I don't think it fair to just say lobbyist. there are lobbyist who are trying to create a better world. not all of them are big oil, big business lobbyist.
on the other hand i think we must agree that one reason lobbyist have alot of power is due to the cost of running for office. If a politician wants to become president they need hundreds of millions of $ and the only way they can get that is through is having donors and usually those donors will want something back.
Totally agree...lobbying needs to be banned. A limit on how much can be spent on a election campaign would help, as well as having a time limit on campaign's before the election.
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
Totally agree...lobbying needs to be banned. A limit on how much can be spent on a election campaign would help, as well as having a time limit on campaign's before the election.
again, i don't think lobbying should be banned. For example, i work for a non profit in Toronto and we do lobby the government around causes that they may not know about. the problem with some lobby is that the $ aspect. my non profit can't complete $ wise with lobbyist who have hundreds of millions to give to politicians.
until we fix the way the election system works we will always have lobbyist. in Canada for example, political parties get money from taxes. that is until our prime minster changes that to more of an American style.
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,426
Other factors to consider:
Staying with an unsustainable linear system of natural resource extraction to production to consumption to waste. Recycling is good but only helps a little to slow down an unsustainable process-- it is not the answer.
Our autobombile addiction. Hybrids help a little, electric cars might help some but again, our driving habits are a major part of an unsustainable linear system. More use of mass transit, living closer to work, increasing local economy and creating more walkable comunities would help greatly.
Refusal to acknowledge global warming is anthropogenic.
Refusal to acknowledge the reality of peak oil and the unlikelyhood of ever finding another source of energy as cheap and abundant as oil.
Continued environmental degradation.
The big uglies: Racism, hate, war, injustice.
Also, as others have pointed out, APATHY! I hope all of us who are unhappy with the state of things are doing something to make a positive difference.
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
You can say it's "pessimism" but it is actually reality and pragmatism based on facts, data and what we see around us. Simply because something is not pleasant or doesn't have a happy outlook, doesn't automatically mean the viewer/spectator is pessimistic.
So do you think things are getting worse? If so, how? (I didn't read through the whole thread)
because folks are soooo pessimistic....
much like the original post...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
You can say it's "pessimism" but it is actually reality and pragmatism based on facts, data and what we see around us. Simply because something is not pleasant or doesn't have a happy outlook, doesn't automatically mean the viewer/spectator is pessimistic.
and this is where republicans really suck balls ... when W stacked the supereme court with his cronies ... any semblance of democracy and gov't for the people went out the window ...
Both political parties are to blame for the debacle our nation faces and what we call a political system which is corrupt and fixed. Both have done detrimental things which have and continue to undermind our nation's well-being which will continue until it just collapses.
and this is where republicans really suck balls ... when W stacked the supereme court with his cronies ... any semblance of democracy and gov't for the people went out the window ...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
You can say it's "pessimism" but it is actually reality and pragmatism based on facts, data and what we see around us. Simply because something is not pleasant or doesn't have a happy outlook, doesn't automatically mean the viewer/spectator is pessimistic.
and this is where republicans really suck balls ... when W stacked the supereme court with his cronies ... any semblance of democracy and gov't for the people went out the window ...
If one can prove that the citizens united decision has allowed corporations to pose a clear and present danger to the public, which includes disenfranchising voters, I am sure you can get them to sway their decision.
The far bigger danger to our republic was seen ~ a couple hundred years ago by de Tocqueville and has gotten worse just about every year since we have existed...Congress has figured out that they can bribe Corporations and individuals a like with their own money...and that is getting worse...more programs, more spending, more lucrative contracts and subsidies to businesses, more (poor) regulation to stifle competition...all of it is just as, if not more so, damaging to our country as allowing corporations to participate as their own entity in the political discussion.
If you rely solely on your government to improve your surroundings you are right...nothing will improve...
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Mike - all this decision does is further enable and bolster the interluding of big business and government, which leaves the citizens on the outside looking in. Whether it's lobby or campaign finance, no matter what political leader or party has the most votes, the only true winner is private interests (big business). Elections come and go, but the system remains the same and each passing moment, the citizens get a little less over time in return except the bill to pay.
If one can prove that the citizens united decision has allowed corporations to pose a clear and present danger to the public, which includes disenfranchising voters, I am sure you can get them to sway their decision.
