Nigerian tries to blow up plane..

WaveCameCrashin

Im really suprised nobody is talking about this. Then again....

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nationa ... plane.html
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Alleged Nigeria terrorist Umar Farouk Abdulmutall tries to explode Northwest Airlines 253 to Detroit

BY JAMES GORDON MEEK AND RICH SCHAPIRO
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS

Originally Published:Friday, December 25th 2009, 4:13 PM
Updated: Saturday, December 26th 2009, 4:27 AM


Karas/AP
Northwest Airlines Flight on the tarmac at Detroit Metropolitan Airport after suspected Nigerian terrorist Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab set off explosives in an effort to bring down the plane.

Archie/AP
Family and friends wait at Detroit Metropolitan Airport for passengers of Flight 253.

Daily News
CLICK TO SEE FLIGHT PATH OF TERROR SUSPECT ABDUL FAROUK ABDULMUTALLAB.
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Flight 253 bomber
What would be an appropriate punishment for suspected Nigerian terrorist Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab?

The death penalty.
Life in prison.
20 years in prison.
5-10 years in prison.
One year in prison.
Not sure. I need more information.

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New York fliers rage at security lapse after alleged terrorist tries to blow up Flight 253
Suspected Nigerian terrorist's foiled plot is latest in long list of plane attacks
An Al Qaeda-linked terrorist attempted to blow up a packed commercial jet over Detroit on Friday, but was tackled by heroic passengers as he tried to explode the bomb, officials said.

Nigerian extremist Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, 23, was subdued immediately aboard Northwest Flight 253 - carrying 278 passengers and 11 crew members - minutes before the plane landed, officials said.

A White House official called the incident "an attempted act of terrorism" and said President Obama was monitoring events.

"It was a fairly sophisticated device," Rep. Pete King (R-L.I.) told the Daily News after counterterrorism officials briefed him. "If it would have worked, he could have brought the plane down."

Obama immediately ordered security tightened at airports across the nation, raising travelers' fears on one of the busiest days of the year.

Abdulmutallab, who suffered third-degree burns, told authorities he got the explosives in Yemen and received orders from Al Qaeda operatives to detonate the device aboard a plane over U.S. soil, officials said.

The suspect, reportedly an engineering student at University College of London, said he had explosive powder taped to his leg.

He confessed to trying to use a chemical-filled syringe designed to ignite the powder, ABC News reported.

King called the explosive "a new device."

"The subject is claiming to have extremist affiliation and that the device was acquired in Yemen along with instructions as to when it should be used," a federal bulletin warned.

King said Abdulmutallab was not on a no-fly list, but was known to have terrorist connections in northern Africa - a hotbed of militant activity.

"He's part of a terrorist nexus," King said.

Officials said Abdulmutallab was traveling one way, without a return ticket. He boarded the Airbus 330 in Amsterdam after transferring from another flight out of Lagos, Nigeria. The flight then continued to Detroit.

Passengers said the frightening incident lasted only a few, chaotic minutes.

Several said they heard a loud popping noise, smelled smoke and then spotted flames leaping from the man's lap.

"It was higher than the seat," Stephanie van Herk, 22, told The Wall Street Journal.

Pandemonium ensued as crew members tried to douse the suspect with water.

Passenger Syed Jafry said that's when a burly man jumped over several seats and tackled the blood-thirsty extremist.

"He took him under his arm and got hold of his neck and then other people helped him," Jafry, who was sitting three rows behind the suspect, told Fox News. "He handled it very well."

"It was terrifying," Richelle Keepman told CNN. "We all thought we weren't going to land, we weren't going to make it."

Once the severely burned terrorist was subdued, he was dragged to the front of the plane and restrained there until the jet landed a few minutes later.

A passenger sitting nearby said the man, his legs charred and his pants cut off, appeared eerily calm.

"He didn't show any reaction to pain or to any feeling of shock or nervousness," said Melinda Dennis. "He just looked like a normal individual."

The heroic passenger was taken to the University of Michigan Medical Center and was still hospitalized Friday night. The extent of his injuries was not revealed. The suspect was being treated at the same hospital under heavy guard and was expected to survive, officials said.

Obama spoke by conference call with national security advisers and then he "instructed that all appropriate measures be taken to increase security for air travel," White House spokesman Bill Burton said in a statement.

