Um, Are We About To Be In A Third War?

135

Comments

  • GET YOUR WAR ON!


    it's started...

    more indiscriminate death raining down from above....

    i'm so sick of this shit.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    Just what the world needs is another war. 112 cruise missiles fired...so senseless.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • Newch91Newch91 Posts: 17,560
    No US troops on Libyan soil.
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  • Newch91 wrote:
    No US troops on Libyan soil.
    do you really believe obama?

    i don't.

    when is the last time a military plan of ours actually went as planned and had a quick and easy conclusion and achieved the desired outcome?
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • LikeAnOceanLikeAnOcean Posts: 7,718
    Newch91 wrote:
    No US troops on Libyan soil.
    do you really believe obama?

    i don't.

    when is the last time a military plan of ours actually went as planned and had a quick and easy conclusion and achieved the desired outcome?
    Kosovo?

    They are going to achieve their desired outcome in the matter of hours, and that is creating a no fly zone so this asshat can stop attacking his own country from the air.


    We don't need ground troops to establish a no fly zone.
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    Newch91 wrote:
    No US troops on Libyan soil.

    The last 2 times no fly zones were enacted they resulted into ground troops and lengthy interventions.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • LikeAnOceanLikeAnOcean Posts: 7,718
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Newch91 wrote:
    No US troops on Libyan soil.

    The last 2 times no fly zones were enacted they resulted into ground troops and lengthy interventions.
    Thats because the first stage in an invasion is establishing a no fly zone. It has to be done before ground troops can enter. Think about it.

    We are doing the right thing this time. I was very much against attacking Iraq.


    We won't need ground troops because the general population is going to take things under control, and they've been trying. With Iraq, there was much less antigovernment resistance. We didn't attack Iraq during a civil war. We attacked because we were made to think they had WMDs..

    Its going to be like Egypt in a few months. This will be over swiftly.
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Newch91 wrote:
    No US troops on Libyan soil.

    The last 2 times no fly zones were enacted they resulted into ground troops and lengthy interventions.
    Thats because the first stage in an invasion is establishing a no fly zone. It has to be done before ground troops can enter. Think about it.

    We are doing the right thing this time. I was very much against attacking Iraq.


    We won't need ground troops because the general population is going to take things under control, and they've been trying.

    I think originally most people were under the impression that Iraq's wanted you there, until you were there. If they send in ground troops it will be the same results a long protracted war,.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • tremorstremors Posts: 8,051
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Just what the world needs is another war. 112 cruise missiles fired...so senseless.

    How is it senseless to respond to requests from inside Libya and across the Arab world to prevent Gadaffi massacring his second city, which he was right on the verge of doing today? Actually, this isn't really an American led war at all, it's a British and French one, with a completely different set of elements to either Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Gadaffi is trying to crush a popular uprising, which would have absolutely no chance of staying alive without external air power.

    The language of oil-hungry crusaders is the propaganda currently coming from Gadaffi's bunch - so if people want to be singing from the same hymn sheet as Libyan propaganda then carry on. But this is actually a rare example of the United Nations supporting a popular revolution, in order to prevent senseless bloodshed if you ask me. It's a defensive intervention rather than an offensive one.
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  • LikeAnOceanLikeAnOcean Posts: 7,718
    tremors wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Just what the world needs is another war. 112 cruise missiles fired...so senseless.

    How is it senseless to respond to requests from inside Libya and across the Arab world to prevent Gadaffi massacring his second city, which he was right on the verge of doing today? Actually, this isn't really an American led war at all, it's a British and French one, with a completely different set of elements to either Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Gadaffi is trying to crush a popular uprising, which would have absolutely no chance of staying alive without external air power.

    The language of oil-hungry crusaders is the propaganda currently coming from Gadaffi's bunch - so if people want to be singing from the same hymn sheet as Libyan propaganda then carry on. But this is actually a rare example of the United Nations supporting a popular revolution, in order to prevent senseless bloodshed if you ask me. It's a defensive intervention rather than an offensive one.
    I agree with you 200%

    I am usually anti-war and was very much against attacking Iraq. I don't see how people think this is bad. This is going to be over quickly. I'll be very surprised otherwise.
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    tremors wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Just what the world needs is another war. 112 cruise missiles fired...so senseless.

