How can anyone justify this?

unsung

Welfare Tab for Children of Illegal Aliens costs $600M in L.A. County


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01 ... la-county/


Combined with public safety costs and health care costs, the official claimed the "total cost for illegal immigrants to county taxpayers" was more than $1.6 billion in 2010.

usamamasan1

I can't, makes me ill.

satansbed

unsung wrote:

Welfare Tab for Children of Illegal Aliens costs $600M in L.A. County


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01 ... la-county/


Combined with public safety costs and health care costs, the official claimed the "total cost for illegal immigrants to county taxpayers" was more than $1.6 billion in 2010.

cause they are still human beings

Cosmo

Anyone got any viable solutions?
And if you offer up the 'deport them all' solutions... you have to solve the problems that would be created filling those jobs with illegal, sub-standard pay that would arise. First off... where are you going to get the resources to identify, locate and deport them? How many people do you need to hire to deport them? What is that effort going to cost? Where is the money to pay for this going to come from? What Americans would be willing to fill those jobs... working long shifts, under minimum wage? And would those Americans be collecting the welfare and food stamps to get them to the poverty line? What would the savings be? What would the consequences be? How do you solve those problems?
...
Point being... any idiot can point out a problem. Solving it is much tougher.

unsung

Jail CEOs of companies that hire illegals. We have 10% unemployment, the jobs WILL fill.

Since there are no longer jobs for illegals most will self deport.

whygohome

unsung wrote:

Welfare Tab for Children of Illegal Aliens costs $600M in L.A. County


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01 ... la-county/


Combined with public safety costs and health care costs, the official claimed the "total cost for illegal immigrants to county taxpayers" was more than $1.6 billion in 2010.

Terrible. I believe in Welfare, unemployment, etc., but this simply is not right. The line has to be drawn somewhere.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

I disagree. Most of those jobs pay peanuts. Americans and Canadians don't get off the couch for peanuts when the government will supply them with free steak.

unsung wrote:

Jail CEOs of companies that hire illegals. We have 10% unemployment, the jobs WILL fill.

Since there are no longer jobs for illegals most will self deport.

Prince Of Dorkness

You realize that $600 million dollars is less than the bonuses given to the CEOs of all the banks that got bailed out AND still managed to partake in a lot of mortgage fraud right?

$600 million is a drop in the bucket, I'm afraid.

But you go on with your diverting us with your phony indignation. Let's see how you feel when you have to pay 3 times as much for produce and the gardens in Palm Springs all become dead weeds in 2 months.

satansbed

sorry but what is wrong with it

Antonovich's figures, though, center on costs generated by American-born children of illegal immigrants. Isabel Alegria, communications director at the California Immigrant Policy Center, said it's "unfair" to roll together costs associated with both illegal immigrants and U.S.-born citizens.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01 ... z1BZsGGLWa

Godfather.

Cosmo wrote:

Anyone got any viable solutions?
And if you offer up the 'deport them all' solutions... you have to solve the problems that would be created filling those jobs with illegal, sub-standard pay that would arise. First off... where are you going to get the resources to identify, locate and deport them? How many people do you need to hire to deport them? What is that effort going to cost? Where is the money to pay for this going to come from? What Americans would be willing to fill those jobs... working long shifts, under minimum wage? And would those Americans be collecting the welfare and food stamps to get them to the poverty line? What would the savings be? What would the consequences be? How do you solve those problems?
...
Point being... any idiot can point out a problem. Solving it is much tougher.

"Point being... any idiot can point out a problem. Solving it is much tougher."

Cosmo thats what this train forum is all about "bitching and whining w/no solutions" or in a nicer way of putting it "debating" right ?

Godfather.

know1

The vast majority of welfare doled out can't be justified in my mind. To me it doesn't make it worse if they happen to be illegal. The problem is much, much bigger than that. It's like complaining about one bag of trash in a landfill.

know1

Jasunmark wrote:

You realize that $600 million dollars is less than the bonuses given to the CEOs of all the banks that got bailed out AND still managed to partake in a lot of mortgage fraud right?

$600 million is a drop in the bucket, I'm afraid.

But you go on with your diverting us with your phony indignation. Let's see how you feel when you have to pay 3 times as much for produce and the gardens in Palm Springs all become dead weeds in 2 months.

Ahh - the appearance of the apples to aardvarks comparison.

blackredyellow

unsung wrote:

Jail CEOs of companies that hire illegals. We have 10% unemployment, the jobs WILL fill.

Since there are no longer jobs for illegals most will self deport.

Sounds easy in theory, but not so much in practice...

Illegal immigrants keep business costs down in a lot of industries, thus keeping the cost down to consumers. If we really go balls out in outlawing all hiring of illegals, we better be willing to support the higher costs of goods and services, and be ready for more outsourcing of jobs to parts of the world with much cheaper labor.

It's easy to point out these obvious problems, but one of the reasons that these problems (illegal immigration, "to big to fail" companies, etc) don't get solved, is that there is no good way to prevent the countless dominoes falling afterwards.

BinauralJam

unsung wrote:

Jail CEOs of companies that hire illegals. We have 10% unemployment, the jobs WILL fill.

Since there are no longer jobs for illegals most will self deport.

