Federation of Islamic Councils wants Sharia Law in Australia

Thoughts_Arrive

and you are telling me this because???.....

Idris

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

Mr Abraham, so you wouldn't be pissed off if this happened where you live?
Migrants should respect the laws and ways of life of the country they choose to live in.
My parents came to Australia 40 years ago along with many others from Europe, they did not complain and make the government change things for them. Why can't these people do the same. It makes me upset :x

People should respect the laws of the land on which they live, as long as the laws are not unjust. But if the law/rules are unjust, I say, fight against those laws..Tirelessly.

Thoughts_Arrive

MrAbraham wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

Mr Abraham, so you wouldn't be pissed off if this happened where you live?
Migrants should respect the laws and ways of life of the country they choose to live in.
My parents came to Australia 40 years ago along with many others from Europe, they did not complain and make the government change things for them. Why can't these people do the same. It makes me upset :x

People should respect the laws of the land on which they live, as long as the laws are not unjust. But if the law/rules are unjust, I say, fight against those laws..Tirelessly.

Well I see this as unjust, banning things we used to be able to purchase.

Smellyman

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

and you are telling me this because???.....

hypocrisy

Thoughts_Arrive

Smellyman wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

and you are telling me this because???.....

hypocrisy

by whom?
please elaborate...

Thoughts_Arrive

So Sharia Law is already being applied in Sydney?

http://www.news.com.au/national/sharia- ... 6057896078

:?

redrock

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

What, they want more?

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/pay-fo ... 6057835721

This article also states that they want state funding for expanding islamic schools. For once, I agree with you. No tax payer's money should be used to fund ANY non-inclusive, religious school, whether it be catholic (yep.. tax payer's money is spent on catholic schools), islamic, jewish, etc.


A point for which I would appreciate clarification... when you say a KFC isn't allowed to sell pork based products, does that mean that it is illegal, ie there is a law against this? What would legally happen if they did? Or is it a business decision from that particular KFC deciding that, being in a majority muslim community, it would make better business sense to attract their custom by removing bacon from their menu. More customers, more profit? Most fast food outlets will adjust menu following regional/local tastes. Taking KFC as an example a number of 'halal' restaurants are being trialed in the UK as they have seen a gap in the market for these. The result of the trial will decide whether it is worth their while continuing with those in muslim communities or not.

You also say that 'everything is Halal' at your supermarket. Again, is this a business decision due to the area this supermarket is? Would it be illegal (against the law) for a supermarket to open and sell non-halal goods across the road from the Halal one? Again, what would legally happen if they did? Or would a potential developer think 'hmmm.... mainly muslims who buy Halal.... I won't get many customers and I will lose money.'?

One needs to bear in mind that a business is there to make profits and will offer goods that will attract their potential customers.

I'm not picking a fight or anything, just trying to understand what the legalities are.

redrock

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

So Sharia Law is already being applied in Sydney?

http://www.news.com.au/national/sharia- ... 6057896078

:?

You seem to be very adept at finding these articles!

" Sharia used to end hundreds of marriages

SHARIA is already being practised in western Sydney, with hundreds of religious divorces granted by imams."

Note the word 'religious' divorces (being granted by a religious figure). Do you also have issues with jewish religious divorces? Because these are also granted under religious law by the Rabbis. Even if a divorce is granted under the civil laws of the country, if the proper religious procedures have not been followed, the couple are not divorced under jewish law (ie religious).

Do you have the same problem with halachah as you do with sharia?

Do you see the similarities? Should a 'hate/scare mongering' article be written about this?

keeponrockin

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

thoughts_arrive, why not move to an area where bacon is sold? they have just as much right to not sell pork products as you do to shop somewhere else...you are a consumer. you vote with your money.

My friend lives in that area not me, re-read my post
My area if fine, we have a lot of Vietnamese here, no chance of Halal and no pork being enforced in my area thank heavens.

They have rights to not sell pork? What country do they live in?
They migrated here so they should accept our way of life, how do you think the people that have been living in these areas for longer than these migrants feel? They were born here and now all of a sudden because some group complains it fucks things up for them. Imagine that, oh I want to host a BBQ, let me go to the butcher around the corner from my home for some pork cutlets, oh no they cannot sell it, shit that means I have to drive a bit to the next area which is about 3 suburbs away.

