Girl gets raped and people don't help WTF .

josevolution

D2D i do place all the blame on the dirt bags who did this , but me being a parent i allways feel the feeling of i should of could of done this to prevent stigma, even when my kids would fall or what ever happened to one of them i'm allways saying/asking myself i should of been/done this differently if that makes any sense ,i feel terrible for this girl & family ...

Cosmo

I think the term being sought here is 'The Bystander Effect'... the greater the number of witnesses, the less likely an individual will help a victim in distress.
ref. http://psychology.about.com/od/socialps ... effect.htm
...
As for being a Hero...
We all can SAY we would do something if this happened or if you saw that... but we cannot say it without having lived through it. Hundreds of people stood on the shore and bridges as a plane crashed into the ice filled Potomac River watching a stewardess lose her grip ot a helicoptered lifeline and go under... ONE man jumped in the water to save her.
In this case, you'd think someone would have called 911 and reported it anonomously.
...
Blame the parent... I don't think so.
Blame the moronic pride in 'Not being a Snitch'... yup. If you see a crime... you are supposed to do something. Not necessarilty intervene and place yourself in harm's way.. but, at LEAST... report it to the cops. By not doing so... sure, you can feel proud about yourself for not being a snitch. But, you are also a coward and an apathetic dick.

cincybearcat

Cosmo wrote:

IBlame the moronic pride in 'Not being a Snitch'... yup. If you see a crime... you are supposed to do something. Not necessarilty intervene and place yourself in harm's way.. but, at LEAST... report it to the cops. By not doing so... sure, you can feel proud about yourself for not being a snitch. But, you are also a coward and an apathetic dick.

I'd say you are also an accomplice...a cowardly, apathetic dick accomplice.

know1

eMMI wrote:

also I agree with you about blaming the parents. really, so many things are just out of their control, no matter how well they've raised their child.

the ones that should get the blame, flame and punishments for this are the guys that actually did it.

my thoughts go out to that girl and her family.

I've always maintained that if we started actually punishing parents with jail times for the crimes their children commit that, suddenly, a lot more things that would be in their control that they claim aren't now.

eMMI

know1 wrote:

eMMI wrote:

also I agree with you about blaming the parents. really, so many things are just out of their control, no matter how well they've raised their child.

the ones that should get the blame, flame and punishments for this are the guys that actually did it.

my thoughts go out to that girl and her family.

I've always maintained that if we started actually punishing parents with jail times for the crimes their children commit that, suddenly, a lot more things that would be in their control that they claim aren't now.

really?

while I do think many times children's bad behaviour is the fault of the parents. whether that's having no boundaries, having too strict boundaries, violence, what have you.. there are so many things parents (or people in general) simply cannot control.

there will always be parents whose children commit the most horrendous crimes for whatever reasons. crimes their parents will have no way of preventing - should those parents still be punished?

blackredyellow

know1 wrote:

eMMI wrote:

also I agree with you about blaming the parents. really, so many things are just out of their control, no matter how well they've raised their child.

the ones that should get the blame, flame and punishments for this are the guys that actually did it.

my thoughts go out to that girl and her family.

I've always maintained that if we started actually punishing parents with jail times for the crimes their children commit that, suddenly, a lot more things that would be in their control that they claim aren't now.

We'd have a lot more terribly behaved teenage children in the foster kid system who have parents in jail... sounds like a terrible solution.

Cosmo

cincybearcat wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

I Blame the moronic pride in 'Not being a Snitch'... yup. If you see a crime... you are supposed to do something. Not necessarilty intervene and place yourself in harm's way.. but, at LEAST... report it to the cops. By not doing so... sure, you can feel proud about yourself for not being a snitch. But, you are also a coward and an apathetic dick.

I'd say you are also an accomplice...a cowardly, apathetic dick accomplice.

...
I agree. Dialing 911 is no heroic act... but, it should be the LEAST you should do if you ever witness a crime.

Cosmo

know1 wrote:

eMMI wrote:

also I agree with you about blaming the parents. really, so many things are just out of their control, no matter how well they've raised their child.

the ones that should get the blame, flame and punishments for this are the guys that actually did it.

my thoughts go out to that girl and her family.

I've always maintained that if we started actually punishing parents with jail times for the crimes their children commit that, suddenly, a lot more things that would be in their control that they claim aren't now.

...
This has GOT to be a joke.
...
... right?

decides2dream

josevolution wrote:

D2D i do place all the blame on the dirt bags who did this , but me being a parent i allways feel the feeling of i should of could of done this to prevent stigma, even when my kids would fall or what ever happened to one of them i'm allways saying/asking myself i should of been/done this differently if that makes any sense ,i feel terrible for this girl & family ...

i hear ya jose, i really, really do. and maybe, as not being a parenti can, possibly, be a bit more objective? idk, not saying that with any certainty. that said, you mention "stigma" and that is exactly what i am thinking of; this girl, her parents, are hurting enough....they do not need anyone else second-guessing or questioning their behaviors. they are not to blame. of course i understand the, or you, or anyone in such a horrid position questioning themselves....tis human nature. i just think that is more than enough and that we collectively, do not need to add to that burden. i think all too often i read things that go right to the parents, such as your OP, and it just pains me b/c that is not where we should immediately look all the time. that's all.

Cosmo wrote:

know1 wrote:

eMMI wrote:

also I agree with you about blaming the parents. really, so many things are just out of their control, no matter how well they've raised their child.

the ones that should get the blame, flame and punishments for this are the guys that actually did it.

my thoughts go out to that girl and her family.

I've always maintained that if we started actually punishing parents with jail times for the crimes their children commit that, suddenly, a lot more things that would be in their control that they claim aren't now.

...
This has GOT to be a joke.
...
... right?

especially coming from someone who usually is the first to espouse "personal responisibility." the sins of the children do not necessarily reflect on the parents, and vice versa.


and...

Cosmo wrote:

I think the term being sought here is 'The Bystander Effect'... the greater the number of witnesses, the less likely an individual will help a victim in distress.
ref. http://psychology.about.com/od/socialps ... effect.htm

exactly.
just what i was thinking of, and emmi helped it along...
kitty genovese...the bystander effect....diffusion of responsibility...

soulsinging

Cosmo wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

I Blame the moronic pride in 'Not being a Snitch'... yup. If you see a crime... you are supposed to do something. Not necessarilty intervene and place yourself in harm's way.. but, at LEAST... report it to the cops. By not doing so... sure, you can feel proud about yourself for not being a snitch. But, you are also a coward and an apathetic dick.

I'd say you are also an accomplice...a cowardly, apathetic dick accomplice.

...
I agree. Dialing 911 is no heroic act... but, it should be the LEAST you should do if you ever witness a crime.

depends on the crime.

musicismylife78

I dont think the "dont be a snitch" mentality had a damn thing to do with this. Its a non issue. The no snitching thing came about from the inner city, this factual idea that police target black youth, and that as prisons are overwhelmingly and disproportionatley black and latino males, it makes sense, that people would have this guard up in those cases. If you know police especially those who patrol the inner city are corrupt, racist, and engage in the kind of murderous activity that notorious organizations like NY and LA's finest who will rape, or kill any blacks on site for merely being black. So yeah I can understand and identify with the no snitching idea. Why cooperate in an investigation with police if the police from the start are racist cowards?

This rape at the school had nothing to do with that

musicismylife78

middle/ high school kids are totally different from the no snitching idea. The no snitching idea is a compelling idea because it revolves around racist and corrupt and wanton police who murder on sight. A school is a neutral setting so to speak. And presumably the school is made up of multiple races and ethnic groups.

Those kids who didnt do anything didnt do anything, no for fear of being blamed a snitched, but for some other reason not yet suggested

keeponrockin

musicismylife78 wrote:

I dont think the "dont be a snitch" mentality had a damn thing to do with this. Its a non issue. The no snitching thing came about from the inner city, this factual idea that police target black youth, and that as prisons are overwhelmingly and disproportionatley black and latino males, it makes sense, that people would have this guard up in those cases. If you know police especially those who patrol the inner city are corrupt, racist, and engage in the kind of murderous activity that notorious organizations like NY and LA's finest who will rape, or kill any blacks on site for merely being black. So yeah I can understand and identify with the no snitching idea. Why cooperate in an investigation with police if the police from the start are racist cowards?

This rape at the school had nothing to do with that

You really think the No Snitch thing had nothing to do with? A year out of highschool, I can tell you, that mentality still exists, and I live in the fucking burbs.

Jeanwah

I didn't read the article, yet. But the mentality of people to not do anything when someone is in need of help is pretty common. I don't know if there's a psych word for it, but let's face it, it's much harder for people to care to act to help than to pretend they don't see anything. It's about responsibility and taking action. We're in the era of "I'm not responsible" for anything mentality. Only looking out for ourselves, which tends to make me ill. Which is probably why I haven't read the article.

musicismylife78

keeponrockin wrote:

musicismylife78 wrote:

I dont think the "dont be a snitch" mentality had a damn thing to do with this. Its a non issue. The no snitching thing came about from the inner city, this factual idea that police target black youth, and that as prisons are overwhelmingly and disproportionatley black and latino males, it makes sense, that people would have this guard up in those cases. If you know police especially those who patrol the inner city are corrupt, racist, and engage in the kind of murderous activity that notorious organizations like NY and LA's finest who will rape, or kill any blacks on site for merely being black. So yeah I can understand and identify with the no snitching idea. Why cooperate in an investigation with police if the police from the start are racist cowards?

This rape at the school had nothing to do with that

You really think the No Snitch thing had nothing to do with? A year out of highschool, I can tell you, that mentality still exists, and I live in the fucking burbs.

I am reasonable certain. I personally dont trust the police. And I personally would feel guilty calling the police if someone broke into my house. I would do it, but I would feel a tinge of guilt.

But I would have no trouble calling it if I saw someone else in need. I would do it immediately.

I think people generally trust the police. I dont think others have the same moral quandry I do.

Maybe the no snitching idea has widened and expanded as you seem to suggest. My point was, the no snitching movement, has very specific origins. for specific reasons.

As I said, I have a view of the police based on experiences I have seen first hand, or have seen on video, have read about etc...but, no question in my mind that if someone was being raped and I happened to come across that, I would immediately help that person, or call the police.

I just dont think middle/highschoolers think in that context. If I call the police i will be a snitch.

Its an easy scapegoat. And as people pointed out, this subject has been part of Psychology 101 for eons and eons. Kitty Genovese certainly didnt live in a time of no snitching, and that didnt stop people from not doing anything to help and save her. Or what about all those Germans during WWII who did nothing as people were burned alive, who kept silent for fear the Nazi's would turn on them. Or what about Matthew Shepard. You know one of those kids had to have had a conscience. And when Matthew was dying, he could have stopped his friends and said, "this isnt right, lets call the cops and save matthew". Or Brandon Teena. Those kids could have called the cops at any point. How about in My Lai or Haditha or Abu Gharaib? Why didnt anyone stop and say "this isnt okay".

Its more than a no snitching fear.

This type of thing has bee

musicismylife78

once you come to the conclusion this has been going on for decades, maybe even centuries, this idea that people do nothing when others are being hurt or killed, you can rule out the "no snitching" explanation.

And anyone with half would understand that

catefrances

know1 wrote:

eMMI wrote:

also I agree with you about blaming the parents. really, so many things are just out of their control, no matter how well they've raised their child.

the ones that should get the blame, flame and punishments for this are the guys that actually did it.

my thoughts go out to that girl and her family.

I've always maintained that if we started actually punishing parents with jail times for the crimes their children commit that, suddenly, a lot more things that would be in their control that they claim aren't now.

im guessing youre not a parent.

Cosmo

musicismylife78 wrote:

I dont think the "dont be a snitch" mentality had a damn thing to do with this. Its a non issue. The no snitching thing came about from the inner city, this factual idea that police target black youth, and that as prisons are overwhelmingly and disproportionatley black and latino males, it makes sense, that people would have this guard up in those cases. If you know police especially those who patrol the inner city are corrupt, racist, and engage in the kind of murderous activity that notorious organizations like NY and LA's finest who will rape, or kill any blacks on site for merely being black. So yeah I can understand and identify with the no snitching idea. Why cooperate in an investigation with police if the police from the start are racist cowards?

This rape at the school had nothing to do with that

...
WHAT????
You would stand by and NOT do a thing if you witnessed this crime???
I think you would. I think you would call the police to report it. To you, you are doing the right thing... to the criminals (and their peers and families and friends)... you are a SNITCH.
...
I don't know where this black inner city prison thing comes into play here... the thing is... witnesses that did NOT report it to the police.

soulsinging

musicismylife78 wrote:

I dont think the "dont be a snitch" mentality had a damn thing to do with this. Its a non issue. The no snitching thing came about from the inner city, this factual idea that police target black youth, and that as prisons are overwhelmingly and disproportionatley black and latino males, it makes sense, that people would have this guard up in those cases. If you know police especially those who patrol the inner city are corrupt, racist, and engage in the kind of murderous activity that notorious organizations like NY and LA's finest who will rape, or kill any blacks on site for merely being black. So yeah I can understand and identify with the no snitching idea. Why cooperate in an investigation with police if the police from the start are racist cowards?

because a 15 year old girl was being gang raped.

soulsinging

musicismylife78 wrote:

middle/ high school kids are totally different from the no snitching idea. The no snitching idea is a compelling idea because it revolves around racist and corrupt and wanton police who murder on sight. A school is a neutral setting so to speak. And presumably the school is made up of multiple races and ethnic groups.

Those kids who didnt do anything didnt do anything, no for fear of being blamed a snitched, but for some other reason not yet suggested

what reason is that? suggest it...