This!

whygohome

Jasunmark wrote:

You realize that $600 million dollars is less than the bonuses given to the CEOs of all the banks that got bailed out AND still managed to partake in a lot of mortgage fraud right?

$600 million is a drop in the bucket, I'm afraid.

But you go on with your diverting us with your phony indignation. Let's see how you feel when you have to pay 3 times as much for produce and the gardens in Palm Springs all become dead weeds in 2 months.

The CEOs belong in jail. They ruined peoples' lives; a jail sentence is justifiable.

As for your comment on produce, you are absolutely correct. Produce across the board - grocery stores, restaurants - would see a spike in prices.

JonnyPistachio

unsung wrote:

Jail CEOs of companies that hire illegals. We have 10% unemployment, the jobs WILL fill.

Since there are no longer jobs for illegals most will self deport.

Just personal experience here, but in south florida, there are a ton of Illegals who work for people and there isnt likely a line to a CEO anywhere. They dont work for corporations.

However, I have noticed since the decline in the economy, that many have 'self-deported', so I could see some leaving if their jobs were in jeopardy. But then again, I think they might just work harder at become legitimate citizens.

he still stands

JonnyPistachio wrote:

unsung wrote:

Jail CEOs of companies that hire illegals. We have 10% unemployment, the jobs WILL fill.

Since there are no longer jobs for illegals most will self deport.

Just personal experience here, but in south florida, there are a ton of Illegals who work for people and there isnt likely a line to a CEO anywhere. They dont work for corporations.

However, I have noticed since the decline in the economy, that many have 'self-deported', so I could see some leaving if their jobs were in jeopardy. But then again, I think they might just work harder at become legitimate citizens.

even small companies, farms, etc (where illegals are employed) are often set up as a corporation. My company has 200 employees and is a corporation - and therefore has a CEO. If it's an LLC, LLP, sole proprietorship, etc - you could then target the President of the company.

But, I'm not saying I agree with doing that.

Personally, I don't have a problem with feeding illegals if they will starve otherwise. I prefer to focus on the human being and not those imaginary boundaries we draw in the sand. It seems that we're not willing to take care of each other so I don't have a problem sending money to the government to feed those people.

whygohome

he still stands wrote:

JonnyPistachio wrote:

unsung wrote:

Jail CEOs of companies that hire illegals. We have 10% unemployment, the jobs WILL fill.

Since there are no longer jobs for illegals most will self deport.

Just personal experience here, but in south florida, there are a ton of Illegals who work for people and there isnt likely a line to a CEO anywhere. They dont work for corporations.

However, I have noticed since the decline in the economy, that many have 'self-deported', so I could see some leaving if their jobs were in jeopardy. But then again, I think they might just work harder at become legitimate citizens.

even small companies, farms, etc (where illegals are employed) are often set up as a corporation. My company has 200 employees and is a corporation - and therefore has a CEO. If it's an LLC, LLP, sole proprietorship, etc - you could then target the President of the company.

But, I'm not saying I agree with doing that.

Personally, I don't have a problem with feeding illegals if they will starve otherwise. I prefer to focus on the human being and not those imaginary boundaries we draw in the sand. It seems that we're not willing to take care of each other so I don't have a problem sending money to the government to feed those people.

As far as sending money to the gov't to feed those people, I agree to a point. I don't have a problem with helping and employing human beings who are simply trying to better their lives either. However, I work and I pay taxes. So should they. Also, they are plenty of American citizens who need these jobs, the problem is though, do they want these jobs?

In The Big One Moore is pleading with Phil Knight - Nike CEO - to open a plant in Flint, MI. As we all know, Nike, the Great American Company, manufactures its highly overrated crap in Asia, not the U.S. Phil Knight said he would love to have plants in the U.S., but he also stated that "Americans don't want these jobs." I get the feeling that he may be correct, but I'm not 100% sure how I feel about that statement.

know1

he still stands wrote:

I prefer to focus on the human being and not those imaginary boundaries we draw in the sand.

I very, very, very much agree with this.

samsonite

Paul David wrote:

I disagree. Most of those jobs pay peanuts. Americans and Canadians don't get off the couch for peanuts when the government will supply them with free steak.

free steak? i would guess you haven't had to support a family with government assistance/welfare.

and what would your solution be? cut out the "government steaks" so the poor would really learn to appreciate being paid peanuts?

like cosmo and blackredyellow said before me this is a very complex problem with no easy solution. the question i ask myself, and i think we should all ask ourselves, is how bad must it be for someone that living on our welfare system is considered the good life?!

whygohome

samsonite wrote:

Paul David wrote:

I disagree. Most of those jobs pay peanuts. Americans and Canadians don't get off the couch for peanuts when the government will supply them with free steak.

free steak? i would guess you haven't had to support a family with government assistance/welfare.

and what would your solution be? cut out the "government steaks" so the poor would really learn to appreciate being paid peanuts?

like cosmo and blackredyellow said before me this is a very complex problem with no easy solution. the question i ask myself, and i think we should all ask ourselves, is how bad must it be for someone that living on our welfare system is considered the good life?!

There was another thread discussing England's plans for those on welfare/unemployment. I don't know how to paste another thread into this one though.