The far bigger danger to our republic was seen ~ a couple hundred years ago by de Tocqueville and has gotten worse just about every year since we have existed...Congress has figured out that they can bribe Corporations and individuals a like with their own money...and that is getting worse...more programs, more spending, more lucrative contracts and subsidies to businesses, more (poor) regulation to stifle competition...all of it is just as, if not more so, damaging to our country as allowing corporations to participate as their own entity in the political discussion.
If you rely solely on your government to improve your surroundings you are right...nothing will improve...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Mike - all this decision does is further enable and bolster the interluding of big business and government, which leaves the citizens on the outside looking in. Whether it's lobby or campaign finance, no matter what political leader or party has the most votes, the only true winner is private interests (big business). Elections come and go, but the system remains the same and each passing moment, the citizens get a little less over time in return except the bill to pay.
If one can prove that the citizens united decision has allowed corporations to pose a clear and present danger to the public, which includes disenfranchising voters, I am sure you can get them to sway their decision.
The far bigger danger to our republic was seen ~ a couple hundred years ago by de Tocqueville and has gotten worse just about every year since we have existed...Congress has figured out that they can bribe Corporations and individuals a like with their own money...and that is getting worse...more programs, more spending, more lucrative contracts and subsidies to businesses, more (poor) regulation to stifle competition...all of it is just as, if not more so, damaging to our country as allowing corporations to participate as their own entity in the political discussion.
If you rely solely on your government to improve your surroundings you are right...nothing will improve...
I agree it is a problem...but I believe it is a symptom of the larger problem rather than the source of the issues...does that make sense?
Whether it is under or on the table...if the incentive to donate is there (and it is because of the bribery from congress in return) it will always be given...There is a reason that the majority of the donations from corporations are given by a small percentage of businesses and those most closely linked to heavily regulated industries...
CU is a dangerous precedent, don't get me wrong...
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
You can say it's "pessimism" but it is actually reality and pragmatism based on facts, data and what we see around us. Simply because something is not pleasant or doesn't have a happy outlook, doesn't automatically mean the viewer/spectator is pessimistic.
Well - the reality is our system is "fixed" not so much "corrupt". We don't have the corruption that most nations face with these matters. We have created legal ways for government policy and leaders to be influenced or run by private business's and their interests. It underminds the fabric of our system and when you have a population which does not stay informed or participate, the environment becomes ripe for collaboration, greed and exploitation at the expense of the citizens for the benefit of big business and private power. That's what our system and government have become.
I agree it is a problem...but I believe it is a symptom of the larger problem rather than the source of the issues...does that make sense?
Whether it is under or on the table...if the incentive to donate is there (and it is because of the bribery from congress in return) it will always be given...There is a reason that the majority of the donations from corporations are given by a small percentage of businesses and those most closely linked to heavily regulated industries...
CU is a dangerous precedent, don't get me wrong...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
All very nice... but they don't influence the world around us like the other matters do. Simply because you focus on happy stuff, doesn't necessary mean we live a good, happy world.. that is solely what you focus on then of course that will be your view. I look at everything.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
almost every problem in the US can be tied to corporations ...
well, that's like your opinion, man...if you try to tie every problem to corporations you can
ya ... the dems suck balls too but the stacking of the supreme court of political ideologues goes far beyond the normal partisanship bs ...
They, being presidents, all do it...shit one tried to move it from to 9 to a max of 15 at one point (FDR)...what political ideology was Roberts following recently?
if you see the justices on the right as political ideologues you see the ones on the left the same way? The 9 are far more impartial than people give them credit for...
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
They, being presidents, all do it...shit one tried to move it from to 9 to a max of 15 at one point (FDR)...what political ideology was Roberts following recently?
if you see the justices on the right as political ideologues you see the ones on the left the same way? The 9 are far more impartial than people give them credit for...
what you have to understand is that when you say left in american terms ... i think centrist-right ... when i say right ... i think hard right ... there are no lefties of any influence in US gov't ... none whatsoever ... it's all relative to where you consider the centre of the spectrum lies ... i expect supreme court appointees to uphold the law in the interests of the people not the interests of corporations ... which lately has been winning all the decisions ...