    How is it senseless to respond to requests from inside Libya and across the Arab world to prevent Gadaffi massacring his second city, which he was right on the verge of doing today? Actually, this isn't really an American led war at all, it's a British and French one, with a completely different set of elements to either Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Gadaffi is trying to crush a popular uprising, which would have absolutely no chance of staying alive without external air power.

    The language of oil-hungry crusaders is the propaganda currently coming from Gadaffi's bunch - so if people want to be singing from the same hymn sheet as Libyan propaganda then carry on. But this is actually a rare example of the United Nations supporting a popular revolution, in order to prevent senseless bloodshed if you ask me. It's a defensive intervention rather than an offensive one.

    Here's an idea, let the Arab countries deal with him then. The US is the major player here, there trying to come across differently, but they are the major player and at the end of the day who's military might will be used most, the US!!!
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • LikeAnOceanLikeAnOcean Posts: 7,718
    lukin2006 wrote:
    tremors wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Just what the world needs is another war. 112 cruise missiles fired...so senseless.

    How is it senseless to respond to requests from inside Libya and across the Arab world to prevent Gadaffi massacring his second city, which he was right on the verge of doing today? Actually, this isn't really an American led war at all, it's a British and French one, with a completely different set of elements to either Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Gadaffi is trying to crush a popular uprising, which would have absolutely no chance of staying alive without external air power.

    The language of oil-hungry crusaders is the propaganda currently coming from Gadaffi's bunch - so if people want to be singing from the same hymn sheet as Libyan propaganda then carry on. But this is actually a rare example of the United Nations supporting a popular revolution, in order to prevent senseless bloodshed if you ask me. It's a defensive intervention rather than an offensive one.



    Here's an idea, let the Arab countries deal with him then. The US is the major player here, there trying to come across differently, but they are the major player and at the end of the day who's military might will be used most, the US!!!
    That's your assumption. You are assuming we are going to be the key player.. We can all stand corrected in coming months.
  • tremorstremors Posts: 8,051
    lukin2006 wrote:
    tremors wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Just what the world needs is another war. 112 cruise missiles fired...so senseless.

    How is it senseless to respond to requests from inside Libya and across the Arab world to prevent Gadaffi massacring his second city, which he was right on the verge of doing today? Actually, this isn't really an American led war at all, it's a British and French one, with a completely different set of elements to either Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Gadaffi is trying to crush a popular uprising, which would have absolutely no chance of staying alive without external air power.

    The language of oil-hungry crusaders is the propaganda currently coming from Gadaffi's bunch - so if people want to be singing from the same hymn sheet as Libyan propaganda then carry on. But this is actually a rare example of the United Nations supporting a popular revolution, in order to prevent senseless bloodshed if you ask me. It's a defensive intervention rather than an offensive one.

    Here's an idea, let the Arab countries deal with him then. The US is the major player here, there trying to come across differently, but they are the major player and at the end of the day who's military might will be used most, the US!!!


    I bet you 10 dollars that as soon as the US have used their Cruise missiles ('Unique Capabilities' that your government are referring to) to establish the no fly zone, the bulk of the Military engagement will be done by Britain, France and the Arab League, with the USA just providing the hi tech support. Control of the operation will pass to Britain and France in a matter of days. It's British and French planes that are right now buzzing over Libya, and they will be committed the most. Obama really doesn't need to be involved in a war, and seems to have little appetite for it - whereas Cameron and Sarkozy (British and French Prime Ministers) are the ones who have been pressing for this for some weeks.
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  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    lukin2006 wrote:
    tremors wrote:

    How is it senseless to respond to requests from inside Libya and across the Arab world to prevent Gadaffi massacring his second city, which he was right on the verge of doing today? Actually, this isn't really an American led war at all, it's a British and French one, with a completely different set of elements to either Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Gadaffi is trying to crush a popular uprising, which would have absolutely no chance of staying alive without external air power.

    The language of oil-hungry crusaders is the propaganda currently coming from Gadaffi's bunch - so if people want to be singing from the same hymn sheet as Libyan propaganda then carry on. But this is actually a rare example of the United Nations supporting a popular revolution, in order to prevent senseless bloodshed if you ask me. It's a defensive intervention rather than an offensive one.



    Here's an idea, let the Arab countries deal with him then. The US is the major player here, there trying to come across differently, but they are the major player and at the end of the day who's military might will be used most, the US!!!
    That's your assumption. You are assuming we are going to be the key player.. We can all stand corrected in coming months.

