OMG the Tea Party...

Cosmo

OnTheEdge wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

Now let me ask you... would you have let the major investment house crash... let General Motors and Chrysler fail? Why?

Let me ask you this. I am at the verge of financial ruin from carelessness in my past.....should I get a bailout from the government to keep my life from crashing?

...
You still failed to answer mty questions... that is the typical response of Sarah Palin, to avoid answering questions and skirt around it.
I WILL answer your question... If you fail... one person and his family fails and does NOT bring down our national economy or the global markets. Are you really comparing yourself to General Motors? Seriously?
...
Now... please, if you are able to... answer my question:
Would you have let the major investment house crash... let General Motors and Chrysler fail? Why?

mikepegg44

Where were they when bush was in office?
Pissed because the spending was out of control, but playing the game of American politics, which is lesser of two evils voting. I think the tea party is a great thing. You may not agree with what they say, you may not agree with the tenants they hold, but you cannot be pissed that people are getting involved.
The primaries had many long time reps lose their jobs because of the tea party.
What I am hoping is that this movement, whatever you want to call it, will start a trend of actually challenging the people in office to do what they say and hold them accountable when they screw up. And not falling back into the lesser of two evils voting that has caused the apathy in our country.

Say what you want about them, but at least people are getting involved because of them, both for their cause and against it.
I actually thought about writing this post today, if someone didn't know what the tea party movement was and just read this forum you would think they wear hoods to meetings, beat up poor single mothers, and only do what fox news tells them. It couldn't be further from the truth, but it is a political season and agendas need to be pushed.
It is sad that many people cannot move past their HATRED of bush and republican establishment to realize that finally a grass roots organization is having an impact on party politics. I would love for a democratic group to start up too.
I know this is the pipe dream I have, but I hope that these people are still pissed off when the republicans get in office and don't do anything different. I want to get back to a country that VALUES states rights over all else. To a country where people are free to walk down the god damn street and smoke a cigarette.
It makes me sad that people are arguing the validity of this group instead of focusing on the idea that FINALLY AMERICANS ARE GETTING INVOLVED.
fyi. 2009 1.4 trillion dollar budget deficit and now a 2010 1.25 trillion dollar deficit. That is outrageous and dangerous. Your dollar isn't worth anything and at this point it isn't solely the bush administrations fault.
What this time has shown me, and really changed me for that matter, is that Government is not the solution to problems. No matter what they have done the economy isn't turning around. WE CANNOT RELY ON THEM FOR ANYTHING. We as americans need to change our culture of spend more. Not just with Government but with our lives. Take responsibility and start saving. Put god dman money in the bank. cannot afford that tv from best buy, don't open a card. That is what I want my government to do, cannot afford something, don't do it.

Cosmo

mikepegg44 wrote:

Where were they when bush was in office?
Pissed because the spending was out of control, but playing the game of American politics, which is lesser of two evils voting. I think the tea party is a great thing. You may not agree with what they say, you may not agree with the tenants they hold, but you cannot be pissed that people are getting involved.
The primaries had many long time reps lose their jobs because of the tea party.
What I am hoping is that this movement, whatever you want to call it, will start a trend of actually challenging the people in office to do what they say and hold them accountable when they screw up. And not falling back into the lesser of two evils voting that has caused the apathy in our country.

Say what you want about them, but at least people are getting involved because of them, both for their cause and against it.
I actually thought about writing this post today, if someone didn't know what the tea party movement was and just read this forum you would think they wear hoods to meetings, beat up poor single mothers, and only do what fox news tells them. It couldn't be further from the truth, but it is a political season and agendas need to be pushed.
It is sad that many people cannot move past their HATRED of bush and republican establishment to realize that finally a grass roots organization is having an impact on party politics. I would love for a democratic group to start up too.
I know this is the pipe dream I have, but I hope that these people are still pissed off when the republicans get in office and don't do anything different. I want to get back to a country that VALUES states rights over all else. To a country where people are free to walk down the god damn street and smoke a cigarette.
It makes me sad that people are arguing the validity of this group instead of focusing on the idea that FINALLY AMERICANS ARE GETTING INVOLVED.
fyi. 2009 1.4 trillion dollar budget deficit and now a 2010 1.25 trillion dollar deficit. That is outrageous and dangerous. Your dollar isn't worth anything and at this point it isn't solely the bush administrations fault.
What this time has shown me, and really changed me for that matter, is that Government is not the solution to problems. No matter what they have done the economy isn't turning around. WE CANNOT RELY ON THEM FOR ANYTHING. We as americans need to change our culture of spend more. Not just with Government but with our lives. Take responsibility and start saving. Put god dman money in the bank. cannot afford that tv from best buy, don't open a card. That is what I want my government to do, cannot afford something, don't do it.