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
They, being presidents, all do it...shit one tried to move it from to 9 to a max of 15 at one point (FDR)...what political ideology was Roberts following recently?
if you see the justices on the right as political ideologues you see the ones on the left the same way? The 9 are far more impartial than people give them credit for...
what you have to understand is that when you say left in american terms ... i think centrist-right ... when i say right ... i think hard right ... there are no lefties of any influence in US gov't ... none whatsoever ... it's all relative to where you consider the centre of the spectrum lies ... i expect supreme court appointees to uphold the law in the interests of the people not the interests of corporations ... which lately has been winning all the decisions ...
they upheld the law in citizens united as consistently as in the past. You just don't agree. Freedom of speech can be only limited when using the clear and present danger test. It was consistent in other SC decisions in the past, they have felt that limiting the political discussion based on where the ideas come from is more damaging than assuming negatives from CU. That was held over from Buckley(?) I believe...Don't think of it as "corporations are people" think of it as the ideas being expressed are important in the political discussion...as I said earlier, not that many corporations participate in politics, and even fewer do it with any sort of regularity...those in heavily regulated industries are more likely to donate and gain from it...a recent statistical analysis showed that political donations really only help improve stock performance if they are given to reps from the state where a corp is located, regardless of party affiliation. Look at what happened to target and the komen foundation...jesus target gives to far more liberal causes than conservative and they were boycotted...Komen foundation was accused of playing politics and their reputation is shit now...I think social media and the 24 hour news cycle will be a nice balance on most coporations decisions to participate in the political process...most will stick to what they do now...support charities.
and since the Supreme court of the US only has legal precedent over the US, I suppose it is useful to discuss the political spectrum in this country
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
All very nice... but they don't influence the world around us like the other matters do. Simply because you focus on happy stuff, doesn't necessary mean we live a good, happy world.. that is solely what you focus on then of course that will be your view. I look at everything.
You are misappropriately connecting two very different ideas. A person's personal happiness in comparison to a realistic outlook/status on the world around them. I can go on tour with PJ and see every show and have a blast.. that's me living and loving life.. that doesn't make the world a good place for everyone to live and survive in. That's the difference you seem to be leaving out.
who are you to say these items don't influence the world around us like other matters do...?
one can sit and wallow in misery or seek enjoyment in life...as Red says: "It comes down to a simple choice, get busy living or get busy dying."
your choice...
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
they upheld the law in citizens united as consistently as in the past. You just don't agree. Freedom of speech can be only limited when using the clear and present danger test. It was consistent in other SC decisions in the past, they have felt that limiting the political discussion based on where the ideas come from is more damaging than assuming negatives from CU. That was held over from Buckley(?) I believe...Don't think of it as "corporations are people" think of it as the ideas being expressed are important in the political discussion...as I said earlier, not that many corporations participate in politics, and even fewer do it with any sort of regularity...those in heavily regulated industries are more likely to donate and gain from it...a recent statistical analysis showed that political donations really only help improve stock performance if they are given to reps from the state where a corp is located, regardless of party affiliation. Look at what happened to target and the komen foundation...jesus target gives to far more liberal causes than conservative and they were boycotted...Komen foundation was accused of playing politics and their reputation is shit now...I think social media and the 24 hour news cycle will be a nice balance on most coporations decisions to participate in the political process...most will stick to what they do now...support charities.
and since the Supreme court of the US only has legal precedent over the US, I suppose it is useful to discuss the political spectrum in this country
they basically said it was ok for corporations to influence elections and buy direct access to gov't officials ... does ron paul believe campaign financing should be rolled back?
You are misappropriately connecting two very different ideas. A person's personal happiness in comparison to a realistic outlook/status on the world around them. I can go on tour with PJ and see every show and have a blast.. that's me living and loving life.. that doesn't make the world a good place for everyone to live and survive in. That's the difference you seem to be leaving out.
they basically said it was ok for corporations to influence elections and buy direct access to gov't officials ... does ron paul believe campaign financing should be rolled back?
I understand what you say they said, but do you not feel that limiting the political idea because of where it comes from is an infringement on the 1st regardless of what you think they said? They said it was ok for corporations to participate on a larger scale (they already did you know) because placing limits on the speech associated with whatever donation was given was unconstitutional as it wasn't shown to or didn't pose a clear and present danger like yelling fire in a crowded theater...
