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Your opinion about Immigration.

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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 27,593
    tbergs said:

    My first President Biden disappointment. To the bolded, does anyone not think that the propaganda and purposeful clouding of the issue has had an effect? The midterms will tell but I'm sure this issue will be hammered on the campaign trail. BOO!


    Opinion: The White House must exorcise the ghost of Stephen Miller


    Joe Biden is president. So why are Stephen Miller’s views still haunting the U.S. immigration agenda?

    On Friday, the White House announced a cowardly decision: Biden would maintain Donald Trump’s record-low refugee admissions ceiling, breaking an earlier promise to quadruple refugee arrivals this fiscal year. To appreciate why, exactly, this decision was so disappointing — beyond the obvious humanitarian reasons — you need to understand the last administration’s anti-immigrant propaganda campaign and how Biden’s decision plays into it.

    Trump and his senior adviser Miller wanted Americans to live in perpetual fear of foreign hordes supposedly laying siege to the country — to our economy, our culture, our racial complexion, even our women. According to this worldview, there is (or should be) no such thing as a legal immigrant; deep down, immigrants are all somehow intrinsically illegal and must be treated as such. The barbarians at the gate cannot be contained by good-faith vetting or the traditional rule of law; all foreigners must be beaten back by whatever means necessary.

    This was the message of Trump officials’ rhetoric and policy. In addition to building a border wall to deter unlawful entry, the Trump administration foreclosed every legal avenue for immigration. The ruthlessness of foreign invaders — these “aliens,” to use Miller’s preferred term — demanded it.

    Trump officials executed this agenda by booby-trapping paperwork and rigging eligibility criteria to keep out foreigners who tried to immigrate legally. Where executive authority allowed, Trump directly ratcheted down entry quotas. That’s what happened with refugees, whose numbers the president has almost plenary power to decide. Trump officials repeatedly declared that refugee admissions had to be reduced because other immigrants were gaining too much ground in their coordinated invasion and were allegedly overwhelming U.S. processing capacity.

    It didn’t matter that refugees are among the most vetted immigrants in the world, waiting years and many rounds of background checks before being allowed to resettle in the United States. Nor that refugees are processed in an entirely different system from those entering U.S. borders without permission. Miller and his fellow xenophobes portrayed even immigrants willing to submit to extensive screening as likely drug-runners, terrorists, rapists and parasites.

    Biden campaigned, and won, on a very different message.

    He promised to “restore the soul of America,” which he argued included welcoming the stranger. It was a message he had promoted for decades. Upon taking office, he declared plans to roll back the Miller/Trump immigration agenda. Among them: raising the refugee admissions ceiling from 15,000 to 62,500.

    Biden’s rationale for this policy was partly moral, partly practical. Unlike their predecessors, Biden and his immigration advisers recognized that creating more pathways for people to come to the United States legally would actually promote “law and order” and alleviate stress on the immigration system. In a February report to Congress, the State Department said one reason to “increase the overall refugee admissions number” was to “facilitate safe and orderly migration and access to international protection and avert a humanitarian crisis at the U.S. southern border.”

    Then, inexplicably, Biden got cold feet.

    He delayed signing the paperwork necessary to put his policy into effect, leaving hundreds of vetted refugees in limbo. White House spokespeople could not explain the holdup. Reports leaked that Biden worried about the “optics” of letting in more refugees amid a surge of migration at the southern border, even though he knew the two issues were unrelated.

    In other words: Biden seemed to concede that Miller’s propaganda had worked and that the public might view all immigrants as a dangerous, undifferentiated horde of intruders the new administration was failing to contain.

    Rather than fighting the confusion and fear Miller had sown, Biden caved. Friday’s White House announcement even invoked the same weaselly excuse Trump officials had used to justify their record-low cap — that it was necessitated by the (irrelevant) border surge.

    On Twitter, Miller took a victory lap. He urged Biden to reduce refugee admissions to zero, which he declared would be the “most popular” thing to do.

    But Biden and Miller both misread the politics. Biden’s announcement drew immediate, widespread backlash. Perhaps unsurprisingly: Despite Team Trump’s relentless smears of refugees and other immigrants, polls show the public has grown more pro-immigrant in recent years — with support reaching record highs.

    Within hours of its initial announcement Friday, the White House backtracked, saying a higher refugee ceiling would be forthcoming. Officials refused to specify the new level and will not commit to the 62,500 Biden previously promised. Biden is leaving his options open — perhaps in case Miller’s political assessment turns out to be right.