...
I would be onboard... I WAS onboard... when it was about the people using the legal system created by our Constitution to to invoke term limits on our leaders.
But... it is no longer a grass roots movement and has morphed into a wing of the Republican Party. Proof of that? Sarah Palin, Karl Rove, William Kristol, Glenn Beck, Ann Coulter, Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh. These may be your people, but I am not getting onboard with them.
Had they remained a grass roots operation and backed a truely Independent candidate, such as a Ron Paul or a Dennis Kucinich, then, I would be onboard. But, i'm not going to hoist and wave the elephant flag of the Republican Party... just as I would never swear an alligence to the Democratic Party.

Commy

mikepegg44 wrote:

I think the tea party is a great thing. You may not agree with what they say, you may not agree with the tenants they hold, but you cannot be pissed that people are getting involved.

i dont' fault the tea party for getting involved, more the opposite. dissent is a GOOD thing.


where they stand and what they stand for....i can respect a movement that stands up for what they believe in. but what gets me is when fox news is deciding that agenda they are fighting so hard to produce. fox has its own agenda, they support the status quo, they ARE the status quo. i can't pretend to support that kind of movement.

OnTheEdge

mikepegg44 wrote:

Where were they when bush was in office?
Pissed because the spending was out of control, but playing the game of American politics, which is lesser of two evils voting. I think the tea party is a great thing. You may not agree with what they say, you may not agree with the tenants they hold, but you cannot be pissed that people are getting involved.
The primaries had many long time reps lose their jobs because of the tea party.
What I am hoping is that this movement, whatever you want to call it, will start a trend of actually challenging the people in office to do what they say and hold them accountable when they screw up. And not falling back into the lesser of two evils voting that has caused the apathy in our country.

Say what you want about them, but at least people are getting involved because of them, both for their cause and against it.
I actually thought about writing this post today, if someone didn't know what the tea party movement was and just read this forum you would think they wear hoods to meetings, beat up poor single mothers, and only do what fox news tells them. It couldn't be further from the truth, but it is a political season and agendas need to be pushed.
It is sad that many people cannot move past their HATRED of bush and republican establishment to realize that finally a grass roots organization is having an impact on party politics. I would love for a democratic group to start up too.
I know this is the pipe dream I have, but I hope that these people are still pissed off when the republicans get in office and don't do anything different. I want to get back to a country that VALUES states rights over all else. To a country where people are free to walk down the god damn street and smoke a cigarette.
It makes me sad that people are arguing the validity of this group instead of focusing on the idea that FINALLY AMERICANS ARE GETTING INVOLVED.
fyi. 2009 1.4 trillion dollar budget deficit and now a 2010 1.25 trillion dollar deficit. That is outrageous and dangerous. Your dollar isn't worth anything and at this point it isn't solely the bush administrations fault.
What this time has shown me, and really changed me for that matter, is that Government is not the solution to problems. No matter what they have done the economy isn't turning around. WE CANNOT RELY ON THEM FOR ANYTHING. We as americans need to change our culture of spend more. Not just with Government but with our lives. Take responsibility and start saving. Put god dman money in the bank. cannot afford that tv from best buy, don't open a card. That is what I want my government to do, cannot afford something, don't do it.

I wish i could put my thoughts into words like you can. But for some reason I can't. Therefore....I love post like this one.

OnTheEdge

Cosmo wrote:

OnTheEdge wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

Now let me ask you... would you have let the major investment house crash... let General Motors and Chrysler fail? Why?

Let me ask you this. I am at the verge of financial ruin from carelessness in my past.....should I get a bailout from the government to keep my life from crashing?

...
You still failed to answer mty questions... that is the typical response of Sarah Palin, to avoid answering questions and skirt around it.
I WILL answer your question... If you fail... one person and his family fails and does NOT bring down our national economy or the global markets. Are you really comparing yourself to General Motors? Seriously?
...
Now... please, if you are able to... answer my question:
Would you have let the major investment house crash... let General Motors and Chrysler fail? Why?

I'll do my best to answer your question. No, I would not have bailed them out. They dug their grave so they can lie in it. Although, I do not believe they would have shut down and put people out of work. Who was the most profitable motors company during this stimulus fiascle? FORD! And they accepted no bailout. To put it in Eddie language......They agreed to a greed.


Kinda ironic how eddies writings backfire on his beliefs. I love you Eddie, but I don't love your ideaoligy

Cosmo

OnTheEdge wrote:

I'll do my best to answer your question. No, I would not have bailed them out. They dug their grave so they can lie in it. Although, I do not believe they would have shut down and put people out of work. Who was the most profitable motors company during this stimulus fiascle? FORD! And they accepted no bailout. To put it in Eddie language......They agreed to a greed.