Ron Paul says this among other things... Campaign finance laws will not make politicians more ethical, but they will make it harder for average Americans to influence Washington.
and ...If the Senator and so many others in Congress believe so strongly in campaign finance reform, why is money in politics such a big problem? In other words, why don't these politicians simply put their money where their mouth is, act with integrity, and do a better job of policing their own campaigns?
I agree with him that a big problem exists. Special interest money has a huge influence in Washington, and it has a tremendous effect on both foreign and domestic policy. Yet we ought to be asking ourselves why corporations and interest groups are willing to give politicians millions of dollars in the first place. Obviously their motives are not altruistic. Simply put, they do it because the stakes are so high. They know government controls virtually every aspect of our economy and our lives, and that they must influence government to protect their interests. Our federal government, which was intended to operate as a very limited constitutional republic, has instead become a virtually socialist leviathan that redistributes trillions of dollars. We can hardly be surprised when countless special interests fight for the money. The only true solution to the campaign money problem is a return to a proper constitutional government that does not control the economy. Big government and big campaign money go hand-in-hand.
I hadn't even really looked into campaign finance reform policy from Paul before, but I could have told you this was what he was going to say...I love that guy
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Comments
I don't think it fair to just say lobbyist. there are lobbyist who are trying to create a better world. not all of them are big oil, big business lobbyist.
on the other hand i think we must agree that one reason lobbyist have alot of power is due to the cost of running for office. If a politician wants to become president they need hundreds of millions of $ and the only way they can get that is through is having donors and usually those donors will want something back.
Totally agree...lobbying needs to be banned. A limit on how much can be spent on a election campaign would help, as well as having a time limit on campaign's before the election.
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
Oh, and tighter controls on "big business" which is Dem-speak for Capitalism.
So... I agree. More Gov't WILL make things worse.
again, i don't think lobbying should be banned. For example, i work for a non profit in Toronto and we do lobby the government around causes that they may not know about. the problem with some lobby is that the $ aspect. my non profit can't complete $ wise with lobbyist who have hundreds of millions to give to politicians.
until we fix the way the election system works we will always have lobbyist. in Canada for example, political parties get money from taxes. that is until our prime minster changes that to more of an American style.
Staying with an unsustainable linear system of natural resource extraction to production to consumption to waste. Recycling is good but only helps a little to slow down an unsustainable process-- it is not the answer.
Our autobombile addiction. Hybrids help a little, electric cars might help some but again, our driving habits are a major part of an unsustainable linear system. More use of mass transit, living closer to work, increasing local economy and creating more walkable comunities would help greatly.
Refusal to acknowledge global warming is anthropogenic.
Refusal to acknowledge the reality of peak oil and the unlikelyhood of ever finding another source of energy as cheap and abundant as oil.
Continued environmental degradation.
The big uglies: Racism, hate, war, injustice.
Also, as others have pointed out, APATHY! I hope all of us who are unhappy with the state of things are doing something to make a positive difference.
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
So do you think things are getting worse? If so, how? (I didn't read through the whole thread)
because folks are soooo pessimistic....
much like the original post...
it's clearly getting worse ...
Godfather.
And yes I think things have gotten worse...most notably this:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/21/the-supreme-courts-citize_n_432127.html
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
and this is where republicans really suck balls ... when W stacked the supereme court with his cronies ... any semblance of democracy and gov't for the people went out the window ...
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
If one can prove that the citizens united decision has allowed corporations to pose a clear and present danger to the public, which includes disenfranchising voters, I am sure you can get them to sway their decision.
The far bigger danger to our republic was seen ~ a couple hundred years ago by de Tocqueville and has gotten worse just about every year since we have existed...Congress has figured out that they can bribe Corporations and individuals a like with their own money...and that is getting worse...more programs, more spending, more lucrative contracts and subsidies to businesses, more (poor) regulation to stifle competition...all of it is just as, if not more so, damaging to our country as allowing corporations to participate as their own entity in the political discussion.
If you rely solely on your government to improve your surroundings you are right...nothing will improve...
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I agree it is a problem...but I believe it is a symptom of the larger problem rather than the source of the issues...does that make sense?
