THIS SITE LEANS TO THE LEFT

Jason P

I thought this thread was headed for a disaster but I've seen some pretty good (and civil) responses so far.

By the way, I can't wait for when you and Byrnzie hook up

_

mikepegg44 wrote:

People like Scb and a few others are actually really fun to have conversations with simply because they are strong in their beliefs but sincerely read posts and try to have a civil conversation with you while being respectful.

Aww... thanks Mike. I don't know who this "new" guy is and haven't yet read whatever's been happening here today, but he seems to be uniting us all!

Your Mom Made Me Pancakes

Mr Smith:

1- I am personally pro-life, but if that was the only thing I disagreed on w/ a particular candidate, I could still vote for them. It's not a deal breaker for me, but I tend to be pro-life. NOTE: I believe it should be a STATE issue, not a FEDERAl one. Let each state decide.

2- I believe marriage should be between a man and a woman. But again, it's not the gov'ts place to tell us how to live or act in our bedrooms. NOTE: This should also be a STATE issue.

3- The Patriot Act, I believe, is necessary and vital to Nat'l Security- and so did the Democrats- that's why they extended it. It really only allows for eaves dropping on calls/emails into or out of the US- and the law got a bad rap. Most of you will probably disagree w/ me on this, but its just our opinions.

he still stands

I've never understood how conservatives can claim to be for "small government" but then support things like the Patriot Act, the recent immigration fiasco in AZ, the war on drugs, etc. (not talking about a specific person here)

Similarly, most liberals are in fear of Big Brother because they worship Orwell's 1984 (yes this is a [gasp] generalization) but they are okay with it as long as it is the government THEY VOTED for...

Meh I'm goin to the bar now....

Your Mom Made Me Pancakes

The bar sounds good. The HASH bar that is!!

Not all conservatives support the war on drugs (in its current form).

Marijuana legalization should also be a STATE issue.


Lets save immigration for another day.

Later skaters.

arq

Your Mom Is Sleeping Over wrote:

What do you believe in?

Well I'm an immigrant so what i believe is not important plus i can't vote, plus the USA system is really complicated and/or convoluted :?

but can you explain to me how is the relationship between a smaller govt and a strong military and national defense? it looks like those two are opposites, a small government could have a big military machinery? I see an unbalance on that.

And about lower taxes, it should be a balance to, people should have a say on where their taxes go, i don't mind pay higher taxes I (the taxpayer) can decide where the money goes.

And of course the government shouldn't have any right to interfere with the people life (drugs, abortion, suicide, etc).

Jason P

I've never understood the hoopla over the Patriot Act myself. Even if I was involved in minor shenanigans, I would have to have a massive ego to think the US Government was actively spending its resources to track and monitor me . . . that is unless I decide to stop paying taxes 8-)

jethrojam420

Your Mom Is Sleeping Over wrote:

Black, Red, yellow:

good question. I believe it is a State issue, and the FEDERAL gov't shouldn't be telling me what to do in MY bedroom, with MY body.

If someone doesn't like Same-Sex Marriage, then they can move to a state that has outlawed it. If you are for it, then there are states where like-minded Americans have chosen to live and govern themselves in that way- and you are free to live there uninhibited.

Marijuana, Abortion, Same Sex Marriage, etc... These are all state issues to me. Let the people vote, and live the way they want to.

Stay out big Govt!!!

A conservative wouldnt say that. At least one alive past 1800. You either believe in something, or you don't. The State is STILL government. STILL BIG GOVERNMENT!!!!

In my state we never voted on abortion or same sex marriage, yet both remain legal. I am sure due to the recent senate election there are conservatives in MA, although if you had asked me a year ago, i would've suggested otherwise. In fact, some polls in MA have SSM losing 55 to 45%.

That being said, I, much like many Americans, am not going to move to a State based on a specific law (although a combination of laws is a bit more feasible, see also Texas, Utah, and yes, Massachusetts) My point is that there are still state laws and interference and whatnot that are based on either liberal and conservative viewpoints. Conservatism is not a belief in state sovereignty, rather smaller government as a whole, at all points - federal, state, and local.