    Shit the US has already fired 112 cruise missiles in day 1, they are already the most important player.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    tremors wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:
    tremors wrote:

    How is it senseless to respond to requests from inside Libya and across the Arab world to prevent Gadaffi massacring his second city, which he was right on the verge of doing today? Actually, this isn't really an American led war at all, it's a British and French one, with a completely different set of elements to either Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Gadaffi is trying to crush a popular uprising, which would have absolutely no chance of staying alive without external air power.

    The language of oil-hungry crusaders is the propaganda currently coming from Gadaffi's bunch - so if people want to be singing from the same hymn sheet as Libyan propaganda then carry on. But this is actually a rare example of the United Nations supporting a popular revolution, in order to prevent senseless bloodshed if you ask me. It's a defensive intervention rather than an offensive one.

    Here's an idea, let the Arab countries deal with him then. The US is the major player here, there trying to come across differently, but they are the major player and at the end of the day who's military might will be used most, the US!!!


    I bet you 10 dollars that as soon as the US have used their Cruise missiles ('Unique Capabilities' that your government are referring to) to establish the no fly zone, the bulk of the Military engagement will be done by Britain, France and the Arab League, with the USA just providing the hi tech support. Control of the operation will pass to Britain and France in a matter of days. It's British and French planes that are right now buzzing over Libya, and they will be committed the most. Obama really doesn't need to be involved in a war, and seems to have little appetite for it - whereas Cameron and Sarkozy (British and French Prime Ministers) are the ones who have been pressing for this for some weeks.

    ...and if those cruise missiles miss their targets and kill innocent people, then the US will take the brunt of the blame and the people of lebanon will turn against them as well.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • tremorstremors Posts: 8,051
    lukin2006 wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:



    Here's an idea, let the Arab countries deal with him then. The US is the major player here, there trying to come across differently, but they are the major player and at the end of the day who's military might will be used most, the US!!!
    That's your assumption. You are assuming we are going to be the key player.. We can all stand corrected in coming months.

    Shit the US has already fired 112 cruise missiles in day 1, they are already the most important player.


    They are the most important player at the beginning, because they are the only ones with the capability to properly establish the No Fly Zone from a distance. Anyway, wait and see - but I'm pretty certain the US will be taking a back seat in a matter of days.
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  • LikeAnOceanLikeAnOcean Posts: 7,718
    lukin2006 wrote:

    Shit the US has already fired 112 cruise missiles in day 1, they are already the most important player.
    The UN is using our advanced missile system in the first stages to cripple the air defense. That has been stated. That is our part. Relax.
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    lukin2006 wrote:
    tremors wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:

    Here's an idea, let the Arab countries deal with him then. The US is the major player here, there trying to come across differently, but they are the major player and at the end of the day who's military might will be used most, the US!!!


    I bet you 10 dollars that as soon as the US have used their Cruise missiles ('Unique Capabilities' that your government are referring to) to establish the no fly zone, the bulk of the Military engagement will be done by Britain, France and the Arab League, with the USA just providing the hi tech support. Control of the operation will pass to Britain and France in a matter of days. It's British and French planes that are right now buzzing over Libya, and they will be committed the most. Obama really doesn't need to be involved in a war, and seems to have little appetite for it - whereas Cameron and Sarkozy (British and French Prime Ministers) are the ones who have been pressing for this for some weeks.

    ...and if those cruise missiles miss their targets and kill innocent people, then the US will take the brunt of the blame and the people of lebanon will turn against them as well.

    Why not let the Arab's deal with him? And the west keep their nose out of it?
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • LikeAnOceanLikeAnOcean Posts: 7,718
    lukin2006 wrote:

    Why not let the Arab's deal with him? And the west keep their nose out of it?
    Because we all have something in common. We are humans. What qualifies another Arabian country to handle this above anyone else? Skin color? Religion??
  • boyo79boyo79 Posts: 6,525
    The bottom line is the US, UK and France are only interested in Libya because of the oil. They aren't interested in protecting the civilians. They've already started dropping bombs just ONE DAY after getting this No Fly Zone in place. The US, UK & France have engineered this so they could drop bombs. They've probably helped the rebels attack Gaddafi's troops knowing he'd retaliate. And then they get the OK to attack.

    Don't get me wrong, Gaddafi shouldn't be in power but the US & the UK have no business in this. What they are doing is nothing short of legalised terrorism. Its Iraq all over again.
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  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    lukin2006 wrote:

    Why not let the Arab's deal with him? And the west keep their nose out of it?
    Because we all have something in common. We are humans. What qualifies another Arabian country to handle this above anyone else? Skin color? Religion??