    It’s not clear why Biden has been so timid. As Biden himself has persuasively argued, admitting more refugees is in the country’s moral and national security interests. What’s more, he was elected on a popular mandate to do it. The White House must exorcise the ghost of Stephen Miller and deliver the agenda that our new, soul-restoring president promised.

    Opinion | The White House must exorcise the ghost of Stephen Miller - The Washington Post

    I read this one earlier too. I think she also wrote the piece I posted in the immigration thread a few weeks ago. It really does seem Biden is being overly conservative on his, which clearly seems only for political reasons, but how long does he plan to hold out? The midterms are a long way away.
    How the richest, most powerful, as some would say, nation of 320,000,000 can't absorb 62,500 immigrants and show the world the potential of the American Dream, as some might call it, is beyond me, particularly after the vetting process they go through. They're all a bunch of rapers and murderers and druggie massacreers building bombs, stealing jobs and flying airplanes into buildings, and costing taxpayers money, never contributing a thing to society, ever.

    Kick Covids dirty rotten ass, will ya? Wish you and your family the best.
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 27,593
    nicknyr15 said:
    PJPOWER said:
    What a racist asshole that Biden is. Afraid of brown people, Joe? 

    Snarkiness aside, the wall was the only Trump idea I kinda liked. Not the stupid “Mexico will pay for it” crap, just the idea of a border wall to curb illegal immigration. And if Joe thinks it’s a good idea to continue construction, he should. Sure the political fallout will be annoying (the right celebrating that Biden is admitting Trump was right about something, the left’s heads exploding for the same reason), but a real president, as so many (especially here) say Joe is (unlike Trump), shouldn’t care about that sort of fallout. 
    Great points! Crickets around here on this though. 
    the biggest issue I have with it is the ecological impact. humans should not put fences keeping animals from their natural migration patters. 

    the wall was a racist dog whistle that helped get trump elected. the fact of the matter is, arrests at the US/Mexico border for illegal crossers was at a 45 year low. 

    "show me a 50 foot wall and I'll show you a 51 foot ladder". 
    This and its just stupid.
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 5,981
    nicknyr15 said:
    PJPOWER said:
    What a racist asshole that Biden is. Afraid of brown people, Joe? 

    Snarkiness aside, the wall was the only Trump idea I kinda liked. Not the stupid “Mexico will pay for it” crap, just the idea of a border wall to curb illegal immigration. And if Joe thinks it’s a good idea to continue construction, he should. Sure the political fallout will be annoying (the right celebrating that Biden is admitting Trump was right about something, the left’s heads exploding for the same reason), but a real president, as so many (especially here) say Joe is (unlike Trump), shouldn’t care about that sort of fallout. 
    Great points! Crickets around here on this though. 
    the biggest issue I have with it is the ecological impact. humans should not put fences keeping animals from their natural migration patters. 

    the wall was a racist dog whistle that helped get trump elected. the fact of the matter is, arrests at the US/Mexico border for illegal crossers was at a 45 year low. 

    "show me a 50 foot wall and I'll show you a 51 foot ladder". 
    The angle of that ladder would be very dangerous. I wouldn’t use it.
  • FiveBelowFiveBelow Lubbock, TXPosts: 816
    mace1229 said:
    nicknyr15 said:
    PJPOWER said:
    What a racist asshole that Biden is. Afraid of brown people, Joe? 

    Snarkiness aside, the wall was the only Trump idea I kinda liked. Not the stupid “Mexico will pay for it” crap, just the idea of a border wall to curb illegal immigration. And if Joe thinks it’s a good idea to continue construction, he should. Sure the political fallout will be annoying (the right celebrating that Biden is admitting Trump was right about something, the left’s heads exploding for the same reason), but a real president, as so many (especially here) say Joe is (unlike Trump), shouldn’t care about that sort of fallout. 
    Great points! Crickets around here on this though. 
    the biggest issue I have with it is the ecological impact. humans should not put fences keeping animals from their natural migration patters. 

    the wall was a racist dog whistle that helped get trump elected. the fact of the matter is, arrests at the US/Mexico border for illegal crossers was at a 45 year low. 

    "show me a 50 foot wall and I'll show you a 51 foot ladder". 
    The angle of that ladder would be very dangerous. I wouldn’t use it.
    4 to 1 rule. 62'-6" ladder and we are talking.

