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  • your move now
    your move now Posts: 1,165
    he's no steve waugh...
    I don't mean to offend anyone, a lot of what I say should be taken with a grain of salt... that said for most of you I'm a stranger on a computer on the other side of the world, don't give me that sort of power!
  • TroubledSoul
    TroubledSoul Posts: 1,374
    Hawk Jam wrote:
    I refuse to support Australian cricket since the shafting that Brad Hodge copped over the years, an official outrage.

    pity the bloke comes across as an absolute flog and peaked when the middle order of australian cricket was rock solid.

    the same argument can be made for blokes like stuart law, jamie siddons, darren lehmann, jamie cox... all blokes that were born in the wrong era.
    Yeh I've seen Pearl Jam, too. But I can't remember the dates.
  • TroubledSoul
    TroubledSoul Posts: 1,374
    your move now wrote:
    Certainly true that an injury can make it hard but for certain players eceptions seem to be made, come because they're just that good (steve waugh) and some because they are selectors pets (brett lee).

    Hodge had it rough no question but he certainly wasn't the first or the worst done by. Matthew Elliot is one who always sticks in my mind. And the other one for different reasons is Michael Slater who when he was dropped was a little out of form but hardly the only one or even the worst one (Ricky Ponting) in India 2001 and its since been made clear that he was dropped for personal reasons not because of his form. And the worst one I've seen is on that same ashes tour when Fleming and Colin Miller didn't get a test match on the tour and came back to find themselves to dropped from the Victorian squad... now that is unreasonable.

    lee took 310 test wickets @ 30. Ok it's not an average of 22 like mcgrath, but he's one of the fittest blokes you'd ever meet and came through several difficult injuries (hello recurring stress fractures in the lower back). oh and i think he took 310 test wickets.. dont know if i mentioned that.

    elliot never recovered after that horror mid pitch collision with mark waugh when he did his knee. thankfully he finished his career over here in the shield (not that we won anything... which is nothing new)...

    funky miller is an interesting one.. peaked when he was about 60 yo in the test side, copped an AB medal, changed his hair colour a few times and disappeared into retirement.
    Yeh I've seen Pearl Jam, too. But I can't remember the dates.
  • your move now
    your move now Posts: 1,165
    interesting you mentioned miller but not fleming.... flemo wasn't as old but the reason they both disappeared is because the victorian squad wasn't interested in experience at the time i hate to speak ill of the dead but their head of selections at the time.......
    but they were both good enough to make the Australian squad for the ashes but not considered good enough by him to play for victoria when they got back which is ridiculous regardless of their ages.
    Elliot never got another chance after that collision, Tugga got straight back in (ok he did a nose and not a leg but even still...)
    I'm not having a go at brett lee for a second, he was very talented, one of the hardest working men in cricket and an amazingly decent bloke. I'm only saying that considering the number of injuries he sustained and how serious and long term some of them were he got chances not afforded to others maybe my point is not that he shouldn't have but that others should have enjoyed the same advantages. Actually not sure where I stand on that would just like to have seen some consistancy
    I don't mean to offend anyone, a lot of what I say should be taken with a grain of salt... that said for most of you I'm a stranger on a computer on the other side of the world, don't give me that sort of power!
  • TroubledSoul
    TroubledSoul Posts: 1,374
    your move now wrote:
    interesting you mentioned miller but not fleming.... flemo wasn't as old but the reason they both disappeared is because the victorian squad wasn't interested in experience at the time i hate to speak ill of the dead but their head of selections at the time.......
    but they were both good enough to make the Australian squad for the ashes but not considered good enough by him to play for victoria when they got back which is ridiculous regardless of their ages.
    Elliot never got another chance after that collision, Tugga got straight back in (ok he did a nose and not a leg but even still...)
    I'm not having a go at brett lee for a second, he was very talented, one of the hardest working men in cricket and an amazingly decent bloke. I'm only saying that considering the number of injuries he sustained and how serious and long term some of them were he got chances not afforded to others maybe my point is not that he shouldn't have but that others should have enjoyed the same advantages. Actually not sure where I stand on that would just like to have seen some consistancy

    i shouldve mentioned flemmo cos i love him. and when victoria dumped him, he also came across here as an honorary redback. his returns were modest from memory, but his experience was valuable for the juniors in tait and rofe (wasted talent). i love his work on fox and the abc, and i hate that fats warne denied him his second test hat trick by dropping a bloody sitter here a few yrs ago.