Authorities on Friday night were investigating how Abdulmutallab got on the plane with explosives.

The Homeland Security Department said passengers may see additional screening measures on all flights because of the incident.

"We encourage those with future travel plans to stay in touch with their airline and to visit http://www.tsa.gov for updates," the department said.

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Anon

Well now TSA will become the most hated government agency surpassing the IRS.

A week ago I was in Chicago at O'Hare flying out to Philadelphia. At 6am, when I was in line at security, there were at least 500 others waiting to get through. TSA had ONE (1) metal detector open for this crowd. And these employees sure could not care less about you missing your flight. It has to be the greatest job in the world, you get to be super lazy and treat people (customers) like shit. If anyone protests they must be against freedom and they must be a terrorist. These are the most incompetent people I've dealt with in some time. I seriously hope every one of them are fired.

So now we aren't allowed to have any items out during the last hour of a flight, nor use the bathrooms. Some flights have already banned all usage of electronic devices as well. Janet Napolitano has declared the system a success even though the person was on a watch list. A little after the fact isn't it?

I guess in order to fly on a plane you must forfeit all of your rights, it sure seems to be getting that way.

Heatherj43

Wow! His dad tried to warn people and they should had know in Amsterdam not to let him proceed! Unbelievable! So much for all of those who have to go though so much every time they travel! It appears all that is in vain! I quit travelling, but when I heard people have to take their shoes off, i couldn't believ it, now I hear this and think how in vain it all is.
I am glad no one got hurt and thankful to that guy, who did get hurt, for jumping on this guy. I am here in Michigan and knew some family that was at the airport that day! Also, the plane could have come down in my neighborhood. I am in a flight path for landing.

aerial

I just heard on the news that a lawyer that was on the flight saw this guy with another man in a suit...the man in the suit was talking to the ticket sales lady saying the bomber did not have a passport but need to be on the flight ....they were told to talk to the manager....So if this is true how did this guy even get on the plane with no passport?...bribery?

gimmesometruth27

aerial wrote:

I just heard on the news that a lawyer that was on the flight saw this guy with another man in a suit...the man in the suit was talking to the ticket sales lady saying the bomber did not have a passport but need to be on the flight ....they were told to talk to the manager....So if this is true how did this guy even get on the plane with no passport?...bribery?

are we sure that he had no passport?

Teddyledbetter

JB811 wrote:

Well now TSA will become the most hated government agency surpassing the IRS.

A week ago I was in Chicago at O'Hare flying out to Philadelphia. At 6am, when I was in line at security, there were at least 500 others waiting to get through. TSA had ONE (1) metal detector open for this crowd. And these employees sure could not care less about you missing your flight. It has to be the greatest job in the world, you get to be super lazy and treat people (customers) like shit. If anyone protests they must be against freedom and they must be a terrorist. These are the most incompetent people I've dealt with in some time. I seriously hope every one of them are fired.

So now we aren't allowed to have any items out during the last hour of a flight, nor use the bathrooms. Some flights have already banned all usage of electronic devices as well. Janet Napolitano has declared the system a success even though the person was on a watch list. A little after the fact isn't it?

I guess in order to fly on a plane you must forfeit all of your rights, it sure seems to be getting that way.

This is normal at O'hare before this incident. It's really all about selling overpriced bottled water at the airport. You can't carry anything through security to drink but you can purchase liquor (flammable) at the duty free shops and still carry this aboard planes? Makes no sense to me! But be sure to look at Major Daily's dirt on the airport roof so he can say Chicago is a green progressive city. How about getting rid of the rental buses and add the renters to the extended parking train that already drives right past the car rental lots? Oh wait that will reduce votes... I mean jobs... I don't pretend to have the answers but I wish someone out there smarter than me had the balls to do something about it. If it looks like shit and smells like shit...it's probably shit.

aerial

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

aerial wrote:

I just heard on the news that a lawyer that was on the flight saw this guy with another man in a suit...the man in the suit was talking to the ticket sales lady saying the bomber did not have a passport but need to be on the flight ....they were told to talk to the manager....So if this is true how did this guy even get on the plane with no passport?...bribery?

are we sure that he had no passport?

The guy they were interviewing, who happen to be a lawyer, said he was standing by them and heard the suit guy say the bomber guy did not have a passport but needed to be on the flight. He said he was from somewhere else. I cannot remember where though.

keeponrockin

Scary shit. Sadly, it's a risk you take when travelling. A MINISCULE one, but a risk nonetheless.

Having said that, do we REALLY need to remove personal items from our laps for the last hour now?

WaveCameCrashin

I'd like to know why it took Obama's people 3 hrs to notify him and then it took him 3 days to even say anything about it. :wtf: Oh I forgot he was on vacation :roll: Those damn turrist,and I thought there was no war on terror as some on her would like to believe. :roll:

dimitrispearljam

ok,,i travel from Amsterdam and the security is hard and search,carefull..
so,,someone help him for sure,,and inside eu u dont need a passport,but from europe to usa u need,so hed a passport for sure.

Byrnzie

keeponrockin wrote:

Scary shit. Sadly, it's a risk you take when travelling. A MINISCULE one, but a risk nonetheless.

Having said that, do we REALLY need to remove personal items from our laps for the last hour now?

And why do we need to turn off our I-Pods? As if listening to an i-pod will make the plane crash?

Heatherj43

aerial wrote:

I just heard on the news that a lawyer that was on the flight saw this guy with another man in a suit...the man in the suit was talking to the ticket sales lady saying the bomber did not have a passport but need to be on the flight ....they were told to talk to the manager....So if this is true how did this guy even get on the plane with no passport?...bribery?

This was said on the news, then they said he did indeed have a passport, so I have no idea why that guy said he heard he did not. They said that guy in the suit also said the guy was a refuge. None of that appears to be true anymore? Oh, and all of that supposedly happened in Amsterdam.

Heatherj43

I just heard that what the guy had was a powder substance that can easily be sewn into undergarments, etc. They showed a demonstration on T.V. of how the stuff works and it is scary to think that all they have to do is get this powder on board. The water is in the bathroom to mix with it. I am unsure if water is needed cuz I missed the first part of demo, but they did mention water. This stuff only takes a little bit to blow a hole in plane's fusilage.

Heatherj43

Teddyledbetter wrote:

JB811 wrote:

Well now TSA will become the most hated government agency surpassing the IRS.

A week ago I was in Chicago at O'Hare flying out to Philadelphia. At 6am, when I was in line at security, there were at least 500 others waiting to get through. TSA had ONE (1) metal detector open for this crowd. And these employees sure could not care less about you missing your flight. It has to be the greatest job in the world, you get to be super lazy and treat people (customers) like shit. If anyone protests they must be against freedom and they must be a terrorist. These are the most incompetent people I've dealt with in some time. I seriously hope every one of them are fired.

So now we aren't allowed to have any items out during the last hour of a flight, nor use the bathrooms. Some flights have already banned all usage of electronic devices as well. Janet Napolitano has declared the system a success even though the person was on a watch list. A little after the fact isn't it?

I guess in order to fly on a plane you must forfeit all of your rights, it sure seems to be getting that way.

This is normal at O'hare before this incident. It's really all about selling overpriced bottled water at the airport. You can't carry anything through security to drink but you can purchase liquor (flammable) at the duty free shops and still carry this aboard planes? Makes no sense to me! But be sure to look at Major Daily's dirt on the airport roof so he can say Chicago is a green progressive city. How about getting rid of the rental buses and add the renters to the extended parking train that already drives right past the car rental lots? Oh wait that will reduce votes... I mean jobs... I don't pretend to have the answers but I wish someone out there smarter than me had the balls to do something about it. If it looks like shit and smells like shit...it's probably shit.

From the demo I watched, this guy couldv'e blown his balls off easily! The powder was stored in his underwear and from what I think I watched, a little liquid and a fire and kaboom!

dimitrispearljam

Heatherj43 wrote:

and kaboom!

i like that one...

inmytree

prfctlefts wrote:

I'd like to know why it took Obama's people 3 hrs to notify him and then it took him 3 days to even say anything about it. :wtf: Oh I forgot he was on vacation :roll: Those damn turrist,and I thought there was no war on terror as some on her would like to believe. :roll:

who cares if it took 3 hours to inform him or if it took 3 days to "say anything"...why is this even an issue...?

Brisk.