  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 5,981
    In a more serious note, I don’t understand the argument of walls don’t always work. It reminds me of what I keep seeing in the gun thread. Someone points out how a gun law didn’t work and the response is almost always a sarcastic “it doesn’t work 100% so why even try.” But for a few years we keep seeing that example and pictures being shared of people climbing a border wall.
    Rarely is anything 100%. Do you never lock your bike up because it can be cut? Do you not wear a mask because it’s not 100%? But walls do work. I bet most people here have one in their backyard to keep people out and things in. It doesn’t mean it can’t be climbed, but it deters some people from trying. I mean what happened after January 6? They put up a fence around the Capitol.
    Environmental concerns and costs are valid points to consider. I’m just not buying the it can be climbed argument.
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 26,547
    For people that live in border states, what are your reactions to having the influx of immigrants in your area?  My family in California constantly complain about it.

    Biggest complaint?  The schools and taxes.
  • static111static111 Posts: 2,508
    I’ve lived in New Mexico and now Texas over the course of the last 16 years.  I have had zero problems with this so called influx.  I guess I’m either to ignorant to know or too poor to be affected.
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 26,547
    static111 said:
    I’ve lived in New Mexico and now Texas over the course of the last 16 years.  I have had zero problems with this so called influx.  I guess I’m either to ignorant to know or too poor to be affected.
    Schools aren't a problem then?  My cousin complains about the lack of ESL teachers to help the ever growing populations in the classroom.
  • static111static111 Posts: 2,508
    static111 said:
    I’ve lived in New Mexico and now Texas over the course of the last 16 years.  I have had zero problems with this so called influx.  I guess I’m either to ignorant to know or too poor to be affected.
    Schools aren't a problem then?  My cousin complains about the lack of ESL teachers to help the ever growing populations in the classroom.
    Most people in my daughters schools in Texas and my in laws schools in New Mex speak Spanish.  I don’t personally but both my wife and daughter do and they make fun of me frequently for my poor pronunciation of Spanish influenced words
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 26,547
    static111 said:
    static111 said:
    I’ve lived in New Mexico and now Texas over the course of the last 16 years.  I have had zero problems with this so called influx.  I guess I’m either to ignorant to know or too poor to be affected.
    Schools aren't a problem then?  My cousin complains about the lack of ESL teachers to help the ever growing populations in the classroom.
    Most people in my daughters schools in Texas and my in laws schools in New Mex speak Spanish.  I don’t personally but both my wife and daughter do and they make fun of me frequently for my poor pronunciation of Spanish influenced words
    We called a mix Spanglish.  Where you can go back and forth between English and Spanish words and have a conversation.  I was quite good at it when I lived in Cali.  I chose to want to learn.  You do have people that have the inability or rather not and that is where the classroom can become a problem with it.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 5,981
    edited April 22
    I don't know how anyone could argue border towns/high immigration towns aren't a strain on the schools. Just 1 aspect to consider is many have co-teachers to help with ELL students. Essentially 2 full time teachers in 1 classroom. Not in every class, but maybe 20% of the classes. So where schools are already struggling for money and funding, they have to hire 20% extra teachers to language support in the classroom. There are many other factors that are involved as well. 
    I'm not saying sny of them are bad or a waste of money, but it is expensive for schools to run with heavy language barriers. And they are also often lower income districts to begin with that already struggle financially. 
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 39,643
    mace1229 said:
    In a more serious note, I don’t understand the argument of walls don’t always work. It reminds me of what I keep seeing in the gun thread. Someone points out how a gun law didn’t work and the response is almost always a sarcastic “it doesn’t work 100% so why even try.” But for a few years we keep seeing that example and pictures being shared of people climbing a border wall.
    Rarely is anything 100%. Do you never lock your bike up because it can be cut? Do you not wear a mask because it’s not 100%? But walls do work. I bet most people here have one in their backyard to keep people out and things in. It doesn’t mean it can’t be climbed, but it deters some people from trying. I mean what happened after January 6? They put up a fence around the Capitol.
    Environmental concerns and costs are valid points to consider. I’m just not buying the it can be climbed argument.
    I hate when people make these comparisons. A wall that costs billions and billions of dollars on the border is equivalent to a fence around the capital building? 

    Are Trump Terrorists climbing over the fence at the capital like the are at the border?
    Are Trump Terrorists digging tunnels to get under the fence at the capital like they are at the border?
    Are Trump Terrorists able to infiltrate the capital buy flying a plane to it or by shipping themselves by boat like the vast majority of drugs that are smuggled into this country?

    I've got a fence around my backyard. Is that the same thing as a multi billion dollar wall too?

    Having a physical border appears to be a good idea in certain places and not such a good idea in other places. But Trump's idea of putting it all across the border is a costly mistake. 

    Return On Investment. It's just not worth the money and the lie that Mexico was going to pay for it should not be swept under the rug. The reason he kept repeating that ad nauseum was because he knew the cost was ridiculously high for something the smugglers know they could easily get around. 

    And the environmental concerns are valid, agreed. I think that is a huge point to consider, and obviously another reason why the capitol fence or the fence in my backyard is not a good comparison. 


    From a political standpoint, I actually think it's good for Biden to have this "problem" so early into his term as opposed to it popping up next year. Gives his administration time to fix it before the mid terms. And with his approval rating a whopping 14ish points above his predecessor, it is clear the American people have a much higher degree of faith in him.
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 27,593
    edited April 24
    $27 million a mile being scaled with $5.00 ladders. Just muy estupido. Muy, muy estupido!

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/apr/24/donald-trump-border-wall-scaled-ladders
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 39,643
    $27 million a mile being scaled with $5.00 ladders. Just muy estupido. Muy, muy estupido!

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/apr/24/donald-trump-border-wall-scaled-ladders
    The guy went bankrupt how many times? He doesn't give a shit about ROI

    lol
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 27,593
    $27 million a mile being scaled with $5.00 ladders. Just muy estupido. Muy, muy estupido!

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/apr/24/donald-trump-border-wall-scaled-ladders
    The guy went bankrupt how many times? He doesn't give a shit about ROI

    lol
    But POOTWH is busy, very busy with the business and except for a little more golf he just never stops.
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 5,981
    edited April 24
    mace1229 said:
    In a more serious note, I don’t understand the argument of walls don’t always work. It reminds me of what I keep seeing in the gun thread. Someone points out how a gun law didn’t work and the response is almost always a sarcastic “it doesn’t work 100% so why even try.” But for a few years we keep seeing that example and pictures being shared of people climbing a border wall.
    Rarely is anything 100%. Do you never lock your bike up because it can be cut? Do you not wear a mask because it’s not 100%? But walls do work. I bet most people here have one in their backyard to keep people out and things in. It doesn’t mean it can’t be climbed, but it deters some people from trying. I mean what happened after January 6? They put up a fence around the Capitol.
    Environmental concerns and costs are valid points to consider. I’m just not buying the it can be climbed argument.
    I hate when people make these comparisons. A wall that costs billions and billions of dollars on the border is equivalent to a fence around the capital building? 

    Are Trump Terrorists climbing over the fence at the capital like the are at the border?
    Are Trump Terrorists digging tunnels to get under the fence at the capital like they are at the border?
    Are Trump Terrorists able to infiltrate the capital buy flying a plane to it or by shipping themselves by boat like the vast majority of drugs that are smuggled into this country?

    I've got a fence around my backyard. Is that the same thing as a multi billion dollar wall too?

    Having a physical border appears to be a good idea in certain places and not such a good idea in other places. But Trump's idea of putting it all across the border is a costly mistake. 

    Return On Investment. It's just not worth the money and the lie that Mexico was going to pay for it should not be swept under the rug. The reason he kept repeating that ad nauseum was because he knew the cost was ridiculously high for something the smugglers know they could easily get around. 

    And the environmental concerns are valid, agreed. I think that is a huge point to consider, and obviously another reason why the capitol fence or the fence in my backyard is not a good comparison. 


    From a political standpoint, I actually think it's good for Biden to have this "problem" so early into his term as opposed to it popping up next year. Gives his administration time to fix it before the mid terms. And with his approval rating a whopping 14ish points above his predecessor, it is clear the American people have a much higher degree of faith in him.
    I said that too. You actually made the same arguments I just made.
    I said costs and environment are a legitimate counter argument to the wall. Just don’t say a wall can be climbed as the main argument to not have one. Of course they can be climbed. But that’s a dumb argument. Cost and environments factors are better reasons to debate the wall.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • ZodZod Posts: 7,522
    Here in Canada we've had lots of legal immigration over the last 10+ years.   No one talks about it, but it's generally because of the population hump.   IE how many people of the Boomer generation there are.   There were way less people following the boomers, so it was going to put huge stress on social programs.   We've had both a right wing and now a left/center government ramp the shit out immigration to artificially inflate our younger population.