Released1980

blackredyellow wrote:

no shit... the site of a politically-outspoken, left leaning rockband leans to the left? You get a gold star for that observation.

No one really cares to debate you because:
a) you ignore any legitimate points made
b) everything you post is baiting crap
c) you act like a condescending little prick who really doesn't want debate, but instead wants to repeat the same insults over and over.

People like you (possibly even the same person) come through here and stir the pot for a few weeks than either get banned or get tired and move on...

There are some very intelligent right-leaning people on here, and a lot of us do lean right on some subjects. There are some people on here who post the same thing everyday and I get tired of some subjects so I stop reading them... but there are even some good points/debates made in even those tired threads.

Eddie... is that you???
Maybe reading some old threads instead of sticking your fingers in your ears saying "la, la, la, la, anti-american, la la la, anti- semitic, la, la, la, lib-tard, la, la, la,", you might figure this out. But you are just that much smarter than us young, uneducated people here, so I guess you don't have to.

GTFLYGIRL

Your Mom Is Sleeping Over wrote:

1- I am personally pro-life, NOTE: I believe it should be a STATE issue, not a FEDERAl one. Let each state decide.

(Not really so...) Funny. I have always thought of it as a personal issue. If you don't believe in abortion... don't have one.

Your Mom Made Me Pancakes

ARQ- hey I gotta go, but would like to talk more tomorrow, because I would like to know your experience from the immigrant side of things. How hard is it to become a citizen in the current system?

real quick- The great strengths of our country are it's natural resources and labor, that is, it's people. The wealth produced and earned in this country is more than many other countries combined- and yet we are in dreadful debt. Because the size of the gov't- not the military- is SO big. (We do have the largest military also, but that's not where all the money goes, despite the two wars and what some people say). The gov't should cut costs in a recession just like all of us have to.

The idea of being able to tell the gov't how to spend my tax dollars is Utopian- meaning I wish I could do that!!

The only way we can do that now is vote them out if we don't like it, and vote them in if we do.

Until tomorrow friends.....

Your Mom Made Me Pancakes

jethrojam:

I couldn't agree more.

But Im operating in a liberal environment here, and honestly, I'd settle for scaling back to state level from where we are, and call it a victory.

But are you for NO law? Anywhere? After all, nothing can be both legal, and illegal. It has to be something, at some level- I'll take the state, unless you want abortion, pot, education, etc, to all be decided at the neighborhood level.... that's a lot of voting.

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

Your Mom Is Sleeping Over wrote:

Mr Smith:

3- The Patriot Act, I believe, is necessary and vital to Nat'l Security- and so did the Democrats- that's why they extended it. It really only allows for eaves dropping on calls/emails into or out of the US- and the law got a bad rap. Most of you will probably disagree w/ me on this, but its just our opinions.

of course the democrats voted to extend it. its big brother bullshit. its their wet dream. Republicans too. National security is their excuse to do whatever they want.

you cant claim to be for smaller federal government and the constitution and then be ok with the way it (and the arizona law) completely ignores basic civil rights and our protections against warrantless search and seizure as provided for by the constitution.

this is the problem with the whole left/right conservative/liberal bullshit. its nothing more than a collection of arbitrary beliefs designed to keep the two party system going. both sides pick and choose which parts of the constitution they want to keep and which rights they decide to grant us.

the true spectrum isnt based on liberalism/conservatism but on a combination of anarchism<->totalitarianism (authority scale) and libertarianism<->collectivism (economy scale).

most people are too lazy to really decide what their beliefs are and accept whatever they are told to think, even if some of their stances on the issues are completely contradictory to each other.

get rid of these stupid labels!

cajunkiwi

Your Mom Is Sleeping Over wrote:

Black, Red, yellow:

good question. I believe it is a State issue, and the FEDERAL gov't shouldn't be telling me what to do in MY bedroom, with MY body.

If someone doesn't like Same-Sex Marriage, then they can move to a state that has outlawed it. If you are for it, then there are states where like-minded Americans have chosen to live and govern themselves in that way- and you are free to live there uninhibited.

Marijuana, Abortion, Same Sex Marriage, etc... These are all state issues to me. Let the people vote, and live the way they want to.

Stay out big Govt!!!