So funny.. i was watching the repots and throughout it they said oh its all suspicion atm yet they bang out the headlines DUDE TRIED TO BLOW UP PLANE, even though they had no evidence of it what so ever.. this was a day or two after so i dont know what the situation is now..

surely if you wanted to blow up a plane you would do it over the ocean, not when you were trying to land?

gimmesometruth27

inmytree wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

I'd like to know why it took Obama's people 3 hrs to notify him and then it took him 3 days to even say anything about it. :wtf: Oh I forgot he was on vacation :roll: Those damn turrist,and I thought there was no war on terror as some on her would like to believe. :roll:

who cares if it took 3 hours to inform him or if it took 3 days to "say anything"...why is this even an issue...?

yeah why rush and speak publicly when not all information is known yet? you risk spreading the wrong info that way. its been 3 days and they still don't know the full story.

obama can't do anything right for some people. had he spoken earlier he would have probably said something that was not true, just like the people that said the guy had no passport when in fact he did.

by the way, war on terror, perfectlefts, YOU CAN NOT WIN A WAR AGAINST A TACTIC!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!
that would be like me waging a war on willfull ignorance. it can't be won....

Thorns2010

Byrnzie wrote:

And why do we need to turn off our I-Pods? As if listening to an i-pod will make the plane crash?

I honestly believe that the reason for that is because the mostly likely time for a plane to crash is on take off or while landing, so they want to make sure that people are aware of what is going on, and can hear crew instructions and all that.

dimitrispearljam

Thorns2010 wrote:

Byrnzie wrote:

And why do we need to turn off our I-Pods? As if listening to an i-pod will make the plane crash?

I honestly believe that the reason for that is because the mostly likely time for a plane to crash is on take off or while landing, so they want to make sure that people are aware of what is going on, and can hear crew instructions and all that.

all the devices that put out signal are dangerous for the electronics of the aircraft,,the mp3 devices noproblem..exept u have your radio on,so thats why they choose to tell all off

dimitrispearljam

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

inmytree wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

I'd like to know why it took Obama's people 3 hrs to notify him and then it took him 3 days to even say anything about it. :wtf: Oh I forgot he was on vacation :roll: Those damn turrist,and I thought there was no war on terror as some on her would like to believe. :roll:

who cares if it took 3 hours to inform him or if it took 3 days to "say anything"...why is this even an issue...?

yeah why rush and speak publicly when not all information is known yet? you risk spreading the wrong info that way. its been 3 days and they still don't know the full story.

obama can't do anything right for some people. had he spoken earlier he would have probably said something that was not true, just like the people that said the guy had no passport when in fact he did.

by the way, war on terror, perfectlefts, YOU CAN NOT WIN A WAR AGAINST A TACTIC!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!
that would be like me waging a war on willfull ignorance. it can't be won....

in Madrid at 11th March /04 after the attack in madrid trains when 191 people killed the goverment (that was in head 8 points before the spanish election ) announce that was ETA do the attack and not the AQ.. next morning the chief of spain police said was AQ....after 3 days in elections the goverment party loose in elections by 8 point..16% of 40 millions of spain people has the right to vote change their mind only for this little mistake or lie,u name it....
so ,is better not to tell people what ever just to be quick.especially if u are the president of a country,like Obama did.

WaveCameCrashin

inmytree wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

I'd like to know why it took Obama's people 3 hrs to notify him and then it took him 3 days to even say anything about it. :wtf: Oh I forgot he was on vacation :roll: Those damn turrist,and I thought there was no war on terror as some on her would like to believe. :roll:

who cares if it took 3 hours to inform him or if it took 3 days to "say anything"...why is this even an issue...?

Because we almost had another major terrorist attack,and hundreds of people could have died that's fucking why !!! He is responsible for keeping us safe. If we are almost attacked he should be notified immediately not 3 hrs later. God forbid we interupt his vacation. If it weren't for some of the passengers that saw what this scumbag was trying to do it would have more than likely happened. What if the plane would have blown up over land.Think about all the innocent people that would have died along with the passengers.This administration is incompetant when it comes to National Security. Not only that the terrorist has already gotten a public defender so now we can't even interrogate him.

concertaholicshirt

keeponrockin wrote:

Having said that, do we REALLY need to remove personal items from our laps for the last hour now?

Well... it's that or profile passengers, and we can't do that, can we? I mean... why ask young Arab and/or Muslim men to take off their shoes when you can delay things massively by asking old ladies and everyone else to do the same. Now, before some jump all ugly on me, let me get out there that I know a bit about the subject of anti-terrorism and knew as soon as the 2nd plane hit on 9-11 that it was AQ and knew they were hiding in the mountains of Afghanistan, but still stopped at my local gas station on the way home to offer sanctuary at my house to the Arabs working there in case the local meatheads started hassling them. I get that we have to judge people on their individual merit, but we can't let a PC mentality keep us from using common sense. When I was growing up, we understood that if cops are looking for crystal meth dealers, they keep their eyes on members of biker clubs. If they wanted to bust cigarette smugglers, they looked for white guys wearing gold necklaces and nylon shirts on I-95 in one of the states between Florida and New York who were in Cadillacs or rental trucks. If they wanted to infiltrate IRA contributers, they went to certain neighborhoods in Brooklyn and Manhattan, but not in BedSty or Harlem. Is this perfect? No. Can a truly sophisticated terrorist use this to their advantage? Absolutely. Would guys like this one and the shoe bomber probably have been caught prior to boarding? Sure. It ain't perfect, but it's a better use of resources and brains than the current, "All must be inconvenienced so we don't look like racists," policy that has been in place since the last administration.

Brisk. wrote:

surely if you wanted to blow up a plane you would do it over the ocean, not when you were trying to land?

That is absolutely incorrect. Blowing a plane up over water just kills those on board, and maybe keeps people from knowing what you did if all of the evidence sinks to the bottom of the ocean. Blowing it up over land kills everyone on board, and maybe kills a bunch on the ground, further adding to the Terrorism Effect. You can't apply the traits of a compassionate human being when trying to understand what these murderers are doing.

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

YOU CAN NOT WIN A WAR AGAINST A TACTIC!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!

It's a semantic distinction perhaps, but I don't know that this is correct. For better or worse the US and coalition forces have killed most of the top bomb makers of AQ, and many in other terrorist organizations, too. As a result, Crotchie had a very unsophisticated bomb in his pants. Now, we can debate whether killing all the bomb makers contributes to guys like this signing up to put their balls on the line, pun fully intended, but it seems folly to deny that we're winning the war when it comes to these folks being able to come anywhere near the sophisticated plan that they put in place 8 years ago. WIll it ever be a completely winnable war? Probably not, but I don't know that we will ever see a surrender by the kind of people who are so ruled by hatred that they will stone women to death for getting raped and kill gays for being who they are, so maybe it's good to take the victories that we can as we keep vigilant in this conflict.

gimmesometruth27

prfctlefts wrote:

inmytree wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

I'd like to know why it took Obama's people 3 hrs to notify him and then it took him 3 days to even say anything about it. :wtf: Oh I forgot he was on vacation :roll: Those damn turrist,and I thought there was no war on terror as some on her would like to believe. :roll:

who cares if it took 3 hours to inform him or if it took 3 days to "say anything"...why is this even an issue...?

Because we almost had another major terrorist attack,and hundreds of people could have died that's fucking why !!! He is responsible for keeping us safe. If we are almost attacked he should be notified immediately not 3 hrs later. God forbid we interupt his vacation. If it weren't for some of the passengers that saw what this scumbag was trying to do it would have more than likely happened. What if the plane would have blown up over land.Think about all the innocent people that would have died along with the passengers.This administration is incompetant when it comes to National Security. Not only that the terrorist has already gotten a public defender so now we can't even interrogate him.

so could you do better job? could you really do a better job on national security?

would you want your advisors to come to you and give you the incomplete story or the wrong story and you pass that misinformation on to a concerned public? seeing that you want obama to fail, you feel that is what should have been done i have no doubt.

you say we can't "interrogate" the suspect. what type of interrogation are you advocating here? waterboarding? how about extraordinary rendition?

you are talking about a lot of "what ifs" here yet you are blaming the administration for some dumbfuck letting this guy on the plane. that would be like blaming a CEO for a janitor not cleaning the bathroom. there is personal acountability and that employee should be fired.