As a business owner, he or she has the right not to sell a certain kind of product, no?

aerial

redrock wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

So Sharia Law is already being applied in Sydney?

http://www.news.com.au/national/sharia- ... 6057896078

:?

You seem to be very adept at finding these articles!

" Sharia used to end hundreds of marriages

SHARIA is already being practised in western Sydney, with hundreds of religious divorces granted by imams."

Note the word 'religious' divorces (being granted by a religious figure). Do you also have issues with jewish religious divorces? Because these are also granted under religious law by the Rabbis. Even if a divorce is granted under the civil laws of the country, if the proper religious procedures have not been followed, the couple are not divorced under jewish law (ie religious).

Do you see the similarities? Should a 'hate/scare mongering' article be written about this?

You forgot racist and bigoted: roll:

As long as there rules affect them only. I would not care. However, if it affects how I live or what I eat (and someone else’s divorce will not) I would have a problem with it. Everyone needs to remember, it is a fact that SOME Muslims ( alot) want to rule the world under Shari Law.
.

redrock

aerial wrote:

As long as there rules affect them only. I would not care. However, if it affects how I live or what I eat (and someone else’s divorce will not) I would have a problem with it. Everyone needs to remember, it is a fact that SOME Muslims ( alot) want to rule the world under Shari Law.
.

But it doesn't affect what you eat... a local shop/franchise decides not to sell a product because it doesn't make good business sense, you get your product elsewhere - whatever that product may be. I'm sure many of us have found that our local supermarket no longer stocks a certain product we may like because it wasn't selling, etc. Example, I eat veal (yeah.... I know....), as many others, my local butcher doesn't have it. If I want some, I need to go to a butcher a few miles away who caters for a community that does eat veal. No difference.

Affects how you live? Sharia law? How so as Sharia is only applicable to muslims.

markin ball

Thoughts Arrive,

Could you please dig up a link of the statutes or ordinances of these places that outlaw pork. I'm in the U.S. and don't even now where to begin looking. I'm amazed by all of this.

Cheers!

cajunkiwi

Smellyman wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

My friend lives in that area not me, re-read my post
My area if fine, we have a lot of Vietnamese here, no chance of Halal and no pork being enforced in my area thank heavens.

They have rights to not sell pork? What country do they live in?
They migrated here so they should accept our way of life, how do you think the people that have been living in these areas for longer than these migrants feel? They were born here and now all of a sudden because some group complains it fucks things up for them. Imagine that, oh I want to host a BBQ, let me go to the butcher around the corner from my home for some pork cutlets, oh no they cannot sell it, shit that means I have to drive a bit to the next area which is about 3 suburbs away.

just think how the aborigines feel.

Funny how that point was never addressed. I can only assume, based on his argument, that he would have no qualms about living in a traditional Aborigine setting out in the bush where he'd be eating beetles... after all, they were born in Australia long before he was

catefrances

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

catefrances wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

Catefrances, pork selling is not allowed in that suburb and a few suburbs close to it so KFC cannot sell it.
I don't buy take away often, very rarely because it is rubbish for the body.

ill be coming down to melbourne shortly.. ill be sure to check those suburbs out.

haha be safe, broady is rough.

considering where i grew up and where i live now, not really a problem. besides rough is relative and highly subjective.

Thoughts_Arrive

markin ball wrote:

Thoughts Arrive,

Could you please dig up a link of the statutes or ordinances of these places that outlaw pork. I'm in the U.S. and don't even now where to begin looking. I'm amazed by all of this.

Cheers!

This came into effect a few years ago and I am struggling to find news articles through my Google search but here is what I could find:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2003 ... 862032.htm

http://www.aph.gov.au/house/committee/m ... sub249.pdf (page 2 and onwards)

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=69575

There were links on forums to news articles that no longer exist, I tried clicking on them but they don't bring up the articles.

If I find more I will post them up.

Kind of off topic but...
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/schoolboy ... 5797121649

markin ball

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

markin ball wrote:

Thoughts Arrive,

Could you please dig up a link of the statutes or ordinances of these places that outlaw pork. I'm in the U.S. and don't even now where to begin looking. I'm amazed by all of this.

Cheers!

This came into effect a few years ago and I am struggling to find news articles through my Google search but here is what I could find:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2003 ... 862032.htm

http://www.aph.gov.au/house/committee/m ... sub249.pdf (page 2 and onwards)

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=69575

There were links on forums to news articles that no longer exist, I tried clicking on them but they don't bring up the articles.

If I find more I will post them up.

Kind of off topic but...
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/schoolboy ... 5797121649

Thank you very much for the links. I guess what I'm looking for though are links to the actual statutes that say "this suburb, locale, etc. must sell only halal meat, etc." I'll try to do some digging myself, as well.

Thoughts_Arrive

Or you can just call KFC in Fawkner and ask them lol

I don't live in these areas btw.
What I posted here is based on a) my experience at that KFC b) what I heard/read in media

Thoughts_Arrive

redrock wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

What, they want more?

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/pay-fo ... 6057835721

This article also states that they want state funding for expanding islamic schools. For once, I agree with you. No tax payer's money should be used to fund ANY non-inclusive, religious school, whether it be catholic (yep.. tax payer's money is spent on catholic schools), islamic, jewish, etc.


A point for which I would appreciate clarification... when you say a KFC isn't allowed to sell pork based products, does that mean that it is illegal, ie there is a law against this? What would legally happen if they did? Or is it a business decision from that particular KFC deciding that, being in a majority muslim community, it would make better business sense to attract their custom by removing bacon from their menu. More customers, more profit? Most fast food outlets will adjust menu following regional/local tastes. Taking KFC as an example a number of 'halal' restaurants are being trialed in the UK as they have seen a gap in the market for these. The result of the trial will decide whether it is worth their while continuing with those in muslim communities or not.

You also say that 'everything is Halal' at your supermarket. Again, is this a business decision due to the area this supermarket is? Would it be illegal (against the law) for a supermarket to open and sell non-halal goods across the road from the Halal one? Again, what would legally happen if they did? Or would a potential developer think 'hmmm.... mainly muslims who buy Halal.... I won't get many customers and I will lose money.'?

One needs to bear in mind that a business is there to make profits and will offer goods that will attract their potential customers.

I'm not picking a fight or anything, just trying to understand what the legalities are.

Not sure if it is law (illegal), I think KFC just choose not to serve it so to avoid offending the muslims.
I also noticed some workers there are muslim so that could play a part.
As for other stores in the area (other fast food, restaurants, butchers, delis etc), I think it is council law, not sure. I just know pork products have been removed from shops, not sure if they have been removed from all the shops as I do not live there.
The two councils I refer to are City of Hume (northern suburbs) and City of Dandenong (south eastern suburbs), these areas have a high muslim population.

As for the Halal foods in supermarkets, that applies everywhere here. A lot of the mass produced products such as dairy foods have the Halal logo on it.

Thoughts_Arrive

redrock wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

So Sharia Law is already being applied in Sydney?

http://www.news.com.au/national/sharia- ... 6057896078

:?

You seem to be very adept at finding these articles!

" Sharia used to end hundreds of marriages

SHARIA is already being practised in western Sydney, with hundreds of religious divorces granted by imams."

Note the word 'religious' divorces (being granted by a religious figure). Do you also have issues with jewish religious divorces? Because these are also granted under religious law by the Rabbis. Even if a divorce is granted under the civil laws of the country, if the proper religious procedures have not been followed, the couple are not divorced under jewish law (ie religious).

Do you have the same problem with halachah as you do with sharia?

Do you see the similarities? Should a 'hate/scare mongering' article be written about this?

I don't have any issue with any divorces with any religion, how each religion handles divorces is up to them and whoever follows that religion needs to accept that.
Divorces are one thing, other aspects of Sharia are another thing.

Thoughts_Arrive

keeponrockin wrote:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

thoughts_arrive, why not move to an area where bacon is sold? they have just as much right to not sell pork products as you do to shop somewhere else...you are a consumer. you vote with your money.

My friend lives in that area not me, re-read my post
My area if fine, we have a lot of Vietnamese here, no chance of Halal and no pork being enforced in my area thank heavens.

They have rights to not sell pork? What country do they live in?
They migrated here so they should accept our way of life, how do you think the people that have been living in these areas for longer than these migrants feel? They were born here and now all of a sudden because some group complains it fucks things up for them. Imagine that, oh I want to host a BBQ, let me go to the butcher around the corner from my home for some pork cutlets, oh no they cannot sell it, shit that means I have to drive a bit to the next area which is about 3 suburbs away.

As a business owner, he or she has the right not to sell a certain kind of product, no?

Yes. But if a council bans it then the business owner would lose money.