    Iraq's are human...people pissed all over Bush for that war (no I'm not a Bush supporter), Hussein massacred his own people, what about Rwanda? How about the Palestinians? The Ivory Coast? And the list goes on and on.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    boyo79 wrote:
    The bottom line is the US, UK and France are only interested in Libya because of the oil. They aren't interested in protecting the civilians. They've already started dropping bombs just ONE DAY after getting this No Fly Zone in place. The US, UK & France have engineered this so they could drop bombs. They've probably helped the rebels attack Gaddafi's troops knowing he'd retaliate. And then they get the OK to attack.

    Don't get me wrong, Gaddafi shouldn't be in power but the US & the UK have no business in this. What they are doing is nothing short of legalised terrorism. Its Iraq all over again.

    +1
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • FlaggFlagg Posts: 5,856
    Some of you guys see the boogey man everywhere don't you? Never can just take something at face value. Always have to find an ulterior motive or a conspiracy.


    They asked for help. They are getting help.

    The "indiscriminate death from above" comment made me laugh. Guess it's ok then if Ghadafi does it. Guess it is ok if he shells his own people with tanks and artillery and drops bombs on them. How else are you supposed to stop him?
    Sanctions? Harsh language?

    Iraq was a mistake. Afghanistan is a mess. This isn't the same thing. I am about as anti-war as you can get but that man is slaughtering his own people who are involved in a popular uprising. Hell I figured most of you would be on board with that.
    DAL-7/5/98,10/17/00,6/9/03,11/15/13
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  • boyo79boyo79 Posts: 6,525
    Flagg wrote:
    Some of you guys see the boogey man everywhere don't you? Never can just take something at face value. Always have to find an ulterior motive or a conspiracy.


    They asked for help. They are getting help.

    The "indiscriminate death from above" comment made me laugh. Guess it's ok then if Ghadafi does it. Guess it is ok if he shells his own people with tanks and artillery and drops bombs on them. How else are you supposed to stop him?
    Sanctions? Harsh language?

    Iraq was a mistake. Afghanistan is a mess. This isn't the same thing. I am about as anti-war as you can get but that man is slaughtering his own people who are involved in a popular uprising. Hell I figured most of you would be on board with that.

    Oil. That's why they are involved. I'm not being funny but the US & UK governments have know what Gaddafi is like for decades. Why all of a sudden the interest in removing him? They aren't interested in the people of Libya.
    2000: Manchester
    2006: Dublin; Leeds; Arnhem
    2007: London
    2009: Manchester
    2012: Manchester I & II : EV Manchester : Soundgarden Shepherds Bush
    2013: Brad Manchester : Soundgarden Manchester
    2014: Amsterdam I & II; Berlin; Leeds; Milton Keynes
    2018: Berlin; London II; Boston II

    Bootleg Reviews: http://pjbootlegreviews.blogspot.com/
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    Flagg wrote:
    Some of you guys see the boogey man everywhere don't you? Never can just take something at face value. Always have to find an ulterior motive or a conspiracy.


    They asked for help. They are getting help.

    The "indiscriminate death from above" comment made me laugh. Guess it's ok then if Ghadafi does it. Guess it is ok if he shells his own people with tanks and artillery and drops bombs on them. How else are you supposed to stop him?
    Sanctions? Harsh language?

    Iraq was a mistake. Afghanistan is a mess. This isn't the same thing. I am about as anti-war as you can get but that man is slaughtering his own people who are involved in a popular uprising. Hell I figured most of you would be on board with that.

    What about Iran last year, no one helped those protestors? What about China in 89' or whenever Tiananmen Square? The west only delivered harsh words then.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • FlaggFlagg Posts: 5,856
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Flagg wrote:
    Some of you guys see the boogey man everywhere don't you? Never can just take something at face value. Always have to find an ulterior motive or a conspiracy.


    They asked for help. They are getting help.

    The "indiscriminate death from above" comment made me laugh. Guess it's ok then if Ghadafi does it. Guess it is ok if he shells his own people with tanks and artillery and drops bombs on them. How else are you supposed to stop him?
    Sanctions? Harsh language?