Whether it is under or on the table...if the incentive to donate is there (and it is because of the bribery from congress in return) it will always be given...There is a reason that the majority of the donations from corporations are given by a small percentage of businesses and those most closely linked to heavily regulated industries...
CU is a dangerous precedent, don't get me wrong...
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
if one simply focuses on the negative, that's is all one will see...
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 100246.htm
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 102405.htm
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/1 ... =good-news
http://www.happynews.com/index.aspx
keep on the sunny side...
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
and ya ... the dems suck balls too but the stacking of the supreme court of political ideologues goes far beyond the normal partisanship bs ...
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
well, that's like your opinion, man...if you try to tie every problem to corporations you can
They, being presidents, all do it...shit one tried to move it from to 9 to a max of 15 at one point (FDR)...what political ideology was Roberts following recently?
if you see the justices on the right as political ideologues you see the ones on the left the same way? The 9 are far more impartial than people give them credit for...
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
that must mean it's true then! ...
what you have to understand is that when you say left in american terms ... i think centrist-right ... when i say right ... i think hard right ... there are no lefties of any influence in US gov't ... none whatsoever ... it's all relative to where you consider the centre of the spectrum lies ... i expect supreme court appointees to uphold the law in the interests of the people not the interests of corporations ... which lately has been winning all the decisions ...
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
they upheld the law in citizens united as consistently as in the past. You just don't agree. Freedom of speech can be only limited when using the clear and present danger test. It was consistent in other SC decisions in the past, they have felt that limiting the political discussion based on where the ideas come from is more damaging than assuming negatives from CU. That was held over from Buckley(?) I believe...Don't think of it as "corporations are people" think of it as the ideas being expressed are important in the political discussion...as I said earlier, not that many corporations participate in politics, and even fewer do it with any sort of regularity...those in heavily regulated industries are more likely to donate and gain from it...a recent statistical analysis showed that political donations really only help improve stock performance if they are given to reps from the state where a corp is located, regardless of party affiliation. Look at what happened to target and the komen foundation...jesus target gives to far more liberal causes than conservative and they were boycotted...Komen foundation was accused of playing politics and their reputation is shit now...I think social media and the 24 hour news cycle will be a nice balance on most coporations decisions to participate in the political process...most will stick to what they do now...support charities.
and since the Supreme court of the US only has legal precedent over the US, I suppose it is useful to discuss the political spectrum in this country
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
one can sit and wallow in misery or seek enjoyment in life...as Red says: "It comes down to a simple choice, get busy living or get busy dying."
your choice...
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
they basically said it was ok for corporations to influence elections and buy direct access to gov't officials ... does ron paul believe campaign financing should be rolled back?
I see you've made your choice...
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/70bf1f ... f-outtakes
I understand what you say they said, but do you not feel that limiting the political idea because of where it comes from is an infringement on the 1st regardless of what you think they said? They said it was ok for corporations to participate on a larger scale (they already did you know) because placing limits on the speech associated with whatever donation was given was unconstitutional as it wasn't shown to or didn't pose a clear and present danger like yelling fire in a crowded theater...
Ron Paul says this among other things...
Campaign finance laws will not make politicians more ethical, but they will make it harder for average Americans to influence Washington.
and
...If the Senator and so many others in Congress believe so strongly in campaign finance reform, why is money in politics such a big problem? In other words, why don't these politicians simply put their money where their mouth is, act with integrity, and do a better job of policing their own campaigns?
I agree with him that a big problem exists. Special interest money has a huge influence in Washington, and it has a tremendous effect on both foreign and domestic policy. Yet we ought to be asking ourselves why corporations and interest groups are willing to give politicians millions of dollars in the first place. Obviously their motives are not altruistic. Simply put, they do it because the stakes are so high. They know government controls virtually every aspect of our economy and our lives, and that they must influence government to protect their interests. Our federal government, which was intended to operate as a very limited constitutional republic, has instead become a virtually socialist leviathan that redistributes trillions of dollars. We can hardly be surprised when countless special interests fight for the money. The only true solution to the campaign money problem is a return to a proper constitutional government that does not control the economy. Big government and big campaign money go hand-in-hand.
I hadn't even really looked into campaign finance reform policy from Paul before, but I could have told you this was what he was going to say...I love that guy
http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig/paul13.html full article...
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan