I just got home from a "Ghost Tour"

ZiggyStarZiggyStar Posts: 14,328
edited June 2010 in All Encompassing Trip
It was really good. Went for 3 hours...heard "a lot" of stories but saw nothing at all...except from a few "orbs" in our photos which were probably just dust.

I love everything ghostly/supernatural etc...but have never had any experiences. I'd love to experience something...but people I know who have apparently experienced things say that if I'd experienced something, I'd never wish that every again...which makes me even more intrigued! haha

Do you have any cool stories to tell? Ever been on a ghost tour or to a haunted place?
★ 1995 - Brisbane ★ 1998 - Brisbane ★ 2003 - Brisbane ★ 2006 - Brisbane ★
★ 2009 - Sydney, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch ★
★ 2011 - EV Newcastle, Melbourne 1, Melbourne 2 ★
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • neilybabes86neilybabes86 Posts: 16,057
    no but i saw a UFO 15 years ago


    it had nothing to do with the mesculine i was on
    i post on the board of a band that doesn't exsist anymore .......i need my head examined.......
  • ZiggyStarZiggyStar Posts: 14,328
    no but i saw a UFO 15 years ago


    it had nothing to do with the mesculine i was on

    tsk tsk tsk.... ;)
    ★ 1995 - Brisbane ★ 1998 - Brisbane ★ 2003 - Brisbane ★ 2006 - Brisbane ★
    ★ 2009 - Sydney, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch ★
    ★ 2011 - EV Newcastle, Melbourne 1, Melbourne 2 ★
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    i'm all over the place.
    i couldn't even begin to tell you what i've been through.

    :twisted:
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • 8181 Posts: 58,276
    we did one in Charleston, SC. I only went because the gf wanted to. i was mostly bored during it. the cool part was seeing a few parts of town that we wouldn't have gone down without the tour. it did inspire us to go back the next morning and check out some of the old cemetary's. there was one that looked to be right out of a horror movie. completly over grown except for the path's. i'll try and dig up a good picture and post it tonight.
    81 is now off the air

    Off_Air.jpg
  • ZiggyStarZiggyStar Posts: 14,328
    81 wrote:
    we did one in Charleston, SC. I only went because the gf wanted to. i was mostly bored during it. the cool part was seeing a few parts of town that we wouldn't have gone down without the tour. it did inspire us to go back the next morning and check out some of the old cemetary's. there was one that looked to be right out of a horror movie. completly over grown except for the path's. i'll try and dig up a good picture and post it tonight.

    Yes! Please do! :thumbup:
    ★ 1995 - Brisbane ★ 1998 - Brisbane ★ 2003 - Brisbane ★ 2006 - Brisbane ★
    ★ 2009 - Sydney, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch ★
    ★ 2011 - EV Newcastle, Melbourne 1, Melbourne 2 ★
  • ZiggyStarZiggyStar Posts: 14,328
    chadwick wrote:
    i'm all over the place.
    i couldn't even begin to tell you what i've been through.

    :twisted:

    Ohhh please tell me....I love all this kinda stuff!!!!!
    ★ 1995 - Brisbane ★ 1998 - Brisbane ★ 2003 - Brisbane ★ 2006 - Brisbane ★
    ★ 2009 - Sydney, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch ★
    ★ 2011 - EV Newcastle, Melbourne 1, Melbourne 2 ★
  • JoJo Posts: 2,098
    Please tell me this creepy shit happends to most people.... :?
    I too don't know where to start......

    Creepy stuff is awesome 8-)
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    ZiggyStar wrote:
    chadwick wrote:
    i'm all over the place.
    i couldn't even begin to tell you what i've been through.

    :twisted:

    Ohhh please tell me....I love all this kinda stuff!!!!!
    saw my gradmother when i was about 8 or 9 years old.
    she'd only been dead about 6-9 months so i'm pretty sure she wasn't alive.

    dad's second wife's house was way haunted... many of us heard voices/conversations...
    one night some upset spirit tried to smash my living room wall down.

    the list goes on...
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • rival.rival. Posts: 7,775
    ZiggyStar wrote:
    I'd love to experience something...but people I know who have apparently experienced things say that if I'd experienced something, I'd never wish that every again...which makes me even more intrigued! haha

    yeah, i have to agree with those people. as much as i want to experience something, i know it would fuck with me for a time to come. would it really be worth it?
  • rival.rival. Posts: 7,775
    chadwick wrote:
    one night some upset spirit tried to smash my living room wall down.

    :shock:

    details!
  • StillHereStillHere Posts: 7,795
    Most all the women in our family have some sort of "gift"...not all the same, and not all willingly so.
    Saying that, if you heed the theory that spirits are attracted to those who can sense them the most, you might understand why we seem to have had so many experiences, lived in so many "haunted houses" and had all sorts of crazy experience.
    My daughter, my youngest, is an unwiltting medium of sorts. She has not cultivated it as much as she could since she's had some quite scary experiences, from the time she was nearly a baby till the present.
    ONE NOTE OF CAUTION for those with ANY psychic or spiritual ability at all..Stay Away from the OUIJA board...nothing but bad news....it all seems like innocent fun but believe me its not.
    A hint if you have any "gifted" family members and want to experience more happenings...seems a lot of this runs in family lines...so even if you don't think you have the gift, but your mom, sister, aunt...does...join in with them...the combination of family members can be so very powerful in reaching all kinds of unusual beings and occurences.
    Watch out in "haunted houses" as I said spirits can be attracted to those who can sense them...and you may unwittingly become a haunted person...you may think you've lived in a series of haunted houses, when it's you, yourself that is actually the target of your new found friend.
    There are soooo many stories to tell, I'll try to get one or two of them all straight in my head and post back soon.
    peace,
    jo

    http://www.Etsy.com/Shop/SimpleEarthCreations
    "How I choose to feel is how I am." ~ EV/MMc
    "Some people hear their own inner voices with great clearness and they live by what they hear. Such people become crazy, or they become legends." ~ One Stab ~
  • ZiggyStarZiggyStar Posts: 14,328
    StillHere wrote:
    Most all the women in our family have some sort of "gift"...not all the same, and not all willingly so.
    Saying that, if you heed the theory that spirits are attracted to those who can sense them the most, you might understand why we seem to have had so many experiences, lived in so many "haunted houses" and had all sorts of crazy experience.
    My daughter, my youngest, is an unwiltting medium of sorts. She has not cultivated it as much as she could since she's had some quite scary experiences, from the time she was nearly a baby till the present.
    ONE NOTE OF CAUTION for those with ANY psychic or spiritual ability at all..Stay Away from the OUIJA board...nothing but bad news....it all seems like innocent fun but believe me its not.
    A hint if you have any "gifted" family members and want to experience more happenings...seems a lot of this runs in family lines...so even if you don't think you have the gift, but your mom, sister, aunt...does...join in with them...the combination of family members can be so very powerful in reaching all kinds of unusual beings and occurences.
    Watch out in "haunted houses" as I said spirits can be attracted to those who can sense them...and you may unwittingly become a haunted person...you may think you've lived in a series of haunted houses, when it's you, yourself that is actually the target of your new found friend.
    There are soooo many stories to tell, I'll try to get one or two of them all straight in my head and post back soon.

    Wow! If you feel like you can tell me some stories one day, I'd love to hear them.
    ★ 1995 - Brisbane ★ 1998 - Brisbane ★ 2003 - Brisbane ★ 2006 - Brisbane ★
    ★ 2009 - Sydney, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch ★
    ★ 2011 - EV Newcastle, Melbourne 1, Melbourne 2 ★
  • cajunkiwicajunkiwi Posts: 984
    When I was a little kid, so I've been told, I went to my mum one day and told her that some lady had cooked me eggs for breakfast right there in my room. When I described what the lady looked like, my mum freaked out - I had described, in perfect detail, my long-dead great-grandmother - who, at that point, I'd never even seen a photo of.

    My mum also swears that her father-in-law - who died two years before I was born - was present in the room at the time of my birth.
    And I listen for the voice inside my head... nothing. I'll do this one myself.
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    rival. wrote:
    chadwick wrote:
    one night some upset spirit tried to smash my living room wall down.

    :shock:

    details!
    my living room was the attic of this big huge old house. behind the drywall that my dad and i installed was a large open area on both sides of the room. one night something behind the wall slammed into it so hard it was as if hulk hogan was imprisoned behind the wall and was trying to knock it down. one thud only but it sounded and felt like a giant was trying to knock it over. i calmly crapped my pants, turned off the tv, and went to bed.
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    StillHere wrote:
    Most all the women in our family have some sort of "gift"...not all the same, and not all willingly so.
    Saying that, if you heed the theory that spirits are attracted to those who can sense them the most, you might understand why we seem to have had so many experiences, lived in so many "haunted houses" and had all sorts of crazy experience.
    My daughter, my youngest, is an unwiltting medium of sorts. She has not cultivated it as much as she could since she's had some quite scary experiences, from the time she was nearly a baby till the present.
    ONE NOTE OF CAUTION for those with ANY psychic or spiritual ability at all..Stay Away from the OUIJA board...nothing but bad news....it all seems like innocent fun but believe me its not.
    A hint if you have any "gifted" family members and want to experience more happenings...seems a lot of this runs in family lines...so even if you don't think you have the gift, but your mom, sister, aunt...does...join in with them...the combination of family members can be so very powerful in reaching all kinds of unusual beings and occurences.
    Watch out in "haunted houses" as I said spirits can be attracted to those who can sense them...and you may unwittingly become a haunted person...you may think you've lived in a series of haunted houses, when it's you, yourself that is actually the target of your new found friend.
    There are soooo many stories to tell, I'll try to get one or two of them all straight in my head and post back soon.

    truer facts have never been told. i need not add to your thoughts.

    wait... ouija boards... you are correct.
    psychic/spiritual ability... through the ceiling...
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    cajunkiwi wrote:
    When I was a little kid, so I've been told, I went to my mum one day and told her that some lady had cooked me eggs for breakfast right there in my room. When I described what the lady looked like, my mum freaked out - I had described, in perfect detail, my long-dead great-grandmother - who, at that point, I'd never even seen a photo of.

    My mum also swears that her father-in-law - who died two years before I was born - was present in the room at the time of my birth.

    a fantastic story... nicely done.
    yeah when a child describes in perfect detail the way a ghosly image looks it is pretty much concrete.
    when i described my grandmother to my dad (his mother) & mom... they did infact shit themselves.

    i do remember dad smiling and being very shocked but also being very calm telling me she'd never harm me but that she only wanted to say good-bye. children see way more tham adults.
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • the wolfthe wolf Posts: 7,027
    ZiggyStar wrote:

    Do you have any cool stories to tell? Ever been on a ghost tour or to a haunted place?

    Hey Ziggy, come hang out at my place for about a week. You may not see anything, but you will hear shit for sure. We used to have sightings every few months at my house. They died off a few years ago, but you can still hear shit moving around.

    fun stuff. I love it.

    One morning around 4am I came down stairs and my front door was wide open, but the dead bolt was still locked so the door didn't just blow open. I figured maybe the GF just didnt have the door shut all the way when she locked up for the night. I went to take my dogs out the back door to let them out to do their business and that door was also wide open with the dead bold in the lock posistion.

    It was pretty awesome.
    Peace, Love.


    "To question your government is not unpatriotic --
    to not question your government is unpatriotic."
    -- Sen. Chuck Hagel
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    the wolf wrote:
    ZiggyStar wrote:

    Do you have any cool stories to tell? Ever been on a ghost tour or to a haunted place?

    Hey Ziggy, come hang out at my place for about a week. You may not see anything, but you will hear shit for sure. We used to have sightings every few months at my house. They died off a few years ago, but you can still hear shit moving around.

    fun stuff. I love it.

    One morning around 4am I came down stairs and my front door was wide open, but the dead bolt was still locked so the door didn't just blow open. I figured maybe the GF just didnt have the door shut all the way when she locked up for the night. I went to take my dogs out the back door to let them out to do their business and that door was also wide open with the dead bold in the lock posistion.

    It was pretty awesome.

    wow that is wild stuff :o
    nicely done mr. wolf.
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • blackredyellowblackredyellow Posts: 5,889
    Our 2 year old son freaks us out sometimes... he gets scared once in a while in his room, and talks about "clouds" that he sees... and he says that sometimes they try to talk to him.

    We have no idea what he's talking about, but it freaks us out a bit lol
    My whole life
    was like a picture
    of a sunny day
    “We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
    ― Abraham Lincoln
  • FrannyFranny Posts: 2,054
    Ok I have a couple.

    many,many years ago my mum woke up suddenly and saw her father sitting on the end of her bed,,,he had been gone for quite a few years, and he just sat there watching her.

    Driving back from a friends place in a rural area one day, came around a bend and this guy in a drizabone, jeans and a cap stepped out onto the road from behind a telegraph pole, I shit myself and hit the skids. Looked in the rearview mirror...NO-ONE there! Yikes, so I asked the girl who was with me if she had seen what I had and she had too. Turns out a guy had died there in a nasty car accident years ago.

    And a house Iived in about 10 years ago had an extra tenant. We would go to bed at night and you could here someone talking really quietly in the lounge room, or the tv would come back on but on a different channel and the volume really low. The nieghbours told us that an elderly couple had rented the house a few years before we did and the lady had died in the house. The husband wouldn't go back in there and lived in a caravan in the back yard till his lease expired.

    So all of mine have been harmless. But I would love to do a ghost tour of one of the old prisons, they reckon the old Boggo Rd one in Brisbane is quite good.
  • eyedclaareyedclaar Posts: 6,980
    Little known fact - In Australia, the ghosts are poisonous. The more you know...
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  • FrannyFranny Posts: 2,054
    eyedclaar wrote:
    Little known fact - In Australia, the ghosts are poisonous. The more you know...


    You'd better believe it!smiley-scared002.gif
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    you want spooky energy?
    go to the backroads around the crow agency where the battle of little big horn was fought.
    at nighttime it is pretty creepy.
    also, the civil war states (gettysburg and the like) are great places to find yourself a ghost.
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • the wolfthe wolf Posts: 7,027
    StillHere wrote:
    Most all the women in our family have some sort of "gift"...not all the same, and not all willingly so.
    Saying that, if you heed the theory that spirits are attracted to those who can sense them the most, you might understand why we seem to have had so many experiences, lived in so many "haunted houses" and had all sorts of crazy experience.
    My daughter, my youngest, is an unwiltting medium of sorts. She has not cultivated it as much as she could since she's had some quite scary experiences, from the time she was nearly a baby till the present.
    ONE NOTE OF CAUTION for those with ANY psychic or spiritual ability at all..Stay Away from the OUIJA board...nothing but bad news....it all seems like innocent fun but believe me its not.
    A hint if you have any "gifted" family members and want to experience more happenings...seems a lot of this runs in family lines...so even if you don't think you have the gift, but your mom, sister, aunt...does...join in with them...the combination of family members can be so very powerful in reaching all kinds of unusual beings and occurences.
    Watch out in "haunted houses" as I said spirits can be attracted to those who can sense them...and you may unwittingly become a haunted person...you may think you've lived in a series of haunted houses, when it's you, yourself that is actually the target of your new found friend.
    There are soooo many stories to tell, I'll try to get one or two of them all straight in my head and post back soon.

    I agree with this 100% My Mom and my Sister have both had many strange things happen. Me ? I have fucked up dreams that tend to come true,..

    There are so many stories from when my sister and I were younger and lived under the same roof with the parental units. I believe that it had to do with us all being together that things happend so often.

    Now things happen, but not like when we lived together. My poor mother, the stories she had.... :shock:
    Peace, Love.


    "To question your government is not unpatriotic --
    to not question your government is unpatriotic."
    -- Sen. Chuck Hagel
  • ZiggyStarZiggyStar Posts: 14,328
    the wolf wrote:
    ZiggyStar wrote:

    Do you have any cool stories to tell? Ever been on a ghost tour or to a haunted place?

    Hey Ziggy, come hang out at my place for about a week. You may not see anything, but you will hear shit for sure. We used to have sightings every few months at my house. They died off a few years ago, but you can still hear shit moving around.

    fun stuff. I love it.

    One morning around 4am I came down stairs and my front door was wide open, but the dead bolt was still locked so the door didn't just blow open. I figured maybe the GF just didnt have the door shut all the way when she locked up for the night. I went to take my dogs out the back door to let them out to do their business and that door was also wide open with the dead bold in the lock posistion.

    It was pretty awesome.

    :shock: It's 5.17am....I'm sitting in the dark....and reading that just made me get a chill! I want to come over!! I'm sleeping in your room though!!! Fucked if I'm sleeping in a room by myself!! :shock: It sucks I live so far away!

    When you say "sightings", what do you mean? What do you see?

    And while typing this something just moved behind me (a ghecko on the wall probably) and I just shit my pants! haha :lol:
    ★ 1995 - Brisbane ★ 1998 - Brisbane ★ 2003 - Brisbane ★ 2006 - Brisbane ★
    ★ 2009 - Sydney, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch ★
    ★ 2011 - EV Newcastle, Melbourne 1, Melbourne 2 ★
  • the wolfthe wolf Posts: 7,027
    ZiggyStar wrote:
    the wolf wrote:
    ZiggyStar wrote:

    Do you have any cool stories to tell? Ever been on a ghost tour or to a haunted place?

    Hey Ziggy, come hang out at my place for about a week. You may not see anything, but you will hear shit for sure. We used to have sightings every few months at my house. They died off a few years ago, but you can still hear shit moving around.

    fun stuff. I love it.

    One morning around 4am I came down stairs and my front door was wide open, but the dead bolt was still locked so the door didn't just blow open. I figured maybe the GF just didnt have the door shut all the way when she locked up for the night. I went to take my dogs out the back door to let them out to do their business and that door was also wide open with the dead bold in the lock posistion.

    It was pretty awesome.

    :shock: It's 5.17am....I'm sitting in the dark....and reading that just made me get a chill! I want to come over!! I'm sleeping in your room though!!! Fucked if I'm sleeping in a room by myself!! :shock: It sucks I live so far away!

    When you say "sightings", what do you mean? What do you see?

    And while typing this something just moved behind me (a ghecko on the wall probably) and I just shit my pants! haha :lol:

    Many times have quite a few different people seen someone walk past my dinning room windows. That side of my house, is the low side of a hill, so the "person" would have to be 25 foot tall for us to see them. So either a "ghost" is floating by the window, or walking across the hallway in the house and we are seeing the reflection in the windows across the room. Either way, it can't really be explained.
    Peace, Love.


    "To question your government is not unpatriotic --
    to not question your government is unpatriotic."
    -- Sen. Chuck Hagel
  • comebackgirlcomebackgirl Posts: 9,885
    StillHere wrote:
    Most all the women in our family have some sort of "gift"...not all the same, and not all willingly so.
    Saying that, if you heed the theory that spirits are attracted to those who can sense them the most, you might understand why we seem to have had so many experiences, lived in so many "haunted houses" and had all sorts of crazy experience.
    My daughter, my youngest, is an unwiltting medium of sorts. She has not cultivated it as much as she could since she's had some quite scary experiences, from the time she was nearly a baby till the present.
    ONE NOTE OF CAUTION for those with ANY psychic or spiritual ability at all..Stay Away from the OUIJA board...nothing but bad news....it all seems like innocent fun but believe me its not.
    A hint if you have any "gifted" family members and want to experience more happenings...seems a lot of this runs in family lines...so even if you don't think you have the gift, but your mom, sister, aunt...does...join in with them...the combination of family members can be so very powerful in reaching all kinds of unusual beings and occurences.
    Watch out in "haunted houses" as I said spirits can be attracted to those who can sense them...and you may unwittingly become a haunted person...you may think you've lived in a series of haunted houses, when it's you, yourself that is actually the target of your new found friend.
    There are soooo many stories to tell, I'll try to get one or two of them all straight in my head and post back soon.
    I think I might be a "haunted person" :? I've had a ghost in the last 3 places I've lived...turning on lights, the tv, smelling men's cologne and cigar smoke, hearing feet on the steps, the basement door creaking open and closed. I think the ghosts are mostly friendly. My first experience was right after my grandmother died. I could feel her sitting on the edge of my bed at night for several months. I heard ghosts can become attached to objects - I have her chandelier hanging in my bedroom, so I wonder if it's her.
    I posted about my latest experiences. About 2 weeks after I moved into my new place I heard a voice saying "go back" in the middle of the day. :? About 2 months later I came home late one night and opened the front door and someone pushed it back at me. I thought my husband was doing it at first because it was really forceful. I stopped for a second and heard feet running up the stairs. When I went inside, my cats looked totally freaked out - were looking up the stairs. One of them started creeping up there really slowly...I thought someone had broken in...since no one is hurting my kitty :evil: I followed her...checked everywhere...no one to be seen. Must have been ghosty :lol: Doors have randomly slammed shut. No electrical stuff yet.
    tumblr_mg4nc33pIX1s1mie8o1_400.gif

    "I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
  • gabersgabers Posts: 2,787
    When I was maybe seven years old we lived in a one floor house. I remember many a night hearing the distinct sound of footsteps in the attic above me. I would tell my mom but she never believed me or heard these sounds in her room. I would get so terrified I'd run to the kitchen to grab the biggest butcher knife we had. As if that would somehow protect me from ghosts. But I shared a room with my little brother and we both heard these sounds. And you'd only hear them late at night.
  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    while i was in my car my dad used to turn on the dome light.
    this was done by physically pushing the light's lens cover with one's finger(s).
    the damn thing snaps in and out of place quite firmly so it's not like it's floppy and doing it on its own.
    dad had just died a few months prior.
    i know it was him, i sensed him.

    also, i've sensed my brother when i was driving a truck.
    he used to sit in the passenger seat.
    i'd talk to him about stuff.
    it was pretty awesome.

    i feel them with me all the time.
    i've felt grandma with me ever since she died but only saw her the one time.

    i do know they're waiting for me on the otherside.
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • ZiggyStarZiggyStar Posts: 14,328
    Wow! These stories are awesome!!

    I really want to have a seance....my bf said no fucking chance in hell am I doing it in any house he's living in! :lol:
    ★ 1995 - Brisbane ★ 1998 - Brisbane ★ 2003 - Brisbane ★ 2006 - Brisbane ★
    ★ 2009 - Sydney, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch ★
    ★ 2011 - EV Newcastle, Melbourne 1, Melbourne 2 ★
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