    i think the thing with lee is that the selectors have had this notion that test batsmen are scared of express pace.. which theyre not. they would salivate at the prospect of him bowling at 150, (which with an avge of 30 suggests he leakd a few runs in his day...). i know what youre saying about some players looking as though they get unjust preferential selection, but which other quicks do you reckon have been short changed in the last 15 yrs? i reckon theres been more bats than quicks in this situation? we were so blessed with having mcgrath, kasper, gillespie, bichel i guess, and lee (when fit), for so long, that not many other blokes had the chance to get an opportunity.. brad williams.. dud.. mick lewis... dud.. bracken maybe is a type you are thinking of...s clark may be a candidate considering his selection later in his career... anyone else?
    Yeh I've seen Pearl Jam, too. But I can't remember the dates.
  • runchaser
    runchaser Posts: 112
    Ha only just saw this thread , I'm a complete Cricket tragic been playing since i was 15...38 now and still get exited that winter nets start this week :)
  • your move now
    your move now Posts: 1,165
    Maybe you're right that there have been more batsmen short changed than bowlers... one batsman that hasn't been mentioned is Stuiw Law, who had one test match debuting in the same game as Ponting, made 60 odd not out from memory and never got another go. Is interesting because ponting made 96 out so whilst he did better Law certainly batted pretty well on debut and enough to give you another go on paper, certainly if Ponting had failed.
    Bracken I would have liked to see more of, I think he offered a variety and especially being a left armer. I think Kasprowicz got more chances (even if they were spread apart) than I would have given him. And I also wish we had given Ian Harvey a chance at test level because whilst he wasn't at the top in either discipline it would have been interesting to see him given a shot and we were lacking an allrounder type at that point. He was also always supurb in the field. But generally speaking you're right more batsmen have been shortchanged than bowlers, or maybe it has just been more obvious to us as we are more aware of the large number of good batsmen out there?
    I don't mean to offend anyone, a lot of what I say should be taken with a grain of salt... that said for most of you I'm a stranger on a computer on the other side of the world, don't give me that sort of power!
  • pjfan31
    pjfan31 Posts: 7,335
    It's funny the guys mentioned like Harvey and Bracken became victims of being classified as one day players... Same as one Michael Bevan.

    Harvey and Bracken were great one day players, they had great variation, which is something not used often in a test. You don't see slower balls every over or slower bouncers stuff like that.

    What about some of these guys you mention, and then think of others who managed to wear the baggy green in recent years.... Bryce Mcgain, Beau Casson... :? :? :roll:

    And Stuart Law was good, no Ricky Ponting...
    Sydney 11/02/2003
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  • TroubledSoul
    TroubledSoul Posts: 1,374
    your move now wrote:
    Maybe you're right that there have been more batsmen short changed than bowlers... one batsman that hasn't been mentioned is Stuiw Law, who had one test match debuting in the same game as Ponting, made 60 odd not out from memory and never got another go. Is interesting because ponting made 96 out so whilst he did better Law certainly batted pretty well on debut and enough to give you another go on paper, certainly if Ponting had failed.
    Bracken I would have liked to see more of, I think he offered a variety and especially being a left armer. I think Kasprowicz got more chances (even if they were spread apart) than I would have given him. And I also wish we had given Ian Harvey a chance at test level because whilst he wasn't at the top in either discipline it would have been interesting to see him given a shot and we were lacking an allrounder type at that point. He was also always supurb in the field. But generally speaking you're right more batsmen have been shortchanged than bowlers, or maybe it has just been more obvious to us as we are more aware of the large number of good batsmen out there?

    i think youll find stuart law was the first bloke i mentioned! 8-)

    i cant remember when bracken injuries hit... but now that hes trying to sue CA, that might say a bit about his character that we didnt know! beautiful hair though.

    harvey is an interesting one, but he was in the same position as someone like dan christian is now... not a top 6 test bat, and a handy 5th bowler, but neither attribute could warrant test selection during the period of greatness. only if gilchrist batted 6, would he have been a chance. andrew mcdonald and steve smith however somehow got picked after selectiors brain fades in recent times whilst also offering the same B grade attributes.
    Yeh I've seen Pearl Jam, too. But I can't remember the dates.
  • runchaser
    runchaser Posts: 112
    Any other decade Stuart law would have played a hell of a lot more for Australia.

    A couple of weeks till England vs Pakistan .......it's bound to kick off again :!:
  • pjfan31
    pjfan31 Posts: 7,335
    runchaser wrote:
    Any other decade Stuart law would have played a hell of a lot more for Australia.

    A couple of weeks till England vs Pakistan .......it's bound to kick off again :!:


    Should drag Hair out of retirement to umpire that one...
    Sydney 11/02/2003
    Sydney 14/02/2003
    Sydney 07/11/2006
    Sydney 18/11/2006
    Sydney 22/11/2009
    EV Sydney 18/03/2011
    EV Sydney 19/03/2011
    EV Sydney 20/03/2011
    Melbourne 24/01/2014
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    EV Sydney 13/02/2014
  • TroubledSoul
    TroubledSoul Posts: 1,374
    pjfan31 wrote:
    runchaser wrote:
    Any other decade Stuart law would have played a hell of a lot more for Australia.

    A couple of weeks till England vs Pakistan .......it's bound to kick off again :!:


    Should drag Hair out of retirement to umpire that one...

    and amir out of gaol. just to make it interesting. that kid can certainly bowl.
    Yeh I've seen Pearl Jam, too. But I can't remember the dates.
  • runchaser
    runchaser Posts: 112
    TroubledSoul wrote:
    pjfan31 wrote:
    runchaser wrote:
    Any other decade Stuart law would have played a hell of a lot more for Australia.

    A couple of weeks till England vs Pakistan .......it's bound to kick off again :!:


    Should drag Hair out of retirement to umpire that one...

    and amir out of gaol. just to make it interesting. that kid can certainly bowl.

    He certainly could ....also couldn't keep his hands out of the till :!:

    Pattinson looks a good find for your boys , along with Steve Finn the best young quicks around :?:
  • pjfan31
    pjfan31 Posts: 7,335
    Ah Steve Finn, Neil's other less talented son...

    Yeah, we also got another young fella Cummins, he has only played the one test, took 6 wickets in one innings. So I am looking forward to seeing him again.. I think we're coming for you poms.

    I'm excited about heading to the test tomorrow... come on aussie...
    Sydney 11/02/2003
    Sydney 14/02/2003
    Sydney 07/11/2006
    Sydney 18/11/2006
    Sydney 22/11/2009
    EV Sydney 18/03/2011
    EV Sydney 19/03/2011
    EV Sydney 20/03/2011
    Melbourne 24/01/2014
    Sydney 26/01/2014
    EV Sydney 13/02/2014
  • runchaser
    runchaser Posts: 112
    pjfan31 wrote:
    Ah Steve Finn, Neil's other less talented son...

    Yeah, we also got another young fella Cummins, he has only played the one test, took 6 wickets in one innings. So I am looking forward to seeing him again.. I think we're coming for you poms.

    I'm excited about heading to the test tomorrow... come on aussie...

    Ha don't get carried away......your bowling's good but ours is better , and the batting's far better :D
    Agree it could be a cracking series in England next time.

    Wonder what excuses India will have when they get whopped again :!:
  • pjfan31
    pjfan31 Posts: 7,335
    haha... I can't stand India as a cricket team... a pack of whingers...


    I hope Lyon can bowl well... I certainly think he is our best option as a spinner, but India is a massive test for him...


    I am hoping to go next Ashes series, if all goes according to plan... I really think the Aussies can do it... I always look forward to Australia vs South Africa, I mean England...
    Sydney 11/02/2003
    Sydney 14/02/2003
    Sydney 07/11/2006
    Sydney 18/11/2006
    Sydney 22/11/2009
    EV Sydney 18/03/2011
    EV Sydney 19/03/2011
    EV Sydney 20/03/2011
    Melbourne 24/01/2014
    Sydney 26/01/2014
    EV Sydney 13/02/2014
  • runchaser
    runchaser Posts: 112
    pjfan31 wrote:
    haha... I can't stand India as a cricket team... a pack of whingers...


    I hope Lyon can bowl well... I certainly think he is our best option as a spinner, but India is a massive test for him...


    I am hoping to go next Ashes series, if all goes according to plan... I really think the Aussies can do it... I always look forward to Australia vs South Africa, I mean England...

    Ha some of them might walk in the wrong dressing room :)

    India never give anyone any credit and there fans on 'PRICINFO' are even worse, nice to see some helpful pitches makes for great cricket.
  • TroubledSoul
    TroubledSoul Posts: 1,374
    runchaser wrote:

    He certainly could ....also couldn't keep his hands out of the till :!:

    id like to know the implications if he DIDNT bowl the no balls... fucking black market, hitmen, millions of dollars involved, threats.. who knows... ask bob woolmer.. oh wait.. :(

    i cant stand the bloody whinging indian supporters. i wonder what excuses and one liners the rabid one eyed delusional indian "fans" will have this week other than the usual "australia are cheating" ... "racism" ... "we have the IPL"... crap that they usually dish out.
    Yeh I've seen Pearl Jam, too. But I can't remember the dates.
  • your move now
    your move now Posts: 1,165
    all crap about india and their supporters aside, you have to admitt their batsmen are great to watch especially when they get on a roll - provided you aren't the team trying to dismiss them
    I don't mean to offend anyone, a lot of what I say should be taken with a grain of salt... that said for most of you I'm a stranger on a computer on the other side of the world, don't give me that sort of power!
  • runchaser
    runchaser Posts: 112
    your move now wrote:
    all crap about india and their supporters aside, you have to admitt their batsmen are great to watch especially when they get on a roll - provided you aren't the team trying to dismiss them
    Yep they've been on a roll abroad just recently ..... back to the pavilion :lol:

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