maybe it was a gov't official that put that guy on the plane? there is a little conspiracy theory for you. who has the authority to go over the head of the TSA? a gov't official puts a guy on a plane in order to expand this war on terror into nigeria....to me its unlikely, but it is plausible so people who think like you will begin to beat the war drums to expand this war.

dimitrispearljam

i hope usa not bomb nigeria after this,,,maybe not.they dont have oil...or they have????mmm

Nigeria is the 12th largest producer of petroleum in the world and the 8th largest exporter, and has the 10th largest proven reserves. (The country joined OPEC in 1971)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigeria#Economy

yahamita

Just another reason for the higher ups to tighten the noose and give us stiffer laws. More control for the govt. And what is it I heard there was actually another passenger from Amsterdam, on the same flight # to MI pulled some sort of shit too? Sounds a bit suspicious to me..

gimmesometruth27

concertaholicshirt wrote:

quote="gimmesometruth27"]YOU CAN NOT WIN A WAR AGAINST A TACTIC!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!

It's a semantic distinction perhaps, but I don't know that this is correct. For better or worse the US and coalition forces have killed most of the top bomb makers of AQ, and many in other terrorist organizations, too. As a result, Crotchie had a very unsophisticated bomb in his pants. Now, we can debate whether killing all the bomb makers contributes to guys like this signing up to put their balls on the line, pun fully intended, but it seems folly to deny that we're winning the war when it comes to these folks being able to come anywhere near the sophisticated plan that they put in place 8 years ago. WIll it ever be a completely winnable war? Probably not, but I don't know that we will ever see a surrender by the kind of people who are so ruled by hatred that they will stone women to death for getting raped and kill gays for being who they are, so maybe it's good to take the victories that we can as we keep vigilant in this conflict.[/quote]

WaveCameCrashin

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

so could you do better job? could you really do a better job on national security?

I figured I would get a reply like that. :roll: Did you ever think maybe it's there job to figure these things out.

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

would you want your advisors to come to you and give you the incomplete story or the wrong story and you pass that misinformation on to a concerned public? seeing that you want obama to fail, you feel that is what should have been done i have no doubt.

I would want them or he to tell him or us somthing. It's better than nothing at all. He didn't seem to care about all the facts when one of his friends was arrested before he called the arresting officers stupid.

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

you say we can't "interrogate" the suspect. what type of interrogation are you advocating here? waterboarding? how about extraordinary rendition?

Well really I think he should have all of his finger nails pulled out. :roll: :roll: Of course I don't expect him to be water boarded. I want him to answer some questions. Is that ok ??

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

o people who think like you will begin to beat the war drums to expand this war.

Oh I see. So we should just ignore this and just pretend like nothing ever happened right. A big fucking joke right ??? you really need to change your username to something else,because the truth is right in front of you yet you choose to ignore it. With all due respect.

gimmesometruth27

concertaholicshirt wrote:

keeponrockin wrote:

Having said that, do we REALLY need to remove personal items from our laps for the last hour now?

Well... it's that or profile passengers, and we can't do that, can we? I mean... why ask young Arab and/or Muslim men to take off their shoes when you can delay things massively by asking old ladies and everyone else to do the same. Now, before some jump all ugly on me, let me get out there that I know a bit about the subject of anti-terrorism and knew as soon as the 2nd plane hit on 9-11 that it was AQ and knew they were hiding in the mountains of Afghanistan, but still stopped at my local gas station on the way home to offer sanctuary at my house to the Arabs working there in case the local meatheads started hassling them. I get that we have to judge people on their individual merit, but we can't let a PC mentality keep us from using common sense. When I was growing up, we understood that if cops are looking for crystal meth dealers, they keep their eyes on members of biker clubs. If they wanted to bust cigarette smugglers, they looked for white guys wearing gold necklaces and nylon shirts on I-95 in one of the states between Florida and New York who were in Cadillacs or rental trucks. If they wanted to infiltrate IRA contributers, they went to certain neighborhoods in Brooklyn and Manhattan, but not in BedSty or Harlem. Is this perfect? No. Can a truly sophisticated terrorist use this to their advantage? Absolutely. Would guys like this one and the shoe bomber probably have been caught prior to boarding? Sure. It ain't perfect, but it's a better use of resources and brains than the current, "All must be inconvenienced so we don't look like racists," policy that has been in place since the last administration.