...
Then... General Motors and Chrysler fails. What happens to those auto workers? Not just the union UAW assemblers... the office workers... secretarys, human resources employees, accountants, clerks... They all join the ranks of the unemployed. What happens to the G.M. and Chrysler dealers... mangers, mechanics, loan officers, clerical? They join them. What about the vendor companies... those companies that make parts, such as the seats, steering wheels, stereo components, rims, tires... AC Delco... what happens at those companies? Layoffs. Millions of Americans added to the unemployment lines. And what about those retired Americans recieving pensions from G.M. and Chrysler. No more pension checks and forced to live solely on Social Security checks. What happens to all of those Americans?
What about letting the Inventment houses fail... the ones whose holdings are pension and 401k plans for millions and millions of working Americans. Those houses go down and the 401ks vaporize... retirement funds... gone. Personally, my 401k took a hit of over $200,000.00 when the markets tanked.
How can that type of economic devistation... lost retirements, 20something% unemployment... helped our country? Difficult problems have extremely difficult solutions that require tough decisions that need to be thought out thoroughly. These problems did not suddenly pop up in 2009. The crash of the markets took place in 2007 and was the result of Free Markets allowed to run, unchecked... unregulated.
Yeah.. the bailouts were extremely painful... but, the alternative would have been crippling.
Also... G.M. has been paying back some of the bail out... so has some of the banking institutes. That money DID do some good and we are beginning to get it back. As for my 401k that is primary to my retirement... has recouped the $200,000.00 that was lost in 2007/2008. We did NOT 'Nationalize the Banking and Financial Community'.... we did NOT 'Nationalize the Auto Industry'. We bailed them out to avoid a catasthropy. Had we failed to do anything... today, we would be more like Mexico than Mexico.
...
Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck may tell you it's okay to let them fail... they are millionaire. The failure of the banks and auto industry would have reached out from their graves and dragged you down, too... unless you are a millionaire like Limbaugh.
Footnote... G.M. is one of the military's suppliers... not so much prime contractors, but they and/or their subsidiaries supply sub-assemblies and parts to companies such as Lockheed/Martin and Boeing as sub-contractors. The failure of G.M. would have been far reaching.

gimmesometruth27

why do poor and lower middle class people root for the rich to win?

honestly, how can these people that can not pay their bills want tax cuts extended to the richest 2% when the richest 2% are the ones that will not miss that money?? and they are not creating jobs, like so many conservatives argue that they do...

i am single and comfortably middle class, and my feelings are screw those billionaire bastards. why is their tax rate at about 15% when mine is nearly 30%??? because they make their money on dividends, where the tax rates are low, and i make my money by showing up to work and working whatever hours because i am on salary. why is my tax rate higher?? the conservatives will argue for a "fair tax", so how is it fair when the ultra rich are paying 15% when i am paying nearly 30%?? it would seem to me that the teabaggers would be trying to defend the middle and lower classes instead of selling them out by opposing what obama is trying to do taxwise...it is completely illogical how they would want tax cuts extended to the richest 2% when they are paying less percentagewise than we are....it just goes tp show that people are so partisan that they will vote against their own interests time and again....

haffajappa

OnTheEdge wrote:

haffajappa wrote:

I think a lot of people are still trying to figure out who it is that you guys need to "take your country back" from... :?

If you haven't figured it out by now.....it's from people like you.

Canadians? :shock:

aerial

Cosmo wrote:

aerial wrote:

That’s right you can’t win an argument when your wrong..

...
I hate to break the news to you... but, only stupid people think arguements are about winning or losing.
Arguements (debate, open discussion) is supposed to be a means of communicating ideas.
...
A word of advice... stick to sports.

Only stupid people think there is no wrong or right...

Godfather.

aerial wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

aerial wrote:

That’s right you can’t win an argument when your wrong..

...
I hate to break the news to you... but, only stupid people think arguements are about winning or losing.
Arguements (debate, open discussion) is supposed to be a means of communicating ideas.
...
A word of advice... stick to sports.

Only stupid people think there is no wrong or right...

I don't ever want to argue with either one of you, you guys are tuff.

Godfather.

Cosmo

aerial wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

aerial wrote:

That’s right you can’t win an argument when your wrong..

...
I hate to break the news to you... but, only stupid people think arguements are about winning or losing.
Arguements (debate, open discussion) is supposed to be a means of communicating ideas.
...
A word of advice... stick to sports.

Only stupid people think there is no wrong or right...

...
See... there you go again...
Do you know there is a difference between winning and losing... and right and wrong? You can win or lose a baseball game... a simple concept that even the simplest of minds can comprehend... but, when discussing complicated, multi-faceted issues that have several solutions that lead to more complicated consequences there is no right or... oh, forget it.