I know I am definitely in the minority here in America on this subject, but the entire concept of state's rights seems... well... wrong to me. At the end of the day, a person from Arizona is just as much of an American as a person from Alaska - it seems odd that one group of Americans should demand the right to live by different laws based solely on arbitrary geographical boundaries. On top of that, I am DEFINITELY against state's rights when it is used as an excuse to defend prejudice. A particular state shouldn't be given the legal right to discriminate against minorities (whether they're of the sexual or racial nature) simply because that particular state wants to live in the 1800s. Sometimes the federal government needs to step in and kick some ass if it's in the name of promoting equality and common sense. A person shouldn't have to move away from their home and live in a different state just to get equal rights - nobody gets a say in what color skin they have or what type of person they're attracted to, so why should a state be given the right to discriminate against them because they find certain minorities "icky?"

CantKeepMeHere

With a username like YOUR MOM IS SLEEPING OVER I find the fact you call yourself a conservative hard to digest

Backstop-440

Usually the conservative people in the USA says, Small Government, Low Taxes/debt, no Govt in Personal Life. The problem most people have with all that lately is they say one thing and do another.

Small Government: So like how is it not BIG Government that you want states to decide. California is a pretty dang big government, bigger than the entire UK and has more people than Canada. Shouldn't everything actually come down to local ordinances at the city level? The folks who live in Austin would probably vote for a different set of laws than the larger Texas population, no? Maybe even home rule for neighborhoods, since (for example) what's good for Cleveland's University Circle neighborhood is not so good for Hough or Collinwood.

Low Taxes: The people that lead the Conservative party (since 1973-ish) do much worse at lowering the national debt than the Democrats. They increase spending and then lower taxes, running up debt which as you said puts the burden on your grandchildren. Republicans deride Democrats as "tax-and-spend" while in reality the Republicans practice "print and spend"!

Personal Life: The Left is actually the side that wants to let people do as they wish. Take your pick of issues that people can rightfully disagree on, the Right want everyone to conform to their version. The left would allow it and people that don't want to do it don't have to. That's what bugs me, the Right acts like we're going to be forced to have gay weddings and do drugs and drive Smartcars, when actually the Left wants to let people do their own thing. The major issue they're opposite on is firearm possession, which admittedly makes me scratch my head, but they have been laying off that for a while.

Now, you can go ahead and say that the Republicans are not truly Conservative and don't represent Conservative views. But in this country, you are either Democratic, Republican, or Not Represented. You can claim all you want to be separate from the Republican party but do the "other side" a favor and recognize that there's a spectrum within that party as well.

When the Republicans are spending money like it's water, forcing their specific values down other people's throats, and expanding the role of the Feds, it's pretty easy to see why thinking people react negatively. And the Internet has a pretty large faction of people who like to learn and discuss things rather than just nod and go with what was right for their parents.

BinauralJam

i lean to the left, but i hate big goverment, so i'm screwed. i'm also pro-choice and anti-abortion, i believe it's wrong but that not having a choice is worse. so ya i'm screwed. maybe i'll move to New Zealand.

flywallyfly

Your Mom Is Sleeping Over wrote:

ARC: it's a good question!

These are some conservative fundamentals:

- smaller govt.
- lower taxes
- capitalism and private/small businesses are the backbone- stop hurting them w/ higher taxes
- stong military and national defense
- less gov't interference in my personal life
- the Constitution

Basically, I want the gov't to just LEAVE ME ALONE and quit spending our money (ie: our children's future) as fast as they can. They need to live on a budget like the rest of us.

Everyday they are more involved in my life than the last.

Government exists to serve the people, but these days, its like the Gov't thinks we exist to serve them.

What do you believe in?

Which conservative government actually enacted all of these pillars ?

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

Backstop-440 wrote:

But in this country, you are either Democratic, Republican, or Not Represented. You .

i think we are just Not Represented.

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

KO282453 wrote:

i lean to the left, but i hate big goverment, so i'm screwed. i'm also pro-choice and anti-abortion, i believe it's wrong but that not having a choice is worse. so ya i'm screwed. maybe i'll move to New Zealand.

that post makes the most sense in this thread, actually.