    That part makes sense, but the rapid increase of population seems to have had a big impact on housing... sigh..


  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, ColoradoPosts: 8,693
    Good...
    President Joe Biden is formally lifting the nation's refugee cap to 62,500 this year, weeks after facing bipartisan blowback for his delay in lifting former Pr...
    https://news.yahoo.com/ap-source-biden-lifting-trump-201422075.html 
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 14,611
    Good...
    President Joe Biden is formally lifting the nation's refugee cap to 62,500 this year, weeks after facing bipartisan blowback for his delay in lifting former Pr...
    https://news.yahoo.com/ap-source-biden-lifting-trump-201422075.html 

    Biden said he received additional information that led him to sign the emergency presidential determination setting the cap at 62,500.

    “It is important to take this action today to remove any lingering doubt in the minds of refugees around the world who have suffered so much, and who are anxiously waiting for their new lives to begin," Biden stated before signing the emergency presidential determination.


    62,500 is actually near the amount of homeless in California. And there’s over 500,000 homeless nation-wide. So the people that have suffered because other countries have failed them get new lives. And the people that are suffering because our country failed them continue to live in the streets. The homeless in the U.S. should just migrate south of the border, and then come back seeking asylum. Then maybe our government would give a fuck about them. 

    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
  • static111static111 Posts: 2,508
    Good...
    President Joe Biden is formally lifting the nation's refugee cap to 62,500 this year, weeks after facing bipartisan blowback for his delay in lifting former Pr...
    https://news.yahoo.com/ap-source-biden-lifting-trump-201422075.html 

    Biden said he received additional information that led him to sign the emergency presidential determination setting the cap at 62,500.

    “It is important to take this action today to remove any lingering doubt in the minds of refugees around the world who have suffered so much, and who are anxiously waiting for their new lives to begin," Biden stated before signing the emergency presidential determination.


    62,500 is actually near the amount of homeless in California. And there’s over 500,000 homeless nation-wide. So the people that have suffered because other countries have failed them get new lives. And the people that are suffering because our country failed them continue to live in the streets. The homeless in the U.S. should just migrate south of the border, and then come back seeking asylum. Then maybe our government would give a fuck about them. 

    That’s actually a really good point.  Here in austin our loving liberal blue dot city in a sea of red just voted to reinstate a public camping ban, which in effect criminalizes homelessness.  So basically instead of I don’t know having Tesla pay taxes to build the factory here or say Samsung who is expanding their factory and use money for housing and job training for homeless we as a city have decided the only handouts we will give are corporate ones.  So the cops are soon gonna break up the camps and ticket people into prison and  chase people to the outskirts so that all the new Silicon Valley money pouring in won’t have to see the problem they are creating by driving housing and apartment costs up 300+% in a few short years.  But I guess that is progress...
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 14,611
    static111 said:
    Good...
    President Joe Biden is formally lifting the nation's refugee cap to 62,500 this year, weeks after facing bipartisan blowback for his delay in lifting former Pr...
    https://news.yahoo.com/ap-source-biden-lifting-trump-201422075.html 

    Biden said he received additional information that led him to sign the emergency presidential determination setting the cap at 62,500.

    “It is important to take this action today to remove any lingering doubt in the minds of refugees around the world who have suffered so much, and who are anxiously waiting for their new lives to begin," Biden stated before signing the emergency presidential determination.


    62,500 is actually near the amount of homeless in California. And there’s over 500,000 homeless nation-wide. So the people that have suffered because other countries have failed them get new lives. And the people that are suffering because our country failed them continue to live in the streets. The homeless in the U.S. should just migrate south of the border, and then come back seeking asylum. Then maybe our government would give a fuck about them. 

    That’s actually a really good point.  Here in austin our loving liberal blue dot city in a sea of red just voted to reinstate a public camping ban, which in effect criminalizes homelessness.  So basically instead of I don’t know having Tesla pay taxes to build the factory here or say Samsung who is expanding their factory and use money for housing and job training for homeless we as a city have decided the only handouts we will give are corporate ones.  So the cops are soon gonna break up the camps and ticket people into prison and  chase people to the outskirts so that all the new Silicon Valley money pouring in won’t have to see the problem they are creating by driving housing and apartment costs up 300+% in a few short years.  But I guess that is progress...
    Just insane. 
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
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