on environmental issues, especially GW ... it will be time well spent ...

secondly ... there aren't enough of us advocating the GW issue ... you can't leave!

Jeanwah

mikepegg44 wrote:

and this place for me isn't necessarily about changing anyone's mind, it is more about challenging my own beliefs. Discussing topics I normally don't get a chance to because too many people either don't know, don't show, or don't care what is going on in the world...

I relate to this. I don't come here to change people's minds, because if you think about it, it's impossible! But getting stories out there (simply to raise awareness) and questioning your own way of thinking, is worth checking back in here for. I've been on here for years, and I've left and come back plenty of times. Sometimes out of frustration, sometimes out of depression of not being able to change the world, but I always come back, probably because I like to hear what people are talking about and actually read an intelligent post! And Brian, you've got some great posts! So take a break if you like, but don't promise you won't be back.

The whole GW thing has gotten me down over the years that we won't be able to save ourselves due to selfishness, ignorance and not enough concern for future generations . But we do have the present. And that's what's gotten me out of any depression about the future. I think accepting what will happen (and I personally think it will, eventually) gets one back to thinking about what we can do right now.

Did you know about the protests going on at the White House due to the Keystone pipeline?
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=170496
For all the negativity we hear, there is progress and people standing up. We just don't hear about it!!

BinauralJam

Dear Brianlux, you are not allowed to stop posting, Sorry if this is a inconvience, there is nothing to be done about it for the forseeable future. Besides winter is coming, we are going to be trapped in our house for a few months anyway.

_

polaris_x wrote:

2. somewhere out there is a lurker or a poster with some critical thinking skills who is digesting all that information ... don't discount the power of written words ... if we get one person to reconsider their viewpoints on environmental issues, especially GW ... it will be time well spent ...

^THIS^

CH156378

BinauralJam wrote:

Dear Brianlux, you are not allowed to stop posting, Sorry if this is a inconvience, there is nothing to be done about it for the forseeable future. Besides winter is coming, we are going to be trapped in our house for a few months anyway.

^THIS^

whygohome

Understandable. I never really considered myself a regular poster, but I have had spurts.
A little while ago, I told my friend that I am in the detachment process: detachment from American society (yes, it has to be American society, because I live in the States and I am bound to this society).
Mentally, ideologically, I am out of here, next up is the physical detachment. My girlfriend was recently offered a job in Europe, where she would have her choice of two locations: Brasov, Romania or Wolfsburg, Germany. She is German, so we were leaning towards Wolfsburg, but we have since chosen Brasov(the Southern Carpathians, skiiing, hiking, anonymity, an adventure, travels around Europe). Unfortunately, she has a contract to teach here in NY, and a few doctoral exams to complete, so the move is postponed until next summer.
I am really looking forward to the move, and a nice change of (social) scenery.
I simply do not feel that people care anymore...about anything. I find popular/mainstream culture in the U.S. grotesque, and I feel we as individuals have lost our way. A handful of good people on a Pearl Jam message board does not mean that society is progressing in any way, shape, or form.

brianlux

Thanks for your thoughtful posts, everyone. I'm really quite taken aback. Sometimes I see myself as just being a thorn in the side around here when what I want most is to be a useful contributer. I guess what I really need is a break from the train. This really is an important forum. We need places like this to discuss current issues because the world is not a settled or stable place right now and we all can benefit from learning here. I know I've learned a lot from each of you- and yes, that includes those of you with whom I at times disagree.

A fellow poster suggested I do something creative for a while like write poetry. I'm over due for getting back into writing and I've got some guitars sitting here looking neglected so I think I will take that good advice and run with it and get back in touch with my creative side.

So take care for now everyone. I'll see you all on the flip side.

Brian

cincybearcat

brianlux wrote:

Thanks for your thoughtful posts, everyone. I'm really quite taken aback. Sometimes I see myself as just being a thorn in the side around here when what I want most is to be a useful contributer. I guess what I really need is a break from the train. This really is an important forum. We need places like this to discuss current issues because the world is not a settled or stable place right now and we all can benefit from learning here. I know I've learned a lot from each of you- and yes, that includes those of you with whom I at times disagree.

A fellow poster suggested I do something creative for a while like write poetry. I'm over due for getting back into writing and I've got some guitars sitting here looking neglected so I think I will take that good advice and run with it and get back in touch with my creative side.

So take care for now everyone. I'll see you all on the flip side.

Brian

Take care. I don't like it when anyone leaves, it's nice to have a lot of different opinions and experiences to hear and learn from...and some to disregard completely.

Go Beavers

People's emotional responses to discussions in here are interesting. Some seem to get bogged down and/or drained by it when people get conflictual. For me, it's energizing in a sense. Plus, at the core I can take some sort of solace in the fact the our society generally moves left over time, knowing that many of my beliefs will eventually come to fruition. My take on conservative dissent is that it's an informal check-and-balance that has developed over time, and I see checks and balances as a good thing, although frustrating at times.

chadwick

cincybearcat wrote:

Take care. I don't like it when anyone leaves, it's nice to have a lot of different opinions and experiences to hear and learn from...and some to disregard completely.

this made me laugh.

Go Beavers

whygohome wrote:

Understandable. I never really considered myself a regular poster, but I have had spurts.
A little while ago, I told my friend that I am in the detachment process: detachment from American society (yes, it has to be American society, because I live in the States and I am bound to this society).
Mentally, ideologically, I am out of here, next up is the physical detachment. My girlfriend was recently offered a job in Europe, where she would have her choice of two locations: Brasov, Romania or Wolfsburg, Germany. She is German, so we were leaning towards Wolfsburg, but we have since chosen Brasov(the Southern Carpathians, skiiing, hiking, anonymity, an adventure, travels around Europe). Unfortunately, she has a contract to teach here in NY, and a few doctoral exams to complete, so the move is postponed until next summer.
I am really looking forward to the move, and a nice change of (social) scenery.
I simply do not feel that people care anymore...about anything. I find popular/mainstream culture in the U.S. grotesque, and I feel we as individuals have lost our way. A handful of good people on a Pearl Jam message board does not mean that society is progressing in any way, shape, or form.

What's your evidence that we're not progressing in any way, shape or form?

STAYSEA

this is not the hotel california. You can check out anytime you like, but you can also leave. I missed some trains. This one, is the best train, because it always comes back... if you miss it! I was always told you can't fix stupid. So I won't jump ship. I went local first... Helped those around me... Then here... Now I broke my writers block. After 13 years? This train may have bumps, but you should not leave.. I wish I could change my picture. This is my angry avatar.

brianlux

STAYSEA wrote:

this is not the hotel california. You can check out anytime you like, but you can also leave. I missed some trains. This one, is the best train, because it always comes back... if you miss it! I was always told you can't fix stupid. So I won't jump ship. I went local first... Helped those around me... Then here... Now I broke my writers block. After 13 years? This train may have bumps, but you should not leave.. I wish I could change my picture. This is my angry avatar.

No worries- I'll be back. (See, even on "vacation" from the train I'm sneaking peeks. ) Meanwhile, I'm enjoying a few little creative indulgences.

catefrances

brianlux wrote:

STAYSEA wrote:

this is not the hotel california. You can check out anytime you like, but you can also leave. I missed some trains. This one, is the best train, because it always comes back... if you miss it! I was always told you can't fix stupid. So I won't jump ship. I went local first... Helped those around me... Then here... Now I broke my writers block. After 13 years? This train may have bumps, but you should not leave.. I wish I could change my picture. This is my angry avatar.

No worries- I'll be back. (See, even on "vacation" from the train I'm sneaking peeks. ) Meanwhile, I'm enjoying a few little creative indulgences.

dont you have to leave first before youll be back. :P

Idris

brianlux wrote:

STAYSEA wrote:

this is not the hotel california. You can check out anytime you like, but you can also leave. I missed some trains. This one, is the best train, because it always comes back... if you miss it! I was always told you can't fix stupid. So I won't jump ship. I went local first... Helped those around me... Then here... Now I broke my writers block. After 13 years? This train may have bumps, but you should not leave.. I wish I could change my picture. This is my angry avatar.

No worries- I'll be back. (See, even on "vacation" from the train I'm sneaking peeks. ) Meanwhile, I'm enjoying a few little creative indulgences.

enjoy your time bro! I just got back from a short vacation. Unplugged, cleared my head, good times,

whygohome

Go Beavers wrote:

whygohome wrote:

Understandable. I never really considered myself a regular poster, but I have had spurts.
A little while ago, I told my friend that I am in the detachment process: detachment from American society (yes, it has to be American society, because I live in the States and I am bound to this society).
Mentally, ideologically, I am out of here, next up is the physical detachment. My girlfriend was recently offered a job in Europe, where she would have her choice of two locations: Brasov, Romania or Wolfsburg, Germany. She is German, so we were leaning towards Wolfsburg, but we have since chosen Brasov(the Southern Carpathians, skiiing, hiking, anonymity, an adventure, travels around Europe). Unfortunately, she has a contract to teach here in NY, and a few doctoral exams to complete, so the move is postponed until next summer.
I am really looking forward to the move, and a nice change of (social) scenery.
I simply do not feel that people care anymore...about anything. I find popular/mainstream culture in the U.S. grotesque, and I feel we as individuals have lost our way. A handful of good people on a Pearl Jam message board does not mean that society is progressing in any way, shape, or form.

What's your evidence that we're not progressing in any way, shape or form?

"In any way, shape or form" was a bit exaggerated. Thinking about this stuff is a bit depressing though, and that fed the exaggeration.
But, just look at all the categories in which we used to at the top, and in which we are now towards the bottom: education, infrastructure, economy, politics........ That has to be an indication of something

Go Beavers

whygohome wrote:

Go Beavers wrote:

whygohome wrote:

Understandable. I never really considered myself a regular poster, but I have had spurts.
A little while ago, I told my friend that I am in the detachment process: detachment from American society (yes, it has to be American society, because I live in the States and I am bound to this society).
Mentally, ideologically, I am out of here, next up is the physical detachment. My girlfriend was recently offered a job in Europe, where she would have her choice of two locations: Brasov, Romania or Wolfsburg, Germany. She is German, so we were leaning towards Wolfsburg, but we have since chosen Brasov(the Southern Carpathians, skiiing, hiking, anonymity, an adventure, travels around Europe). Unfortunately, she has a contract to teach here in NY, and a few doctoral exams to complete, so the move is postponed until next summer.
I am really looking forward to the move, and a nice change of (social) scenery.
I simply do not feel that people care anymore...about anything. I find popular/mainstream culture in the U.S. grotesque, and I feel we as individuals have lost our way. A handful of good people on a Pearl Jam message board does not mean that society is progressing in any way, shape, or form.

What's your evidence that we're not progressing in any way, shape or form?

"In any way, shape or form" was a bit exaggerated. Thinking about this stuff is a bit depressing though, and that fed the exaggeration.
But, just look at all the categories in which we used to at the top, and in which we are now towards the bottom: education, infrastructure, economy, politics........ That has to be an indication of something

To me it reflects a rise in global standard of living combined with mis-spent funds within the United States.

whygohome

Go Beavers wrote:

whygohome wrote:

Go Beavers wrote:

What's your evidence that we're not progressing in any way, shape or form?

"In any way, shape or form" was a bit exaggerated. Thinking about this stuff is a bit depressing though, and that fed the exaggeration.
But, just look at all the categories in which we used to at the top, and in which we are now towards the bottom: education, infrastructure, economy, politics........ That has to be an indication of something

To me it reflects a rise in global standard of living combined with mis-spent funds within the United States.

TomAto, TomAHto.

The rise in the global standard of living is a good thing, no matter how much it scares the American Exceptionalists

STAYSEA

Go Beavers wrote:

whygohome wrote:

Understandable. I never really considered myself a regular poster, but I have had spurts.
A little while ago, I told my friend that I am in the detachment process: detachment from American society (yes, it has to be American society, because I live in the States and I am bound to this society).
Mentally, ideologically, I am out of here, next up is the physical detachment. My girlfriend was recently offered a job in Europe, where she would have her choice of two locations: Brasov, Romania or Wolfsburg, Germany. She is German, so we were leaning towards Wolfsburg, but we have since chosen Brasov(the Southern Carpathians, skiiing, hiking, anonymity, an adventure, travels around Europe). Unfortunately, she has a contract to teach here in NY, and a few doctoral exams to complete, so the move is postponed until next summer.
I am really looking forward to the move, and a nice change of (social) scenery.
I simply do not feel that people care anymore...about anything. I find popular/mainstream culture in the U.S. grotesque, and I feel we as individuals have lost our way. A handful of good people on a Pearl Jam message board does not mean that society is progressing in any way, shape, or form.