Godfather.

is it possible to out think your self cosmo ?

Godfather.

Cosmo

Godfather. wrote:

is it possible to out think your self cosmo ?

Godfather.

...
I'm certain it is.
Look... I don't claim to be some sort of expert on anything, but I do understand one thing... no one knows for sure what the truth is. With that very simple concept, I apply logic that fits that premise.
Especially when it comes to politics. Simply replacing Democrats with Republicans is not going to solve anything. We will STILL have a two party system where the opposition is demonized and nothing gets done. Doing nothing simply compounds the existing problems. Fixing the problems is extremely difficult because for every political solution, several other complex problems are created... I used the bailouts as an example of this. Letting those big institutions fail would have created disasterous consequences that would require even tougher decisions to come up with viable solutions.
The Tea Party claims to have simple solutions to complex political issues. That is not going to solve anything and perhaps, create even greater problems. I have been following politics for the better part of the last 30 years and have witnessed the results. I don't have any 'right' answers. But, I do believe that at the core of our problems is the belief that politics is about winning or losing. It is more about coming up with solutions to limit future problems and limit risk to our way of life. Politics is not a game... not a sport. But, it has become just that. Where there are only 2 teams in the political arena and people with limited knowledge of the complexities of governing have all of a sudden tossed their opinions into the mix, offering up simple solutions.
Anyway.. in political discussion... it is NOT about winning or losing. It is about thinking about the best path to take by discussion possible solutions, assessing the risk and working out the hundreds of scenarios to limit the long term effects of those solutions. People who think it is about winning or losing tend to be those with little understanding of what all is involved with governing a country of 300 million people.
That's all.

UpSideDown

Cosmo wrote:

Simply replacing Democrats with Republicans is not going to solve anything. We will STILL have a two party system where the opposition is demonized and nothing gets done.

This. The notion of Democrat and Republican is fucking ridiculous.

Gary Carter

haffajappa wrote:

I think a lot of people are still trying to figure out who it is that you guys need to "take your country back" from... :?

from the black lawyer

obivously



yes i went there

and if the tea party does want to be critical on both sides then how come on their website it's nothing but liberal and democrat bashing. explain that to me.

OnTheEdge

haffajappa wrote:

OnTheEdge wrote:

haffajappa wrote:

I think a lot of people are still trying to figure out who it is that you guys need to "take your country back" from... :?

If you haven't figured it out by now.....it's from people like you.

Canadians? :shock:

LMAO.....Sorry, didn't take notice to that small issue. :oops:
That shocked face cracks me up every time.

whygohome

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

aerial wrote:

I hope they get it soon….They (Obama sheep) have been so brain washed they make up things to hate about the Tea Party…such as the Tea Party is racist but just look at gimmesometruth’s post why put people in your little groups
“ polling badly among African Americans, Hispanic Americans, and Muslim Americans”.
The Tea Party has always said everyone is more than welcomed to participate…..we don’t say come African Americans oh and you Hispanics can come also….The Tea Party does not care about the colour of skin as they do….. Yet we are the racist. :roll:

the funny thing about them is how sadly misinformed some of them are....

and aerial, i welcome you to provide me with evidence that these voting blocks have not been key the last several election cycles. also can you show me a poll where these groups support the tea party or the gop? nobody is dividing anyone up into groups, that is just demographic information...can you disprove my post?

Misinformed is the appropriate word. But, can I add stupid and uneducated? This sign - the fact that someone constructed it - shows how uneducated and sheeplike people can be. I guarantee 100% that the jackass that made this sign has no clue about the people on it, and has no clue about the theories written on it.

We live in a society of misinformed, uneducated, intellectually lazy zombies. It is sad and pathetic. People look up Socialism on wikipedia and think they are political theorists.

Sad

P.S. I have been to 2 tea party "rallies" or meetings, and I have not seen one drop of intelligence. it is just a group of individuals spouting the rhetoric of hate and nonsense. They are pawns in the propaganda machine of the right. They did not say anything original, they had no clue about what the constitution states - though they referenced it many times - and I read it before I went. It was a circus.

whygohome

UpSideDown wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

Simply replacing Democrats with Republicans is not going to solve anything. We will STILL have a two party system where the opposition is demonized and nothing gets done.

This. The notion of Democrat and Republican is fucking ridiculous.

+1. Reminds me of recess. Everyone HAD to be a Mets or Yankees fan. There was no room for any other opinion. And yes, I think comparing our current system to a bunch of 9 year olds is accurate.

gimmesometruth27

as someone said before, calling obama a socialist is offensive to socialists...