    Iraq was a mistake. Afghanistan is a mess. This isn't the same thing. I am about as anti-war as you can get but that man is slaughtering his own people who are involved in a popular uprising. Hell I figured most of you would be on board with that.

    What about Iran last year, no one helped those protestors? What about China in 89' or whenever Tiananmen Square? The west only delivered harsh words then.

    Well Ghadafi is an easy target. Not sure the US was ready to risk WWIII with China.

    Same with Iran. They are a much tougher foe.

    Besides, Russia and China would veto any action against Iran. They did not against Libya.

    The West this time did exactly what Bush would not/could not do in 2003. They got UN and Arab League blessing.
    DAL-7/5/98,10/17/00,6/9/03,11/15/13
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    PHL-5/27/06,5/28/06,10/30/09,10/31/09
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  • FlaggFlagg Posts: 5,856
    boyo79 wrote:
    Flagg wrote:
    Some of you guys see the boogey man everywhere don't you? Never can just take something at face value. Always have to find an ulterior motive or a conspiracy.


    They asked for help. They are getting help.

    The "indiscriminate death from above" comment made me laugh. Guess it's ok then if Ghadafi does it. Guess it is ok if he shells his own people with tanks and artillery and drops bombs on them. How else are you supposed to stop him?
    Sanctions? Harsh language?

    Iraq was a mistake. Afghanistan is a mess. This isn't the same thing. I am about as anti-war as you can get but that man is slaughtering his own people who are involved in a popular uprising. Hell I figured most of you would be on board with that.

    Oil. That's why they are involved. I'm not being funny but the US & UK governments have know what Gaddafi is like for decades. Why all of a sudden the interest in removing him? They aren't interested in the people of Libya.

    Yeah, but the people have only revolted recently.

    I am not denying oil is a major if not the major factor here. But I still think destroying his air defenses and grounding his planes are the right things to do. And there is no way US ground troops need to be involved.
    DAL-7/5/98,10/17/00,6/9/03,11/15/13
    BOS-9/28/04,9/29/04,6/28/08,6/30/08, 9/5/16, 9/7/16, 9/2/18
    MTL-9/15/05, OTT-9/16/05
    PHL-5/27/06,5/28/06,10/30/09,10/31/09
    CHI-8/2/07,8/5/07,8/23/09,8/24/09
    HTFD-6/27/08
    ATX-10/4/09, 10/12/14
    KC-5/3/2010,STL-5/4/2010
    Bridge School-10/23/2010,10/24/2010
    PJ20-9/3/2011,9/4/2011
    OKC-11/16/13
    SEA-12/6/13
    TUL-10/8/14
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    Flagg wrote:
    lukin2006 wrote:
    Flagg wrote:
    Some of you guys see the boogey man everywhere don't you? Never can just take something at face value. Always have to find an ulterior motive or a conspiracy.


    They asked for help. They are getting help.

    The "indiscriminate death from above" comment made me laugh. Guess it's ok then if Ghadafi does it. Guess it is ok if he shells his own people with tanks and artillery and drops bombs on them. How else are you supposed to stop him?
    Sanctions? Harsh language?

    Iraq was a mistake. Afghanistan is a mess. This isn't the same thing. I am about as anti-war as you can get but that man is slaughtering his own people who are involved in a popular uprising. Hell I figured most of you would be on board with that.

    What about Iran last year, no one helped those protestors? What about China in 89' or whenever Tiananmen Square? The west only delivered harsh words then.

    Well Ghadafi is an easy target. Not sure the US was ready to risk WWIII with China.

    Same with Iran. They are a much tougher foe.

    Besides, Russia and China would veto any action against Iran. They did not against Libya.

    The West this time did exactly what Bush would not/could not do in 2003. They got UN and Arab League blessing.

    Why should the west have to clean up these mess's all the time. Personally I think the west only gets involved when its convenient to them. How about the Palestinians? I doubt anyone would get upset if the west helped them out? This over over oil! I'd be interested to see how much oil the UK and France get from libya.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • ONCE DEVIDEDONCE DEVIDED Posts: 1,131
    People the middle east are rising up to take out the dictators who rule them
    I say stand behind people who want freedom
    gaddafi needs a 7.62 between the eyes or a rope around his neck
    any other dictator as well
    What about Saudi Arabia?

    any and all who stand up for themselves, for their country
    hopefully in the style of egypt with minimal loss of life but if they need our help lets give that
    AUSSIE AUSSIE AUSSIE
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