What's your evidence that we're not progressing in any way, shape or form?

It is progressing... americans (well some) are noticing . I used to work in the book industry.. and it's almost gone.. magazines are getting sloppy. "mainstreamers" just do what ever Oprah says. Natural Selection. survival of the brainless?

brianlux

STAYSEA wrote:

It is progressing... americans (well some) are noticing . I used to work in the book industry.. and it's almost gone.. magazines are getting sloppy. "mainstreamers" just do what ever Oprah says. Natural Selection. survival of the brainless?

This sounds like the description of a downward progression. I'd love to hear more about your work in the book business, STAYSEA, because I am in that business as well (used books- a great way to recycle)- but more importantly, what you are saying is exactly why I'm in the book business. It gives me the opportunity to turn people on to good, intelligently written books both because they tell about what people do (non-fiction) and why they do what they do (fiction). I get no greater thrill than to turn a high school kid on to John Steinbeck and Sylvia Plath or Terry Tempest Williams and Wendell Berry or whomever. Yes, there is a lot of low grade printed matter out there (or digital "print" on e-readers if that's what you're into) but there are still many, many fine, well written books out there. I agree with that whole theory of the "dumbing down of America"- there's no denying it- this is something that is painfully obvious (if nothing else, statistics will prove this to be true so I'd be surprised to see any argument here on this subject.) This is why it is important to have places like this to intelligently (we hope) discuss matters of relevence.

So here I am, writing this in a thread where explained why I jumped off the train. I thought about that today and thought about the comment mikepegg44 said:

"so if someone were to agree with you on everything they are ok, but if someone disagrees with you it is because it is simply convenient or whatever fox tells them?

just f'n with you."

I know he was mostly kidding, but in a way, it was a good call. We all like to be right and we all- at least mostly- like to be agreed with.

We need places like this. We need them to be intelligent. And, yeah, we (or perhaps I should say "I") need to be able to suck it up when someone disagrees with us/me. It would just be so much better here if we could disagree in a more civil manner than many of us have at times.

We're smart- let's be smarter. We're good- let's be better.

STAYSEA

Im with the BRAin on this!!!

The Brain Knows!!!!


Well, at least we're all Pearl Jam fans, right!

Take care everyone... and take care of someone else. And forgive me if this all seems too self-indulgent. I don't mean it that way.[/quote]

STAYSEA

I walk the line.

brianlux

STAYSEA wrote:

Im with the BRAin on this!!!

The Brain Knows!!!!


Well, at least we're all Pearl Jam fans, right!

Take care everyone... and take care of someone else. And forgive me if this all seems too self-indulgent. I don't mean it that way.

[/quote]
I LOVE that quote- right on Staysea! Not self-indulgent at all- it's a wonderful thought!

RFTC

alright blux, dont stray too far. we need your voice back on the train someday...p.s. is of mice n men better than grapes of wrath? read the latter...

brianlux

RFTC wrote:

alright blux, dont stray too far. we need your voice back on the train someday...p.s. is of mice n men better than grapes of wrath? read the latter...

Hey, thanks, RFTC! Books- the subject always tempts to hang around a while. Oh, I love Steinbeck and not ashamed to say it. My Pop used to take us down to Cannery Row when we were kids and he'd show us Doc's Lab - that is, the real Ed Ricketts and the real Ed Ricketts lab. It was boarded up but basically intact with ocean-air faded walls and salt crusted windows and it was getting ready to start falling apart at the seams. The stink, noise, light, tone, habit, nostalgia and dream still lingered and it was very much still a poem.

But we were talking of mice, men and grapes. Of Mice and Men is a mini masterpiece, a nearly perfect tragedy and an incredible piece of work. Grapes of Wrath of course is much more sweeping and wide and very solid. Grapes of Wrath- FWUMP! A massive monster of a great book. So I guess I'd have to say apples and oranges or grapes and watermelons. I love them both but my favorites are Tortilla Flat, Cannery Row, Sweet Thursday and Travells With Charley- not necessarily because they're better but because they're the easiest shoes to put on for me.

How did you like Grapes, RFTC?