Brisk. wrote:

surely if you wanted to blow up a plane you would do it over the ocean, not when you were trying to land?

That is absolutely incorrect. Blowing a plane up over water just kills those on board, and maybe keeps people from knowing what you did if all of the evidence sinks to the bottom of the ocean. Blowing it up over land kills everyone on board, and maybe kills a bunch on the ground, further adding to the Terrorism Effect. You can't apply the traits of a compassionate human being when trying to understand what these murderers are doing.

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

YOU CAN NOT WIN A WAR AGAINST A TACTIC!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!

It's a semantic distinction perhaps, but I don't know that this is correct. For better or worse the US and coalition forces have killed most of the top bomb makers of AQ, and many in other terrorist organizations, too. As a result, Crotchie had a very unsophisticated bomb in his pants. Now, we can debate whether killing all the bomb makers contributes to guys like this signing up to put their balls on the line, pun fully intended, but it seems folly to deny that we're winning the war when it comes to these folks being able to come anywhere near the sophisticated plan that they put in place 8 years ago. WIll it ever be a completely winnable war? Probably not, but I don't know that we will ever see a surrender by the kind of people who are so ruled by hatred that they will stone women to death for getting raped and kill gays for being who they are, so maybe it's good to take the victories that we can as we keep vigilant in this conflict.

if you want to play terrorist whack a mole in the desert for the next 50 years be my guest. but at no point will we ever say "that's it, we killed them all, no more terrorists." every one of them we kill there has a son or neice or nephew or brother or sister that is going to grow up and wage jihad to avenge the death of their loved one, and so the cycle continues.....and the band plays on....

concertaholicshirt

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

if you want to play terrorist whack a mole in the desert for the next 50 years be my guest.

Actually, I'd rather not, and hopefully we won't feel compelled to do that.

but at no point will we ever say "that's it, we killed them all, no more terrorists."

Agreed.

every one of them we kill there has a son or neice or nephew or brother or sister that is going to grow up and wage jihad to avenge the death of their loved one, and so the cycle continues.....and the band plays on....

Why? If we're supposed to take our lumps after 9/11 and not kill terrorists, they why aren't they held to the same standard? I mean... what exactly are you suggesting? That we just pull up stakes in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. and let the locals sort it out on their own, regardless of what chaos and genocide ensue? That we just suck it up for perpetuity as these folks amass power and still lob bombs at us?

I'm sure that you and I can find a lot of agreement on what has been done wrong for the last 8, 15, 40, etc. years. That said, this msgboard isn't some model-UN that transcends into reality where we can wax philosophically and impose our utopian view of things on everyone. There are some evil mutherfukers out there who won't turn the cheek just because we do. What are you suggesting here that can have a positive effect on the real world situation?

inmytree

prfctlefts wrote:

inmytree wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

I'd like to know why it took Obama's people 3 hrs to notify him and then it took him 3 days to even say anything about it. :wtf: Oh I forgot he was on vacation :roll: Those damn turrist,and I thought there was no war on terror as some on her would like to believe. :roll:

who cares if it took 3 hours to inform him or if it took 3 days to "say anything"...why is this even an issue...?

Because we almost had another major terrorist attack,and hundreds of people could have died that's fucking why !!! He is responsible for keeping us safe. If we are almost attacked he should be notified immediately not 3 hrs later. God forbid we interupt his vacation. If it weren't for some of the passengers that saw what this scumbag was trying to do it would have more than likely happened. What if the plane would have blown up over land.Think about all the innocent people that would have died along with the passengers.This administration is incompetant when it comes to National Security. Not only that the terrorist has already gotten a public defender so now we can't even interrogate him.

relax...

I'd be willing to bet if something did truly happen, i.e., the plane did crash, that the President would have addressed the nation A.S.A.P.

In this case, what would you have wanted him to say...? first reports were that someone set off firecrackers...let's say Obama interrupted your episode of the 700 Club and said "it's come to my attention that moments ago, someone set off firecrackers on a plane...now hear this, I will not rest until firecrackers are eradicated and we'll start with attacking China..."

I'm pretty sure you'd be unhappy with that response...

Why do you need the President to speak to you...are that scared that you need his calming influence...?

As for the the nutbomber getting a lawyer...welcome the US, it's nice that we now follow the rule of law...